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  #1121  
Old 05-20-2016, 06:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Furienna View Post
Well, it seems like the only one on this list, who has any chance of getting near a throne, must be Märtha Louise. And even with her, we're talking about the Norwegian throne and not the British one. It is very interesting though to see how little you have to care of your "royal reputation", when you end up so low down on the list.
When you are born below the top 15 in line for the throne, most people wont even know you are royal. You are private citizens who actually pay your own bills. So if you marry a surfer from NZ or work as a shop girl, good on you. As long as you're not posing nude wearing fake crown jewels and emphasizing your place in line to the throne Martha Louise agreed to the removal of her HRH title to loosen her connection to the RF.
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  #1122  
Old 05-20-2016, 09:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Roslyn View Post
It might make you chuckle, but it makes me fume and swear and want to throw things.

Isn't that archaic notion of a married woman's identity being subsumed within that of her husband long past its use-by date? Why do women tolerate it any longer?
Because many of us don't care and are comfortable with more traditional ways of doing things...taking my husband's surname doesn't make me a lesser person or somehow unequal, oppressed or subjugated.


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  #1123  
Old 05-20-2016, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
Because many of us don't care and are comfortable with more traditional ways of doing things...taking my husband's surname doesn't make me a lesser person or somehow unequal, oppressed or subjugated.


LaRae
That's fine. It's your choice, though it saddens me that so many women don't care. But taking your husband's surname is not quite the same as having all your identity subsumed within his by being known as Mrs (husband's first name) (husband's surname), which is what has happened with Zara, or being known as Princess Michael.
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  #1124  
Old 05-20-2016, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Roslyn View Post
That's fine. It's your choice, though it saddens me that so many women don't care. But taking your husband's surname is not quite the same as having all your identity subsumed within his by being known as Mrs (husband's first name) (husband's surname), which is what has happened with Zara, or being known as Princess Michael.
Yes exactly it's my choice. I wish feminists would respect it and stop acting like women who choose this are being somehow mistreated. It's insulting.

Zara's identity has not being 'subsumed' because she might be referred to as Mrs Michael Tindall. She still shows (in her career) using her maiden name. Either way, I've seen nothing to indicate she has an issue with how she is addressed.



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  #1125  
Old 05-20-2016, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
Yes exactly it's my choice. I wish feminists would respect it and stop acting like women who choose this are being somehow mistreated. It's insulting.

Zara's identity has not being 'subsumed' because she might be referred to as Mrs Michael Tindall. She still shows (in her career) using her maiden name. Either way, I've seen nothing to indicate she has an issue with how she is addressed.

LaRae
I have not said that women who choose to take their husband's surnames are being mistreated. That's a matter of choice, just as when a man chooses to take his wife's surname, or a couple chooses to adopt a hyphenated surname incorporating both their surnames, and when a woman chooses to keep her own surname. That is choice and it is quite a different thing from being described by others merely in terms of your relationship to a particular man. That amounts to having your identity subsumed, and that is not just a matter of opinion, it was a fact of the doctrine of coverture and the laws that applied under that doctrine. Referring to Zara as "Mrs Michael Tindall" is anachronistic and insulting, in my opinion, even if she is happy as a clam for them to do this.
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  #1126  
Old 05-20-2016, 10:58 PM
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The focus should be turned into the direction of those women in the world who suffer true oppression, basically being chattel and having little to no right of self determination.

It seems rather misguided to carry on about women being referred to as 'Mrs Michael Tindall' when you have women undergoing true oppression elsewhere in the world.


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  #1127  
Old 05-20-2016, 11:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
Yes exactly it's my choice. I wish feminists would respect it and stop acting like women who choose this are being somehow mistreated. It's insulting.

Zara's identity has not being 'subsumed' because she might be referred to as Mrs Michael Tindall. She still shows (in her career) using her maiden name. Either way, I've seen nothing to indicate she has an issue with how she is addressed.



LaRae
She actually competes by her married name now. Check her last few competitions . She's also has registered her name with British Eventing as 'Mrs Zara Tindall' . Here's her rider profile. https://www.britisheventing.com/asp-...?RiderId=33381
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  #1128  
Old 05-21-2016, 12:11 AM
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And that's cool too..if she wants to compete using her married name, that's up to her. Everything I've seen has been still under Phillips (she was in the US at Rolex recently and identified as Zara Phillips) but anyway...she's fine with it so should everyone else be.


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  #1129  
Old 05-21-2016, 01:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
And that's cool too..if she wants to compete using her married name, that's up to her. Everything I've seen has been still under Phillips (she was in the US at Rolex recently and identified as Zara Phillips) but anyway...she's fine with it so should everyone else be.


LaRae
The rolex event was in Spring 2015. Hardly 'recent'. Her competitions this year have called her Zara Tindall. Her two elite events this year a four-star(Badminton Trials) and a three-star (Chatsworth) both called her Tindall.

The official Badminton site (Zara is listed 23rd)- https://www.badminton-horse.co.uk/in...-results-2016/

The official page for Chatsworth (type in Tindall)- Chatsworth

In fact, this year Zara has gone out of her way to insist she be called by her married name when she is competing. Several articles were written about it.

