The Future of the British Monarchy 1: 2018 - 2022

[Iluvbertie]

When Charles has his coronation do we think it will be a big massive event like the queens with decorations around london

No - they won't have anywhere like 8000 in the Abbey (Health and Safety would be a major barrier to that). I can't see them closing the Abbey for half a year in preparation either. The Abbey couldn't afford the loss in revenue.

It will be big but not on the scale of The Queen's. The actual ceremony will be the same but the parade to and from the Abbey won't have as many carriages for instance.

I am not even sure they will use the Gold State Coach (when I was last at The Mews that was hinted at by the people who work there due to the cost of refurbishing it - around 10 million pounds in 2012 ... which is one reason why it wasn't used for the Diamond Jubilee and the cost of refurbishing it will only increase).

 

[lucien]

I would think so. Because the Tory-government needs a big, prestigious event to show the world that Britain is still an important country in the world. At the moment the papers don't ask for it yet, out of respect for the still living queen, but it will the coronation or both the Platinum Jubilee and the Coronation to be celebrated in full. It shows the victory over Covid as well, don't forget.

No,Charles isnt halve as pompous as several say.It will be more in touch with the time.This is the 21st century,not Victorian times nor pompous Bertie s days.
But still I expect a marvellous spectacle.But it won t be under the Boris band of shananigans and looney bin types...

 

[Osipi]

One big major difference with Charles' coronation is that it will be broadcasted and watched by an audience by far larger than the Queen's. Simply because technology is improved so much since 1953.

I think Charles will keep to the traditions of a coronation as much as possible but it'll reflect the 21st century more so than the 20th. Perhaps a concert at BP again and street parties? It will be a time to celebrate the new reign as people come out of mourning for their Queen that had ruled for so very long and so very well.

 

[Denville]

One big major difference with Charles' coronation is that it will be broadcasted and watched by an audience by far larger than the Queen's. Simply because technology is improved so much since 1953.

I think Charles will keep to the traditions of a coronation as much as possible but it'll reflect the 21st century more so than the 20th. Perhaps a concert at BP again and street parties? It will be a time to celebrate the new reign as people come out of mourning for their Queen that had ruled for so very long and so very well.

It will be smaller and simpler than the queen's but I think that Charles will defintely want a big show. Perhaps not using coaches etc...I thik that they're going out of style....

 

[saastechfashion12]

If Charles or anyone else wished to go and live in Canada or Australia, (if they were still realms which I doubt,) it would probably require some consultation between Britain and the specific other countries. It could well be a bone of contention.

 

[yukari]

Queen Victoria statue at Manitoba Legislative Building torn down

The statue of Queen Victoria on the front lawn of the Manitoba Legislative Building was toppled off its base Thursday afternoon.

According to posts on social media, the statue, doused in red paint, was pulled down by a group of people using what appears to be a long rope wrapped around the front.

Not long after, a statue of Queen Elizabeth II was also torn down.

It had stood on the east side of the grounds near the Governor’s House.

(...)

Statue of Queen pulled down by protesters in Canada

Statues of Queen Elizabeth II and Queen Victoria were torn down in the Canadian city of Winnipeg by protesters furious over the recent discovery of hundreds of unmarked graves of indigenous children.

(...)

A spokesman for Britain’s prime minister, Boris Johnson, said he “condemned any defacing of statues of the Queen”.

(...)

During the reign of Victoria, Canada entered into Confederation and signed treaties with indigenous peoples. The residential schools policy was also enacted during the monarch’s rule (from 1837 until her death in 1901).

The discoveries of graves overshadowed Canada Day celebrations as people asked to cancel the festivities usually marked with fireworks and celebrations.

The prime minister, Justin Trudeau, acknowledged the country’s failures and injustices on the federal holiday.

(...)

 

[Alison H]

A number of Catholic churches have been burnt down. From the BBC website:


Two more Catholic churches burned down in indigenous communities in western Canada early on Saturday.


The fires at St Ann's Church and the Chopaka Church began within an hour of each other in British Columbia.

