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  #461  
Old 07-25-2019, 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by theroyalfly View Post
There must have created a bigger issue inside the RF. I wonder how King Philippe reacted to it.


Claire can't just hold it in. If I were Laurent's wife, I would have walked out. I respect Claire so much as to how she manages herself in awkward situations like this.

Honestly, I don´t wanne know about what happened in that Palace after the parade...

About Claire: She reacted absolutely correct. "Walking out" would have caused a major scandal in the media - even bigger than the telephone incident itself!
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  #462  
Old 07-25-2019, 12:29 PM
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Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
Honestly, I don´t wanne know about what happened in that Palace after the parade... [....]
To be fair: the replacement of Prince Laurent to a side dais was like begging the devil.
Who was the dumb and the goof here? The Court (and King Philippe agreeing with that) or Prince Laurent, who is provoked to obnoxious behaviour? I think Philippe and Mathilde have insulted him to his core fundaments, for the eye of the Nation.

Result? Headlines like "The Royal House has never been so visibly divided", see https://gpdhome.typepad.com/.a/6a00d...87e5426970b-pi

What were Philippe and Mathilde THINKING??? Did they really expect Prince Laurent swallow it as a docile sheep?
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  #463  
Old 07-25-2019, 12:50 PM
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To be fair: the replacement of Prince Laurent to a side dais was like begging the devil.
Who was the dumb and the goof here? The Court (and King Philippe agreeing with that) or Prince Laurent, who is provoked to obnoxious behaviour? I think Philippe and Mathilde have insulted him to his core fundaments, for the eye of the Nation.

Result? Headlines like "The Royal House has never been so visibly divided", see https://gpdhome.typepad.com/.a/6a00d...87e5426970b-pi

What were Philippe and Mathilde THINKING??? Did they really expect Prince Laurent swallow it as a docile sheep?

Sorry...?! Members of the RF not being the King and Queen and their children have been seated that way for years - that´s neither new nor surprising. Neither L nor Astrid are the sovereign couple or their immediate heirs so their seating is absolutely proper and correct, like it would be done in other Royal Houses, too!
Laurent is not a "docile sheep" at all! He´s behaving like if Philippe betrayed him of the throne. But he didn´t! His elder brother is the monarch and Ph. and Mathilde having children, he is way down the pecking order, it was his rightful place. That´s how things work since 100s of years and Laurent knows that pretty well!
If he felt treated unjustified (which was not the case when it came to seating- contrary, he just took a seat pretty aggressively which was obviously not occupyed for him), there was still no need to telephone during that parade! If he was a gentleman, which I start to doubt, he would take any seat which was prepared for him.

The only question is, who´s prerogative, by line of succession, is to sit closer to the Royal dais, Laurent or Astrid?
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  #464  
Old 07-25-2019, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
Sorry...?! Members of the RF not being the King and Queen and their children have been seated that way for years - that´s neither new nor surprising. Neither L nor Astrid are the sovereign couple or their immediate heirs so their seating is absolutley proper and correct, like it would be done in other Royal Houses, too!
Laurent is nogt a docile sheep at all! He´s behaving like Philippe betrayed him of the throne. But he didn´t! His elder brother is the monarch and Ph. and Mathilde having children, he is way down the pecking order, his rightful place. That´s how things work since 100s of years and Laurent knows that pretty well!
If he felt treated unjustified (which was not the case when it came to seating- contrary, he just took a seat pretty aggressively which was obviously not occuoeid for him), there was still no need to telephone during that parade!


The only question is, who´s prerogative, by line of succession, is to sit closer to the Royal dais, Laurent or Astrid?
Astrid. She is 5th in the line of succession, after the King’s children.

One of the stories upthread says Laurent took Astrid’s seat, that she had already been shown to, when he arrived as she was off talking to someone and it was empty. Then Laurent wouldn’t move.
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  #465  
Old 07-25-2019, 01:02 PM
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Princess Claire also suits herself and has been missing from many other family events of late,National Day is the 1st we've seen of her in an official capacity in some time.
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  #466  
Old 07-25-2019, 01:23 PM
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Watch this video at 1:28/ 29! Pr. Laurent left the parade BEFORE the King and Queen and their children (didn´t know that!)! Obviously he decided to kick protocol with his feet that day... He is such a loose canon!



