Prince William and Catherine Middleton Possible Titles

[branchg]

The wife of Prince Charles is "HRH The Princess Charles, Duchess of Rothesay, Countess of Carrick, Baroness Renfrew and Princess of Scotland" in Scotland.

The last two are simply styles reflecting the ancient offices of the heir to the Scottish throne, which are not titles in the Peerage of Scotland.

Would Prince Charles have become The Prince Charles and The Duke of Cornwall immediately after George VI's death? Or would he have remained Prince Charles until his mother's coronation?

Yes. Charles was "HRH Prince Charles of Edinburgh" until his mother succeeded to the throne in 1952. At that point, he automatically became "HRH The Prince Charles, Duke of Cornwall, Duke of Rothesay, Earl of Carrick, Baron of Renfrew, Lord of the Isles, Prince & Great Steward of Scotland" as the eldest son and heir of The Sovereign.

In 1958, his mother created him "Prince of Wales and Earl of Chester".

 

[Leslie2006]

I'm thinking the Queen may have to create a new (or renew) a ducal title for William and Kate because the ones that are traditionally used in the BRF (York, Kent, Gloucester, Edinburgh) are already in use by other royal family members. William may end up with something like Duke of Clarence, Fife or Albany, maybe even Connaught & Strathearn.

 

[Sister Morphine]

There's already been a lot of discussion in previous threads about what ducal titles are available, what aren't, and those that aren't a possibility. The frontrunner it would appear, is Cambridge.

 

[branchg]

Duke of Clarence or Duke of Cambridge are probably the two likely choices.

 

[Skippy]

I think Duke of Cambridge has the nicest and best sound. It is the second oldest university in England and a prestigious one, if I am correct. William is second in line to the throne, so there is a similarity already .

 

[MRSJ]

My thought is Prince William will take no title...just my opinion that he will choose to remain Prince William of Wales and Catherine will be Princess William- that's my guess!

 

[Zonk]

Any and all discussions regarding Prince Charles's title should be in the http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f44/prince-of-wales-title-and-succession-14668-2.html thread.

Zonk
British Forums Moderator

 

[ladongas]

"the other place"

If he's to be Duke of Cambridge, will the old Oxonians refer to him as the Duke of "the other place"?

 

[Iluvbertie]

...William may end up with something like Duke of Clarence, Fife or Albany, maybe even Connaught & Strathearn.

Albany is not available as there are 'heirs male of the body' able to petition parliament to have the title restored. Until it merges with the Crown it simply isn't an option.

Connaught isn't an option either as it is in the Republic of Ireland and there is no way that the Queen will create a title that has its place name in a country over which she is no longer Queen.

Would Prince Charles have become The Prince Charles and The Duke of Cornwall immediately after George VI's death?

It was instantaneus - just as his mother instantly become Queen, Charles instantly became The Prince Charles, Duke of Cornwall, Duke of Rothesay etc and Anne became The Princess Anne.

 

[Lady Oona]

Duke of Anglesey?

There is an Earl of Anglesey that in the 17th century went extinct, I would love to see it brought back and altered to a dukedom (I have no clue if thats even possible) for William and Catherine. It would be a great reminder of where they started their life together.

 

[Kataryn]

There is an Earl of Anglesey that in the 17th century went extinct, I would love to see it brought back and altered to a dukedom (I have no clue if thats even possible) for William and Catherine. It would be a great reminder of where they started their life together.

Unfortunately it was already brought back in 1815 and became the Marquisate of Anglesey for the Paget family. Currently George Paget is the 7th Marquess of Anglesey.

 

[Leslie2006]

Connaught isn't an option either as it is in the Republic of Ireland and there is no way that the Queen will create a title that has its place name in a country over which she is no longer Queen.

Oh. I didn't know that. I honestly thought Connaught was within the UK. My bad.

 

[Sister Morphine]

If for some reason we're all wrong about Cambridge being the likely choice, are there any available dukedoms or earldoms in Wales that the Queen could give to William? Seeing as how he's a prince of Wales, they'll be living in Wales, I think something like that would a great idea.

