Prince of Wales - Title, Succession and Wales

[wyevale]

If a MAJORITY in the constituent nations of the United Kingdom wish to vote for independence they have the vote.... and parties to vote for.

Therefore they have the capacity to end the tradition of the usage of non English names as titles for members of the reigning family. Currently more than 70% are content with the status quo. There is no need to waste money consulting them. If they are unhappy at the time a decision is made, they will be vocal enough to ensure they are consulted !

[royalistbert]

You are never going to have universal support for anything. There is always going to be people who object to things. I think most people assume William will be made Prince of Wales when Charles is King. The heir to the throne has been created Prince of Wales for centuries. It has the weight of history behind it.

[Lumutqueen]

Originally Posted by royalistbert

They BRF should NEVER ever have to ask permission to create titles for parts of The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

If there is severe objection to something, then yes they should. The monarchy is not autocratic you know. Just because they've been chosen by God doesn't mean they can abuse their people. If Wales didn't want a Prince of Wales, then it shouldn't happen.

[carlfraley]

This entire should he/ should he pow title is ludicrous . It mirrors the 1910 situation of EVII/Alix & GV/MAY. Anyone who has read queen Mary's letters to HRH the grand duchess Augusta knows exactly how infuriated she was that the title was withheld for 11 months .

HM George v In turn only waited a month for his son Edward VIII, .

[Nice Nofret]

Originally Posted by Ish

....

Likewise, the feelings of the Scots should be considered in the event of making Scottish Royal titles as well. In ignoring the people that live in those countries and not considering their feelings when creating Scottish or Welsh (or Northern Irish) titles the BRF is simply acting the role of the conqueror and oppressor.

The Scotts werent conquered by the English ... James of Scottland became also English King and in his Person and forthwith England & Scottland became united ... so you could say Scottland gained England. I can't understand from where comes the notion, that Scottland is 'lower' than England... only because Goverment is in London?

And I also don't understand the issue of the Welsh people - since Bruce (whatever his name) it's also a 1000 years that those to parts belong to gether.

Does Cornwall makes a fuss? Or Kent, Devon, Sussex, York etc? So why the Scotts and Wales?

With the Irish it's another matter, sadly they where treated badly by the english for to long a time..

[muriel]

Originally Posted by Lumutqueen

How about going with all four.

What about the Scottish and Irish titles? Would you like referendums for those as well? By that same vein, should we elect the next King?

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie

...There is a vocal Welsh republican movement - might be small but it is there...

IMO, the Welsh nationalist movement is hardly a mainstream issue in the UK, and continues to be very much a fringe issue. Surely the question even the Welsh nationalists will be asking is whether they wish to continue as part of the UK, or would like independence and have Wales as an independent country. That the heir to the UK throne is entitled The Prince of Wales is, IMO, a secondary question.

If we look at the Scottish nationalist campaign championed by the SNP, they would like Scotland to leave the UK and become an independent country, whilst at the same time they have clearly indicated they would retain the current monarch as the monarch of an independent Scotland.

[Osipi]

This is just my supposition but I think if asked of the Welsh people, they might feel that investing William as The Prince of Wales in a way would be like investing one of their own. Will and Kate lived there, worked there, interacted with the people there for what? Three years?.

Although it was primarily for military reasons, over their tenure there, we did get a glimpse of how the local people were protective of the couple. It was rare that any kind of tabloid stories came out and local residents very much respected their privacy.

[Ancient Prince]

The Crown, a metal weight that signifies a mental weight, is the single most coveted item in the history of man. All kinds of darkness covers the history of pretty much every Crown in existence...
Things done to gain, retain, and pass on the "rights". Wars, bogus stories, blackmail, you name it... If held to the full light of the Duty of Royalty, not a single person alive, including myself, would be able to place a crown on our heads.

IMO lol

[AdmirerUS]

Originally Posted by Ancient Prince

The Crown, a metal weight that signifies a mental weight, is the single most coveted item in the history of man. All kinds of darkness covers the history of pretty much every Crown in existence...
Things done to gain, retain, and pass on the "rights". Wars, bogus stories, blackmail, you name it... If held to the full light of the Duty of Royalty, not a single person alive, including myself, would be able to place a crown on our heads.

IMO lol

Welcome AP Too bad the lust for power often gets in the way of all that duty.

