Nicholas Medforth-Mills (formerly His Royal Highness Prince Nicholas of Romania)

[Gaudete]

Which of course begs the question, what was it exactly that he did that saw him stripped of his position and title? As I’ve said before, until that’s resolved then he’s damaged goods. How can he take a prominent position within the Royal House with a scandal lurking in the closet?

I realise he has his devotees but the fact that he’s the subject of so much negativity is hardly helpful as the Royal House enters a new era with a semi official position in a modern Romania.

[Cory]

The negativity does certainly not come from the Romanian people.
He certainly needs to find out what really happened in 2015 but until now there are more questions and answers.

[Gaudete]

I didn’t say it came from the Romanian people. I said it came from him personally. King Michael was a fair man, I don’t believe he was prone to over reaction. The best thing Nicholas can do is concentrate on his wife and building a happy and contented private life out of the spotlight and leave his aunt to do the rest.

[Cory]

Nobody denies how fair the King was. After the controversial events of August 2015 the King met his grandson in the same autumn and nothing was mentioned about those events and even more the Sovereign asked his grandson how things were going in Romania:

https://www.qmagazine.ro/printul-nic...s-de-mine/amp/

When Nicholas the Roumanie Medforth Mills was leaving Curtea de Arges after the funeral of his beloved grandfather a group of people started to shout "Prince Nicholas".

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by Cory

He will have a public religious marriage anyhow so I do not see any problem at all.

As you maybe will know, for law the civil marriage is what counts, not the religious one. We may assume that the members of the royal family are law-abiding people, so -if true- Nicholas Medforth-Mills is married. We should see the public registers to see if it is true.

[SweetLana]

Having in view that Nicholas' marriage was "approved" by the Royal Family given the letters of congratulations they sent on his engagement, I see no problem when he chooses to have the civil ceremony, especially since there will be a religious ceremony and wedding next summer.
I have a pet theory regarding why he had a civil ceremony beforehand, but there is no proof to confirm this. I believe they got married now so that Alina could also participate in the official ceremony of his grandfather's funeral. I don't think she would have been allowed to participate at the ceremony just as his fiancee capacity, given that all royal and noble guests were accompanied by spouses only. However, this theory would be confirmed only if they got married after the death of the king, but since the date of their marriage was not announced, there is no way of knowing.

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by Gaudete

I think what Duc means is that getting married in the way he did doesn’t exactly show that he wants to return to his old position and yet other statements he makes suggests he’s still sour about it. His recent actions seem to suggest (to me) that he’s eager to find a way back in and yet if that were the case, he would have waited a little while until some time had passed and he could find a way to heal the rift with his family.

But IMO he isn’t so much interested in building bridges as setting himself up as a rival.

Indeed. If Nicholas considers himself a private person, yes, 100% right to marry Ms Binder. But that is not what Nicholas wants, to be "a private person": his public disagreement with the removal from the Royal House etc. seems to hint he wants to be in the (royal) spotlights.

Originally Posted by Gaudete

I didn’t say it came from the Romanian people. I said it came from him personally. King Michael was a fair man, I don’t believe he was prone to over reaction. The best thing Nicholas can do is concentrate on his wife and building a happy and contented private life out of the spotlight and leave his aunt to do the rest.

Amen to that. Congratulations to Mr and Mrs Medforth-Mills. May they have a long and happy life together.

[SweetLana]

Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair

As you maybe will know, for law the civil marriage is what counts, not the religious one. We may assume that the members of the royal family are law-abiding people, so -if true- Nicholas Medforth-Mills is married. We should see the public registers to see if it is true.

In Romania at least, civil weddings are not a big deal, since the religious ceremony is considered the most important. Usually guests are not invited to the civil ceremony, just close family members. Many couples for various reasons choose to have a civil ceremony some time beforehand and then have the "real" religious wedding. I see this as a similar case for Nicholas and Alina.

[Benjamin]

Originally Posted by SweetLana

I have a pet theory regarding why he had a civil ceremony beforehand, but there is no proof to confirm this. I believe they got married now so that Alina could also participate in the official ceremony of his grandfather's funeral. I don't think she would have been allowed to participate at the ceremony just as his fiancee capacity, given that all royal and noble guests were accompanied by spouses only. However, this theory would be confirmed only if they got married after the death of the king, but since the date of their marriage was not announced, there is no way of knowing.

I was wondering that as well.

And, as you rightfully point out, since the marriage was approved by the then Head of House (King Michael), there is no issue if a civil marriage has already occurred and a bigger, possibly public religious ceremony is to be held in 2018. Some posters seem to forget that tons of royals do this; for many of them, it is the religious wedding that really counts. One can review the Online Gotha to see how prevalent separate civil and religious marriages are among royal houses. http://www.angelfire.com/realm/gotha/gotha/gotha.htm

This does not mean the people involved are “sneaky”; it is simply their tradition. Oftentimes, especially with the non-reigning Roman Catholic royal families, only the date of the religious wedding is provided to genealogists.

[xenobia]

Originally Posted by SweetLana

In Romania at least, civil weddings are not a big deal, since the religious ceremony is considered the most important. Usually guests are not invited to the civil ceremony, just close family members. Many couples for various reasons choose to have a civil ceremony some time beforehand and then have the "real" religious wedding. I see this as a similar case for Nicholas and Alina.

