Prince William and Catherine Middleton Possible Titles

[Kataryn]

I like the Duke of Clarence and St. Andrews. They will one day(maybe/probably) live in Clarence House and they both met at St. Andrews Uni. It makes the most sense to me. I can't believe the wedding is less than three months away.

As I learned in this thread, there is already a "Royal" Earl of St. Andrews - it's the secondary title of HRH The Duke of Kent, so his heir uses it as his courtesy title. It's a pity, though.

 

[Lady Deborah]

There is so much knowledge here it is truly fascinating and all are to be commended!

 

[Mirabel]

I really hope it is The Duke of Cambridge...I love the sound of that..

I like it too.
I also like Duke of Richmond.

But I read some speculation that William may not get a title, since the Queen is now in her eighties (Phillip is ninety) and, in the nature of things, a title or two may become available quite soon.
In that case it may not be worthwhile creating one for William (but I hope they do).

 

[Jacknch]

There is so much knowledge here it is truly fascinating and all are to be commended!

I agree with you! It is the only place to be able to find out and see information and facts, as well as develop opinions and obtain such a wide variety of ideas and thoughts.

 

[EmpressRouge]

As I learned in this thread, there is already a "Royal" Earl of St. Andrews - it's the secondary title of HRH The Duke of Kent, so his heir uses it as his courtesy title. It's a pity, though.

St. Andrews might be taken, but a Scottish would be very appropriate since the couple met there. Throwing random ideas out there (if any of these are impossible or already exists, please correct me): something new like Duke of Glasgow? Duke of Aberdeenshire? Duke of Balmoral? Duke of Ross? The most royal would be Duke of Albany (as long as the Saxe-Coburg-Gotha heirs don't mind)

 

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi,

My 2 cents:

I think the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge is appropriate for the Heir to the Heir to the Throne and his wife.
William and Catherine should have ducal titles since they are so high up in the Order of Succession.
Harry should get a title too (but not until his wedding) but perhaps an Earldom, as he is not as important as William....

Also, I think Catherine should be lent the 'Fringe Tiara' that The Queen wore at her wedding, so as to carry on a tradition...
I understand that The Queen still likes to wear this occasionally, so Catherine can return it after the wedding
She doesn't need to keep it, just borrow it for a day!!

Larry

 

[Lumutqueen]

THEY - aren't high up in the order of succesion, he is.
Harry is just as important as William, if he doesn't have any children.
What tradition?

 

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi,

I respectfully disagree.
"They" are important as she will be Queen and that is high up in the succession order. "They" are going to be a 'unit'....

The tradition is that The Queen wore the tiara and so did Princess Anne, I believe..
Diana didn't need the fringe tiara as she had her own family's...

Larry

 

[Lumutqueen]

She will be The Queen in name only, she will not be in line for the succesion, only her children will be.
Catherine isn't part of the family, why would she wear the "family" tiara it seems?

 

[Kataryn]

The full name of the fringe tiara is The Hanover Russian Fringe Tiara which Queen Mary commissioned in 1919 to be made from a tiara and fitting necklace she got from Queen Victoria as a wedding gift. Later Queen Mary gave the tiara as a present to the then Queen Elizabeth who loaned it to her daughter Princess Elizabeth as the "something borrowed". When Princess Anne married, it was loaned to her by The Queen Mother.

So it would be fitting as a "loaned" tiara for Catherine Middleton. I don't see the queen loaning it to Zara Philips, even though that would be much more traditional but it's too glamourous and regal for her, I think. Probably Zara will wear her mother's Greek Key Tiara, as it's a lot more understated but very chic, especially for such a classical beauty like Zara.

 

[Kataryn]

She will be The Queen in name only, she will not be in line for the succesion, only her children will be.
Catherine isn't part of the family, why would she wear the "family" tiara it seems?

Since when do wifes not belong to their husband's family? And why then "family" tiara when the future wife of the heir of the heir got the jewels as a wedding gift from her new husband's grandmother The Queen (Victoria) and had the stones reworked into this tiara which she gave then to the new queen consort Elizabeth in 1936?

Okay, you may argue that Mary of Teck was already part fo the family, even before she married her George and queen Elizabeth was already her daughter-in-law ehn she got the tiare, but still.... Catherine is going to be a future queen consort and thus may well wear such a traditional tiara.

 

[FasterB]

She will be The Queen in name only, she will not be in line for the succesion, only her children will be.
Catherine isn't part of the family, why would she wear the "family" tiara it seems?

Well, QMII loaned the danish wedding veil to the then Miss Donaldson, when she married CP Frederik and became CPss Mary. So it can happen

 

[EmpressRouge]

Well, OMII loaned the danish wedding veil to the then Miss Donaldson, when she married CP Frederik and became CPss Mary. So it can happen

True, but not Khedive tiara, which only female descendants of Ingrid of Sweden (or female-line descendants of Margaret of Connaught) have worn.

 

[Lumutqueen]

Since when do wifes not belong to their husband's family? And why then "family" tiara when the future wife of the heir of the heir got the jewels as a wedding gift from her new husband's grandmother The Queen (Victoria) and had the stones reworked into this tiara which she gave then to the new queen consort Elizabeth in 1936?

