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  #1541  
Old 06-09-2021, 02:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
From what I understand, the decision to remove the Queen's portrait from the Common Room was not due to republicanism, but rather to cater for students from former British colonies who felt uncomfortable with the Queen's image, which they associate with their countries' colonial past. That is fair to a certain extent as in many countries in Africa for example, which were still colonies during part of the Queen's reign, portraits of the Queen were likely common as symbols of British sovereignty over those territories.
I'm not aware of that & it's not mentioned by the BBC. Although it may be elsewhere?

If that is the case I find it quite peculiar. Being uncomfortable doesn't give anyone special rights. The absurdities of modern academia.
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  #1542  
Old 06-09-2021, 02:17 PM
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Aren't many if not most of those "countries in Africa" and former British colonies part of the Commonwealth, anyway? If someone really has a problem with the Queen, perhaps they should not be studying in the UK? She is a bit ubiquitous.
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  #1543  
Old 06-09-2021, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Prinsara View Post
She is a bit ubiquitous.
Stamps & money for a start.
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  #1544  
Old 06-09-2021, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Durham View Post
Stamps & money for a start.
To quote Tracey Ullman as Camilla: "How many 'mother-in-laws' is it?"

But this seems to be a case of ivory-tower sensibility ultimately clashing with... reality?
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  #1545  
Old 06-10-2021, 11:44 PM
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More proof that the world's gone crazy. I reckon that if students from former British colonies have a real issue with the British Queen's image being in the common room of a university in Britain, they should choose to study at a university in another country.
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  #1546  
Old 06-11-2021, 04:13 AM
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The person who actually moved the motion is a 25 year old American lecturer.
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  #1547  
Old 06-11-2021, 09:50 AM
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The Future of the British Monarchy

The incident in Magdalen College, Oxford has made it into the House of Commons debate. On Business of the House (10th June) in HoC chamber, Tom Hunt (Conservative MP for Ipswich) asked his colleague Jacob Rees-Mogg, Leader of The House on finding a time to discuss "was to prevent woke-ification of Oxbridge colleges" and university campuses. Tom Hunt also mentioned about 150 academia refusing to teach unless the Rhodes' statue is taken down and the plans to changed the name of "Churchill College" in Cambridge University to be more inclusive.

To which, Jacob Rees-Mogg labelled the students who tried to remove the portrait of Her Majesty "pimply adolescents" though he did say he "not get too excited about that". He then tried to flip the coin and "speculate" what would have happen if a Brit studying in America suggested taking down the American flag. He also labelled the academics who refused to teach "a useless bunch" and "feeble". He then jokingly suggested that Parliament should pass a Bill to change the name of Cambridge University to Churchill University. In context, Jacob Rees-Mogg went to Oxford and has made digs at Cambridge before (Like some students at rival (often top) universities often do, e.g. University of Sydney and University of New South Wales).

Quote:
Tom Hunt (Ipswich) (Con)
On Oxbridge colleges, I was very pleased to see the Prime Minister intervene and object to the appalling news that Magdalen College, Oxford had taken down a portrait of the Queen, but of course, this is not an isolated incident. Today I hear that 150 academics at Oriel College, Oxford are refusing to teach because the Rhodes statue has not been taken down. This week we also heard the disturbing news that Churchill College, Cambridge is considering changing the name of the college, to make it seem more inclusive. I know that, historically, there have been lots of eccentric, left-wing academics at Oxford and Cambridge, but given the sheer frequency with which these events are cropping up, will my right hon. Friend provide time for us to discuss what we can do to prevent the woke-ification of Oxbridge colleges?

Mr Rees-Mogg
As for Magdalen College, it is not exactly 1687-88. It is a few pimply adolescents getting excited and taking down a picture of Her Majesty. It makes Magdalen look pretty wet, but it is not the end of the world. I would not get too excited about that, although it amuses me to speculate as to what would happen if one of Her Majesty’s subjects suggested taking down the stars and stripes in an American university. It might not be enormously well received. As the pimply adolescent in question is, I think, an American citizen, he might like to think about that. He might think that taking down the US flag in an American university was a bridge too far even for the most patriotic Briton.

As regards the academics’ refusing to teach, I am half tempted to say that one should be lucky not to be taught by such a useless bunch. If they are that feeble, what are you missing and what are they doing there? Why do they not have any pride in their country, in our marvellous history and in our success? Rhodes is not a black and white figure. Perhaps they are not learned enough to have bothered to look up the history of Rhodes, which has been written about quite extensively now, in any detail. As I say, he is a figure of importance, interest and enormous generosity to Oxford. Do they want to give the money back to the descendants of Cecil Rhodes, or are they intending to keep it to themselves? We must not allow this wokeness to happen. As for the idea of changing Churchill College, perhaps we should introduce a Bill to rename Cambridge Churchill and call it Churchill University. That would be one in the eye for the lefties.
Business of the House
Volume 696: debated on Thursday 10 June 2021
https://hansard.parliament.uk/common...nessOfTheHouse

Jacob Rees-Mogg has also tweeted out the video
Jacob Rees-Mogg @Jacob_Rees_Mogg
The woke brigade at Oxford and Cambridge are determined to prove Cicero’s point “There is nothing so absurd but some philosopher [academic] has said it”.
6:42 PM · Jun 11, 2021·Twitter Web App
https://twitter.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/...71320100655105
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  #1548  
Old 06-11-2021, 10:00 AM
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Didn't students vote to put it up? Then students voted to take it down.

