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  #41  
Old 10-21-2020, 03:53 PM
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I think Leonor is the best prepared of his generation, you can see that she has a thorough preparation.
Elizabeth of Belgium also has a good preparation, has made some speeches and accompanied her father and mother several times at official events.
Catharina-Amalia appears less, I think at this time should have at least made a speech and could accompany her father in some events.
Ingrid Alexandra has already made some speeches and it is noted that she is already more comfortable with her role.
Christian has a preparation similar to that of Ingrid Alexandra, appears in public always very natural, in good pictures. I hope he can make a speech soon.
Estelle from Sweden since she was a little girl who appears with her parents at some events and I think that's very good for her. The way Victoria and Daniel insert their daughter into the events of the royal family should be an example to the other monarchies.
George from Cambridge has also been introduced gradually into the life of the royal family, as happened in that video he made with the brothers. As a baby, he accompanied her parents on the official visit to Australia and New Zealand. I think his parents want to give him and his brothers a normal childhood, but always showing him what the role of the royal family is.

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  #42  
Old 10-21-2020, 04:18 PM
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I do agree that Catharina-Amalia looks the "less" prepared since she doesn't engage in any engagements (even the one where it was an inauguration of a ship? in her name, and it was Maxima who went instead-besides we only see her 3 times a year only during winter Lech, King's day and Summer photosession). But, I think WA and Maxima said before that they wanted their daughters to prioritize their studies. So we won't see Catharina-Amalia doing any engagements until she finishes school. Yet, I do wonder how she will fare in public speeches. In my opinion, sooner the better (to get used to it), because doing fine speeches takes effort and time, which Catharina-Amalia lacks since she never gave a public speech. She will have to work harder than anyone else because she will start late her duty as crown princess.


Yes, I do agree that Leonor probably didn't write her speech. I think neither of the young royals wrote their own speeches. Every single royal, even adults, gets help for their speeches. I think no other royal has written a fully speech without a double check from a third party (I don't know how accurate is The Crown, but it shows professional people preparing The Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh's speeches). So I don't see a point in saying that Leonor didn't write her speech, when clearly, most royals don't write their own speeches.


To me Elisabeth is well prepared, maybe the most well prepared of the young heirs, but she is also the oldest, has a different midset and is more mature.


Ingrid Alexandra doesn't engage with the public only on National Day. She has her own Sculpture Park, which she often visits with her Grandmother Sonja. She has inaugurated ships, and guided the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge once. She was very confident and well spoken on her speech during her confirmation as well. Ingrid Alexandra is being very well prepared for her future role.


I agree about Estelle. Victoria and Daniel are raising Estelle quite formidable. They let her focus on her studies and youth, but they take her to some official events, and non-official events. From time to time, we see Estelle at museums, royal libraries, among many others. Victoria wants Estelle to have a normal upbringing, but without forsaking the responsabilities of royal life. Victoria and Daniel are, in my opinion, one of the best parents in raising royal children. Estelle will be one of the most prepared heirs of her time, without a doubt.
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  #43  
Old 10-21-2020, 04:32 PM
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Yes, I do agree that Leonor probably didn't write her speech. I think neither of the young royals wrote their own speeches. Every single royal, even adults, gets help for their speeches. I think no other royal has written a fully speech without a double check from a third party (I don't know how accurate is The Crown, but it shows professional people preparing The Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh's speeches). So I don't see a point in saying that Leonor didn't write her speech, when clearly, most royals don't write their own speeches.
The point was that Willem-Alexander was chastised for reading a 'speech' that was supposedly written for him, while Leonor was praised for her responsible behavior because of the words in her speech (that was surely written for her); so it was rather hypocritical to chastise one and praise the other in one post for comparable behavior (N.B. in this case it seems far more likely that Willem-Alexander had a lot more input in his statement than Leonor in hers).
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Old 10-21-2020, 04:40 PM
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I see that both of you put a lot of emphasis on speeches. Why is that more important than anything else (it seems)? Is that what you consider to be the core of the job as monarch?

It is clear that Willem-Alexander and Máxima chose a different path for their daughters than most of the royal colleagues but I'm not sure that Amalia will be a lesser queen because of it. She indeed has less experience is giving speeches on a national podium (she might practice in smaller settings) but more experience in relating with professional athletes representing the Netherlands (to name something that the princesses are more active in than most of their contemporaries).

