Sussex Residences

[O-H Anglophile]

I think it’s awful that newlyweds with a baby/growing family on the way are being rehoused in this place and I sense a not-so-nice sense of humour behind the offer. I dunno but the movie ‘the parent trap’ springs to mind or maybe a ‘the newlyweds trap’ film could be on the horizon. Just my opinion!

Since Queen Mary lived in this mansion before, I don't see why it would be an awful place to live nor do I understand why it would be a nasty joke for the Queen to make it available to them.

Windsor seems like a perfectly normal place for them to live and doesn't surprise me.

I also fail to understand how a movie about separated twins trying to get their parents back together has anything to do with Harry & Meghan and Frogmore Cottage.

Great to have it confirmed. Lovely they will be living at Frogmore, even if cottage she not main house. The estate has played a special role for them.

Even if the planning permission was only new I highly doubt they waited till now to tell the residents. They didn't kick people into the street just before Christmas Unless they bought a new place it was going to be a reality they woukd have to move someone as the properties are all being used in some form. I find it funny people are upset employees are being rehoused but we're all for the Gloucesters having to relocate from their long time home. Same thing happened with Amner, it was leased. The queen actually ended the lease early on the tennant so the work could be done.

Their rented place makes sense. They likely knew the planning and work would take time. Since unlike William and Kate they would not have alternative housing when the baby came (Wales until early September and Buckleberry) the rental gave them some where to be. They can stay there until work is done. Likely something was worked out with their agreement.

The home makes sense. Close to London to be their main home. They can gave a small London base if needed like Anne, Andrew and Edward do.

As for Philip he is often at Windsor. And he isn't reason enough for them to live at Sabdringham. This is their long term home, even after he passes. This base suits their life so much better. Like they do now, they will visit Sabdringham at Christmas and other times. Possible when Charles is king, they will use something like word farm for their privacy at holidays.

Nice touch that the cottage was Queen Mary's home. Meghan sore Mary's diamond bandeau at the wedding. I know not reason for the house but still a nice link.

You make a number of excellent points in your post.

I especially like this sentence--

"I find it funny people are upset employees are being rehoused but we're all for the Gloucesters having to relocate from their long time home."

I don't understand why so many are ready to throw the Gloucesters out of the home they have had so many years so Harry could live next door to his brother.

 

[tommy100]

Nor do I think the Queen would be one of those willing for that to happen.

 

[MaiaMia_53]

Well, the recent U.S. documentary produced by ABC that aired last week still stated the inaccurate gossip that the Sussexes were planning to move into Apt 1 at KP, next to Will & Kate. That was wrong on a number of levels. Perhaps that's why KP decided to finally make this announcement and clear up the rumors.

If I had known from the beginning that Apt 1 has been home to the Gloucesters for years and was previously inhabited by the present Duke's father, Prince Henry (the 4th son of King George V), there's no way I personally would have believed the suggestion that the Gloucesters were giving up their home to the Sussexes. I seriously doubt that the Gloucesters offered to move out of Apt 1 to make room for the Cambridges either, as has also been liberally reported.

It's as if the media give short shrift to everyone in the extended royal family and think only the Queen and Prince Charles & his family have any significance and importance. That's not true. I'm sure the Queen is very cognizant of being head of a large extended family, including all of her various cousins, and her sister's offspring too. Within the family, respect and courtesy for everyone is surely upheld as much as possible. Someone had suggested in the Future Home for Prince Harry thread that the original rumor may have been started by Princess Michael to distract from her KP digs being considered for the Sussexes. Most likely, extended members of the family are rarely asked to give up their long held residences for younger royals.

