Mary's Accent and Languages

[mashed potatoes]

that link doesn't work?
does anyone have another link where we could here mary speaking?

[LauraL]

[quote=Jaques Demolay]Layla1971

"An American would not know what an Australian sounds like, who is going through the above process, except to listen to Mary and then to think, " Goldarnit, somethin ain't right in the state a Louisiana",( Denmark in this case) because they would be expecting to hear that broad Aussie accent."



Such a generalization is quite untrue. Two points. I am an American and I certainly know what an Australian sounds like. If a person is not exposed to persons of other nationalities, it does become more difficult. However, even before I had met a person from either Australia I could tell you the difference between a British, an Australian and a Scottish accent. It has to do with the sensitivity of a person's ear and their desire to pay attention, not their nationality.

Secondly, generalizing that all Americans speak in such a way (" Goldarnit, somethin ain't right in the state a Louisiana") is rude. I am from the South, Texas to be specific, and no one of my aquaintance speaks like that. Are there people who do? Yes, I imagine there is a small minority somewhere who do. But even that person could be able to hear the difference in Mary's accent.

I haven't heard Mary speak in English, but her Danish accent was markedly different from the two people who spoke before her in the most recent clip provided. Was it poor? I have no idea. I don't speak Danish. But it certainly sounded crisper, like she was making an attempt to be precise.

Oh, and it's goshdarnit, not goldarnit.

[RoyalKnottie]

This is an interesting topic. Of what I have heard of Mary speaking leads me to believe that she has a slight Australian accent. I looked up Mary's bio and it said she attended elementary school in Texas, USA, had Scottish parents, and ultimately grew up in Australia. So what accent she has is mostly faint, IMO.
I also think that since both of her parents are professors and highly educated they would not allow her to develop a strong, backward if you will, accent.

http://www.kronprinsparret.dk/ac000c

[Lady Jean]

I listened to the clip for Heart Week and even though I'm American and don't know Danish at all I was impressed with how she did....I have heard her speak only a few times. What impressed me was the apparent ease she had and the speed in which she read, no hesitancy that I could see with the pronunciation (but of course I know she could have practiced the speech many times at home).

[Australian]

Non-Australians can also gain an impression of Australian English from well-known actors and other native speakers. The normal speaking voices of Cate Blanchett, Russell Crowe, Hugh Jackman, Nicole Kidman and Heath Ledger are examples of General Australian accents
So this is probably the level of the accent mary has, just like the typical aussie girl.

So this is what your average Aussie sounds like, the really ocker ones sound like Steve Irwin but i dont know anyone who speaks like him, he is very exaggerated.:)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_English

[tinadk]

regarding Mary's accent maybe i can add my view :)

I am English but live in Denmark, over the last couple of years i have heard Mary speak more and more Danish and think that is responsible for a lot of the change in the way she speaks her English. It can be a little confusing to speak two languages on a day to day basis especially when danish is put into different sentences than English. However i will also say that when we first started hearing her speak English in public ie) Engagement and dating times it appears that she is trying to sound a little more precise when speaking the English - this may be down to the fact that she is trying to be more understood by the danes.

[Violet25]

Personally as an Aussie (and an avid linguist, as i studied it at university here in Sydney) I can tell you her way of speaking is not normal- regardless of how long she's been living in Denmark, because she started speaking this way a couple of years ago (2004!) and i doubt her accent changed that much when she was only starting to learn the language, an accent should only change once one starts to speak in another language , albeit more fluently.
I would say she's been made to correct her Aussie accent, she doesn't sound Aussie at all, she sounds 'half pom half Nordic' as someone put it and its really really fake. you can tell its not her normal way of speaking due to the pauses she takes between words and how carefully she articulates certain words, it just isn't natural. I'd like to believe she doesn't speak this way around her friends or they'd all be laughing at her. When she came to Australia last year and did that interview with Andrew Denton, everybody was talking here about how fake her accent sounded and how its not Australian at all. I'm not saying one has to sound like Steve Irwin to be an Aussie, because most of us don't, but Mary is no longer an Aussie- that is very evident..
I say good on her, if this is what she had to do , then she's done it well. But please dont' call her an Aussie because at the end of the day she's anything but! and I'm still trying to figure out what she's done for Australia? her life is in Denmark now and her job as a CP is to promote Danish lifestyle, culture, etc. nothing to do with Australia anymore, she's not even an Australian citizen anymore as far as I'm aware.