Thanks for the insights! It's always interesting to learn more about other countries customs, and this was for me a good example.

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by SweetLana

In Romania at least, civil weddings are not a big deal, since the religious ceremony is considered the most important. Usually guests are not invited to the civil ceremony, just close family members. Many couples for various reasons choose to have a civil ceremony some time beforehand and then have the "real" religious wedding. I see this as a similar case for Nicholas and Alina.

That is the same for most continental countries, unless the civil wedding is the only wedding (which happens to be in the majority of the weddings in North-West-Europe). But Nicholas Medforth-Mills wants to be HRH Prince Nicolae of Romania again, or have I misunderstood something? He is estranged from the royal family, for unclear reasons. He has set a fait accompli. If the story is true. He and Miss Binder are apparently married.

That is all fine and well. The best wishes to the married couple. But you will agree that in the logic of things all this is not 'handy'. Suddenly there are problems. A lady claims to be pregnant with Mr Medforth-Mills' baby, which so far has not been solved. He is thrown out of the Royal House and is no longer a successor and his royal titulature has been removed. Then he suddenly is engaged (and even married?) with a certain Miss Binder.

The Royal House "has been informed and wishes Mr Medforth-Mills well" which is a quite distant reaction and then they are married without any family. He is the grandson of a King, the nephew of the so-styled "Custodian of the Crown", the son of the successor to named "Custodian" and sees himself having a role in the royal family. Then these actions seem inconsequent and bear no real logic. But okay, his life, his choices, his consequences.

[Marengo]

I really don't see why it is illogical for an engaged couple to get married.

[Benjamin]

Originally Posted by Marengo

I really don't see why it is illogical for an engaged couple to get married.

Glad I am not the only one perplexed by certain of these reactions.

Especially, as mentioned before, that it is often the practice among royals and nobles to have separate civil and religious marriages.

[Gaudete]

I don’t see it as illogical, it just confirms that he wants to do things as a private citizen. Which he is. But there’s no consistency when you consider that he continues to whine that he isn’t a Prince anymore. He can’t have the best of both worlds. He’s either willing to make amends and put things right with a view to playing a role again or he’s just an ordinary guy with no pretensions. In which case, far better for him to keep himself to himself and not to be seen as antagonising or opposing his aunt. She has a difficult task on her hands, she doesn’t need a rival showing off.

[Cory]

He is certainly not seen by some of the Romanians as a private citizen.

[Gaudete]

Cory, I accept that you’re a big fan of Nicholas but you must offer proof when you make statements like that. I asked you before for some kind of poll or anything non-anecdotal that shows Nicholas is this unifying popular figure and you can’t seem to offer anything. You’re absolutely entitled to your opinion of course and I appreciate you support him but it’s not enough just to repeat that Romanians like him. There has to be some kind of evidence of that to change the direction of the conversation.

[Benjamin]

Originally Posted by Gaudete

I don’t see it as illogical, it just confirms that he wants to do things as a private citizen. Which he is. But there’s no consistency when you consider that he continues to whine that he isn’t a Prince anymore. He can’t have the best of both worlds. He’s either willing to make amends and put things right with a view to playing a role again or he’s just an ordinary guy with no pretensions. In which case, far better for him to keep himself to himself and not to be seen as antagonising or opposing his aunt. She has a difficult task on her hands, she doesn’t need a rival showing off.

Margarita and the then Radu Duda had a separate civil and religious wedding. I do not understand how it is a big deal. They obviously both had plans to play public roles in Romania. Yet, since they are Orthodox, the religious ceremony is the one that was the most important.

Same goes for Grand Duchess Maria Vladimirovna of Russia and her former husband Prince Franz Wilhelm of Prussia. They had a civil marriage in France and a religious marriage in Madrid. Practically no one knew the date of the civil marriage, because the religious ceremony was the big bash that was attended by a gaggle of royal relatives. One can hardly claim with a straight face that Grand Duchess Maria is an "ordinary" woman.

[Gaudete]

I do agree with you but that doesn’t change the fact that Nicholas can’t seem to decide what he wants. Margareta and Maria knew what they would be doing in the future. Nicholas can’t seem to decide.

My issue isn’t with the marriage at all. You talk about a public role but Nicholas doesn’t have that anymore. Does he want it? Doesn’t he? Who knows? He’s a man of very mixed messages, not all of them pleasant.

[Cory]

Originally Posted by Gaudete

Cory, I accept that you’re a big fan of Nicholas but you must offer proof when you make statements like that. I asked you before for some kind of poll or anything non-anecdotal that shows Nicholas is this unifying popular figure and you can’t seem to offer anything. You’re absolutely entitled to your opinion of course and I appreciate you support him but it’s not enough just to repeat that Romanians like him. There has to be some kind of evidence of that to change the direction of the conversation.

I have certainly sympathy for the Kin's grandson but I can hardly be considered his supporter because I support the Constitution of 1923 and the Hohenzollerns.
Everybody saw though these days how Nicholas de Roumanie Medforth Mills was welcomed by the people in front of the Royal Palace and when he left Curtea de Arges after the funeral.

[Gaudete]

That’s not enough. A handful of people cheering him in a small crowd doesn’t relate to actual measurable support that can be used to build a cause. But I can see you won’t give on this one so I’m happy to agree to disagree.