Restoration of the Monarchy in Romania

[LadyRohan]

Originally Posted by Von Schlesian

When compared to some of the cataclysmic scandals that have been whipped up by the media here in the UK, I agree entirely with LadyRohan, that the poll results are less damaging than they might have been.

Still, was there a question relating specifically to the change in the proposed line of succession?

There was not. The poll asked three questions, about views of the Royal House generally, the Custodian of the Crown and the views of monarchy vs. republic. Nothing else was singled out for a question, and the poll reveals no background for the answers given, so we are none the wiser factually as to what would explain the rises in the standing of the Royal House and the Crown Princess, except the support for a restoration, which shows a slight drop of 4,4%.

[Cory]

Any chances for a quick restoration of Mobarchy are vanished.

[Lee-Z]

Originally Posted by Cory

Any chances for a quick restoration of Mobarchy are vanished.

*Was* there a chance for a quick restoration in Romania in recent years?

[LadyRohan]

Originally Posted by Cory

Any chances for a quick restoration of Mobarchy are vanished.

Glad to see you're once again out to quash anything positive concerning the monarchy in Romania. The only times 'quick' systemic change takes place, is in the contexts of revolutions and coups, and neither are benefitial to monarchies. In fact, they're contrary to its very nature, and not something to strive for.

[Jacknch]

Romania has been a stable country for many years now and the likelihood of a quick restoration via some sort of coup or revolution was never on the cards as far as I can see.

I think the status quo will be maintained unless the popularity of the royal forum becomes such that it would make sense to restore it!

[Cory]

Originally Posted by Lee-Z

*Was* there a chance for a quick restoration in Romania in recent years?

Until last years the possibility of the restoration of Monarchy was very real and the support for the Monarchy was increasing quickly.

[LadyFinn]

How popular is the monarchy restoration idea in Romania?
The idea of restroring monarchy is popular among Romanians. Now living in the republic of Romania, about 21% of the respondents to a survey would go for monarchy should a referendum on the form of government in Romania. be organized.
But over half – 62% – would still vote for the republican option, according to an IRES survey. The survey’s results were published just days before the King’s Day celebration in Romania on May 10.
However, the Royal House of Romania has an increased reputation: 93% of Romanians said they had heard about it. The Royal House also enjoys high confidence levels: 61% of respondents have confidence and great confidence in the Royal House, although less than a quarter of those who have heard about this institution are aware of its work.
Some 42% believe that the Royal House is involved in the public life just enough, whereas a similar percentage (45%) think that it should get more involved.
The IRES study was conducted on March 23-24 for Sinteza magazine, on a sample of more than 1,000 people.
More at the article
How popular is the monarchy restoration idea in Romania_ - Romania Insider

[Duc_et_Pair]

"The idea of restroring monarchy is popular among Romanians. Now living in the republic of Romania, about 21% of the respondents to a survey would go for monarchy should a referendum on the form of government in Romania. be organized. But over half – 62% – would still vote for the republican option, according to an IRES survey."

The first sentence is immediately contradicted by the following two sentences.

[LadyRohan]

Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair

"The idea of restroring monarchy is popular among Romanians. Now living in the republic of Romania, about 21% of the respondents to a survey would go for monarchy should a referendum on the form of government in Romania. be organized. But over half – 62% – would still vote for the republican option, according to an IRES survey."

The first sentence is immediately contradicted by the following two sentences.

The first sentence stands well on its merit, and is only contradicted by the ones following it if that is what the reader wants to interpret it to.
In an existing monarchy, republicans would be glad if the support for the monarchy was at 62%. It would mean that all they needed, was a slight drop in support to get a majority for a republic. I wonder why that same logic isn't applied in the reverse, like in this case.
The survey shows that 1 in 5 would vote outright to change the system of governance to a monarchy. Those are good numbers to start from, and other than Serbia, no other former monarchy can show similar numbers. If you change 2 more minds out of every 5, you have a majority in favour of the monarchy.

That can be achieved by settling the questions around the line of succession, and raising the visibility of the Royal Family, as the numbers of people wanting them to be more active in society, show.

