The Lascelles Family


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Thank you for the information Alex. I was not suggesting by my comment that the turn out at the Memorial Service was a failure on behalf of the Royal Family. I was just curious as to who chooses people to represent the senior royals. Do they themselves choose who goes, or is it set by someone else? For example, would Edward and Sophie have chosen Michael to represent them? Would the Queen have chosen Alexandra? Or is it merely a matter of "who is free to attend to represent a senior"? I noticed that none of the senior royals attended, and I have read your reply regarding Royal family presence at Memorial services distracting from the mourners, which I understand. I was simply curious as to who chooses their representation.
 
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Molly, I realise that of course you were not suggesing any disrespect by what you said!

I can only speak generally from what I have picked up during my career, but understand the the Royals' Private Secretaries, in consultation with 'their' Royals work out which Royals will be appearing and who will represent whom, usually depending upon which royals are 'available'. I stand to be corrected on this, but I never saw any evidence of the Queen 'allocating royals' etc


Alex
 
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I understand that etiquette and custom is the only thing that determines the life of the Court and the Royals' behaviour in such situtations, like the death of Lord Harewood. What has Alex wrote cleared up it to us, but I am just wondering... from my very own poiont of view, if they ever wanted to break the custom and protocol and attend the funeral or thanksgiving service of their closest, very first cousin, you know, be there in person. Because for me and in my society, it matters a lot to take part in such most important family life events.
And I wonder, when Zara Phillips dies, would King William and Queen Catherine attend the funeral? It will not be appropriate, as I understand from Alex's post. they could be represented by, let's say, James Mountbatten, who is the most junior male member of the RF from his generation. Like Prince Michael was representing the Queen at the Harewood's funeral service.
 
kbk, I think the answer lies in an examination of what has happened before. For example, I can remember Prince Andrew attending the funeral of one of his staff [a servant, not a private secretary or other executive] on one occasion. This is a normal departure from what usually happens, but Prince Andrew had been very close to this servant over the years, who had apparently been 'almost like a father to him'.

I therefore presume that if any member of the royal family wanted to depart from the 'usual custom and practice', then this would be allowed. This is speculation on my part, so there is nothing that I can particularly refer you to by way of an authority. Common sense tells me that if a funeral was a 'private affair', then it would be easier for a member of the Royal Family to attend. I also have to say that if a Royal Engagement had been scheduled for the funeral day, then I am sure that the Royal engagement would take priority, particularly if it was an engagement connected with charity, and therefore the Royal would not attend the funeral.

[as a general point, the Queen is always keen to stress that she regards charitable functions as very important - even when the particular event does not involve a royal visit (for example, when the Funeral of Diana, Princess of Wales was held, BP announced that (even though the country was engaged in a very public dispaly of mourning], any charitable occasion was not to be cancelled and instead was to go ahead]
 
I think it is up to the individual member of the family to determine whether they attend or are represented. Probably they take into consideration their schedule of engagements and where the funeral is being held. Andrew attended the funeral of Lady Kennard, his godmother, in early May. She died the day before Williams wedding. Photos were taken of Andrew at the funeral, which may be another reason why royals don't often attend private funerals....the photogs tend to show up.
 
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kbk said:
And I wonder, when Zara Phillips dies, would King William and Queen Catherine attend the funeral? It will not be appropriate, as I understand from Alex's post. they could be represented by, let's say, James Mountbatten, who is the most junior male member of the RF from his generation. Like Prince Michael was representing the Queen at the Harewood's funeral service.
Click to expand...

I'd like to think William would attend the funeral of his cousin, whether he was the King or not. But who knows. Prince Michael was representing Edward and Sophie at Lord Harewood's funeral, not the Queen.

I imagine, as NGalitzine stated, it has probably more to do with schedules and such whether they attend the funeral, as well as avoiding the attraction of unwanted press.
 
Molly2101 said:
Prince Michael was representing Edward and Sophie at Lord Harewood's funeral, not the Queen.
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It was Prince Michael who represented the Queen at the funeral. He later represented The Wessexes at the service of thanksgiving.
I just hope the younger generation of the RF is not so bounded with the protocol as the elders and they will attend the most important events in the lifes of their closest relations. I mean, would you not attend the funeral of your first cousin, with whom you spent childhood?
 
