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  #41  
Old 05-04-2020, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
Thank you to JR76 for the answers.



Please correct me if the following interpretation is not valid under the Swedish wording, but I assumed it implied that the prince must be qualified as a potential king but is not required to concretely succeed to the throne. (I have seen comparable wording used in other languages.) For instance, Prince Wilhelm, Duke of Södermanland had a potential right of succession but, given that he was a second son and his older brother produced sons, there was no expectation that the potential right would ever be realized. Put another way: He did not have the right to inherit the throne while his brother was living, but he would potentially have the right if his brother and his brother's male heirs passed away.

As you said, the difficulty for Prince Alexander would be finding grounds to declare him a "prince of the ruling royal house" when he is not a member of the Royal House. An argument could be put forward that he is a prince and he is descended from the Royal House, but applying that argument would hypothetically allow Prince Nikolai of Denmark to lease Stenhammar, as he is a prince and a descendant of Princess Ingrid of Sweden, so it was surely not what was meant by Mr. von Kraemer. I would be very interested to know if the King's attorney has drawn up plans to deal with this difficulty.
I agree with most of your interpretation. But if I'm not mistaken, prince Alexander is still in line to the throne, so in that respect not comparable to prince Nikolai who is not in line to the throne nor a Swedish citizen.

I'd say he still meets the requirements
A. Swedish citizen
B. who is a Prince of the ruling Royal House
C. who has an potential right of inheritance to the throne

The only one that people might argue about is B; but I'd say he is still a prince and member of the reining royal family - but that could of course be challenged - however, it seems the Swedish RF makes up the interpretation of the rules as they go, so if they want him to have the castle, he surely will. Him being made a 'Duke of Södermanland'; a designation that has not been retracted, strengthening his case.
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  #42  
Old 05-04-2020, 03:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
My comment quoted in your post was about a daughter or granddaughter, so for instance: Supposing, after Prince Carl Philip's death (or possibly Prince Alexander's death, if an interpretation of the testament can still be found that would make him eligible to claim the estate), Queen Estelle would like her daughter (not her son) to lease Stenhammar estate. Would the National Property Board truly insist that no, only a man is eligible to lease it?
I see. That's a good question. It would be especially interesting if a princess of Sweden was created 'Duchess of Södermanland' compared to a prince that's duke to another landskap.
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  #43  
Old 05-04-2020, 03:21 PM
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Link to the exact location of Stenhammars Gods at Google Maps.
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  #44  
Old 05-04-2020, 03:45 PM
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I agree with most of your interpretation. But if I'm not mistaken, prince Alexander is still in line to the throne, so in that respect not comparable to prince Nikolai who is not in line to the throne nor a Swedish citizen.

I'd say he still meets the requirements
A. Swedish citizen
B. who is a Prince of the ruling Royal House
C. who has an potential right of inheritance to the throne

The only one that people might argue about is B; but I'd say he is still a prince and member of the reining royal family - but that could of course be challenged - however, it seems the Swedish RF makes up the interpretation of the rules as they go, so if they want him to have the castle, he surely will. Him being made a 'Duke of Södermanland'; a designation that has not been retracted, strengthening his case.
As a legal matter, I'm not sure it would be feasible to cite Prince Nikolai's citizenship since the testament does not mention Swedish citizenship as a requirement. Of course, at the time it was drafted, it would have been unthinkable for a Swedish royal prince not to be a Swedish citizen. But yes, that is a very good point that Prince Nikolai's lack of succession rights excludes him, regardless.

As a point of principle, I think the primary issue with the royals (hypothetically) interpreting "ruling royal house" as "Royal Family" instead of "Royal House" would be the inconsistency with their present interpretation of the Constitution, in which they seem to deploy the argument that "Royal House" is defined as members of the Royal House to the exclusion of all other members of the Royal Family (which conveniently frees Princess Madeleine's children to be raised abroad without losing their place in line to the throne).

While I don't personally agree with their interpretation, it would be a clear double standard if they would argue the opposite regarding Mr. von Kraemer's testament. (That being said, I would not be surprised if they once more changed their interpretation of the Constitution if it ever becomes problematic for Princess Madeleine's children to have rights of succession...)

But indeed, the government has refrained from challenging the king's interpretation of laws relating to the royal family, so I agree you are likely correct that whatever the monarch (most likely Victoria or Estelle) wishes to happen will happen.
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  #45  
Old 05-04-2020, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
But indeed, the government has refrained from challenging the king's interpretation of laws relating to the royal family, so I agree you are likely correct that whatever the monarch (most likely Victoria or Estelle) wishes to happen will happen.
Don't forget that the public inquiry of, among other things, the royal finances and who is expected to carry out official duties, is still ongoing. If the government or parliament wants to challenge the royal family's interpretation they'll probably wait until the inquiry is completed.
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  #46  
Old 05-30-2020, 06:01 PM
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I have a question. I know someone here has an answer. Ha! I believe LadyFinn posted an interesting article on one of these threads about the royal residences. In the article it listed private residences of the Swedish royal family. Some properties weren’t listed at all as was pointed out in the post. So I don’t know how correct this list is. But one thing I noticed was that Stenhammer castle was listed as a private property of the king and queen. Is this correct? I thought the king leased it. Was it just a mistake? Anyone know?
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  #47  
Old 05-30-2020, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by temhbobo View Post
I have a question. I know someone here has an answer. Ha! I believe LadyFinn posted an interesting article on one of these threads about the royal residences. In the article it listed private residences of the Swedish royal family. Some properties weren’t listed at all as was pointed out in the post. So I don’t know how correct this list is. But one thing I noticed was that Stenhammer castle was listed as a private property of the king and queen. Is this correct? I thought the king leased it. Was it just a mistake? Anyone know?
The King has the lease on the Stenhammar estate for life since 1965.
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  #48  
Old 05-30-2020, 11:01 PM
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The King has the lease on the Stenhammar estate for life since 1965.
Hi! Thanks for Your reply. I thought he leased it too. But if you are leasing something, you don’t really own it. Like the king can’t leave it to who he wants like it is his property right? It was listed in that article as private property meaning to me he owned it outright. What am I missing? I was just surprised to see it under private property.
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