 

[NGalitzine]

... William may end up with something like Duke of Clarence, Fife or Albany, maybe even Connaught & Strathearn.

I think the current Duke of Fife, a cousin of The Queen, might object to his title being given to William.

 

[rossop7]

If for some reason we're all wrong about Cambridge being the likely choice, are there any available dukedoms or earldoms in Wales that the Queen could give to William? Seeing as how he's a prince of Wales, they'll be living in Wales, I think something like that would a great idea.

I was thinking about that the other day, I've no idea what is actually possible or not or if anything can be done but if it were possible then I think it'd be a great idea to give them a dukedom in Wales...maybe Duke & Duchess of Carmarthenshire or something. I mean Anglesey would be meaningful to them but seeing as Anglesey is fairly tiny itself I'm not sure it'd be a "major enough" title/dukedom for a future King.

 

[Vanya Trubetskoy]

I read the other day, sorry I can't remember where, that William will be the Duke of Clarence.
I think it was on Yahoo. The title of the article was something like 'Wills to take title of Jack the ripper'.
The previous Duke of Clarence was rumored to be the infamous victorian serial killer.
(I think in recent times it was proved he wasn't).

 

[Iluvbertie]

The Clarence title has been rumoured for William, along with Cambridge.
As for the last Duke of Clarence - the idea that he was Jack the Ripper was torn apart as soon as the idea emerged - simply because he was at Balmoral on the occasion of at least two of the murders and he had no medical training but...that something he did might have triggered the murders is another issue altogether - but that is the topic for another thread.

 

[rob2008]

An option such as Duke of Montgomery & Strathern would please the Welsh and Scottish at the same time. The English could accept this because the title will become extinguished upon ascending the throne. Perhaps Duke of Clarence and Teviotdale might be a politically useful combination - with, subsidiarily, Earl of (insert name of available Welsh place).

 

[Lady Oona]

Unfortunately it was already brought back in 1815 and became the Marquisate of Anglesey for the Paget family. Currently George Paget is the 7th Marquess of Anglesey.

Dang it! I got so excited by finding it I did not bother to look any deeper!

 

[Duke of Leaside]

There are titles that have only a masculine form, like eg. The Queen is "The Duke of Lancaster" while on Charles' ascension he will become Duke of Lancaster but his wife won't be Duchess of Lancaster.

The Great steward-title in fact is not really a title, but the name of a Royal office. The Stuarts (Stewarts) started their Royal carreer as Stewards of the king of Scotland, which was the second-in-power to the king. When Walter Stewart showed great sucess at the battle of Bannockburn, he was rewarded with the hand of Marjorie Bruce, daughter of Robert I. (Bruce) of Scotland. When Marjorie's brother David II. died childless, her son Robert II. (Stewart), who had been Great Steward of Scotland and regent during king David II.'s minority became king in 1371 and founded the House of Stuart. Since then the position of Great Stewart of Scotland belonged to the heir apparent of the Scottish monarch. As women can't be heir apparent at the moment, there is no such office as "Great Stewardess". Of course, if the order of succession is changed and this change includes old Scottish titles, and William's first child is a daughter, she could be in her own right the first Princess of Wales, Duchess of Rothesay and Great Stewardess of Scotland. But quite some ifs....

Great! Question answered. Thanks so much for the info.

 

[melissaadrian]

I was thinking about that the other day, I've no idea what is actually possible or not or if anything can be done but if it were possible then I think it'd be a great idea to give them a dukedom in Wales...maybe Duke & Duchess of Carmarthenshire or something. I mean Anglesey would be meaningful to them but seeing as Anglesey is fairly tiny itself I'm not sure it'd be a "major enough" title/dukedom for a future King.

As stated above Anglessy is not an option, not because its too small, but because the Marquess of Anglessy might not like being stripped of his title. Any more then the Duke of Fife would like to be of his.

