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  #1481  
Old 09-07-2020, 05:30 PM
AC21091968's Avatar
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The TaxPayers' Alliance now claiming on social media and its website that their members have lobbied the fast repayment

https://twitter.com/the_tpa/status/1303008646939529216

https://www.taxpayersalliance.com/ta...n_royal_refund

From wikipedia: The TaxPayers' Alliance is a right-wing libertarian pressure group in the United Kingdom formed in 2004 to campaign for a low tax society.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TaxPayers'_Alliance

It does make me wonder whether Sir Geoffrey Clifton-Brown and Bim Afolami (Conservative MPs) were persuaded by the TaxPayers' Alliance' petition to raise this concern to the Public Accounts Committee.
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  #1482  
Old 09-07-2020, 05:39 PM
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Deleted and merged with another post.
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  #1483  
Old 09-07-2020, 05:40 PM
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All sorted then, case closed. I don't care what they do with their own money as long as they aren't taking official money or still owing any.
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  #1484  
Old 09-07-2020, 05:46 PM
Majesty
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommy100 View Post
All sorted then, case closed. I don't care what they do with their own money as long as they aren't taking official money or still owing any.

The DM is also saying that they will no longer take Charles' cash, having de facto declared their "financial independence".

All that is very good, but I insist they should not be diverting their production company's money to repay unrelated private debt or to pay for private expenses, at least not until they have delivered an actual product to Netflix.

I don't know how things like that are seen in the UK, if that is what they are doing, but it sounds a bit like a Ponzi scheme to me.

I don't know, maybe I'm overreacting.


Quote:
Originally Posted by AC21091968 View Post
The TaxPayers' Alliance now claiming on social media and its website that their members have lobbied the fast repayment

https://twitter.com/the_tpa/status/1303008646939529216

https://www.taxpayersalliance.com/ta...n_royal_refund

From wikipedia: The TaxPayers' Alliance is a right-wing libertarian pressure group in the United Kingdom formed in 2004 to campaign for a low tax society.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TaxPayers'_Alliance

It does make me wonder whether Sir Geoffrey Clifton-Brown and Bim Afolami (Conservative MPs) were persuaded to raise this concern to the Public Accounts Committee.
A somewhat nonsensical claim IMHO as the money, as far as I understand, was paid back to the Queen (via a contribution to the Sovereign Grant) and not directly to the Treasury.

In other words, taxpayers didn't get any money back and, in fact, no extra "taxpayer money" was spent on Frogmore cottage which had not already left the Treasury and been given to the Queen.
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  #1485  
Old 09-07-2020, 05:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
A somewhat nonsensical claim IMHO as the money, as far as I understand, was paid back to the Queen (via a contribution to the Sovereign Grant) and not directly to the Treasury.

In other words, taxpayers didn't get any money back and, in fact, no extra "taxpayer money" was spent on Frogmore cottage which had not already left the Treasury and been given to the Queen.
Exactly, I think The TaxPayers' Alliance is just frustrated on public spending due to COVID-19. Any "unnecessary" expenditure would anger them.

(P.S. I am personally for low taxation, but accept the fact that Frogmore Cottage renovation was paid by the Sovereign Grant, not the taxpayer or HM Treasury)
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  #1486  
Old 09-07-2020, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
The DM is reporting that the renovation cost was repaid with money the Sussexes got from the Netflix deal.

It sounds unwise to me as that should be investment money, especially considering the big operation they are setting up (with feature films, documentaries and children's programming).
If that’s the case it’s between them and Netflix. The UK has been reimbursed.
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  #1487  
Old 09-07-2020, 07:35 PM
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Excellent news that the money for refurbishing their wedding gift from the Queen has now been reimbursed by the Sussexes. Also that Charles will no longer be paying them an allowance. All within six months of leaving as working royals. Now perhaps the tabloids will concentrate on other matters besides constant criticism of this couple.
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  #1488  
Old 09-08-2020, 03:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
Excellent news that the money for refurbishing their wedding gift from the Queen has now been reimbursed by the Sussexes. Also that Charles will no longer be paying them an allowance. All within six months of leaving as working royals. Now perhaps the tabloids will concentrate on other matters besides constant criticism of this couple.


