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  #5261  
Old 08-12-2020, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CyrilVladisla View Post
This is quite confusing. At the start Prince Harry and Meghan wanted no royal or aristocratic title for Archie. Why is Archie being given a title by King Charles III?
I had hoped we'd have less no more of them. Seems pointless.

And I do dislike this notion that it's their (anyone in the royal family) "right" to be a HRH. It's nobody's right, it's a privilege & an honour for anyone to have this style.

It's needs to be rationed & employed by those who work for the British people.
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  #5262  
Old 08-12-2020, 04:39 PM
Majesty
 
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Originally Posted by Durham View Post
I had hoped we'd have less no more of them. Seems pointless.

And I do dislike this notion that it's their (anyone in the royal family) "right" to be a HRH. It's nobody's right, it's a privilege & an honour for anyone to have this style.

It's needs to be rationed & employed by those who work for the British people.
It is rationed. Its confined to those who are closest to the queen.. ie the children and grandchildren of the monarch.
I dont know the Sussexes want a title for Archie, but he will be HRH and prince when his grandfather becomes King.. unless his parents and Charles agree that he is not going to be HRH.
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  #5263  
Old 08-12-2020, 04:46 PM
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Rationed more then. They're too many as it is.

And realistically going forward if male line grandchildren like Archie are to continue being given this style then female line grandchildren will have to be as well. So that inevitably means the children of both Charlotte & Louis.

It's too much.
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  #5264  
Old 08-12-2020, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Denville View Post
It is rationed. Its confined to those who are closest to the queen.. ie the children and grandchildren of the monarch.
I dont know the Sussexes want a title for Archie, but he will be HRH and prince when his grandfather becomes King.. unless his parents and Charles agree that he is not going to be HRH.
His parents don't necessarily have to agree. It's up to the Sovereign...
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  #5265  
Old 08-13-2020, 05:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CyrilVladisla View Post
This is quite confusing. At the start Prince Harry and Meghan wanted no royal or aristocratic title for Archie. Why is Archie being given a title by King Charles III?
The second article quoted was published first.

The article asserting that "on the change of reign the George V convention would apply" and elevate Archie Mountbatten-Windsor to Prince Archie was published at the time of his birth.

The book asserting that "[Charles] said he would consider when became king issuing a new letters patent" to assure that Archie would forgo a royal title until of age to decide for himself was published only a few days ago.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Darius1 View Post
Had Philip not renounced his Greek and Danish titles his children would automatically have been born Princes of Greece and Denmark.
It is true that European royal titles are traditionally passed down by fathers, but should King George VI have requested that Philip be granted leave to keep the titles Prince of Greece and Prince of Denmark on a non-hereditary footing, I think the kings of Greece and Denmark would have been accommodating.
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  #5266  
Old 08-14-2020, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Durham View Post
Rationed more then. They're too many as it is.

And realistically going forward if male line grandchildren like Archie are to continue being given this style then female line grandchildren will have to be as well. So that inevitably means the children of both Charlotte & Louis.

It's too much.
I dont realy see that it matters,. It does not mean that they have to be on the royal working roster or that they get any tax payers money...
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  #5267  
Old 08-14-2020, 04:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I dont realy see that it matters,. It does not mean that they have to be on the royal working roster or that they get any tax payers money...
Well, these styles & titles confer status & dignity on the individual who have them so they need to be awarded sparingly. Ideally only those who support the crown should have them.

The rest can use the courtesy titles of the younger children of dukes (since that what they are anyway) if they want one. The money issue is a red herring.
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  #5268  
Old 08-14-2020, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Durham View Post
Well, these styles & titles confer status & dignity on the individual who have them so they need to be awarded sparingly. Ideally only those who support the crown should have them.

The rest can use the courtesy titles of the younger children of dukes (since that what they are anyway) if they want one. The money issue is a red herring.
I just dont see that it matters. I'd like to see Andrew lose his HRH but its not likely to happen. Other than that there are only 4 HRHs in Harry's generation.. and only 3 in the next gen.
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  #5269  
Old 08-14-2020, 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I just dont see that it matters. I'd like to see Andrew lose his HRH but its not likely to happen. Other than that there are only 4 HRHs in Harry's generation.. and only 3 in the next gen.
We don't know that Louise and James won't pick theirs up. Doesn't seem likely, but we don't know for sure.
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  #5270  
Old 08-14-2020, 04:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Prinsara View Post
We don't know that Louise and James won't pick theirs up. Doesn't seem likely, but we don't know for sure.
I doubt it.. but IMO its not that big a deal if they do. Perhaps in Wills reign HRH will be confined to the children of the heir.. but I think we can cope with Eugenie, Bea, etc....
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  #5271  
Old 08-14-2020, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I just dont see that it matters. I'd like to see Andrew lose his HRH but its not likely to happen. Other than that there are only 4 HRHs in Harry's generation.. and only 3 in the next gen.
Well they'd be another three in Harry's generation if it was already all grand children (male or female line). And a further three in Charles'. And four in the queen's.