Zara Philips to now be known as Mrs Tindall as she prepares for the Rio Olympics 2016 | Somerset Live

Shane Watson: Zara Phillips plays the name game
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  #1130  
Old 05-21-2016, 01:46 AM
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I'm confused: what does the succession to the crown act have to do with what name Zara uses? The two seem totally unrelated. 🤔


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  #1131  
Old 05-21-2016, 01:55 AM
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The Succession Act addressed issues of patriarchy, a woman using her husbands name is also seen as a vestigial of patriarchy. The Shane Watson article I posted moaned about the latter. That's why Pranter and Roslyn were connecting the topics.

I only jumped in to point out Zara's stance on the subject.
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  #1132  
Old 05-21-2016, 06:28 AM
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Thanks !


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  #1133  
Old 05-21-2016, 07:00 AM
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Originally Posted by miss whirley View Post
The Succession Act addressed issues of patriarchy, a woman using her husbands name is also seen as a vestigial of patriarchy. The Shane Watson article I posted moaned about the latter. That's why Pranter and Roslyn were connecting the topics.

I only jumped in to point out Zara's stance on the subject.

I agree that this is not the appropriate forum to discuss Zara's last name.
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  #1134  
Old 05-21-2016, 07:09 AM
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Originally Posted by miss whirley View Post
The rolex event was in Spring 2015. Hardly 'recent'. Her competitions this year have called her Zara Tindall. Her two elite events this year a four-star(Badminton Trials) and a three-star (Chatsworth) both called her Tindall.

The official Badminton site (Zara is listed 23rd)- https://www.badminton-horse.co.uk/in...-results-2016/

The official page for Chatsworth (type in Tindall)- Chatsworth

In fact, this year Zara has gone out of her way to insist she be called by her married name when she is competing. Several articles were written about it.

Zara Philips to now be known as Mrs Tindall as she prepares for the Rio Olympics 2016 | Somerset Live

Shane Watson: Zara Phillips plays the name game

Rolex was last month in Kentucky, May 2016. She was not competing but was there as she was interviewed on the cross country course and discussed various fences on the course.

And yes the reason her name came up is that it was used as an example of how women are somehow being marginalized because they use their husbands surname or are referred to as Mrs John Smith (Zara was used as example).


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  #1135  
Old 05-21-2016, 07:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
And that's cool too..if she wants to compete using her married name, that's up to her. Everything I've seen has been still under Phillips (she was in the US at Rolex recently and identified as Zara Phillips) but anyway...she's fine with it so should everyone else be.


LaRae
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
Rolex was last month in Kentucky, May 2016. She was not competing but was there as she was interviewed on the cross country course and discussed various fences on the course.

And yes the reason her name came up is that it was used as an example of how women are somehow being marginalized because they use their husbands surname or are referred to as Mrs John Smith (Zara was used as example).


LaRae
Bolded- you answered your own question. She was not competing. She was going to compete with High Kingdom at the 2015 rolex but he got injured. She was not a rider there in 2016. In 2016 she exclusively competes under the name Zara Tindall by her own choice. It shouldn't bother anyone that she no longer uses Phillips. Her choice.
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  #1136  
Old 05-21-2016, 08:53 AM
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Actually she was still being identified as Philips at Rolex (rider or not)...however perhaps not everyone in the horse world is aware, yet, of her decision to use her married name.


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  #1137  
Old 05-21-2016, 09:18 AM
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Okay, time to get back to the topic at hand - the Succession to the Crown Act. If you wish to further discuss Zara's choice of Phillips or Tindall, her own thread is more appropriate.
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  #1138  
Old 03-17-2018, 12:18 AM
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How did Parliament come up with the number six? I realize the advantages of limiting the number of heirs who need the monarch's permission to marry – others further down the line of succession probably wouldn't be working royals or even HRHs and their chances of actually succeeding to the throne would be slim to none.

But why six instead of five or seven or eight or ten? Was the actual number ever discussed or debated in Parliament?
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  #1139  
Old 03-17-2018, 12:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Gawin View Post
How did Parliament come up with the number six? I realize the advantages of limiting the number of heirs who need the monarch's permission to marry – others further down the line of succession probably wouldn't be working royals or even HRHs and their chances of actually succeeding to the throne would be slim to none.

But why six instead of five or seven or eight or ten? Was the actual number ever discussed or debated in Parliament?
I'm going to take a guess at this and submit that the reason the number is set at six because it is the top six in succession to the Crown that are eligible to serve as Councilors of State. The exception is the consort of the monarch who also can serve.
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  #1140  
Old 03-17-2018, 12:46 AM
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I'm going to take a guess at this and submit that the reason the number is set at six because it is the top six in succession to the Crown that are eligible to serve as Councilors of State. The exception is the consort of the monarch who also can serve.
I believe, actually that it’s the top FOUR in succession that are eligible to serve as Counsellors of State (provided they are 21 (or 18 in the case of the heir apparent or heir presumptive)), plus the consort. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother was additionally eligible from 1953 for the rest of her life.

As to why they picked the number 6? It’s in the notes to the Act on the UK parliament website. Basically the rationale was this: NO ONE LOWER THAN 5TH HAS EVER SUCCEEDED TO THE THRONE so they picked 6 just to be safe.
The future Queen Victoria was 5th in line for a few months after she was born.
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