Frogmore Cottage was never a “wedding gift from the Queen”:

“Harry should have paid this bill from the outset, rather than expecting the taxpayer to stump up the cash.

“They’ve now paid for the refurbishment while continuing to use the home whenever they stay in the UK.

“Their statement claims the cottage is the Queen’s property, which is untrue.

“It belongs to the Crown Estate, which is there to raise revenue for the Treasury, so we have a right to know what rent they are paying for the place.”

Questions have been raised as to how much time Harry and Meghan intend to spend in the UK. Some key live-in staff at Frogmore Cottage were moved to other duties within the Queen’s household earlier this year.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...e_iOSApp_Other
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  #1489  
Old 09-08-2020, 04:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalriada View Post
“Their statement claims the cottage is the Queen’s property, which is untrue.

“It belongs to the Crown Estate, which is there to raise revenue for the Treasury, so we have a right to know what rent they are paying for the place.”
Just to clarify things, "The Crown Estate belongs to the reigning monarch 'in right of The Crown', that is, it is owned by the monarch for the duration of their reign, by virtue of their accession to the throne. But it is not the private property of the monarch - it cannot be sold by the monarch, nor do revenues from it belong to the monarch."

The Sovereign Grant is given to the monarch from the Crown Estate and with that funding, the monarch is footing the bill for renovations and restoration of the properties the royal family uses.

One thing too is that when the Sussexes were taking Frogmore Cottage as their UK residence, it was the personalizing of the interior that they reimbursed the Sovereign Grant for. The renovations of any of the structure of the residence would have had to be done regardless if the Sussexes moved in there or Andrew or Anne or if it was to be a playhouse for Charlotte.

Its easier to see where the taxpayer monies come into play when we take a look at the renovations being done over a period of 10 years to Buckingham Palace.

"Funding for a multimillion-pound refurbishment of Buckingham Palace has been approved by MPs. They backed changes to the Sovereign Grant - the funding formula for the monarchy's official duties - by 464 votes to 56. The grant will increase by 66% to pay for the £369m refurbishment."

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-38025513...20next%20April.
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  #1490  
Old 09-08-2020, 05:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stunking View Post
A deal is a deal and they paid for the renovations made to Frogmore Cottage.
yes. which was the right thing for them to do. If they want to spend their advance on that, I think it was a good idea...
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  #1491  
Old 09-08-2020, 11:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
Just to clarify things, "The Crown Estate belongs to the reigning monarch 'in right of The Crown', that is, it is owned by the monarch for the duration of their reign, by virtue of their accession to the throne. But it is not the private property of the monarch - it cannot be sold by the monarch, nor do revenues from it belong to the monarch."



The Sovereign Grant is given to the monarch from the Crown Estate and with that funding, the monarch is footing the bill for renovations and restoration of the properties the royal family uses.



One thing too is that when the Sussexes were taking Frogmore Cottage as their UK residence, it was the personalizing of the interior that they reimbursed the Sovereign Grant for. The renovations of any of the structure of the residence would have had to be done regardless if the Sussexes moved in there or Andrew or Anne or if it was to be a playhouse for Charlotte.



Its easier to see where the taxpayer monies come into play when we take a look at the renovations being done over a period of 10 years to Buckingham Palace.



"Funding for a multimillion-pound refurbishment of Buckingham Palace has been approved by MPs. They backed changes to the Sovereign Grant - the funding formula for the monarchy's official duties - by 464 votes to 56. The grant will increase by 66% to pay for the £369m refurbishment."



https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-38025513...20next%20April.


Many thanks for reinforcing the point. So generous of you.
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  #1492  
Old 09-08-2020, 11:09 AM
Majesty
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
The BBC is reporting that the Duke of Sussex has now repaid in full the cost of renovating Frogmore Cottage.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-54062799

The following excerpt from the BBC article is worth quoting.
Rather like The Yorks place Sunninghill. There are reports that they may use Frogmore, I really don't see the point unless they are going to be back for month or 2 at a time.
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  #1493  
Old 09-23-2020, 09:46 PM
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In regards to the percentage of asset from Crown Estate, Daniel Martin, policy editor of the Daily Mail has tweeted out a screenshot of the paper along with his tweet
Daniel Martin @Daniel_J_Martin
EXC: Treasury to spend millions propping up Queen’s income after her property loses money thanks to coronavirus
7:14 AM · Sep 24, 2020·Twitter for iPhone
https://twitter.com/Daniel_J_Martin/...77383966035969