I am not surprised that Meghan and Harry are setting up their permanent residence at Frogmore Cottage. KP press office has always made a point of noting how much Harry and Meghan enjoy Windsor, and that they spent a lot of time on the estate during their courtship. Even in the recent announcement, M&H's love of the Windsor/ Frogmore environs is reiterated. I suspect there's some significance for M&H that King George III had Frogmore House built for his wife, the popular Queen Sophia Charlotte, who was visibly of mixed heritage. Frogmore Cottage is situated in the Windsor Home Park "facing the beautiful grounds of Frogmore House."

https://courierjournal.org/entertai...-meghan-markle-prince-harry-new-home-86882424

So the rumors have all been wrong with everything from York Cottage at Sandringham and Adelaide Cottage at Windsor having been gossiped. Us Weekly cites a palace source as saying the Sussexes "never enjoyed living in London," and that they are more comfortable residing in the country and raising their children in a country setting which offers more privacy.
https://www.usmagazine.com/celebrit...and-duchess-meghan-to-move-to-windsor-estate/

https://www.eonline.com/news/990264...-harry-are-moving-away-from-kensington-palace

 

[Rudolph]

A little off topic but I think when the Gloucesters do decide to downsize, apartment 1 will be used by The Cambridges. It connects to 1a and gives them tons extra space when William is heir. Room for extra staff and the like.

 

[MaiaMia_53]

According to Emily Andrews the Queen has given Harry and Meghan Frogmore Cottage at Windsor.
Exclusive: Harry & Meghan are moving out of Kensington Palace next year. They’ve been given a new house by the Queen and it will be their official residence. It’s currently undergoing a large refurbishment to turn it back from staff accommodation to a family home.
The 20-room Apartment 1 at Kensington Palace, next door to William & Kate’s apartment at 1a, will become available next year as the Duke & Duchess of Gloucester are moving to a smaller part of KP. But Harry & Meghan have chosen not to move there.
Instead the Queen has given them Frogmore Cottage in Windsor. It’s within the private Home Park and faces the beautiful grounds of Frogmore House. It’s where they had their private evening wedding party & where their gorgeous engagement pictures were shot.
It needs major building work to turn it back into a luxury family home, boasting 10 bedrooms & a new nursery plus space for a gym & yoga studio. Currently it’s been chopped up into 5 units where palace staff have been living. Harry, Meghan & baby Sussex hope to move in next year.
- Emily Andrews twitter

I can see one of the younger Cambridges inheriting Apt 1 at some point when they start their own families. But I don't see W&K taking over such a huge space of 21 additional rooms when they already have plenty of room for staff, guests, and visiting family members in their 20-room digs.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7815881/harry-set-to-split-from-big-brother-wills-meghan-windsor/

Ok, I didn't see this news about the Gloucesters having decided to move into smaller KP digs, prior to posting my previous comments. So then, the Gloucesters don't have a problem with moving out of their old home, and have no issue with giving up Apt 1. I stand corrected, unless this bit about them moving has not yet been officially confirmed.

Now the question arises as to whether there was some tension between Wm and Harry regarding the Sussexes not actually wanting to make KP their official residence, and not being eager to move next door to W&K. Hmmm...

 

[O-H Anglophile]

Ok, I didn't see this news about the Gloucesters having decided to move into smaller KP digs, prior to posting my previous comments. So then, the Gloucesters don't have a problem with moving out of their old home, and have no issue with giving up Apt 1. I stand corrected, unless this bit about them moving has not yet been officially confirmed.

Now the question arises as to whether there was some tension between Wm and Harry regarding the Sussexes not actually wanting to make KP their official residence, and not being eager to move next door to W&K. Hmmm...

No, nothing has been confirmed regarding the Gloucesters moving, it is still tabloid rumor.

I also think the tension thing between the Cambridges and Sussexes is tabloid rumor, although I could see there being tension between some staff.

But both men now have their own lives and families so having independent living arrangements that suit them and their families isn't that odd.

 

[Lumutqueen]

Now the question arises as to whether there was some tension between Wm and Harry regarding the Sussexes not actually wanting to make KP their official residence, and not being eager to move next door to W&K. Hmmm...

You know what, personally, I think there is something in this. Not sinister or hateful but Henry has been a third wheel with William and Catherine for a long time, and now he's married, the "foursome" has formed instead. Now that Meghan has settled in I do think it's time they become two twosomes. ? They are siblings, and I imagine they do have their ups and downs but they do both need to lead separate lives as couples. Getting away and not being under each others feet is a good thing in my eyes.