I understand that you don't see it matters. It's obviously something which attracts different points of view.

Less is more in this case to my way of thinking.
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  #5272  
Old 08-14-2020, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I just dont see that it matters. I'd like to see Andrew lose his HRH but its not likely to happen. Other than that there are only 4 HRHs in Harry's generation.. and only 3 in the next gen.
It would be 4 if Archie also becomes a royal highness upon his grandfather's ascension to the throne.
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  #5273  
Old 08-14-2020, 04:52 PM
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It would be 4 if Archie also becomes a royal highness upon his grandfather's ascension to the throne.
I think that's unlikley since they dont even use his courtesty title as an earl...
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  #5274  
Old 08-15-2020, 12:39 AM
JSH JSH is offline
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It is entirely possible that the Sussexes don't have Archie use his courtesy title now in order to avoid confusion when Charles becomes king and Archie drops any courtesy title and takes up his HRH Prince title.
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  #5275  
Old 08-16-2020, 10:55 AM
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It is entirely possible that the Sussexes don't have Archie use his courtesy title now in order to avoid confusion when Charles becomes king and Archie drops any courtesy title and takes up his HRH Prince title.
I don't see why.. they can ask for him not to have the HRH.. he doesn't HAVE to have it.. and other people inherit titles and give up using courtesy titles and there's no confusion. As Archie is mainly known to the press by his first name, he'll still be Archie, even if he does become a prince. I think that they decided that he would be jsut Master Archie, partly because they were planning on leaving royal life and partly because his courtesty title was a rather unfortunate one.. I think that "Earl of Dumbarton" was bound to get jokes made abuot it.
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  #5276  
Old 08-16-2020, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I don't see why.. they can ask for him not to have the HRH.. he doesn't HAVE to have it.. and other people inherit titles and give up using courtesy titles and there's no confusion. As Archie is mainly known to the press by his first name, he'll still be Archie, even if he does become a prince. I think that they decided that he would be jsut Master Archie, partly because they were planning on leaving royal life and partly because his courtesty title was a rather unfortunate one.. I think that "Earl of Dumbarton" was bound to get jokes made abuot it.
Yes, that might have played a part; although in that case the more logical thing to do (imho) was to just use the title of younger sons, so have all their children styled as Lord/Lady ... as any other children would have been as children of a duke.
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  #5277  
Old 08-16-2020, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I don't see why.. they can ask for him not to have the HRH.. he doesn't HAVE to have it.. and other people inherit titles and give up using courtesy titles and there's no confusion. As Archie is mainly known to the press by his first name, he'll still be Archie, even if he does become a prince. I think that they decided that he would be jsut Master Archie, partly because they were planning on leaving royal life and partly because his courtesty title was a rather unfortunate one.. I think that "Earl of Dumbarton" was bound to get jokes made abuot it.
I agree with the people who have already said that Harry and Meghan could have asked HM for any other earldom for Harry if that were the issue. She has been known to be accommodating.
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  #5278  
Old 08-16-2020, 11:06 AM
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Yes, that might have played a part; although in that case the more logical thing to do (imho) was to just use the title of younger sons, so have all their children styled as Lord/Lady ... as any other children would have been as children of a duke.
I think it was an unfortunate courtesy title.. had he been Earl of Kent (I'm just making up a title)... he could have been Archie Lord Kent.. and probably mostly called Archie in the papers and by his parents when referring to him.. but I do think that giving the title Earl of Dumbarton was not well thought out.. Even if the press only used it now and then, I suspect there would be jokes about Dumbo etc.
but i think that by the time A was born, they were on the way to a get out, and they wanted to show their modern credentials by saying "we just want him to be plain Archie MW... " and they din't want him to be Lord A or a sister to be Lady Petunia MW
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  #5279  
Old 08-16-2020, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Prinsara View Post
I agree with the people who have already said that Harry and Meghan could have asked HM for any other earldom for Harry if that were the issue. She has been known to be accommodating.
Probably they didn't think far ahead either...
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  #5280  
Old 08-16-2020, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I think it was an unfortunate courtesy title.. had he been Earl of Kent (I'm just making up a title)... he could have been Archie Lord Kent.. and probably mostly called Archie in the papers and by his parents when referring to him.. but I do think that giving the title Earl of Dumbarton was not well thought out.. Even if the press only used it now and then, I suspect there would be jokes about Dumbo etc.
but i think that by the time A was born, they were on the way to a get out, and they wanted to show their modern credentials by saying "we just want him to be plain Archie MW... " and they din't want him to be Lord A or a sister to be Lady Petunia MW



He could use Lord Kilkeel instead as his courtesy title if he wanted to, but it is not terribly flattering either (think Archie Kilkeel or Archie Dumbarton).


Of course, if he became an HRH, he could be simply Archie Sussex in a British school and that would actually sound nice, I think.
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