Well if I was part of the Lascelles family I might be put off from having my cousin the Queen attend my fathers family because of security, protocol and press attention. The focus of the funeral should have been on the late Earl, his widow and his children, not on The Queen and his other royal relations being in attendance. There are other ways of expessing condolence privately than attending a funeral.
 
kbk said:
It was Prince Michael who represented the Queen at the funeral. He later represented The Wessexes at the service of thanksgiving.
I just hope the younger generation of the RF is not so bounded with the protocol as the elders and they will attend the most important events in the lifes of their closest relations. I mean, would you not attend the funeral of your first cousin, with whom you spent childhood?
Click to expand...

Ahhh, ok I see. I did not know that. I do think the younger Royals will be more relaxed regarding protocol as they have grown up in the 21st Century. They are not like Royal prince's and princesses of yesteryears. I would also like to think your last comment would be true and a no-brainer; William would likely attend his cousin's funeral, even if he was The King, just like James (The Duke of Edinburgh as he'll likely be known then) would attend his cousin's funeral, even if he is much, much younger than her and would not have many childhood memories together. (I find that a bit sad really as Louise and James are so much younger, but that was unpreventable and another topic completely.) Family is family at the end of the day. It's quite similar to the situation of would Charles attend the funeral of his younger cousins, if he were to outlive them if he is King. I'd like to think he would.

I was just reading some of the Lascelles family history and I was slightly confused regarding the now 8th Earl of Harewood's children. His older two children were born out of wedlock, but became children of a Viscount upon their parent's marriage yet the oldest son (Ben) is now not Viscount Lascelles. Is this because he was born out of wedlock, thus he is not entitled to inherit?
 
Molly2101 said:
I was just reading some of the Lascelles family history and I was slightly confused regarding the now 8th Earl of Harewood's children. His older two children were born out of wedlock, but became children of a Viscount upon their parent's marriage yet the oldest son (Ben) is now not Viscount Lascelles. Is this because he was born out of wedlock, thus he is not entitled to inherit?
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Yes, only the new Earls son born in wedlock will inherit the earldom. Those born before marriage may be allowed courtesy titles as the children of an earl but cannot inherit the peerage or have a place in the line of succession to the throne.
 
Happy News for Lascelles family!

Lady Emily Lascelles (b.1975) [oldest of four children and only daughter of David Lascelles, Earl of Harewood (b.1950) & his first wife, Margaret Messenger (b.1948)] & her husband Matthew Shard had their third child, another son, last year.

A brother for twins Ida & Isaac (b.2008)


Her first cousin, Tewa Lascelles (b.1985) [youngest of four children of James Lascelles (b.1953) by his second marriage to Lori Lee (b.1954)] married Cynthia Ramirez sometime this year.

Source: www.angelfire.com/in/heinbruins/Christian.html
 
Lascelles family

Can anyone help me locate a picture of the current Viscount Lascelles and also Elizabeth Collingwood, the wife of late Gerald Lascelles? Thanks
 
I just googled the name and got pictures of Viscount Lascelles under images.
 
Lascelles pictures

When I Goggle Viscount Lascelles I can find plenty of pictures of the current Earl when he was Viscount Lacelles but none of his son, Alexander.
 
The engagement has been announced between the Hon Edward David Lascelles (born 19 Nov, 1982), third son of the 8th Earl of Harewood, of Harewood House, Leeds, West Yorkshire, by his 1st wife the former Margaret Rosalind Messenger, and Miss Sophie Emma Cartlidge (b 1986), daughter of Nigel G. Cartlidge, by his wife the former Katharine A.C. Hall..
Peerage News: Lascelles/Cartlidge engagement
 
MAfan said:
Marion Thorpe, née Stein, the first wife of the late 7th Earl of Harewood and mother of the current Earl, died on 6 March 2014 aged 87.

Marion Thorpe obituary | Politics | The Guardian
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Sad news. Rest in peace, Marion.