 

[tommy100]

Nothing has been confirmed about the Gloucester's at all, that is the part of this I don't believe. If they have decided to downsize I don't think its anything to do with Harry and Meg. However a number of sources have reported royal aides as saying the Gloucester's aren't going anywhere. I think the Apartment 1 talk is just an attempt to cover up that the media were wrong for suggesting it as a possibility in the first place. Better to make a story out of it - a William and Harry split - rather than just saying they were wrong.

 

[MaiaMia_53]

A little off topic but I think when the Gloucesters do decide to downsize, apartment 1 will be used by The Cambridges. It connects to 1a and gives them tons extra space when William is heir. Room for extra staff and the like.

I can see one of the younger Cambridges inheriting Apt 1 when they grow up and start their own family. However, I don't see how W&K would need the huge 21-room space of Apt 1, when they already have 20 rooms in Apt 1A, which is plenty for staff, guests, their children and the nanny, as well as occasional visiting family and friends.

I don't remember such fuss when the Cambridges were given Anmer Hall ...
I don't see Frogmore cottage as a big deal, in fact it's much more in the tradition of the previous country retreats given by the Queen in the Family.
To overhype any move by/for/supposed against the Sussexes is a bit crazy ( i mean CNN really).

What do you mean by fuss? There continues to be huge interest in everything Meghan and Harry, because of their charming personalities and especially because Meghan has ties to the U.S. and to Canada. And as we've seen lots of Commonwealth residents down under are mad about Harry and Meghan.

Even the way this thread has ballooned so quickly over such a short period of time demonstrates that this news is being avidly digested by royal followers who have been wondering what M&H's residence plans are with them expecting a baby soon, and Nottingham Cottage being so small.

Nothing was said about the Cotswolds rental, so I would imagine M&H will continue to rent their small residential retreat in the Cotswolds near the Soho Farmhouse environs.

 

[HereditaryPrincess]

This was interesting to hear and it's nice that the Sussexes are moving close to where they married. I don't understand the fuss about the move either, as Lumutqueen said I suspect Harry and Meghan want to be a twosome independently from the Cambridges
I wonder if this will mean that in the future Baby Sussex will end up attending St. George's in Windsor Castle where the York siblings, Lady Louise and Viscount Severn as well as Zenouska Mowatt all attended.

 

[O-H Anglophile]

Nothing was said about the Cotswolds rental, so I would imagine M&H will continue to rent their small residential retreat in the Cotswolds near the Soho Farmhouse environs.

Nothing was ever even officially confirmed about them renting in the Cotswolds, so I don't see why they would confirm anything one way or the other about a rental property now.

 

[Zonk]

I am a bit confused....are they keeping Nottingham Cottage as their London base? With the Frogmore Cottage to be their official home?

 

[Osipi]

No, nothing has been confirmed regarding the Gloucesters moving, it is still tabloid rumor.

I also think the tension thing between the Cambridges and Sussexes is tabloid rumor, although I could see there being tension between some staff.

But both men now have their own lives and families so having independent living arrangements that suit them and their families isn't that odd.

A day without tabloid gossip and rumors and innuendo that is pitting British royal against other British royals is like a day without web access.

@Zonk: With the official statement about the move to Frogmore Cottage, I would imagine that Nottingham Cottage will be their London base for now. Now watch the rumors fly about where H&M go from Nott Cott at KP.

 

[Rudolph]

It’s not clear. The announcement said Frogmore Cottage will be their official residence but made no mention if they’ll retain Nottingham Cottage as a London base.

Maybe they’ll just operate from Windsor.

 

[Countessmeout]

I am a bit confused....are they keeping Nottingham Cottage as their London base? With the Frogmore Cottage to be their official home?

Nothing has been said about Nott yet.