I can only repeat myself: I really didn´t want to be present in the palace afterwards...
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  #467  
Old 07-25-2019, 01:56 PM
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Just...wow. I kind of have a soft spot for Laurent because I feel he has suffered terribly. But he doesn't do himself any favors.
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  #468  
Old 07-25-2019, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
Sorry...?! Members of the RF not being the King and Queen and their children have been seated that way for years - that´s neither new nor surprising. Neither L nor Astrid are the sovereign couple or their immediate heirs so their seating is absolutely proper and correct, like it would be done in other Royal Houses, too!
Laurent is not a "docile sheep" at all! He´s behaving like if Philippe betrayed him of the throne. But he didn´t! His elder brother is the monarch and Ph. and Mathilde having children, he is way down the pecking order, it was his rightful place. That´s how things work since 100s of years and Laurent knows that pretty well!
If he felt treated unjustified (which was not the case when it came to seating- contrary, he just took a seat pretty aggressively which was obviously not occupyed for him), there was still no need to telephone during that parade! If he was a gentleman, which I start to doubt, he would take any seat which was prepared for him.

The only question is, who´s prerogative, by line of succession, is to sit closer to the Royal dais, Laurent or Astrid?
Last year's humiliating arrangement was actually new. It used to be like this, just besides the King: https://nbocdn.akamaized.net/Assets/....0909091__.jpg

And it became a velvet box, far from his brother: https://nieuws.medialaancdn.be/sites...7/defile_0.jpg
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  #469  
Old 07-25-2019, 02:25 PM
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The first photo seems to be exactly as they are seated now, aren't the King and Queen just walking past to their own seats.

I agree the one chair on its own for Laurent was pretty bad but that was a year when Astrid didn't attend if I recall. Personally I would have thought those in charge would simply have fitted and extra chair in the main dais rather than have Laurent by himself.
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  #470  
Old 07-25-2019, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
Watch this video at 1:28/ 29! Pr. Laurent left the parade BEFORE the King and Queen and their children (didn´t know that!)! Obviously he decided to kick protocol with his feet that day... He is such a loose canon!



I can only repeat myself: I really didn´t want to be present in the palace afterwards...
When I watched the parade I noticed him missing when the family was going back together to the palace, but I didn't see him leaving before the Sovereigns.

I agree that the separate bench only for him was really a bad decision and if Philippe was aware of that, it was a terrible mistake from him, no matter what protocol demands. But if I remember correctly, it was the first year after the enthronement, and Philippe was a "young" king and still inexperienced. Laurent is constantly throwing a tantrum, there is no excuse for that. Not anymore.
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  #471  
Old 07-25-2019, 03:51 PM
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I noticed in that video above that following the Parade that Prince Emmanuel walks directly behind the king then Princess Eleonore followed by the queen,duchess of Brabant and Prince Gabriel to greet the dignitaries.There seems to be no clear protocol or order of precedence and little wonder the Palace Protocol office is in such disarray.

It was silly not seating the kings siblings and spouses on the right hand side of the Dais and have all the Royal Family seated in the same area.
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  #472  
Old 07-25-2019, 04:13 PM
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I noticed in that video above that following the Parade that Prince Emmanuel walks directly behind the king then Princess Eleonore followed by the queen,duchess of Brabant and Prince Gabriel to greet the dignitaries.There seems to be no clear protocol or order of precedence and little wonder the Palace Protocol office is in such disarray.

It was silly not seating the kings siblings and spouses on the right hand side of the Dais and have all the Royal Family seated in the same area.
It is not something new. It has been like that for years. When Albert was king, only Philippe and Mathilde sat in the main dais. I expect the same thing happening with Philippe's kids once Elisabeth will get married.