[Blog Real]

English Princes of Wales From 1301:
Edward (son of Edward I and Eleanor of Castile)
Created Prince of Wales on 1st February 1301, aged 16, in Lincoln. Acceded as Edward II on 8th June 1307

Edward (son of Edward III and Philippa of Hainault)
Created Prince of Wales on 12th May 1343, aged 12, at Westminster
Died on 8th June 1376

Richard (son of Edward, Prince of Wales and Joan of Kent)
Created Prince of Wales on 20th November 1376, aged nine, at Havering
Acceded as Richard II on 22nd June 1377

Henry (son of Henry IV and Mary de Bohun)
Created Prince of Wales on 15th October 1399, aged 12, at Westminster
Acceded as Henry V on 20th March 1413

Edward (son of Henry VI and Margaret of Anjou)
Created Prince of Wales on 15th March 1454, aged five months
Invested on 9th June 1454, at Windsor
Died on 4th May 1471

Edward (son of Edward IV and Elizabeth Woodville)
Created Prince of Wales on 26th June 1471, aged seven months, at Westminster
Acceded as Edward V on 9th April 1483

Edward (son of Richard III and Anne of Warwick)
Created Prince of Wales on 24th August 1483, aged 10
Invested on 8th September at York Minster
Died on 9th April 1484

Arthur (eldest son of Henry VII and Elizabeth of York)
Created Prince of Wales on 29th November 1489, aged three
Invested on 27th February 1490, at Westminster
Died on 2nd April 1502

Henry (second son of Henry VII and Elizabeth of York)
Created Prince of Wales on 18th February 1504, aged 12, at Westminster
Acceded as Henry VIII on 22nd April 1509

Henry (eldest son of James I and Anne of Denmark)
Created Prince of Wales on 4th June 1610, aged 16, at Westminster
Died on 6th November 1612

Charles (second son of James I and Anne of Denmark)
Created Prince of Wales on 4th November 1616, aged 15, at Whitehall
Acceded as Charles I on 27th March 1625

Charles (son of Charles I and Henrietta Maria of France)
Declared Prince of Wales c. 1638-41, in London, aged c.8-11
Acceded as Charles II on 30th January 1649

James (son of James II and Mary of Modena)
Created Prince of Wales c. 4th July 1688, aged three weeks, at St James's
Forfeited title when James II was declared to have abdicated, on 11th December 1688

George (son of George I and Sophie Dorothea of Brunswick-Luneburg and Celle)
Created Prince of Wales on 27th September 1714, aged 30, at Westminster
Acceded as George II on 11th June 1727

Frederick (son of George II and Caroline of Brandenburg-Anspach)
Created Prince of Wales on 8th January 1729, aged 21, in London
Died on 20th March 1751

George (son of Frederick, Prince of Wales and Augusta of Saxe-Gotha)
Created Prince of Wales on 20th April 1751, aged 12, in London
Acceded as George III on 25th October 1760

George (son of George III and Charlotte of Mecklenburg-Strelitz)
Created Prince of Wales on 19th August 1762, aged one week, in London
Acceded as George IV on 29th January 1820

Albert Edward (son of Queen Victoria and Prince Albert)
Created Prince of Wales on 8th December 1841, aged four weeks, in London
Acceded as King Edward VII on 22nd January 1901

George (son of King Edward VII and Queen Alexandra)
Created Prince of Wales on 9th November 1901, aged 36, in London
Acceded as King George V on 6th May 1910

Edward (son of King George V and Queen Mary)
Created Prince of Wales on 23rd June 1910, aged 16. Invested on 13th July 1911, at Caernarfon Castle
Acceded as King Edward VIII on 20th January 1936

Charles (son of Queen Elizabeth II and The Duke of Edinburgh)
Created Prince of Wales on 26th July 1958, aged nine; invested on 1st July 1969, at Caernarfon Castle.
Acceded as King Charles III on 8 September 2022

William (son of King Charles III and Diana, Princess of Wales)
On 9 September 2022, the King Charles III announced the creation of William as Prince of Wales

[Tatiana Maria]

This seems relevant to this thread as well:

Originally Posted by Mbruno

No plans for Prince William to be invested as Prince of Wales, according to the BBC .

[SLV]

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

This seems relevant to this thread as well:

That is a pity.
Though I understand the controversy around it, if he did.

[An Ard Ri]

Originally Posted by Blog Real

English Princes of Wales From 1301:
Edward (son of Edward I and Eleanor of Castile)
Created Prince of Wales on 1st February 1301, aged 16, in Lincoln. Acceded as Edward II on 8th June 1307

Edward (son of Edward III and Philippa of Hainault)
Created Prince of Wales on 12th May 1343, aged 12, at Westminster
Died on 8th June 1376

Richard (son of Edward, Prince of Wales and Joan of Kent)
Created Prince of Wales on 20th November 1376, aged nine, at Havering
Acceded as Richard II on 22nd June 1377

Henry (son of Henry IV and Mary de Bohun)
Created Prince of Wales on 15th October 1399, aged 12, at Westminster
Acceded as Henry V on 20th March 1413

Edward (son of Henry VI and Margaret of Anjou)
Created Prince of Wales on 15th March 1454, aged five months
Invested on 9th June 1454, at Windsor
Died on 4th May 1471

Edward (son of Edward IV and Elizabeth Woodville)
Created Prince of Wales on 26th June 1471, aged seven months, at Westminster
Acceded as Edward V on 9th April 1483

Edward (son of Richard III and Anne of Warwick)
Created Prince of Wales on 24th August 1483, aged 10
Invested on 8th September at York Minster
Died on 9th April 1484