 

[jdcharlie]

I just heard that the Queen and DoE are visiting Cambridge on April 27. This may be a silly question, but does the Queen have to ask for permission or consult with anyone in the city - or does she do it out of courtesy - before she names William Duke of Cambridge? (If, of course, that is the route she's taking)

http://www.royal.gov.uk/LatestNewsandDiary/Royaldiary/Locationsandtimes.aspx

Literally, the entry reads: "The Queen and The Duke of Edinburgh will visit Cambridge." That seems odd, doesn't it? There is no event associated with the entry.

 

[Iluvbertie]

She wouldn't have to ask anyone to use a place name within her kingdom for a Dukedom.
The visit to Cambridge with no associated events listed could indicate that they will be undertaking more than one event.

 

[Iluvbertie]

As stated above Anglessy is not an option, not because its too small, but because the Marquess of Anglessy might not like being stripped of his title. Any more then the Duke of Fife would like to be of his.

There would be no need to strip the Marquess of his title in creating William a Duke of the same area - there would simply be two titles relating to Anglessy - one a Marquess and one a Duke.

I doubt that the Queen would create him Duke of there but she could, without it impacting the Marquess at all.

Fife is a different proposition as there is already a Duke.

 

[melissaadrian]

I guess if there is a Marquess of Queensbury and a duke, it is possible, but I think it more plausible he be given his own title. Though with the Queensbury it has more to do with 1 family and the division of titles between heirs, not the new creation of a title for a seprate family. Queensbury has an interesting history, never knew there was a canibal in their family tree.

Why not reinstate an old title or create a new like:

Duke of Monmouth- last held by the eldest illegitamite son of Charles II
Duke of Swansea
Duke of Gwynedd

William, Duke of Monmouth and Earl of Doncaster has a ring to it.

I think though we will end up seeing one of the ones suggested when he became engaged like Duke of Camebridge. It is possible he will remain Prince William, since he will become Prince of Wales when his father becomes king. Harry will most certainly get a title when he weds, as he will eventually be second son to the king, like Andrew.

I do hope if he and Harry are dukes, the letter pattents state heir of either gender, unlike York. There is at least one Scottish dukedome that does. It would be nice if their daughter could inherit, instead of it going defunct if they only have daughters like Andrew's. I know it won't really matter for William, as his dukedome would just merge with the crown, but it would be nice if Harry had daughters like his Uncle, they could inherit. Spain and the UK are the only major monarchies in Europe without equal primogeniture. I'm hoping Spain will finally introduce it, since it has two female heirs. Though I guess as long as Felipe and Letizia have no more children, Leonor will be queen.

 

[Iluvbertie]

There are a lot of interesting points here but one thing - William won't necessarily become Prince of Wales when his father becomes King. He will become Duke of Cornwall and Duke of Rothesay but Charles might wait a minute, a day, a week, a month, six months, a year, ten years etc before deciding to create William Prince of Wales.

 

[Kataryn]

William won't necessarily become Prince of Wales when his father becomes King. He will become Duke of Cornwall and Duke of Rothesay but Charles might wait a minute, a day, a week, a month, six months, a year, ten years etc before deciding to create William Prince of Wales.

I guess Charles will leave it to the Welsh if they want William as their Prince.

 

[purple_Lulu]

William, Duke of Monmouth and Earl of Doncaster has a ring to it.

For me the Earl of Doncaster will be forever tainted by the Blackadder first series episode "The Queen of Spain's Beard."

"Morning Doncaster!" Classic comedy gold!

 

[EmpressRouge]

For me the Earl of Doncaster will be forever tainted by the Blackadder first series episode "The Queen of Spain's Beard."

"Morning Doncaster!" Classic comedy gold!

"Oh, what a love this must be that you dress as a Spanish man to delight me!"

 

[KittyAtlanta]

There would be no need to strip the Marquess of his title in creating William a Duke of the same area - there would simply be two titles relating to Anglessy - one a Marquess and one a Duke.

I doubt that the Queen would create him Duke of there but she could, without it impacting the Marquess at all.

Fife is a different proposition as there is already a Duke.

Kind of off topic. The house my late husband and I owned sat on leasehold land owned by the Marquess of Anglesey. I used to write a check to him every November. We had a 99 year lease on the land.