List of her descendants:

2.2.3.1.Sir George Lascelles, Earl of Harewood (1923-2011), m.1st 1949 (div 1967) Maria Donata (Marion) Stein (*1926)
2.2.3.1.1.David Lascelles, Earl of Harewood (*1950), m.1st 1979 (div 1989) Margaret Messenger (*1948), m.2nd 1990 Diana Jane Howse (*1956)
2.2.3.1.1.1.Honourable Emily Lascelles (*1975), m.2008 Matthew Shard
2.2.3.1.1.1.1.Ida Shard (*2008)
2.2.3.1.1.1.2.Isaac Shard (*2008)
2.2.3.1.1.1.3.son (*2011)
2.2.3.1.1.2.Honourable Benjamin Lascelles (*1978), m.2009 Carolina Velez Robledo
2.2.3.1.1.2.1.Mateo Lascelles (*2013)
2.2.3.1.1.3.Honourable Alexander Lascelles, Viscount Lascelles (*1980)
2.2.3.1.1.3.1.[by Laleh Yeganegy] Leo Lascelles (*2008)
2.2.3.1.1.4.Honourable Edward Lascelles (*1982)
2.2.3.1.2.Honourable James Lascelles (*1953), m.1st 1973 (div 1985) Fredericka (Freddy) Duhrsson (*1954), m.2nd 1985 (div 1996) Lori (Shadow) Lee (*1954), m.3rd 1999 Joy Elias-Rilwan (*1954)
2.2.3.1.2.1.Sophie Lascelles (*1973), m.2011 ............
2.2.3.1.2.2.Rowan Lascelles (*1977)
2.2.3.1.2.3.[by 2nd wife] Tanit Lascelles (*1981)
2.2.3.1.2.4.[by 2nd wife] Tewa Lascelles (*1985), m. m.2012 Cynthia Ramirez
2.2.3.1.3.Honourable Jeremy Lascelles (*1955), m.1st 1981 (div) Julie Baylis (*1957), m.2nd 1999 Catherine Bell (*1965)
2.2.3.1.3.1.Thomas Lascelles (*1982)
2.2.3.1.3.2.Ellen Lascelles (*1984)
2.2.3.1.3.3.Amy Lascelles (*1986)
2.2.3.1.3.4.Tallulah Lascelles (*2005)

Obituary in The Telegraph informs about two her great-granddaughters; one is Ida Shard, and another one...maybe daughter of Sophie, Alexander, or Tewa?
 
I already know the name of the great-granddaughter - it's Lilianda Pearce, daughter of Sophie Lascelles & her husband Timothy Pearce (b.1955).

Source: the same as above.

Update:
2.2.3.1.1.David Lascelles, Earl of Harewood (*1950), m.1st 1979 (div 1989) Margaret Messenger (*1948), m.2nd 1990 Diana Jane Howse (*1956)
2.2.3.1.1.1.Honourable Emily Lascelles (*1975), m.2008 Matthew Shard
2.2.3.1.1.1.1.Ida Shard (*2008)
2.2.3.1.1.1.2.Isaac Shard (*2008)
2.2.3.1.1.1.3.son (*2011)
2.2.3.1.1.2.Honourable Benjamin Lascelles (*1978), m.2009 Carolina Velez Robledo
2.2.3.1.1.2.1.Mateo Lascelles (*2013)
2.2.3.1.1.3.Honourable Alexander Lascelles, Viscount Lascelles (*1980)
2.2.3.1.1.3.1.[by Laleh Yeganegy] Leo Lascelles (*2008)
2.2.3.1.1.4.Honourable Edward Lascelles (*1982), m.2014 Sophie Emma Cartlidge (*1986)
2.2.3.1.2.Honourable James Lascelles (*1953), m.1st 1973 (div 1985) Fredericka (Freddy) Duhrsson (*1954), m.2nd 1985 (div 1996) Lori (Shadow) Lee (*1954), m.3rd 1999 Joy Elias-Rilwan (*1954)
2.2.3.1.2.1.Sophie Lascelles (*1973), m.2011 Timothy Pearce (*1955)
2.2.3.1.2.1.1.Lilianda Pearce
2.2.3.1.2.2.Rowan Lascelles (*1977)
2.2.3.1.2.3.[by 2nd wife] Tanit Lascelles (*1981)
2.2.3.1.2.4.[by 2nd wife] Tewa Lascelles (*1985), m. m.2012 Cynthia Ramirez
2.2.3.1.3.Honourable Jeremy Lascelles (*1955), m.1st 1981 (div) Julie Baylis (*1957), m.2nd 1999 Catherine Bell (*1965)
2.2.3.1.3.1.Thomas Lascelles (*1982)
2.2.3.1.3.2.Ellen Lascelles (*1984)
2.2.3.1.3.3.Amy Lascelles (*1986)
2.2.3.1.3.4.Tallulah Lascelles (*2005)
 
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Emily's second son is called Otis, born in 2010.
 