In the same vein, I wouldn't expect Felipe and Letizia to state that Leonor should make her own mistakes as that is a healthy part of growing up (they seem adamant to have 'perfect daughters' which makes even a small mishap an enormous event), while Willem-Alexander did express that sentiment: so, it's really about a different perspective. I think both Spain and the Netherlands are somewhat extreme in their approaches - which partly relates to the different culture. I do hope that both will end up being excellent queens for their respective countries.
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  #45  
Old 10-21-2020, 05:13 PM
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Videos of events where we can see the young heirs of Europe speaking or speaking.

Leonor, Princess of Astúrias.


Princess Elisabeth.


Princess Ingrid Alexandra.


Princess Catharina-Amalia.


Prince Christian.


Princess Estelle.


Prince George.
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  #46  
Old 10-21-2020, 05:14 PM
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I would say that the various princesses (and princes) are prepared differently. Apparently, the Spanish king and queen consider it very important that Leonor is able to give a speech. The Dutch king and queen on the other hand consider it much more important that Amalia is able to freely engage with the public and is able to talk freely with the press (to a limited extend) - I don't recall Leonor or one of the others, ever doing so while younger than 16..
Prince Christian and his siblings have also been freely engaging with the public and occasionally the Danish press for years. Christian, especially, is better at it than plenty of adult royals and could probably handle most sorts of informal or moderately formal engagements on his own.
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  #47  
Old 10-21-2020, 05:20 PM
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The best prepared of the heirs is the Duchess of Brabant.

She has made speeches in more than one language, she has prepared academically for her role at home and internationally. In addition she has military training and has carried out official duties both at home and abroad.

She has seen first hand the role Belgium plays on the world stage.

None of the other heirs have that experience.

The least prepared is the Princess of Orane.
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  #48  
Old 10-21-2020, 06:49 PM
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I think Leonor is the best prepared of his generation, you can see that she has a thorough preparation.
Elizabeth of Belgium also has a good preparation, has made some speeches and accompanied her father and mother several times at official events.
Catharina-Amalia appears less, I think at this time should have at least made a speech and could accompany her father in some events.
Ingrid Alexandra has already made some speeches and it is noted that she is already more comfortable with her role.
Christian has a preparation similar to that of Ingrid Alexandra, appears in public always very natural, in good pictures. I hope he can make a speech soon.
Estelle from Sweden since she was a little girl who appears with her parents at some events and I think that's very good for her. The way Victoria and Daniel insert their daughter into the events of the royal family should be an example to the other monarchies.
George from Cambridge has also been introduced gradually into the life of the royal family, as happened in that video he made with the brothers. As a baby, he accompanied her parents on the official visit to Australia and New Zealand. I think his parents want to give him and his brothers a normal childhood, but always showing him what the role of the royal family is.

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Just curious...why do you believe that Leonor of Spain....who has only recently began her public profile...is better prepared than Elisabeth of Belgium? Elisabeth was being taken to engagements as a toddler, making speeches in three languages at about age ten, and has already lived abroad and been exposed to military training. She is far and away the best trained and prepared of all the Gen Z heirs imo

Leo doesn't even come close...she has only just begun.
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  #49  
Old 10-21-2020, 07:51 PM
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Just curious...why do you believe that Leonor of Spain....who has only recently began her public profile...is better prepared than Elisabeth of Belgium? Elisabeth was being taken to engagements as a toddler, making speeches in three languages at about age ten, and has already lived abroad and been exposed to military training. She is far and away the best trained and prepared of all the Gen Z heirs imo

Leo doesn't even come close...she has only just begun.
Yes, I believe Elisabeth is the best prepared. But Leonor in recent years has made many appearances, but made his first speech just last year.
Elisabeth and Leonor in my opinion are the best prepared. But Elisabeth started her preparation earlier as a future queen and yes that is admirable.
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  #50  
Old 10-21-2020, 08:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
Just curious...why do you believe that Leonor of Spain....who has only recently began her public profile...is better prepared than Elisabeth of Belgium? Elisabeth was being taken to engagements as a toddler, making speeches in three languages at about age ten, and has already lived abroad and been exposed to military training. She is far and away the best trained and prepared of all the Gen Z heirs imo

Leo doesn't even come close...she has only just begun.
Well we also have to consider the age difference. Yes Elisabeth is better prepared including military now and time abroad. She is also three years older then Leonor. At almost fifteen Elisabeth had done neither. Leonor has done speeches in Catalan and Spanish and demonstrated knowledge of English. She is also learning Mandarin in school. She will likely be expected when she finished school to do military training as well.

