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  #561  
Old 12-13-2017, 03:44 PM
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Nicholas de Roumanie Medforth Mills is indeed very popular so he could become King if the Parliament of the Kingdom receives a formal renunciation of the Princes of Hohenzollern.
There is no any desire for a restoration of the monarchy, why would Parliament do anything at all? There is no kingdom, there is no throne, there is no succession in the republican State of Romania.

Even when the FŁrst von Hohenzollern renounces, his son, or his brother, or his nephews, or his cousins have not renounced. Such an act would be meaningless. Charles can renounce. William can renounce. Can underaged George renounce? And underaged Charlotte? And then comes Harry, etc. Such a renunciation by Karl Friedrich does not mean all Hohenzollerns have given up.
  #562  
Old 12-13-2017, 03:46 PM
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No Hohenzollern formally renounced. Obviously we do not speak only about the Furst and his son. The Parliament would decide on such an issue only if the Monarchy is restored.We speak about dynastic rights not about something else.
  #563  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:01 PM
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The problem is that the head of the dynasty (King Michael) changed the rules. The dynasty, that are his daughters minus one, his grandchildren minus three. Opinions differ if King Michael could do all this to his own will and pleasure, but okay, so to see the constitutional heirs are out and no more relevant.
  #564  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:04 PM
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The King knew very well he could not change the rules by Himself and he asked in the 2007 family document the Parliament to solve the issue in case of restoration. At the moment different interpretations are available but the only one that is popular and known to the Romanians seem to be Nicholas de Roumanie Medforth Mills.
  #565  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:06 PM
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Succession to the Romanian Throne

The problem is, thatís anecdotal. We have no evidence to suggest that Nicholas is universally popular in sufficient numbers with monarchist movements. I canít even find figures to show public support for the new arrangements set for the Royal House by Parliament, let alone approval ratings for Nicholas. This all seems very bizarre. Margareta is clearly being offered semi-official status with a set role. If that isnít good enough, Iíve no idea why anyone is wasting their time. A 1920s monarchy in Romania in 2017? Thereís more chance of Elvis being elected Pope.
  #566  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:07 PM
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There are no polls about the popularity of Nicholas de Roumanie Medforth Mills and no polls about the controversial bill either
  #567  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Cory View Post
There are no polls about the popularity of Nicholas de Roumanie Medforth Mills and no polls about the controversial bill either
But youíre saying that heís very popular and seen as a unifying force for monarchists? You must be basing that on something?
  #568  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:19 PM
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Interviews with royalists leaders, comments of the people on different blogs,Facebook in the last period.
  #569  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:22 PM
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With respect, that isnít representative. Twitter predicted a Clinton win and a Brexit loss. And look what happened. Even polls arenít all that reliable. I just canít see that thereís any real evidence to support the idea that Romanians are demanding Nicholas take over on some redundant legal document from 90 years ago which most have probably never heard of.
  #570  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:24 PM
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The majority of Romanians are not officially royalists so it's hard to say. Everybody remembers the 1992 Easter visit and how the King was presenting his grandson Nicholas to the people.
  #571  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:25 PM
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Iím sure they do but that isnít proof enough in itself. The idea that thereís a powerful movement thatís demanding such changes isnít really accurate if in fact itís a handful of angry people on a Facebook page.
  #572  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:28 PM
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The fact many well known royalists are promoting Nicholas de Roumanie Medforth Mills can't be denied. To speak about a powerful movement would be really too much.
  #573  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:31 PM
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But who are these people and what influence do they have? Enough to overturn the decision of the Romanian Parliament? Because thatís all that really matters in the here and now. The rest is wishful thinking.
  #574  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:40 PM
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The Parliament of a republic can recognize an ngo and decide funds for it but has no power to decide the Succession to the Throne.
  #575  
Old 12-13-2017, 04:51 PM
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Succession to the Romanian Throne

What throne? There is no throne. And if they decided to restore the throne, why would anybody have any serious reason to believe they would take anything away from Margareta? And if that was even a consideration, Margareta would surely just restore her nephewís succession rights?

I appreciate that youíre saying she has no right to do that or that King Michael left it for parliament to decide but whereís the Romanian pro-Nicholas monarchist party with sufficient public and parliamentary support who are going to pull that off? How many Romanian politicians are going to say that the Royal Houseís position is now being upgraded but the cast are being changed based on a piece of paper from 1923?