He was born in 2011:

Another update:

2.2.3.1.Sir George Lascelles, Earl of Harewood (1923-2011), m.1st 1949 (div 1967) Maria Donata (Marion) Stein (1926-2014), m.2nd 1967 Patricia Tuckwell (*1926)
2.2.3.1.1.David Lascelles, Earl of Harewood (*1950), m.1st 1979 (div 1989) Margaret Messenger (*1948), m.2nd 1990 Diana Jane Howse (*1956)
2.2.3.1.1.1.Honourable Emily Lascelles (*1975), m.2008 Matthew Shard
2.2.3.1.1.1.1.Ida Shard (*2008)
2.2.3.1.1.1.2.Isaac Shard (*2008)
2.2.3.1.1.1.3.Otis Shard (*2011)
2.2.3.1.1.2.Honourable Benjamin Lascelles (*1978), m.2009 Carolina Velez Robledo
2.2.3.1.1.2.1.Mateo Lascelles (*2013)
2.2.3.1.1.3.Honourable Alexander Lascelles, Viscount Lascelles (*1980)
2.2.3.1.1.3.1.[by Laleh Yeganegy] Leo Lascelles (*2008)
2.2.3.1.1.4.Honourable Edward Lascelles (*1982), m.2014 Sophie Emma Cartlidge (*1986)
2.2.3.1.2.Honourable James Lascelles (*1953), m.1st 1973 (div 1985) Fredericka (Freddy) Duhrsson (*1954), m.2nd 1985 (div 1996) Lori (Shadow) Lee (*1954), m.3rd 1999 Joy Elias-Rilwan (*1954)
2.2.3.1.2.1.Sophie Lascelles (*1973), m.2011 Timothy Pearce (*1955)
2.2.3.1.2.1.1.Lilianda Rose Pearce (*2010)
2.2.3.1.2.2.Rowan Lascelles (*1977)
2.2.3.1.2.3.[by 2nd wife] Tanit Lascelles (*1981)
2.2.3.1.2.4.[by 2nd wife] Tewa Lascelles (*1985), m.2012 Cynthia Ramirez
2.2.3.1.3.Honourable Jeremy Lascelles (*1955), m.1st 1981 (div) Julie Baylis (*1957), m.2nd 1999 Catherine Bell (*1965)
2.2.3.1.3.1.Thomas Lascelles (*1982)
2.2.3.1.3.2.Ellen Lascelles (*1984)
2.2.3.1.3.3.Amy Lascelles (*1986)
2.2.3.1.3.4.Tallulah Lascelles (*2005)
 
Spheno said:
The engagement has been announced between the Hon Edward David Lascelles (born 19 Nov, 1982), third son of the 8th Earl of Harewood, of Harewood House, Leeds, West Yorkshire, by his 1st wife the former Margaret Rosalind Messenger, and Miss Sophie Emma Cartlidge (b 1986), daughter of Nigel G. Cartlidge, by his wife the former Katharine A.C. Hall..
Peerage News: Lascelles/Cartlidge engagement
Click to expand...

Has a wedding date been given for the Hon. Edward Lascelles and Sophie Cartlidge?
​
 
Remembering the Earl of Harewood
The British Royals Message Board: Remembering the Earl of Harewood[FONT=verdana, arial][FONT=verdana, arial]

Prince and Princess Michael of Kent, [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=verdana, arial][FONT=verdana, arial][FONT=verdana, arial][FONT=verdana, arial]Princess Alexandra, [/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=verdana, arial][FONT=verdana, arial][FONT=verdana, arial][FONT=verdana, arial][FONT=verdana, arial][FONT=verdana, arial]Lady Gabriella Windsor and[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT] Lady Frederick Windsor were present[/FONT][/FONT].
 
George, the seventh Earl of Harewood, and his second wife Patricia were not invited to Princess Anne's wedding in 1973.
​
 
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