I don't understand what the last part if your sentence actualy says?

And, William is also part of the Spencer family is her not, so Catherine should have rights to the Spencer Tiara as well as the royals ones.
Did Sarah or Diana where this tiara when they got married? Or has it just been worn by HM and Princess Anne?

 

[Saragli]

I don't think that already have a Earl of St. Andrews will matter all that much. It is possible to have a Duke and an Earl with the same name. Plus, they would only be known as the D and D of St. Andrews when they are in Scotland and Duke of Clarence everywhere else. The St. Andrews would rarely collide.

 

[Lumutqueen]

I think it matters quite a bit that they'll be two St Andrews titles.

 

[FasterB]

True, but not Khedive tiara, which only female descendants of Ingrid of Sweden (or female-line descendants of Margaret of Connaught) have worn.

That´s right, but it was quite significant IMO that QMII loaned the veil to CPss Mary

But perhaps we can view at the danish wedding veil and the british tiara as the same, since the BRF doesn´t have a wedding veil, as far as I know

 

[Lumutqueen]

If there is anything we do know, it's that the BRF is incredible different to the European royals.

 

[Roslyn]

I expect Kate to wear "family" tiaras and other jewels after she's married, but I would not expect her to wear a family tiara at her wedding, since she won't be a member of the Royal family till the ceremony's over. Since her own family doesn't have a family tiara, I suspect she will do what Sarah did and wear a floral arrangement in her hair till the paperwork is signed, then walk out sporting a new tiara. I don't think she'll walk out of the church in a family tiara, but in one of her own, which I think will be elegant yet modern.

 

[FasterB]

If there is anything we do know, it's that the BRF is incredible different to the European royals.

So true, so true

 

[Lady Ann]

I like it too.
I also like Duke of Richmond.

But I read some speculation that William may not get a title, since the Queen is now in her eighties (Phillip is ninety) and, in the nature of things, a title or two may become available quite soon.
In that case it may not be worthwhile creating one for William (but I hope they do).

Well, I also see nothing wrong with him staying Prince William of Wales and Kate, Princess William of Wales for Hopefully what will be a long while...before the other titles become available but if the Queen does give him a title on his wedding Duke of Richmand is not my frist chocie but not a bad one either ...I like it too...

 

[Taroonababe]

So true, so true [/QUOTE

Thankfully. (for the Europenas at any rate).

 

[jdcharlie]

I expect Kate to wear "family" tiaras and other jewels after she's married, but I would not expect her to wear a family tiara at her wedding, since she won't be a member of the Royal family till the ceremony's over. Since her own family doesn't have a family tiara, I suspect she will do what Sarah did and wear a floral arrangement in her hair till the paperwork is signed, then walk out sporting a new tiara. I don't think she'll walk out of the church in a family tiara, but in one of her own, which I think will be elegant yet modern.

Oh, I hope she doesn't wear the floral arrangement in and a tiara out. I know she won't be "official" until after she signs the documents, but the flower headpiece switcheroo, in my very honest opinion, is just sooo tacky. If nobody purchases a tiara for her (if that is indeed what will be required), I'd rather see her go without than switch halfway through. (Sorry Fergie lovers!)

 

[Mermaid1962]

Catherine isn't a Spencer, though. Diana and her sisters wore the tiara at their weddings because they were daughters of the Earl Spencer; otherwise, only the Countess Spencer has the right to wear it. A bride wears the tiara of her own family unless one is given/loaned to her by the family into which she's marrying, and Catherine's married name won't be Spencer.

Diana and Sarah never wore the fringe tiara. In fact, I think that the only tiara Sarah ever wore was the one she was married in, although I could be wrong there.

And, William is also part of the Spencer family is her not, so Catherine should have rights to the Spencer Tiara as well as the royals ones.
Did Sarah or Diana where this tiara when they got married?

 

[Kataryn]

Maybe Catherine surprises us all and does a "queen Mary"? She has designed jewelery before and could be given stones from HM's private collection to design a new tiara which is then made by a jeweller. To be known as the "new title for William and Catherine"-tiara from then one.

 

[Lady Deborah]

That's a great idea! I wonder if this forum is ever scanned by BRF? maybe they'll adopt your fine idea of Kate designing her own tiara!! And since it's been a while since this was done( Queen Mary was the last time?) it could also be yet another signifiers of the 'modern monarchy'.

 

[Zonk]

Please note that any posts regarding which (if any) tiara Catherine should wear on April 29th should be posted here http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f132/tiaras-and-jewels-for-catherine-middleton-29273-29.html .

 

[Vecchiolarry]

Hi,

I'm sorry, Zonk, but it seems that I'm the one who inadvertently started this tiara rampage by mentioning the fringe tiara on this thread.
I apologize....

Now back to the title:
Although I wouldn't be averse to Clarence -
I still think Duke and Duchess of Cambridge is best...

Larry

 

[EmpressRouge]

I now like Duke of Albany because its Scottish association. Does anyone know if there any legal issues coming from the Saxe-Coburg-Gotha heirs if the Queen were to grant William (or anyone for that matter) their former title?

 

[KittyAtlanta]

Not sure, EmpressRouge; but I believe Ernst can have it if he wants it. Perhaps they have to reserve it for him -- no matter what.