[princess olga]

Originally Posted by Violet25

Personally as an Aussie (and an avid linguist, as i studied it at university here in Sydney) I can tell you her way of speaking is not normal- regardless of how long she's been living in Denmark, because she started speaking this way a couple of years ago (2004!) and i doubt her accent changed that much when she was only starting to learn the language, an accent should only change once one starts to speak in another language , albeit more fluently.
I would say she's been made to correct her Aussie accent, she doesn't sound Aussie at all, she sounds 'half pom half Nordic' as someone put it and its really really fake. you can tell its not her normal way of speaking due to the pauses she takes between words and how carefully she articulates certain words, it just isn't natural. I'd like to believe she doesn't speak this way around her friends or they'd all be laughing at her. When she came to Australia last year and did that interview with Andrew Denton, everybody was talking here about how fake her accent sounded and how its not Australian at all. I'm not saying one has to sound like Steve Irwin to be an Aussie, because most of us don't, but Mary is no longer an Aussie- that is very evident..
I say good on her, if this is what she had to do , then she's done it well. But please dont' call her an Aussie because at the end of the day she's anything but! and I'm still trying to figure out what she's done for Australia? her life is in Denmark now and her job as a CP is to promote Danish lifestyle, culture, etc. nothing to do with Australia anymore, she's not even an Australian citizen anymore as far as I'm aware.

I have to say I'm totally with you. I have a lot of family in Australia so I know what real Australians are supposed to sound like, but when I heard Mary speak on that engagement video they did, she came across as someone who's trying to sound more English than the queen (Elizabeth, for that matter!). I also noticed the pauses between words, but I thought at the time that it might be due to the fact she's trying to please the whole world and the planet of Mars with her message..but the whole thing came across as totally utterly artificial and orchestrated, hence perhaps I never really took a shine to this girl..whatever her accent, aussie it wasn't!

[Peaches]

Originally Posted by princess olga

I have to say I'm totally with you. I have a lot of family in Australia so I know what real Australians are supposed to sound like, but when I heard Mary speak on that engagement video they did, she came across as someone who's trying to sound more English than the queen (Elizabeth, for that matter!). I also noticed the pauses between words, but I thought at the time that it might be due to the fact she's trying to please the whole world and the planet of Mars with her message..but the whole thing came across as totally utterly artificial and orchestrated, hence perhaps I never really took a shine to this girl..whatever her accent, aussie it wasn't!

I think she tried to refine her ways but I think she over-polished herself!

[RachelD]

Greetings to all!

My opinion is that she's just trying to sound as polished and proper as possible and usualy people that speak that way are depicted as British (or with a British accent). So maybe she un-intentionaly (sp?) ends up speaking sort of Britishy...but only she knows the real reason why her accent is the way it is. Does she sound Britishy? I have not been able to hear her speak (I don't have speakers on my computer!).

[Quality Blonde]

Oh Violet25 thanks for putting a linguistic spin on things. I totally agree with you. Having read through this thread I would like to say..

I think her parents being originally from Scotland and some of her upbring in the states contributes to her accent sounding "less" Australian and more English...

Please..
I have read this justification 1000x but Mary is the youngest! Her older siblings have broad Australian accents! Siblings do not speak that differently from each other.

Also in regards to her accent - Definately acquired, no one in Australia speaks with that accent if they have been brought up and schooled here from the age of 5 until the end of a University degree.

If she has had elocution lessons as well as Danish lessons fine - being able to be understood and speaking clearly can only be a benefit in her situation.