As is the case with any statistics, they can always, without failing, be interpreted in different ways, most often skewed by the views of the one interpreting them. If you're against restoring the monarchy in Romania, they can be spun as sad and as a non-starter for the cause. If your view is that the monarchy should be restored, they serve as a good platform to start from, and that all you need, is to reduce support for the republic by 12%, and its majority is gone.

With the right work, a proper campaign of information and visibility and a firm belief in the cause of monarchy itself, these numbers again confirm that a restoration is achievable, and that the Romanians are sympathetic to the family and their work.

[Al_bina]

The statistics and popularity of Romanian royals are largely irrelevant. As I have said earlier, any restoration requires a really really effectual kingmaker. The public squabble accompanied by odd Facebook posts and machinations was detrimental to the public image. The Romanian royal family's campaign still remains incoherent, whereas the succession line is not viable.

[LadyRohan]

Originally Posted by Al_bina

The statistics and popularity of Romanian royals are largely irrelevant. As I have said earlier, any restoration requires a really really effectual kingmaker. The public squabble accompanied by odd Facebook posts and machinations was detrimental to the public image. The Romanian royal family's campaign still remains incoherent, whereas the succession line is not viable.

Statistics and numbers is what forms a basis for any movement in any direction. Based on the way the questions are framed, and who has been asked, it can reveal a sentiment or mood, and is quite often used by organizations and even individuals when assessing priorities.
What you mean by effectual kingmaker I have no idea of, but as has been said many times before, there is no chance of restoring the monarchy in Romania without political support and willingness to carry the question forward, but this is regularly done nowadays, as in the last presidential election, where Victor Ponta, later PM for a short period, vowed to resolve the issue and put it to a referendum if he was elected.

The Romanian Royal Family does not undertake a campaign, and this is probably where some get disappointed, and others confuse the facts. A monarchy is an ancient institution and system of governance where the people in it do not undertake campaigns to elevate themselves, or promote their own positions. The Royal Family, represented by the Crown Princess, has made it clear that the family is at the disposal of the people, in whatever capacity they decide they want them in. After that, they spend their time in Romania representing, opening, visiting and communicating with people, visibly making clear that Romania has a choice and that they are willing to serve. Any 'campaign' to follow, to ensure the monarchy wins a referendum, when called, will not be arranged by the Royal Family themselves, but by sympathetic supporters, institutions and organizations, who will highlight and make clear the strengths of the monarchy as part of educating the public on the issue.

To do anything else from a privileged position of royalty would be unseemly, and something royal families would shy away from.

When it comes to the line of succession, we all agree that there are questions around it, and the unfortunate events surrounding Princess Elenas son Nicholas, have been much debated. He is however still around, and whether or not the question today might seem up in the air, when the time comes for people to make a decision on the future of the monarchy, I would not bet against him being part of that process. Even without him, the proposed line of succession to the Romanian throne has roughly the same number of people in it (6) as the Norwegian (7) or the Swedish (8), and should not be described as 'not viable'. It is however not the final answer if and when the monarchy is restored, as most people will accept, and I think it is still quite clear that Nicholas Medforth-Mills is most likely the future of the monarchy in Romania, after or even instead of his aunt, the Crown Princess.

[Duc_et_Pair]

I think the chance to see an existing monarchy turning into a republic, for an example The Netherlands or Spain, is bigger than seeing Romania turning into a monarchy. Why would the democratically elected elite ever voluntarily step aside to make place for system of hereditary succession, and that for a family without serious successors, overseeing it from the michaelist viewpoint.

[Al_bina]

Originally Posted by LadyRohan

Statistics and numbers is what forms a basis for any movement in any direction. Based on the way the questions are framed, and who has been asked, it can reveal a sentiment or mood, and is quite often used by organizations and even individuals when assessing priorities.
What you mean by effectual kingmaker I have no idea of, but as has been said many times before, there is no chance of restoring the monarchy in Romania without political support and willingness to carry the question forward, but this is regularly done nowadays, as in the last presidential election, where Victor Ponta, later PM for a short period, vowed to resolve the issue and put it to a referendum if he was elected.... [snipped]

An effectual kingmaker is a person, who will mobilise public opinion and politicians to have a referendum with a predetermined result. An effectual kingmaker will push the restoration through EU bureaucracy as Romania is a de facto EU colony. Enthusiasm and statistics mean nothing in the big picture as they can be attuned to fit the restoration agenda.