The Romanian Parliament can decide whatever it wants. In the same way the English Parliament restored the Crown to Charles II and in the same way that the Greek Parliament created and then abolished the monarchy several times over. Any referendum will have to be created by a bill of law and the results of that referendum enforced by legislation. Which is passed by Parliament, not Margareta, not Nicholas or a random owner of a Facebook page.

The parliament of a constitutional monarchy can decide succession laws, so can the parliament of a republic. Theyíre unlikely to however considering theyíve just semi-restored the Royal House which must have at least more support than what youíre suggesting or it would never have happened.

Itís lovely to stick to traditions and to be rigid in what once was but itís never going to achieve anything close to what you really want.
  #576  
Old 12-13-2017, 05:00 PM
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Cory, you are back again. Where are your proofs?
  #577  
Old 12-13-2017, 05:00 PM
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The Parliament can become Constitutional Assembly and restore the Monarchy but that's hardly the case now. The republic decides only about things that are not contrary to the republican system. The dynastic rights and the Line of Succession can't be decided by the Parliament until the country is a republic.
Regarding those monarchists that support Nicholas de Roumanie Medforth Mills they certainly see in him the descendant of the King that can become a symbol for the future restoration. If the Monarchy will be restored and the rules of 1923 will be considered as finished the Parliament will certainly have the right to choose a new King and a new Line of Succession.
  #578  
Old 12-13-2017, 05:13 PM
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Succession to the Romanian Throne

Iím going to disregard the latter half of your post because I have yet to see anything to substantiate those claims.

But I think youíre overlooking the way that modern European democracies operate. Constitutions are the rulers today, not Crowns. Certain constitutions may invest some crowns with rights and privileges over things like succession rights but for the most part, these things are dealt with by parliaments. With or without the approval of the Sovereign.

If the British Parliament today decided to introduce a bill to deny the Prince of Wales his succession rights and it passed, there would be absolutely nothing the Queen could do about it except refuse to give her assent. And even then, it would be ignored, put to a referendum and the people would decide.

What youíre suggesting is that parliaments have no right to regulate monarchies. It hasnít been that way in Europe for decades and nobody will ever return to that either.

If the Romanian parliament passed a bill tomorrow recognising Margareta as the Queen regnant and abolishing the presidency, thatís all there is to it. If the bill is introduced, voted on and passed according to the constitution in effect in Romania today, thatís the law. Thatís the binding decision of a sovereign parliament. And whether you have a President or a King, itís parliament that decides such things today.

What youíre saying is contradictory because youíre suggesting that a republican parliament can not pass any bill that affects the monarchy in Romania because itís somehow illegitimate or has no right to do so. But it would be that same republican parliament that would have to pass legislation to restore the monarchy and set Nicholas on a restored throne. That comes before any 1923 related nonsense.

Using your own logic, youíre expecting the constitution to be scrapped, the sovereign parliament of Romania to be abolished, the restoration of the monarchy, the election of a new parliament, the introduction and passage of a bill upholding the 1923 rules or endorsing the 2007 changes and all this will be decided by a numberless movement with unclear motives and no visible support in Romania.

I canít see that happening.
  #579  
Old 12-13-2017, 05:19 PM
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The Parliament can decide certainly on the Succession rules but only if first restores the Monarchy. This is certainly not the case.
All the Parliament of the Monarchies in Europe can decide rules of Succession and Lines of Succession. That is certainly not the case for the Parliament of the republics that do not have such competence. Officially Romania is not a Monarchy but a republic.
  #580  
Old 12-13-2017, 05:26 PM
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What makes the parliament of Romania less sovereign according to the present constitution which would make it more sovereign in the future?

Let me explain it another way. The timeline of what youíre proposing would have to be as follows:

1. A referendum on the restoration of the monarchy and the approval of a new constitution

2. A bill passed in parliament before the restoration to affect the restoration.

3. The abolition of both the parliament and constitution of Romania and the immediate enactment of a new constitution which makes Margareta or Nicholas an absolute monarch for a finite time

4. A general election to replace the entire Romanian Parliament

5. The passage of a new bill which defines succession laws, if this was not already part of the newly approved constitution

6. That Romanian monarchist groups be allowed to direct the new parliament as an advisory committee

7. That the 1923 rules be revived by the new Romanian Parliament and approved by the Sovereign

8. That those rules be abolished and replaced by a bill which makes legal the changes which King Michael wanted in 2007

9. That the new constitution be amended to reflect that but only after parliament has given up any rights to determine succession because the 2007 rules place that right with the Crown

10. That Nicholas be installed as King at some point in this timeline.

Itís not very likely is it?
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