Yes Elisabeth started attending duties younger than Leonor. Both Elisabeth and Estelle have the leg up on other heiresses on an early introduction.
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  #51  
Old 10-21-2020, 09:09 PM
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Prince Christian and his siblings have also been freely engaging with the public and occasionally the Danish press for years. Christian, especially, is better at it than plenty of adult royals and could probably handle most sorts of informal or moderately formal engagements on his own.
I agree. It seems the Dutch and Danish approach focus more on dealing with the public and less on speeches.

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Well we also have to consider the age difference. Yes Elisabeth is better prepared including military now and time abroad. She is also three years older then Leonor. At almost fifteen Elisabeth had done neither. Leonor has done speeches in Catalan and Spanish and demonstrated knowledge of English. She is also learning Mandarin in school. She will likely be expected when she finished school to do military training as well.

Yes Elisabeth started attending duties younger than Leonor. Both Elisabeth and Estelle have the leg up on other heiresses on an early introduction.
If it is about starting the earliest: there is no doubt that prince Charles of Luxembourg will be the best prepared. None of them had had as many engagements before turning 6 months old

N.B. Princess Catharina-Amalia had her first official engagement at 21 months: buying 'children's stamps' with her mother.
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  #52  
Old 10-22-2020, 05:01 AM
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It is interesting to see the different approaches by the nations in preparing their heirs.

Elizabeth is the eldest "young" heir and seems the most prepared for her future role and the most as ease in the public eye

Leonor is also appearing more and doing speeches - I think having a mother with a background in TV/Media is evident in the way Leonor is being prepared.

Ingrid and Christian also seem at ease in the public eye but it is kept more informal than Leonor's events

Amalia is the heir we see the least in public but we have to respect that is the way her parents want. Im sure once she turns 18 we will see a marked increase in her public role

It is probably also best noting that only Elizabeth, Leonor and Amalia are direct heirs and the others are second in line behind their fathers
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  #53  
Old 10-22-2020, 06:59 AM
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It might be better to discuss the preparation of the various future monarchs in a more general thread.



I would say that the various princesses (and princes) are prepared differently. Apparently, the Spanish king and queen consider it very important that Leonor is able to give a speech. The Dutch king and queen on the other hand consider it much more important that Amalia is able to freely engage with the public and is able to talk freely with the press (to a limited extend) - I don't recall Leonor or one of the others, ever doing so while younger than 16.

From my perspective, Leonor's preparation is rather limited in nature and mostly concerns highly orchestrated events; while Amalia's is the opposite and includes fewer highly orchestrated events but more low-key events in which she is able to more freely express herself. Ingrid-Alexandra's preparation seems to be a great mixture with some speeches but also a short tv-interview (with her father by her side). I'm not sure how much exposure she has had to the general public; other than waving at them at the National Day.

So, again, it really depends on what is prioritized. Formal speeches are not that important in the Netherlands, while expressing yourself seems less important in Spain (to concentrate on the two that were previously discussed).

Willem-Alexander certainly had more experience than Amalia when he was her age, including international experience studying abroad in Wales, while Amalia is still attending a Protestant Christian school in the Netherlands.


I tend to be skeptical of royal families who claim that they want their children, especially heirs, to have "normal teenage lives". The truth is, however, that a future king/queen is not "normal" and never will be. Whereas it is positive that royal heirs now go to "normal" schools rather than being educated by palace tutors, special preparation is still required for their future role. I am afraid that might be being overlooked in Amalia's and her sisters' case. And since Amalia is only two years away from receiving a hefty annual income from the Dutch taxpayers (unlike Élisabeth for example), I think it is high time she and her parents took her preparation for her future role more seriously.
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  #54  
Old 10-22-2020, 01:23 PM
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Leonor's preparation IS NOT reading speeches. The preparation of Leonor is aimed at what will be her role: the public function in all its facets.
Her father told Leanor when he imposed the Golden Fleece on her: "Because your actions -all- should be guided by the greatest sense of dignity and exemplarity, by honesty and integrity, by the capacity for renunciation and sacrifice, by the permanent spirit of improvement, and for your dedication without reservation to your country and your people ". "You must respect others, their ideas and beliefs; and you will love culture, arts and sciences, because they give us the best human dimension to be better and help our society progress."
Her presence at important events since she was very young is part of her training in the public function that will correspond to her. Knowing what protocol, sacrifice, and standing in dignity mean when necessary. Her childhood plot or private, take place off-camera. I think it will definitely be the best prepared, although that will tell the future. Spain is always demanding with its monarchs and Leonor will meet our expectations. I am convinced.