Officers said both buildings were completely destroyed, and they were treating the fires as "suspicious".

Last Monday two other Catholic churches in the province were destroyed in fires, as Canada marked National Indigenous People's Day.

"The investigations into the previous fires and these two new fires are ongoing with no arrests or charges," Royal Canadian Mounted Police Sgt Jason Bayda said.

It comes after hundreds of unmarked graves were discovered at sites of former residential schools in Canada.

The government-funded compulsory schools were run by religious groups in the 19th and 20th centuries with the aim of assimilating indigenous youth.



Indigenous groups have demanded a nationwide search for more graves.


What happened at the schools was horrific and needs to be properly investigated, but it was not the fault of either Queen Victoria or the present Queen, and I'm not sure that either vandalising statues or burning down churches is a very helpful way to deal with anything.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

It will be smaller and simpler than the queen's but I think that Charles will defintely want a big show. Perhaps not using coaches etc...I thik that they're going out of style....

Coaches are used at State Visits, at Royal Weddings, at Royal Funerals, at the Trooping, at the State Opening of Parliament, at Garter Day, at Ascot race days so why would it not be used for THE most ceremonial State event of all?

 

[Denville]

Coaches are used at State Visits, at Royal Weddings, at Royal Funerals, at the Trooping, at the State Opening of Parliament, at Garter Day, at Ascot race days so why would it not be used for THE most ceremonial State event of all?

because they are uncomfortlabe, very expensive to maintain and beginning to look out of date. Cars are being used now at royal weddings... so I think its possible that they'll give up using them altogether.....

 

[AC21091968]

Downing Street has responded to the toppling of statues of Queen Victoria and Queen Elizabeth II.

A No 10 spokesman said: “We obviously condemn any defacing of statues of the Queen.

“Our thoughts are with Canada’s indigenous community following these tragic discoveries and we follow these issues closely and continue to engage with the government of Canada with indigenous matters.”

Downing Street condemns toppling of the Queen and Queen Victoria statues in Canada
US Correspondent Emma Murphy explains why the statues have been toppled and takes a look at the darker elements of Canada's past
https://www.itv.com/news/2021-07-02...he-queen-and-queen-victoria-statues-in-canada

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

because they are uncomfortlabe, very expensive to maintain and beginning to look out of date. Cars are being used now at royal weddings... so I think its possible that they'll give up using them altogether.....

But the cavalry escort, the Blues and the Royals are exactly there, to escort... It would be a shame no longer to see fantastic gala coaches. The UK is, with the Netherlands, Sweden and Denmark still using coaches (in Spain only for Ambassadors). I hope they will keep the pomp and splendour.

 

[Stefan]

because they are uncomfortlabe, very expensive to maintain and beginning to look out of date. Cars are being used now at royal weddings... so I think its possible that they'll give up using them altogether.....

Why then do they stil add new coaches like the diamond Jubilee Coach which is also quiet new and comofortable

 

[Roslyn]

Deleted due to duplication

 

[Roslyn]

because they are uncomfortlabe, very expensive to maintain and beginning to look out of date. Cars are being used now at royal weddings... so I think its possible that they'll give up using them altogether.....

One could say essentially the same things about the royal family. The royals are only going to be able to keep their elevated position as long as the people consider they are of value. Only one of the royals has an essential function, the rest are extras. A large part of what the royal family does is provide entertainment by providing spectacles for the people to watch, and that includes getting out there in gaudy old-fashioned clothing laden with lots of jewels and riding in coaches. Those coaches and jewels don't belong to the Mountbatten-Windsors, they belong to the people and the people deserve to see them.

 

[Iluvbertie]

The cost of these coaches is enormous. It will cost MILLIONS to get the Gold State Coach ready for such an event. Every time it is used it has to be repainted and regilded with gold. It also needs to be re-sprung. That is a cost I suspect the public wouldn't be happy paying, on top of the rest of the costs of having a coronation. The Queen's cost millions in 1952 - it would be a billion or so now.

They may use the glass coach or the jubilee coach but I suspect not the Gold State Coach.