Windsor is close so they could use Frogmore for London activities. But on the other hand Edward and Andrew both love at great Windsor and have a London base. The difference though is that London base acts as work as well. Harry and Meghan have the Kensington offices for that.

A little off topic but I think when the Gloucesters do decide to downsize, apartment 1 will be used by The Cambridges. It connects to 1a and gives them tons extra space when William is heir. Room for extra staff and the like.

I don't see why the Cambridges woukd need a 41 room home. Their own apartment is 21 rooms. That includes rooms for staff that may live with them. There us also staff housing in the palace for staff who unlike a nanny don't need to live there. They also have the reception rooms in their offices, that they use for official events. It's a bit out there to think they would need a second massive apartment.

If current doesn't work in long run they would likely move into Clarence House when Charles moves. But there seems little need. And the plan was for them to stay.

If any Cambridge ends up in the Gooucester apartment likely to be one of the kids when older and have a family.

 

[Lady Reem]

Yes I can see it’s every new brides’s wish to raise a new family on an estate that literally a cemetery. For some folk that is pretty ... Me? I would find that creepy and very unsettling. But I suppose we can at least say it was very generous of a queen to the offload some staffers in order to move a prince/senior working royal and his foreign bride into the staff quarters. How generous of the queen

To the person this concerns, Queen Mary was old & widowed when she lived there. Not young, just married, pregnant and hoping to raise a family

Done here.

 

[Countessmeout]

Yes I can see it’s every new brides wish to raise a new family on an estate that literally a cemetery. For some folk that is pretty ... Me? I would find that creepy and very unsettling. But I suppose we can at least say it was very generous of a queen to the offload some staffers in order to move a prince/senior working royal and his foreign bride into the staff quarters. How generous of the queen

To the person this concerns, Queen Mary was old & widowed when she lived there. Not young, just married, pregnant and hoping to raise a family

Done here.

It's not like the mausoleum is in their back yard. It's on the grounds yes, but not like the kids will be playing in a cemetery

The queen isn't offloading staff. She yet firing them. New residence will be found for them.

What does a widower vs a young couplevhavevtondo with anything? People thought the Gloucester apartment was good for them and they are an old married couple passed having kids. It's a huge ten bedroom manor house. That's more then room enough to be a good family home. One could argue that it is better suited for a family then a widow.

No different then moving into the home of the queen mum.

 

[padams2359]

Hide and seek in the family cemetery. Fun times!

 

[jacqui24]

Ok, I didn't see this news about the Gloucesters having decided to move into smaller KP digs, prior to posting my previous comments. So then, the Gloucesters don't have a problem with moving out of their old home, and have no issue with giving up Apt 1. I stand corrected, unless this bit about them moving has not yet been officially confirmed.

Now the question arises as to whether there was some tension between Wm and Harry regarding the Sussexes not actually wanting to make KP their official residence, and not being eager to move next door to W&K. Hmmm...

I don’t know many siblings would be too eager to move in next door with their families. Especially if they already share office space. It’s the one reservation I’ve always had about Apartment 1. It’s uncomfortably close in my opinion. Even if it’s a massive apartment.

Gloucester’s have not been confirmed to leave Apartment 1. It’s a comment from EA in her same article about Frogmore. It’s not unfathomable for one part of the story to be true while other details may not be. We shall wait and see about Gloucesters.

Frogmore is perhaps better suited to raise children in a more normal way. Locked behind palace walls isn’t exactly normal no matter how much they shield them away from the media. While many kept talking about Eugenie’s connection to Windsor, people tend to forget that Harry went to Eton. So while his parents never lived at Windsor, he did spend a good part of his formative years in Windsor. And given the tension at home, wouldn’t surprise me if it served as an escape for him where he was able to relax and be a kid without adult drama.

 

[DeeT]

The Queen loves Windsor & has spoken fondly of the Frogmore estate. Some beautiful pictures of her majesty & her family spending time there are easily available.The Sussexes have previously stated that they spent a lot of time in the area, long before the general public knew how serious their relationship was. We’ve since seen their engagement & wedding in Windsor, lovely that they’ve decided to live at Frogmore cottage.

