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  #961  
Old 05-02-2020, 07:50 AM
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William did both Spanish and Latin for his GCSE's but he didn't continue with any language (including English) for his A-levels.
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  #962  
Old 05-02-2020, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by janet14 View Post
The one thing ALL British monarchs have to learn is how NOT to be political figures!
So true. The last monarch who tried to be political was forced to abdicate (and yes I know that marrying a divorced American was the excuse given but if not Wallis some other excuse would have been found as the government were determined he had to go - as he was 'too political').

The one before that, who became 'too political' for the politicians of the day lost his head.

The English/British do NOT want a monarch who is involved in politics. They are a figurehead only and not a politician or diplomat but a symbol.
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  #963  
Old 05-02-2020, 08:33 AM
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Originally Posted by janet14 View Post
The one thing ALL British monarchs have to learn is how NOT to be political figures!
After all, British monarchs are expected to be neutral. The same applies to members of the Royal Family. It's for this reason why Princess Margaret's grandson failed to win a seat in the House of Lords after one got vacated and elections were held for that seat to be filled.
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  #964  
Old 05-02-2020, 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post

The one before that, who became 'too political' for the politicians of the day lost his head.

The English/British do NOT want a monarch who is involved in politics. They are a figurehead only and not a politician or diplomat but a symbol.
True, but I wonder, since when - since after the Tudors?

In Germany we don't have a freedom loving society, still not... but we have the "consensus society", calm and order are the first civil duties... and this since the "30 years war", in which the Germanics almost exterminated themselves; the remnants became the Germans. And this german desire for civil peace can easily be abused: Promise us calm and we will follow You...

So, since when does the modern, freedom and an "apolitical monarchy" loving "English/British" nation exist? And I wonder, if this could change...!

I once did read a book called "The Aachen Memorandum"... it was a prophetic vision of the UK leaving the EU - and the Mountbatten-Windsors as then royals of only New Zeeland returned in the end, triumphantly, if I remember it right...
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  #965  
Old 05-02-2020, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by victor1319 View Post
True, but I wonder, since when - since after the Tudors?

In Germany we don't have a freedom loving society, still not... but we have the "consensus society", calm and order are the first civil duties... and this since the "30 years war", in which the Germanics almost exterminated themselves; the remnants became the Germans. And this german desire for civil peace can easily be abused: Promise us calm and we will follow You...

So, since when does the modern, freedom and an "apolitical monarchy" loving "English/British" nation exist? And I wonder, if this could change...!

I once did read a book called "The Aachen Memorandum"... it was a prophetic vision of the UK leaving the EU - and the Mountbatten-Windsors as then royals of only New Zeeland returned in the end, triumphantly, if I remember it right...
The British monarchy has been "non political" for a long time. George III was the last monarch to be acitve in politics. Gradually, from then on as party politics developed, the Monarch became a neutral figure who is not supposed to intervene, not supposed to allow his political views to be known, and to stand above party politics, allowing the democratic process to work. He or she is the king or queen of ALL the people, and so cannot favour one party over another.
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  #966  
Old 05-02-2020, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
The British monarchy has been "non political" for a long time. George III was the last monarch to be acitve in politics. Gradually, from then on as party politics developed, the Monarch became a neutral figure who is not supposed to intervene, not supposed to allow his political views to be known, and to stand above party politics, allowing the democratic process to work. He or she is the king or queen of ALL the people, and so cannot favour one party over another.
George III was probably the last overly political monarch in the UK , but the transition from an executive monarch to a ceremonial one was actually a gradual process.

William IV , if I am not mistaken, was the last monarch to dismiss a prime minister ( in 1834) and try to install a minority government. The new government was forced to call an election , which it lost, and the King had to call back the previous PM whom he had dismissed.

The young Queen Victoria also considered the possibility of refusing ministerial advice, which would have led to a resignation of the PM, during the so-called “ bedchamber crisis”, but ultimately didn’t do it. Nevertheless, throughout her reign, Queen Victoria was probably far more iactively engaged with government policy and foreign policy in particular than Queen Elizabeth II is today .

I suppose the game changers that really triggered the monarch’s gradual withdrawal from politics in the UK were , first, Parliament taking control of government finances and legislation, which meant that a government could not function in practice without a working majority in the House of Commons, and, second, the expansion of franchise and parliamentary reform, which led to competitive elections where the government of the day was no longer guaranteed to keep its majority in the event of a dissolution .The British monarch then, unlike other sovereigns like Pedro II of Brazil, could not pick a party of his/her choice to form the government with the expectation that a fresh election would automatically return a majority to support it.
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  #967  
Old 05-02-2020, 09:29 AM
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Yes I agree it was a gradual process but it would be too detailed to go into all the ins and outs. But the fact is that for the past 100 years, the monarch has been expected to stay out of politics.. the government is formed by the people elected by the public and the monarch cannot intervene in that process.. and he or she is the monarch for all his people, Labour or conservative, poor or rich.. etc.
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  #968  
Old 05-02-2020, 11:08 AM
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Conclusion: Prince William is very suitable. His duty is essentially to keep his mouth shut and to wave. Which he does in a terrific way. And he was already "suitable" when he was in his mother's womb because even being born after his father's death would have made him an heir anyway. Mind you, a better illustration that there is no any requirement for this "job", is hard to find.
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  #969  
Old 05-02-2020, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post