I also think that only two coaches would be in any procession - one for the King and Queen/Princess Consort and one for the Duke and Duchess of Cornwall and Cambridge (assuming not created as Prince of Wales before the Coronation).

I can see a coronation 'lite' as the way forward even slowly moving away from that and more to the European model as the population of the UK increasingly becomes aetheist at best.

 

[Stefan]

The cost of these coaches is enormous. It will cost MILLIONS to get the Gold State Coach ready for such an event. Every time it is used it has to be repainted and regilded with gold.

Why has it to be repainted and regilded every time it is used?

 

[vkrish]

I guess each time means.. once in a couple of decades.. since it is used so rarely.
So the maintenance cost is for that couple of decades together.
But unfortunately media and critics will present it as a cost for that particular single morning..

 

[Roslyn]

I just had a look at pics of that Gold State Coach. I think it is high time that one was pensioned off. It really looks like a relic of a bygone age, and if it is going to cost millions of pounds to get it ready for Charles' coronation then I think it should definitely be passed over and consigned to history. The Diamond Jubilee State Coach looks fancy enough for a 21st century coronation, and the Australian State Coach is quite new and also fancy, and there are a few other coaches that can be used if needs be, and carriages.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

The cost of these coaches is enormous. It will cost MILLIONS to get the Gold State Coach ready for such an event. Every time it is used it has to be repainted and regilded with gold. It also needs to be re-sprung. That is a cost I suspect the public wouldn't be happy paying, on top of the rest of the costs of having a coronation. The Queen's cost millions in 1952 - it would be a billion or so now.

They may use the glass coach or the jubilee coach but I suspect not the Gold State Coach.

I also think that only two coaches would be in any procession - one for the King and Queen/Princess Consort and one for the Duke and Duchess of Cornwall and Cambridge (assuming not created as Prince of Wales before the Coronation).

I can see a coronation 'lite' as the way forward even slowly moving away from that and more to the European model as the population of the UK increasingly becomes aetheist at best.

The Dutch Golden State Coach has been completely dis-assembled and restored in the past five years. The restoration costs (1,2 million Euro) were paid for by the owner, the King, and the works were finished last month. This was the first major maintenance since 1898, as this coach was only used once a year.

So it surprises me to read that the British Golden State Coach, barely used, has to be prepared for "millions" or even has to be re-gilded every time (why???). I think this is a sensation press bogus story.

.

 

[Iluvbertie]

Why has it to be repainted and regilded every time it is used?

Because it was made in the 1700s and the way it was done means that each time it is used the gilding doesn't stay in place all over. To regild means removing the paintings and then replacing them so they need to be touched up as well.

It is simply its age. The gilding doesn't last and the painting fades so has to be redone to be bright for use.

 

[Iluvbertie]

I guess each time means.. once in a couple of decades.. since it is used so rarely.
So the maintenance cost is for that couple of decades together.
But unfortunately media and critics will present it as a cost for that particular single morning..

Its maintenance costs are in additional to making it presentable for use.

It costs quite a lot to maintain just sitting doing nothing - largely because it is open to the public for well over 350 days a year and sweat, breath etc means maintenance needs to be done regularly.

When I was there there were three people doing some work on the coach then so I asked how often they did things and was told 'every week something needs to be done to this coach because it is on show. If is wasn't on show it would cost about half in maintenance than it costs now.

 

[Denville]

Yes its ridiculous IMO to spend so much. They can have a good show without the use of these ancient coaches which have had thier day...

 

[Roslyn]

Its maintenance costs are in additional to making it presentable for use.

It costs quite a lot to maintain just sitting doing nothing - largely because it is open to the public for well over 350 days a year and sweat, breath etc means maintenance needs to be done regularly.

When I was there there were three people doing some work on the coach then so I asked how often they did things and was told 'every week something needs to be done to this coach because it is on show. If is wasn't on show it would cost about half in maintenance than it costs now.

It should be on show somehow otherwise there is not much point keeping it IMO. Surely it would be possible to construct a climate-controlled room with glass or perspex on three sides where it can be seen but not touched. Though initial costs would be high, the upkeep would be minimal compared to what it seems to be costing now.