Why though she felt the need to adopt an English-sort-of accent is beyond me. What a joke. There are plenty of well spoken Australians who are not afraid to maintain their accent (e.g Cate Blanchett - actress). There is no way that having training for public speaking suddenly changes 30 years of speech habits that dramatically. Purposefully changing it, does however.

As regards her syntax - I have watched the engagment interview and pre-wedding documentary and my observations and opinions are based on that.

Why in the world does it seem like she can't string a coherent, gramatically correct sentence together??

Ok so at the engagement press conference she was nervous, fair enough. Let's use the documentary instead. The most notable things are her "ahm's" a sort of hybrid 'um + ah' and the fact that she pauses SO often in the middle of a sentence. Not just for a breath, or a short pause but enough to break up the meaning and for her to forget what she said at the start rendering the rest of the sentence gramatically incorrect.


E.g first sentence of clip "it wasn't____________________________ (pause)my life changed overnight.

for goodness sake it wasn't what??? that, as if, ........ without this joining word her phrase has the opposite meaning to what she intends (i.e things did happen quickly).

Then on the plane, referring to the flight over wineglass bay: "but it also had another special moments, it was a place that my grandmother loved"

Another example of this awkward phrasing was the introductory sentence at the press conference. She does her (memorised) spiel in Danish and then mentions in english "there will be some questions that I will feel h-appier answering in english - therefore I will do so". Um ok really what she meant was "However, there will be some questions I will feel more comfortable answering in english".

Not to mention "I was saddened" and "one".

This is her native language people!! All of this would be much more understandable if it had been in Danish. To me this clearly indicates that she is thinking far more about her pronunciation than anything else. Evidently because it is newly acquired. Maybe you might suggest that she is 'shy' and 'reticent' (as she claimed) wanting to reflect on what she says - why then does she have to pause in the middle of the sentence. It really should come out fully formed.

I mean doesn't Fred ever find it wierd that she speaks soooo differently to when they met? Not to mention her family. Anyone have a link to the quote made by her brother about it (apparently in an Australian Newspaper article).

I could quote more from the documentary but I'm sure I've already upset some people with what I've said here.

QB xox

[Madame Royale]

Originally Posted by princess olga

I have a lot of family in Australia so I know what real Australians are supposed to sound like.

Real? As apposed to fake Australian's.lol. So you must be familiar with the indigenous patois then :mrgreen:

I'm sure you were not suggesting that Mary was not a real Australian because by every means, she was - by birth and legality - until the day of her marriage.

And what exactly are we Australian's supposed to sound like? A country of such diverse cultures, influences and upbringings... I am curious to know

[crisscross1]

Originally Posted by Quality Blonde

Oh Violet25 thanks for putting a linguistic spin on things. I totally agree with you. Having read through this thread I would like to say..



Please..
I have read this justification 1000x but Mary is the youngest! Her older siblings have broad Australian accents! Siblings do not speak that differently from each other.

Also in regards to her accent - Definately acquired, no one in Australia speaks with that accent if they have been brought up and schooled here from the age of 5 until the end of a University degree.

If she has had elocution lessons as well as Danish lessons fine - being able to be understood and speaking clearly can only be a benefit in her situation.

Why though she felt the need to adopt an English-sort-of accent is beyond me. What a joke. There are plenty of well spoken Australians who are not afraid to maintain their accent (e.g Cate Blanchett - actress). There is no way that having training for public speaking suddenly changes 30 years of speech habits that dramatically. Purposefully changing it, does however.

As regards her syntax - I have watched the engagment interview and pre-wedding documentary and my observations and opinions are based on that.

Why in the world does it seem like she can't string a coherent, gramatically correct sentence together??

Ok so at the engagement press conference she was nervous, fair enough. Let's use the documentary instead. The most notable things are her "ahm's" a sort of hybrid 'um + ah' and the fact that she pauses SO often in the middle of a sentence. Not just for a breath, or a short pause but enough to break up the meaning and for her to forget what she said at the start rendering the rest of the sentence gramatically incorrect.


E.g first sentence of clip "it wasn't____________________________ (pause)my life changed overnight.

for goodness sake it wasn't what??? that, as if, ........ without this joining word her phrase has the opposite meaning to what she intends (i.e things did happen quickly).