The media were the ones that falsely accused that the Sussexes were going to kick the Gloucesters out of their home. So far, I haven’t seen an official announcement that the Gloucesters are downsizing now. It’s weird that some think a family can’t remain close unless they live right next door to each other.

Yes I can see it’s every new brides’s wish to raise a new family on an estate that literally a cemetery. For some folk that is pretty ... Me? I would find that creepy and very unsettling. But I suppose we can at least say it was very generous of a queen to the offload some staffers in order to move a prince/senior working royal and his foreign bride into the staff quarters. How generous of the queen

To the person this concerns, Queen Mary was old & widowed when she lived there. Not young, just married, pregnant and hoping to raise a family

Done here.

Queen Mary was 70 when she started living at Frogmore Cottage. The Gloucesters are 74 & 72 respectively living at KP. Why does the age of a previous occupant matter? Most people renovate & decorate to their own preference. The Frogmore estate is beautiful, looks like a beautiful place to live.

 

[hel]

So, was digging through some planning documents online and found out some interesting things.

1) I don't think this has been in the works for a long time. In April 2018, two applications were filed to make several interior and exterior changes to Frogmore Cottage that are directly at odds with the concept of a single family home. (The application was approved in July and the approval was good for three years.)

Consent for various internal alterations, a single storey rear canopy and single storey rear extension to the studio to form 3 x three bedroom dwellings and 1 x one bedroom dwelling with associated parking and a new footpath.

2) There may be fewer tenants to rehome than might be expected. In the Planning Officer's Assessment attached to the April application, it says:

Due to the ad hock [sic] layout the Royal Household have found it difficult to let out three of the five properties and this has meant they have fallen into disrepair.

3) The work in the October permit has not been approved yet -- I'd be surprised if it's started.

4) The work will be extensive, so I'm unconvinced it'll be done before the baby comes. If you read the April document, it gives an idea of the current state of the building, and thus an inking of the scope of the work to be completed:

The cottages have had a large number of internal alterations which have removed original features including fireplaces, floorboards, doors and lath and plaster walls.

Later it says

[T]he main Frogmore Cottage has undergone a large number of changes internally and externally, to the point where the original floor plan and footprint is almost completely unrecognisable. Fireplaces have been removed and a number of stud walls and extensions have been added.

5) Apparently, the property comes complete with a wee building that sounds like a gem in the rough, The Studio, which is described as being in a state of disrepair. (In the April plans, they were intending to build an extension that -- if I'm reading this correctly -- would have integrated the Studio into the main building somehow).

However internally the studio has original features such as a fire place, red tiled flooring, original light switches and what appears to be pink marble on the northern wall. The ceiling is high and the roof structure is exposed.

Anyway, if anyone's interested, the documents for the April application are at
18/01216/LBC | Consent for various internal alterations, a single storey rear canopy and single storey rear extension to the studio to form 3 x three bedroom dwellings and 1 x one bedroom dwelling with associated parking and a new footpath. | 3 And 4

 

[Osipi]

Hide and seek in the family cemetery. Fun times!

As the children grow older, a walk through the cemetery with Daddy could be filled with being right there and seeing the names and learning the history of the family. This is also true of St. George's Chapel. The Sussex kids will be raised in the midst of an area steeped in centuries of British history.

 

[Rudolph]

I don’t doubt it’s in disrepair because from the reports it will be a £ multimillion renovation

 

[hel]

Incidentally, the house more than twice as far from the Mausoleum and gravesites as Anmer Hall is from the parish church, St. Mary's, and its graveyard.

Harry and Meghan's kids will be ok on that score.

 

[AdmirerUS]

Happy Days. Google Books has a number of preview pages of Royal Landscape: The Gardens and Parks of Windsor available. Author: Jane Roberts. p. 227, plate 229 has a photo of Frogmore Cottage. It was originally a Gardener's Cottage. IF this is the same building - but it looks to be so?
If so it is in the North West Part of the Garden. Just before Frogmore Dr ends at the N.