As for the protocol, I think the royals unfortunately don't seem to pay really attention to it. However we are talking about kids (especially Eleonore and Emmanuel). They are surely forgiven because they don't really spend time with those authorities talking like Philippe and Mathilde do.
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  #473  
Old 07-25-2019, 04:24 PM
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Originally Posted by An Ard Ri View Post
I noticed in that video above that following the Parade that Prince Emmanuel walks directly behind the king then Princess Eleonore followed by the queen,duchess of Brabant and Prince Gabriel to greet the dignitaries.There seems to be no clear protocol or order of precedence and little wonder the Palace Protocol office is in such disarray.

It was silly not seating the kings siblings and spouses on the right hand side of the Dais and have all the Royal Family seated in the same area.

I don't think they follow an order of precedence for the children, but they do for Astrid's and Laurent's families, which is fine. I am sure that, after Elisabeth turns 18, she will be accorded precedence.


Although I am generally in favor of observing protocol, I think it is OK not to put children like Emmanuel or Eleonore in a position where they may feel inferior to their older siblings.
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  #474  
Old 07-25-2019, 04:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Last year's humiliating arrangement was actually new. It used to be like this, just besides the King: https://nbocdn.akamaized.net/Assets/....0909091__.jpg

And it became a velvet box, far from his brother: https://nieuws.medialaancdn.be/sites...7/defile_0.jpg
That velvet box dates from 3 years ago (see heading mentioning 2016 in the other link). Apparently because Laurent's wife nor his sister and brother-in-law were willing yo show up, which meant very little space was needed. The smart thing to do would have been to find a less awkward seating arrangement.
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  #475  
Old 07-25-2019, 05:13 PM
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I don't think they follow an order of precedence for the children, but they do for Astrid's and Laurent's families, which is fine. I am sure that, after Elisabeth turns 18, she will be accorded precedence.


Although I am generally in favor of observing protocol, I think it is OK not to put children like Emmanuel or Eleonore in a position where they may feel inferior to their older siblings.
The Duchess of Brabant should have been 1st in line after the king and queen as she 1st in line of succession after that the rest didn't really matter as much.
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  #476  
Old 07-25-2019, 07:22 PM
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Originally Posted by An Ard Ri View Post
I noticed in that video above that following the Parade that Prince Emmanuel walks directly behind the king then Princess Eleonore followed by the queen,duchess of Brabant and Prince Gabriel to greet the dignitaries.There seems to be no clear protocol or order of precedence and little wonder the Palace Protocol office is in such disarray.

It was silly not seating the kings siblings and spouses on the right hand side of the Dais and have all the Royal Family seated in the same area.
At last someone observed it this way. Have you noticed the King's children's seating arrangement too?
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  #477  
Old 07-25-2019, 07:32 PM
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Normally they are very well organized; with Filip and Mathilde in the middle, Elisabeth and Gabriel on either side and Emmanuel with Elisabeth and Eleonore with Gabriel. This is probably some kind of transition phase in which that original plan no longer is as needed as the younger kids can fend for themselves, so some rearranging might be in order.
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  #478  
Old 07-26-2019, 02:11 AM
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A well-written article from Vanitatis about Princess Claire's commendable composure.

**https://www.vanitatis.elconfidencial...bieta_2144403/
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  #479  
Old 07-26-2019, 02:18 AM
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Normally they are very well organized; with Filip and Mathilde in the middle, Elisabeth and Gabriel on either side and Emmanuel with Elisabeth and Eleonore with Gabriel. This is probably some kind of transition phase in which that original plan no longer is as needed as the younger kids can fend for themselves, so some rearranging might be in order.

The Belgian Court often gives the impression they are in need of a functional reorganization. Remember the chaos at Queen Fabiola's funeral, which really could be categorized as an event able to be planned years in advance, with blueprints, repeated rehearsals and updates.
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  #480  
Old 07-26-2019, 03:17 AM
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The Belgian Court often gives the impression they are in need of a functional reorganization. Remember the chaos at Queen Fabiola's funeral, which really could be categorized as an event able to be planned years in advance, with blueprints, repeated rehearsals and updates.
And also the unnecessary and tardy confusion the Belgian Court caused over the titles and style of Prince Amedeo of Belgium wife Elisabetta von Wolkenstein which went on for years!
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