According to this article, the percentage of Sovereign Grant is 25% (up 10% from 15% in the early 2010s)

I'm not quite if Daniel Martin is stirring up trouble or just reporting the truth.
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  #1494  
Old 09-23-2020, 09:59 PM
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If you scroll back a little ways to post #1489, I've shown where Parliament has agreed to up the Sovereign Grant for the renovations to Buckingham Palace. This was quite a while back ago. 2016, I believe. If they've upped the Sovereign Grant again since the pandemic, I've heard nothing about that.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-38025513...20next%20April
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  #1495  
Old 09-24-2020, 10:34 AM
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“We said this would happen when the grant was introduced in 2011. The Crown Estate profits fall but the Sovereign Grant doesn't go down. The taxpayers lose out.” Republic spokesperson:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...plummeted.html
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  #1496  
Old 09-24-2020, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalriada View Post
“We said this would happen when the grant was introduced in 2011. The Crown Estate profits fall but the Sovereign Grant doesn't go down. The taxpayers lose out.” Republic spokesperson:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...plummeted.html
Well yes indeed. In the final analysis the monarchy is underwritten by the taxpayer.
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  #1497  
Old 09-25-2020, 03:34 AM
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More press coverage today: ““These figures don’t disclose the daily abuse of money on shorter trips around the country, taking helicopters when they could go by car, driving when they could go by train. The figures also ignore security, revenue lost from the two Duchies, costs met by local councils and much more. Add those figures in and £345m is much closer to the truth.”


https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...e_iOSApp_Other
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  #1498  
Old 09-25-2020, 03:59 AM
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For so far the framing of the Dutch as "the most expensive monarchy". It really is about transparence and what is the basis for any calculation of costs.
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  #1499  
Old 09-25-2020, 04:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalriada View Post
More press coverage today: ““These figures don’t disclose the daily abuse of money on shorter trips around the country, taking helicopters when they could go by car, driving when they could go by train. The figures also ignore security, revenue lost from the two Duchies, costs met by local councils and much more. Add those figures in and £345m is much closer to the truth.”


https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...e_iOSApp_Other
Thank you for the article. The Daily Mail has also mentioned it yesterday (or the day before).

Like a lot of newspaper publications, they seem to be mistaken on the how the sovereign grant works. The sovereign grant is NOT taxpayer-founded. It is the 25% (as of 2016) of the annual Crown Estate's profit. The rest of 75% goes to HM's Treasury in which the government (or more likely Chancellor of the Exchequer) can decide what to spend on.
The Queen will receive £86.3m from the taxpayer-funded sovereign grant next year for both official duties and palace refurbishment. Though Crown Estate profits are expected to be lower, she will receive the same in 2022-23, as under the 2012 funding formula, the amount can never go down.
I apologise if I have been repeating the same sentence. These newspaper publication seriously need to get this thing right.

I am not surprised that the profit of Crown Estate has gone down due to COVID-19. Increase the number of tours in Buckingham Palace, other Crown Estate properties or even the Queen's private properties (Sandringham House & Balmoral Castle) is definitely not an option. In most cases, indoor tours cannot happen because of COVID restriction.

Like the article has mentioned, the income from Royal Collection Trust (RCT) and Duchy of Cornwall has also fallen.

I am not quite sure if the current Chancellor (Rt Hon. Rishi Sunak MP) will change the percentage of Crown Estate's profit that goes into the Sovereign Grant. I don't think increasing the rate greater than 25% will not sit well with the public. Conversely, I don't think Mr. Sunak will decrease the rate, given that George Osbourne (former Chancellor from the Conservative Party) increase it from 15%.
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  #1500  
Old 09-25-2020, 08:05 AM
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Financial reports 2019-20

The Royal Household has published their annual financial statement, the Sovereign Grant Report, for the financial year 2019-20. There are three PDF documents (Sovereign Grant Report 2019-20: Summary, Full Sovereign Grant Report 2019-20 and Sovereign Grant Report 2019-20: Royal Travel appendix). The website from the link below also listed the key financial details.

https://www.royal.uk/financial-reports-2019-20
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