Arthur (eldest son of Henry VII and Elizabeth of York)
Created Prince of Wales on 29th November 1489, aged three
Invested on 27th February 1490, at Westminster
Died on 2nd April 1502

Henry (second son of Henry VII and Elizabeth of York)
Created Prince of Wales on 18th February 1504, aged 12, at Westminster
Acceded as Henry VIII on 22nd April 1509

Henry (eldest son of James I and Anne of Denmark)
Created Prince of Wales on 4th June 1610, aged 16, at Westminster
Died on 6th November 1612

Charles (second son of James I and Anne of Denmark)
Created Prince of Wales on 4th November 1616, aged 15, at Whitehall
Acceded as Charles I on 27th March 1625

Charles (son of Charles I and Henrietta Maria of France)
Declared Prince of Wales c. 1638-41, in London, aged c.8-11
Acceded as Charles II on 30th January 1649

James (son of James II and Mary of Modena)
Created Prince of Wales c. 4th July 1688, aged three weeks, at St James's
Forfeited title when James II was declared to have abdicated, on 11th December 1688

George (son of George I and Sophie Dorothea of Brunswick-Luneburg and Celle)
Created Prince of Wales on 27th September 1714, aged 30, at Westminster
Acceded as George II on 11th June 1727

Frederick (son of George II and Caroline of Brandenburg-Anspach)
Created Prince of Wales on 8th January 1729, aged 21, in London
Died on 20th March 1751

George (son of Frederick, Prince of Wales and Augusta of Saxe-Gotha)
Created Prince of Wales on 20th April 1751, aged 12, in London
Acceded as George III on 25th October 1760

George (son of George III and Charlotte of Mecklenburg-Strelitz)
Created Prince of Wales on 19th August 1762, aged one week, in London
Acceded as George IV on 29th January 1820

Albert Edward (son of Queen Victoria and Prince Albert)
Created Prince of Wales on 8th December 1841, aged four weeks, in London
Acceded as King Edward VII on 22nd January 1901

George (son of King Edward VII and Queen Alexandra)
Created Prince of Wales on 9th November 1901, aged 36, in London
Acceded as King George V on 6th May 1910

Edward (son of King George V and Queen Mary)
Created Prince of Wales on 23rd June 1910, aged 16. Invested on 13th July 1911, at Caernarfon Castle
Acceded as King Edward VIII on 20th January 1936

Charles (son of Queen Elizabeth II and The Duke of Edinburgh)
Created Prince of Wales on 26th July 1958, aged nine; invested on 1st July 1969, at Caernarfon Castle.
Acceded as King Charles III on 8 September 2022

William (son of King Charles III and Diana, Princess of Wales)
On 9 September 2022, the King Charles III announced the creation of William as Prince of Wales

The future Edward VI was also Prince of Wales from 1537–1547

[Iluvbertie]

Originally Posted by SLV

That is a pity.
Though I understand the controversy around it, if he did.

There is no need for an investiture, which was a 20th century invention and done for two very young men - one 17 and the other 20. In Charles' case it was also when he publicly swore his allegiance to his mother, Edward having already done so at the coronation of his father the month before.

William is a middle-aged man. He can make his homage at the coronation if Charles believes that such a sign is necessary (and I think that the homage will be a major part that will have to go to cut out over 2 hours from the late Queen's coronation service to get it down to the reported one hour Charles wants).

[SLV]

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie

There is no need for an investiture, which was a 20th century invention and done for two very young men - one 17 and the other 20. In Charles' case it was also when he publicly swore his allegiance to his mother, Edward having already done so at the coronation of his father the month before.



William is a middle-aged man. He can make his homage at the coronation if Charles believes that such a sign is necessary (and I think that the homage will be a major part that will have to go to cut out over 2 hours from the late Queen's coronation service to get it down to the reported one hour Charles wants).

Ah, I didn't know it was a rather recent invention.
Make even more sense not to do so, then.

[muriel]

Originally Posted by Iluvbertie

There is no need for an investiture, which was a 20th century invention and done for two very young men - one 17 and the other 20. In Charles' case it was also when he publicly swore his allegiance to his mother, Edward having already done so at the coronation of his father the month before.

William is a middle-aged man. He can make his homage at the coronation if Charles believes that such a sign is necessary (and I think that the homage will be a major part that will have to go to cut out over 2 hours from the late Queen's coronation service to get it down to the reported one hour Charles wants).

Originally Posted by SLV

Ah, I didn't know it was a rather recent invention.
Make even more sense not to do so, then.

I agree, an investiture in Wales does not seem necessary.

[Tatiana Maria]

An explanation of the titles, some automatic and some not, held by the Prince of Wales, from the website of the previous Prince of Wales:

https://www.princeofwales.gov.uk/tit...pter-wrapper-5

Letters patent of creation for previous Princes of Wales, as the title is not automatic (note that the present Prince of Wales was "created" by a speech and no letters patent have been gazetted so far):

https://www.heraldica.org/topics/bri...docs.htm#Wales