Conclusion: Prince William is very suitable. His duty is essentially to keep his mouth shut and to wave. Which he does in a terrific way. And he was already "suitable" when he was in his mother's womb because even being born after his father's death would have made him an heir anyway. Mind you, a better illustration that there is no any requirement for this "job", is hard to find.
You know a king's job is more than waving and being shut.
A King has to advise the government and be aware of the whole political situation, besides that he has many other duties.
It is a symbolic function but of great responsibility.
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  #970  
Old 05-02-2020, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Blog Real View Post
You know a king's job is more than waving and being shut.
A King has to advise the government and be aware of the whole political situation, besides that he has many other duties.
It is a symbolic function but of great responsibility.
Come on. As if the Queen had any influence on Cameron, May and Johnson.
The Supreme Court unanimously ruled that prorogation of Parliament was unlawful. The only thing the Queen could do is to walk to a room where a table was, with a cloth and two candles. The Honourable Jacob Rees Mogg Esq. read the Prorogation of Parliament - wilfully abusing the monarch- and the only thing the Queen could do was to nod her head and pronounce the word: "approved". Anything other than this was a constitutional crisis. Let us be honest about who is the puppet and the puppetmaster
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  #971  
Old 05-02-2020, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Come on. As if the Queen had any influence on Cameron, May and Johnson.
The Supreme Court unanimously ruled that prorogation of Parliament was unlawful. The only thing the Queen could do is to walk to a room where a table was, with a cloth and two candles. The Honourable Jacob Rees Mogg Esq. read the Prorogation of Parliament - wilfully abusing the monarch- and the only thing the Queen could do was to nod her head and pronounce the word: "approved". Anything other than this was a constitutional crisis. Let us be honest about who is the puppet and the puppetmaster
But the same goes for the heads of state of the republics.
The role of a head of state is to represent a country and this requires preparation. Prince William is being prepared, obviously.
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  #972  
Old 05-02-2020, 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Come on. As if the Queen had any influence on Cameron, May and Johnson.
The Supreme Court unanimously ruled that prorogation of Parliament was unlawful. The only thing the Queen could do is to walk to a room where a table was, with a cloth and two candles. The Honourable Jacob Rees Mogg Esq. read the Prorogation of Parliament - wilfully abusing the monarch- and the only thing the Queen could do was to nod her head and pronounce the word: "approved". Anything other than this was a constitutional crisis. Let us be honest about who is the puppet and the puppetmaster
Very well said. At the end of the day, the monarch is essentially a rubber stamp for the government. Their main duty is smile and wave, smile and wave.
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  #973  
Old 05-02-2020, 01:33 PM
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Very well said. At the end of the day, the monarch is essentially a rubber stamp for the government. Their main duty is smile and wave, smile and wave.
It depends, King Juan Carlos, for example, made decisions during his reign and used his influence and his contacts to bring business to Spain. She did a lot more than smile and wave...
King Felipe VI is not as influential as his father, but in this pandemic situation he also used his contacts to raise protective materials and fans for Spain.
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  #974  
Old 05-02-2020, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Blog Real View Post
But the same goes for the heads of state of the republics.
The role of a head of state is to represent a country and this requires preparation. Prince William is being prepared, obviously.

Since before his birth, if one takes in to account, how his parents met.

And this is much more, than one can say about all these political adventurers, which had childhood dreams of being an astronaut, a cowboy or a fireman... and ended up by accident as head of state...

And if one thinks, the Monarch should have more power: A) Beware what you ask for... and B) We are not living at the end of history... The Monarch is there as potential political leader in times of societal turmoil, always!
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  #975  
Old 05-02-2020, 03:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post


Conclusion: Prince William is very suitable. His duty is essentially to keep his mouth shut and to wave. Which he does in a terrific way. And he was already "suitable" when he was in his mother's womb because even being born after his father's death would have made him an heir anyway. Mind you, a better illustration that there is no any requirement for this "job", is hard to find.
History has taught us that eligibility is not necessarily the same as suitability - as William will surely be aware of based on the history with his grandmother's uncle... The Belgians might also add their own story with king Leopold to show that some are more suitable than others to fulfil the role of Sovereign.
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  #976  
Old 05-02-2020, 04:47 PM
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I have no idea what William's political views are so in that regard he's eminently suitable to be king. We don't need or want to know & he doesn't share his views publicly that I'm aware of. So everyone's happy.
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  #977  
Old 05-02-2020, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Blog Real View Post
You know a king's job is more than waving and being shut.
A King has to advise the government and be aware of the whole political situation, besides that he has many other duties.
It is a symbolic function but of great responsibility.
Kings do not have to advise the government.. it is the other way around. The government advises the king on what they require him to do...
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  #978  
Old 05-03-2020, 09:09 AM
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https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-10313818.html

A quick summary of the position at the link above.

Of course constitutional monarchy is undemocratic , no argument, but no one's yet come up with a reason that's convinced the public or Parliament that it's worth taking time to prioritise a debate on alternatives, a referendum, parliamentary
sessions, legal instruments etc, when there are so many other demands on government.
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  #979  
Old 05-03-2020, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Blog Real View Post
It depends, King Juan Carlos, for example, made decisions during his reign and used his influence and his contacts to bring business to Spain. She did a lot more than smile and wave...
King Felipe VI is not as influential as his father, but in this pandemic situation he also used his contacts to raise protective materials and fans for Spain.
You are comparing apples to oranges.

The UK is a well established democracy whilst when Juan Carlos took the throne, Spain emerged from a dictatorship and was again taking baby steps towards a democracy.

Even with Spain, Juan Carlos was forced to abdicate to keep Spain a Monarchy.
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  #980  
Old 05-03-2020, 11:56 AM
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I have no idea what William's political views are so in that regard he's eminently suitable to be king. We don't need or want to know & he doesn't share his views publicly that I'm aware of. So everyone's happy.
Yes, that is good but I would not be surprised if William does not have any political views (or religious views) like most of our generation. Plus, being interested in politics requires a certain level of intellectual curiosity that William seemingly does not possess.
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