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Well we also have to consider the age difference. Yes Elisabeth is better prepared including military now and time abroad. She is also three years older then Leonor. At almost fifteen Elisabeth had done neither. Leonor has done speeches in Catalan and Spanish and demonstrated knowledge of English. She is also learning Mandarin in school. She will likely be expected when she finished school to do military training as well.

Yes Elisabeth started attending duties younger than Leonor. Both Elisabeth and Estelle have the leg up on other heiresses on an early introduction.
It is very logical to think that Elizabeth from Belgium is better prepared right now. He is four years older than Leonor. Leonor is 14 and Elizabeth 19. Leonor is a girl and Elizabeth is a woman.
The closest comparison would be Elizabeth with Amalia. And honestly, Amalia has not done any preparation except controlled poses and highly retouched photos distributed by her parents.
Christian is just a child that we usually see a lot but it is not that he has a serious side or of political preparation, but it seems that the Danes do not care about that, which makes me quite sad. Their crown prince barely has any acts, he lives on permanent vacations and that yes, posing for photos is great. That would be a horror for Spain, but apparently it works in Denmark. He's just not well prepared, neither his parents nor Christian, but apparently it doesn't matter. Ingrid is in a middle way.

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It is probably also best noting that only Elizabeth, Leonor and Amalia are direct heirs and the others are second in line behind their fathers
From my personal opinion, what you reveal is irrelevant. You only have a childhood, adolescence and youth to learn. It is in those moments of life when you have to assume roles that will serve you for a lifetime. If any of them is not heir or heir until they are 50 years old, will they start training at that age? I do not think so.
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  #55  
Old 10-22-2020, 02:32 PM
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Leonor doesn't make speeches only. She also gives awards and engages with the winners (as seen last year during the ceremony of Felipe's 5th anniversary as a monarch).


Moreover, the visits to exemplary villages such as Asiegu and Somao, shows Leonor engaging with the people. This summer at Mallorca, Leonor and Sofia participated in two acts, one of them with young people. They are seen interacting with the teenagers at the event. So, not that very different from what Amalia does at King's day (which by the way, it's the only time in a whole year, on which she engages with the dutch people, since Lech and the Summer photosession are just for photos).


Don't get me wrong. I love Amalia and the sisters. I've been following them for a long long time. We are just discussing the appearances of the young heirs in an official manner, which to me, shows that Amalia lacks in that department. I do respect WA and Maxima's choice to let their girls focus on school only. But I do believe Amalia will get a harder time, or maybe a longer time, in learning the official aspects required for her role as crown princess.


It's the same as learning a language. If you learn it as child, you will learn it faster. But, if you learn it as an adult, it's possible but it will take a longer time to perfect it. This is what I mean. And I don't doubt that Amalia will be a great Queen too, but her education as crown princess with be harder for her than it is/has been for Elisabeth and Leonor.
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Old 10-22-2020, 04:30 PM
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I don't think Amalia's preparation is perfect. The part I like about her preparation is that she is allowed to fully explore who she is and make mistakes in the process. The expectation for some heirs, and especially Leonor, seems to be that they are perfect. I don't think that is a healthy approach.

That's why I said they were on the opposite ends of the spectrum: I think that Leonor would benefit from an approach in which she can more freely express herself and learn who she truly is (although I also understand the more precarious situation in Spain which might make that a little harder) while I agree that it wouldn't hurt if Amalia started to do some more royal engagements - although I haven't seen any issues in that respect with the limited engagements that we've seen her participate in. From very early on, she has shown to be confident in her own skin and professional/diplomatic in her approach. Her private visit to Parliament also shows that she is fully aware of her position and is preparing herself, although less so with public engagements (and no public speeches).
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Old 10-22-2020, 04:34 PM
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This thread has been re-opened. Please keep in mind that we are talking about minors.