"Ancient institution and system of governance" can be applied to Japan or other Asian monarchies and does not apply to a majority of the European royals. The Europeans tainted their bloodlines as much as they could and stopped adhering to the traditions. Crown Princess of Romania failed her responsibility to ensure the bloodline continuation. Mr Medforth-Mills is marred by cheap dramas and intrigues. The rest of the succession line is not viable for me.

[MAfan]

Originally Posted by LadyRohan

The Romanian Royal Family does not undertake a campaign, and this is probably where some get disappointed, and others confuse the facts. A monarchy is an ancient institution and system of governance where the people in it do not undertake campaigns to elevate themselves, or promote their own positions. The Royal Family, represented by the Crown Princess, has made it clear that the family is at the disposal of the people, in whatever capacity they decide they want them in.

Personally I agree with the choice not to actively campaign for the restoration, as it would ultimately need to actively engage in politics.
But - as for the restoration - I believe that there could be only two possible ways for reaching it (or at least for trying to reach it).
The one is some kind of popular revolution, with the aim of changing form of government. This is IMHO highly unlikely, if not even impossible. The Royal Family may be very popular, but not to the point of being perceived as something somehow necessary.
The other one is that there is the already mentioned "kingmaker", a person or a group who has real powed and who chooses to strip himself of it by restoring the monarchy. This scenario would, in the end, require an action of the romanian government and parliament to restore the monarchy, and this appears to me also very unlikely.

[Duc_et_Pair]

A Kingmaker usually is a strong man or a triumvirate or something pressuring things their way. For an example General Franco who pushed the return of the monarchy in Spain.

Or someone like one of the Swedish courtiers, Baron Karl-Otto Mörner, who, entirely on his own initiative, offered the succession to the Swedish Crown to the French Marshall Jean-Baptiste Bernadotte.

Or a "National Comité" like in the Southern Netherlands which offered the throne of the new-founded State of Belgium to Prince Leopold von Sachsen-Coburg und Gotha.

Without such a force able to push things, I can not see a restoration happen. Vladimir Putin and Dmitri Medvedev can -autocratic as they are- play for kingmaker of a ceremonial tsardom, they themselves firmly keeping the reins of power in hands. They are able to do that.

Someone like the Greek PM Alexis Tsipras, elected on a wave of discontentment, could have pushed for a restoration of the monarchy but of course his own political colour is diametrically that of a monarchy. I only want to illustrate the sort of person one needs for kingmaking.

[Cory]

Not restoration of Monarchy but a "Montenegro solution"?

Principele Radu vrea de la stat un buget anul de minim 4,5 milioane euro | Monarhistii sunt furiosi

[Marengo]

And what would the "Montenegro sollution" be? They will be included on the civil list but are not allowed to participate in the political life?

[Cory]

Money from the state for a sort of semi-official activities but in the republican system. Certainly this is not what the royalists want.

[Benjamin]

Honestly, what la-la land are the Romanian royalists living in?

The more time that passed since King Michael returned to his country in the 1990s, the more the likelihood that he would be restored as king, or that the monarchy would be restored in general, has decreased. If the monarchists were *serious* and committed to their cause, they would have used the momentum created at various times by different events (the King's 90th birthday, political scandals, etc.) in order to bring back the monarchy. However, this was not done, and the monarchists have now squandered the chances of seeing their dreams realized and seem to slowly fall victim to infighting and squabbles.

Regardless of how repulsive he may be to some, at least Prince Radu is trying to definitively secure a place for the Royal Family in the nation's future life.

[Duc_et_Pair]

The former Hohenzollers should sink on their knees when the State of Romania makes such an arrangement with them. The Orléans in France, the Habsburgers in Austria, the no-surnames in Greece, they can only dream of such a cooperative and well-willing state!