Then on the plane, referring to the flight over wineglass bay: "but it also had another special moments, it was a place that my grandmother loved"

Another example of this awkward phrasing was the introductory sentence at the press conference. She does her (memorised) spiel in Danish and then mentions in english "there will be some questions that I will feel h-appier answering in english - therefore I will do so". Um ok really what she meant was "However, there will be some questions I will feel more comfortable answering in english".

Not to mention "I was saddened" and "one".

This is her native language people!! All of this would be much more understandable if it had been in Danish. To me this clearly indicates that she is thinking far more about her pronunciation than anything else. Evidently because it is newly acquired. Maybe you might suggest that she is 'shy' and 'reticent' (as she claimed) wanting to reflect on what she says - why then does she have to pause in the middle of the sentence. It really should come out fully formed.

I mean doesn't Fred ever find it wierd that she speaks soooo differently to when they met? Not to mention her family. Anyone have a link to the quote made by her brother about it (apparently in an Australian Newspaper article).

I could quote more from the documentary but I'm sure I've already upset some people with what I've said here.

QB xox

WOW, you must have spent hours coming up with all that, unlike Crown Princess Mary who has to answer questions quite off the cuff. She possibly doesn't want to answer the questions or doesn't know the answer to some of the questions, hence the long --------------- pauses.
I obviously have more important things in my life to think about, I know CP Mary's accent isn't one of them, but, it was an interesting---------------read.

[Australian]

Just a side note- Most Aussies do not speak like Steve Irwin lol. A Norwegian exchange student at my university told me "I thought you Australians spoke like Steve Irwin but you all sound normal to me" haha I wonder what 'normal' means.

[Jo of Palatine]

Originally Posted by RachelD

Greetings to all!

My opinion is that she's just trying to sound as polished and proper as possible and usualy people that speak that way are depicted as British (or with a British accent). So maybe she un-intentionaly (sp?) ends up speaking sort of Britishy...but only she knows the real reason why her accent is the way it is. Does she sound Britishy? I have not been able to hear her speak (I don't have speakers on my computer!).

I've no idea how she sounded in the beginning but she is the child of two Britons who immigrated to Australia. So probably the Donaldsons spoke a kind of mixed British/Australian English at home. While her siblings live in Australia, Mary moved on to Europe. I guess she got more and more into contact with non-native speakers who learned their English according to the British way to speak (alot of them probably in Britain) and thus took on/ enhanced some special sounds.

Of course she is trying to sound as polished as possible because that's what is asked of her on doing a good job as a Crown Princess. When I saw the videos on www.youtube.com I realized how tense this girl was, how difficult the change into this new world obviously was and how hard she tried to please. In some things she said in her pre-wedding interviews you could hear how tough the situation actually was for her: both Frederick and herself realized that she simply had to be a success if they wanted to be happy together. They obviously talked about what to do if she didn't please the queen, if the queen was against the marriage. Abdication had been a topic then between the two of them but Mary clearly stated that she didn't want frederick to give it all up for her so she was forced to be a success. And that she was willing to work as hard as it takes to be the wife the Danes wished for their prince.

As we all know, the queen agreed as did the parliament. Now, after the birth of the next in line I have the feeling that she started to relax more and more. Additionally she got more and more routine on dealing with people and started to show the people the real Mary, the warm-hearted, easy-going woman that prince Frederick fell in love with, as he said in his "speech to his bride" on their wedding.

[soCal girl]

I agree with you, Jo. It's pretty unfair to call Mary a fake when you realize she was trying to stadle both worlds and please everybody because she simply has to. Her English was probably more "Aussie" sounding but then she moved to Denmark and was surrounded by a mix of European accents and Danish. English and Danish are two very different and distinct languages. Just take a look at the questions she answered when she left the hospital. Some she had to answer in English because they were Australian reporters and others in Danish for the Danish reporters. It's pretty clear there that she's a little bit more comfortable with the two languages she must juggle than she was before. Mary also learned Danish as an adult. I'm a person who doesn't grasp languages very well but I managed to learn three languages somewhat fluently. It was very hard and Mary has said that she had never studied another language before and that Danish was her first, second language. Considering all things, I think her accent is fine. After all the changes made in her life, it isn't surprising that the accent went along for the changes also.