Those who can not keep their demons under control and feel the need to insult and attack children will see their account suspended.
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Old 10-22-2020, 05:51 PM
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Oh those videos. So lovely! Thank you for sharing. In fact, I watched those footages when they came out, but watching them together feels quite different.


The voices of our young royals. Leonor has a huskey voice, very breathy (and very different from Sofia's voice). Elisabeth has that serene, calm and soothing voice that makes me feel at peace. Ingrid Alexandra has a strong voice, and she seems to speak quite fast (maybe it was the nerves?). Amalia has that young woman voice, very romantic. Estelle has a deep voice like her mother's voice, she is so young and she has already such a mature voice.


I bet Christian's voice is not the same now, since he grew so much in the last year.
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Old 10-22-2020, 06:46 PM
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Is it just me, or does Amalia speak (Dutch) with what almost sounds like an American accent?

I don't know enough to say if the time/class/accent gap between her and her grandmother is equivalent to the one between Queen Elizabeth and William, or why it would take that particular tone. I suppose it would be partly solved by hearing her speak English, but that's yet to happen.
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Old 10-22-2020, 06:46 PM
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Leonor's preparation IS NOT reading speeches. The preparation of Leonor is aimed at what will be her role: the public function in all its facets.
Her father told Leanor when he imposed the Golden Fleece on her: "Because your actions -all- should be guided by the greatest sense of dignity and exemplarity, by honesty and integrity, by the capacity for renunciation and sacrifice, by the permanent spirit of improvement, and for your dedication without reservation to your country and your people ". "You must respect others, their ideas and beliefs; and you will love culture, arts and sciences, because they give us the best human dimension to be better and help our society progress."
Her presence at important events since she was very young is part of her training in the public function that will correspond to her. Knowing what protocol, sacrifice, and standing in dignity mean when necessary. Her childhood plot or private, take place off-camera. I think it will definitely be the best prepared, although that will tell the future. Spain is always demanding with its monarchs and Leonor will meet our expectations. I am convinced.
I sincerely hope that she doesn't crumble under the enormous pressure she is put under.

Quote:
It is very logical to think that Elizabeth from Belgium is better prepared right now. He is four years older than Leonor. Leonor is 14 and Elizabeth 19. Leonor is a girl and Elizabeth is a woman.
The closest comparison would be Elizabeth with Amalia. And honestly, Amalia has not done any preparation except controlled poses and highly retouched photos distributed by her parents.
Elisabeth seems to be prepared very well indeed. Just like Spain the monarchy is more at risk than in some other countries, so it is a great asset to have someone like Elisabeth.

However, you seem to be unaware of King's day and Amalia's participation in it. Both she and Alexia did a great job even during the pandemic interacting with the public via video calls (although Máxima had a hard time not interrupting her second daughter).

Quote:
Christian is just a child that we usually see a lot but it is not that he has a serious side or of political preparation, but it seems that the Danes do not care about that, which makes me quite sad. Their crown prince barely has any acts, he lives on permanent vacations and that yes, posing for photos is great. That would be a horror for Spain, but apparently it works in Denmark. He's just not well prepared, neither his parents nor Christian, but apparently it doesn't matter. Ingrid is in a middle way.
Again, this is a very uncharitable look into the Danish royal family (the evidence doesn't point to the family being on vacation permanently): Frederick regularly is appointed regent and has his official agenda as crownprince as well. Christian has been going on official trips with his family for many years now and started accompanying his father to several engagements in the last 2 years. He also studied abroad earlier this year for a few months. He seems a very caring older brother to his siblings; so I'd say his parents are doing a great job (as well as Christian himself!). He is growing into a well rounded young man.

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From my personal opinion, what you reveal is irrelevant. You only have a childhood, adolescence and youth to learn. It is in those moments of life when you have to assume roles that will serve you for a lifetime. If any of them is not heir or heir until they are 50 years old, will they start training at that age? I do not think so.
I would sincerely hope that the royals don't stop learning when they are adults; that would be the worst of all. And don't worry: all heirs are being prepared from early on; the emphasis is just on different aspects of the role - depending on their parents own experiences and preferences and the country they are to be the sovereign of.
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