Alternately, SE of Frogmore there are Aviary Cottages (sets of 3 and 4) to be found on Google Maps. These are between Frogmore House and The Prince Consort's Home Farm.

Link to the Roberts Book on Google: https://books.google.com/books?id=G...179#v=onepage&q="the aviary" frogmore&f=false

 

[Sun Lion]

I tried to identify Frogmore Cottage on Google Maps (satellite); can someone help out? Is it one of the slightly larger structure north west of Frogmore House at the end of Frogmore Drive (there are 2 somewhat larger houses) or is it the one right next to Frogmore House? Or even another structure?

The largish property in the top left hand corner, Somebody.

Old photo below says it's off Shaw Farm Rd. (Shaw Farm is on ordinance maps.)

The small whitish thing in front is the Indian Kiosk. Here's a photo of the Indiam Kiosk, with Frogmore Cottage behind it -

https://www.alamy.com/indian-kiosk-...rogmore-estate-windsor-uk-image178100126.html

Used to be called "Double Garden Cottage". Reported as having a parapeet - can't see it in these photos though.

About four-fifths down in the article below, there is a description of the path that goes past it.

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/...LvhVRhg3uX4M_IiweATAcOFB6sM_zEUzHERiybP0PU5UJ

#googleearth https://earth.app.goo.gl/HFvEKi

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2018/1...e_House_which_is_locat-a-20_1543055917983.jpg

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/1s/2018/11/24/11/6585570-6423965-image-a-63_1543059651793.jpg

https://www.rct.uk/collection/2100460/frogmore-cottage-windsor

 

[Somebody]

So, was digging through some planning documents online and found out some interesting things.

1) I don't think this has been in the works for a long time. In April 2018, two applications were filed to make several interior and exterior changes to Frogmore Cottage that are directly at odds with the concept of a single family home. (The application was approved in July and the approval was good for three years.)

2) There may be fewer tenants to rehome than might be expected. In the Planning Officer's Assessment attached to the April application, it says:

3) The work in the October permit has not been approved yet -- I'd be surprised if it's started.

4) The work will be extensive, so I'm unconvinced it'll be done before the baby comes. If you read the April document, it gives an idea of the current state of the building, and thus an inking of the scope of the work to be completed:

Later it says

5) Apparently, the property comes complete with a wee building that sounds like a gem in the rough, The Studio, which is described as being in a state of disrepair. (In the April plans, they were intending to build an extension that -- if I'm reading this correctly -- would have integrated the Studio into the main building somehow).

Anyway, if anyone's interested, the documents for the April application are at
18/01216/LBC | Consent for various internal alterations, a single storey rear canopy and single storey rear extension to the studio to form 3 x three bedroom dwellings and 1 x one bedroom dwelling with associated parking and a new footpath. | 3 And 4

Thanks for these interesting tidbits. So, it sounds having Harry and Meghan move into this cottage might actually be a great solution as few staff members were interested in living there (probably because of the conditions the building is in; or because it is relatively small for 5 families - compared to 1 family it will house in the future).

Based on these documents: would it be possible for Harry and Meghan to move in to a part of the house while they work on the remainder? The KP release clearly stated that they will be moving before the baby is due to be born...

 

[royal rob]

Where will little baby go to school when the times comes

 

[Humbugged]

Thanks for these interesting tidbits. So, it sounds having Harry and Meghan move into this cottage might actually be a great solution as few staff members were interested in living there (probably because of the conditions the building is in; or because it is relatively small for 5 families - compared to 1 family it will house in the future).

Based on these documents: would it be possible for Harry and Meghan to move in to a part of the house while they work on the remainder? The KP release clearly stated that they will be moving before the baby is due to be born...

I guess Apartment 1 & 2 are subject to the new application if they already have Planning Permission for the rest of the cottage

 

[TLLK]

Where will little baby go to school when the times comes

Perhaps St. George's Windsor like the Wessex children.?


https://www.stgwindsor.org/