[juliana]

Mary's present English is not Australian. Children get their accents from the society they go to school in, not their parents. Mary's parents were both Scots and, as all Scots do, they seem to keep their accents for ever; there is no hint of a Scottish accent in Mary's accent. If she had a hint of Scottishness she would sound North American. She would grow up speaking the same as her siblings and schoolfriends- Tasmanian/ Australian and there is nothing wrong with that because that is what her husband first heard.

Mary's mother-in-law and ex-sister-in- law speak beautiful English with lovely upper class English accents, but not Fred- he has more of an American accent. Perhaps hearing the upper class English accent of her future relatives may have been daunting and perhaps influenced her to change. The accent is definitely a wannabe posh English accent but doesn't quite make it compared to her in-laws or other upper middle/upper class English people.

There was a voice mail recording of Mary where she speaks with a normal Aussie accent- just the same as her siblings. The change was evident and her brother made a comment about how her accent had changed. Mary's present English accent is not genuine and though she may have had elocution lessons, which might explain the inexplicable change, she does not seem comfortable speaking in English these days- too many gaps in the syntax.

[Jo of Palatine]

Originally Posted by juliana

Mary's mother-in-law and ex-sister-in- law speak beautiful English with lovely upper class English accents, but not Fred- he has more of an American accent. Perhaps hearing the upper class English accent of her future relatives may have been daunting and perhaps influenced her to change. The accent is definitely a wannabe posh English accent but doesn't quite make it compared to her in-laws or other upper middle/upper class English people.

Personally I find it pretty unpolite or even arrogant to label the way somebody else talks in the best of intentions (eg giving verbal support to charities or highlighting events through attending and speaking there) as talking with a "wannabe" accent of whatever kind. But that's my personal opinion, of course.

As for Mary speaking the way she does: I guess you never heard the terrible German accent and sometimes quite queer grammar queen Silvia presents when interviewed by German TV or giving a speech here in her "fatherland". I'm convinced that it's because the queen grew up in Brazil talking Portugese with her mother's family while being educated by German nuns, then returning to Germany, after that embarquing on a relationship with a man who didn't speak either German or Portugese, so English was the choice of language till she learned enough Swedish to cope there. Swedish friends claim the queen never really mastered the language and has a terrible (German!) accent... And I'm convinced she lost her grip of German....

Does that make the queen of Sweden into a "wannabe" instead of a honest person? I don't think so. IMHO the Crown Princess of Denmark is as much trying to adapt as her Swedish counterpart on the throne did. And it is much more difficult to learn a new language as an adult if you never learned one before - while queen Silvia grew up with a mother's tongue and a father's language. Truly - for me it doesn't matter if Mary spoke "Kauderwelsch" (which is a German word meaning someone who tried to speak French in a time when well-educated upper class people spoke French but didn't manage well on mixing words from German and French...). I like what she says and how she interacts with people. And there have been Royal consorts before who never even mastered one word in their new homeland's language.....

[UserDane]

Well said, Jo of Palatine

[juliana]

Originally Posted by Jo of Palatine

Personally I find it pretty unpolite or even arrogant to label the way somebody else talks in the best of intentions (eg giving verbal support to charities or highlighting events through attending and speaking there) as talking with a "wannabe" accent of whatever kind. But that's my personal opinion, of course.

Wannabe= would be and what is wrong with that? You do make impolite remarks about others that you disagree with, I must say.
My comments were about her English accent - that of her Danish skills, not being a Danish speaker, I would never be able to comment on so why would non-native English speakers try to offend those that do have actual knowledge so that an opinion can be posted on this board. My comments were purely about her accent and syntax, nothing else, so please don't try to harbour misintention.
Not sure why the Silvia came up either- this is not about her.