 

[Stefan]

It should be on show somehow otherwise there is not much point keeping it IMO. Surely it would be possible to construct a climate-controlled room with glass or perspex on three sides where it can be seen but not touched. Though initial costs would be high, the upkeep would be minimal compared to what it seems to be costing now.

When i was there in 2006 it was on display in a room inside and one could not reach it as the place where it was standing was closed off. So no possibility for Tourists to touch it.

 

[Iluvbertie]

It should be on show somehow otherwise there is not much point keeping it IMO. Surely it would be possible to construct a climate-controlled room with glass or perspex on three sides where it can be seen but not touched. Though initial costs would be high, the upkeep would be minimal compared to what it seems to be costing now.

It is on show in a purpose built part of The Mews. Tourists can't 'touch' it but they can walk all around all four sides in a one way direction and so can see all the fantastic detail. It is the highlight of a visit to The Mews. It is also climate controlled. The 'shed (for want of a better word) is also built for ease of getting it in and out due to its size - about twice that of any of the other carriages weighing 4 tons.

When it is in use it needs over 20 people around it to keep it moving - some on horses, some on the coach and some walking beside it. It also needs 8 horses to move it (and no doubt the animal rights people would get involved in having those horses pull such a heavy coach).

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

It should be on show somehow otherwise there is not much point keeping it IMO. Surely it would be possible to construct a climate-controlled room with glass or perspex on three sides where it can be seen but not touched. Though initial costs would be high, the upkeep would be minimal compared to what it seems to be costing now.

This has been done in the Netherlands: the brand "new" restored Golden State Coach is now in a glass box, safe for elements: https://images.nrc.nl/IkjewKpXoS-Gm...l/images/gn4/stripped/data72220504-8777ca.jpg

They can do the same for the British Golden State Coach. The Dutch coach is pulled by eight horses as well but not for reasons of weight: according protocol the King's coach is always pulled by eight horses in state ceremonial. Never heard animal activists about it. (Yet.)

 

[Blog Real]

A report based on the poll and published in the same magazine said, "When asked whether they support or oppose the monarchy, ​​53 per cent of respondents say they support the institution, of which 26 per cent strongly support it. Just 18 per cent oppose it, of whom only 7 per cent strongly oppose it, and 23 per cent neither support nor oppose it."

https://www.geo.tv/latest/367043-ne...support-monarchy-after-queen-elizabeths-death

 

[Mbruno]

A report based on the poll and published in the same magazine said, "When asked whether they support or oppose the monarchy, ​​53 per cent of respondents say they support the institution, of which 26 per cent strongly support it. Just 18 per cent oppose it, of whom only 7 per cent strongly oppose it, and 23 per cent neither support nor oppose it."

https://www.geo.tv/latest/367043-ne...support-monarchy-after-queen-elizabeths-death

Who conducted the poll for the New Statesman? The British monarch consistently gets higher support in surveys by reliable polling firms like YouGov, so I wonder if that is a scientific poll with a random sample, etc.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

Who conducted the poll for the New Statesman? The British monarch consistently gets higher support in surveys by reliable polling firms like YouGov, so I wonder if that is a scientific poll with a random sample, etc.

See their site and all the organizations they work for:
https://redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/media/

This poll seems conducted amongst 1500 eligible voters representing a median of the UK population.

The outcome of the poll is more or less similar to my country: a not too big majority supporting the monarchy, a small minority advocating the republic and a firm chunk of the people who do not care less about either a monarchy or a republic, at all.

 

[Mbruno]

See their site and all the organizations they work for:
https://redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/media/

This poll seems conducted amongst 1500 eligible voters representing a median of the UK population.

The outcome of the poll is more or less similar to my country: a not too big majority supporting the monarchy, a small minority advocating the republic and a firm chunk of the people who do not care less about either a monarchy or a republic, at all.

I am familiar with Redfield and Wilton, or at least with their election polls. It is considered a reliable firm.



Surprisingly low numbers nonetheless.