What is the issue? That is their right.
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  #1549  
Old 06-11-2021, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roslyn View Post
More proof that the world's gone crazy. I reckon that if students from former British colonies have a real issue with the British Queen's image being in the common room of a university in Britain, they should choose to study at a university in another country.
I totally agree. I am an American and this embarrasses me. The royal family should let it be known through an "anonymous" palace source that if the Queen's picture is not put back up, no organization associated with Oxford University will enjoy their patronage anymore. I bet that would get their attention.
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  #1550  
Old 06-11-2021, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by ACO View Post
Didn't students vote to put it up? Then students voted to take it down.

What is the issue? That is their right.
I don't understand your point. No one has disputed that the students had the legal right to put it up or take it down.
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  #1551  
Old 06-11-2021, 10:55 AM
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Several newspapers have questioned whether the American student concerned, an old boy of a $48,000 per year school, also objects to spending sterling, on the grounds that it has pictures of the Queen on it. One assumes not.
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  #1552  
Old 06-11-2021, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
I don't understand your point. No one has disputed that the students had the legal right to put it up or take it down.
So what exactly is the outrage?
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  #1553  
Old 06-11-2021, 12:36 PM
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I'm not sure I follow. Most "outrage" does not involve illegal activity, so it is nothing unusual for perfectly legal actions to draw criticism.
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  #1554  
Old 06-11-2021, 01:03 PM
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My confusion is if students voted to put it up (as it wasn’t there before) then why the fuss others students voted to remove it to how it was before?

Nothing really about legality except we got people (even in this thread) saying these students should maybe leave the county. Bit extreme, no?
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  #1555  
Old 06-11-2021, 01:13 PM
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It seems clear from the posted articles that the "fuss" is about the statements made by the spokesperson in explaining the removal.
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  #1556  
Old 06-11-2021, 01:14 PM
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Well, they aren't exactly helping the cause! No matter what it might be.

Militants rarely win over Joe and Jolene Average, on the contrary.
Because if there is anything that is very touchy it's national and historical symbols!

And if you are a guest, who have been treated, wined and dined as a guest, and you start to criticize the way the host decorate their home, it's perhaps time to leave...

So in my eyes, this is an example of people who have been educated above their intelligence.
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  #1557  
Old 06-11-2021, 01:14 PM
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It's strange but reading all this about an outrage of a Queen's portrait hanging in a student communal setting at an university in the UK makes me seriously wonder if we're heading for a situation where, in the future, it will be a sensitive issue to wear a certain color such as orange as orange may symbolize something that isn't universal to all human beings. Or that hair styles conform to being uniform so that individuality is not expressed. Burn down or erase the history of what was so as not to mar the present with dissention?

Are we reaching a point where we're so afraid of offending someone else that we will give up our own individuality, our own cultures and our own thoughts so as to preserve the status quo so to speak?

Is this where we're heading:

"Beam me up, Scotty, there ain't no intelligent humanity left here. Just clones."
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  #1558  
Old 06-11-2021, 01:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
It's strange but reading all this about an outrage of a Queen's portrait hanging in a student communal setting at an university in the UK makes me seriously wonder if we're heading for a situation where, in the future, it will be a sensitive issue to wear a certain color such as orange as orange may symbolize something that isn't universal to all human beings. Or that hair styles conform to being uniform so that individuality is not expressed. Burn down or erase the history of what was so as not to mar the present with dissention?

Are we reaching a point where we're so afraid of offending someone else that we will give up our own individuality, our own cultures and our own thoughts so as to preserve the status quo so to speak?

Is this where we're heading:

"Beam me up, Scotty, there ain't no intelligent humanity left here. Just clones."
Exactly!

The greatest threat to freedom today is not dictators, religious fanatics or terrorists. It's the fear not being politically correct, of having prejudices, of not offending anyone - even those who are not offended...
Because we are only humans and as such politically incorrect in so many ways in our daily lives.
We all have prejudices. Hundreds of them. - That's down to ignorance and in most cases we are proven wrong by learning about whoever it might be. And in some cases we are proven right...
I'm offended every single day. Several times a day in fact, just by reading a paper.
Sometimes I'm offended for several minutes and if it really bad I'm offended for several hours.
But life moves on despite me being offended - and I no doubt offend other people as well.
That's life.

So instead of making a song and dance act about how righteous these people think they are, perhaps they should simply join the most of us, and grow some tolerance and overbearing.

Because if we don't stand up to these self-appointed censors, we will lose our freedom. And what is just as bad, there will come a backlash.
Because the brown shirts, who Joe and Jolene Average voted for in their frustration, don't care about being called racists or nationalists. They'll beat you up, rather than apologizing for a colonial past.
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