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  #701  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:13 PM
Aristocracy
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by principessa View Post
What possibilities does the Queen and the Royal Family now have? Revoking them from the line of succession, taking away the titles, terminating the right to live at Frogmore cottage, removing them from the Royal Family?
All of the ABOVE. I don't care. The attacks against the monarchy are bad.
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  #702  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:21 PM
Gentry
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
According to the BBC:


A source close to the Sussexes has told the BBC that the wedding that Meghan referred to in the "backyard" three days before the public wedding in May 2018 was a private exchange of vows.


OK, no problem with doing that. It's not legally binding, but I suppose it's quite romantic in a way, and I've seen quite a few things on social media about couples who've done that whilst weddings have been legally banned because of lockdown restrictions.


But what Meghan said was:


"You know, three days before our wedding, we got married. Ah, no one knows that. But we called the Archbishop and we just said look, this thing, the spectacle, is for the world. But we want our union between us.

So the vows that we have framed in our room are just the two of us in our backyard with the Archbishop of Canterbury."


I'd love to hear Justin Welby's comments on this, but I very much doubt that he wants to get involved in this sorry mess.
I think it is admirable that they did this. It shows their committment to each other and the seriousness with which they undertook their marriage vows. It was a separate religious ceremony away from the hullabaloo of the public wedding.

As stated above, a source close to the couple later clarified that, while they did exchange vows in a private ceremony, they were legally married during their official ceremony.
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  #703  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:22 PM
Claire's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
These are very good points.




Going to take a stab.
The cold analytical side of my don't understand the purpose of this extremely frank interview.
Why the public accusations? They feel that have been hard done. Obviously Megxit wasnt what they wanted money, security or fame wise.
Where they necessary? Now? Now they need to make money, extablish thier brand in the UK and the world. As defenders of the down trodden
What is the point? Fame/ Money. Prove a point, they really seem to need to win this battle - get the last word
What is to be gained? Fame / Money
Where will/can they go from here? They are hoping that this helps people watch their shows and podcasts. That it helps establish Archewell and their causes.

There is obviously a deep conflict within the BRF, this interview will escalate, rather than deescalate this conflict. Big time!
They had several options and other topics they could talk about and they could have been less frank, so why go public? Why hurt Harry's family not least his grandmother? Been former members of the royal family is all they have - I really think they want the win, the revenge, They really didnt like what came out of Megexit.
I can't see what H&M will gain from this in the long term. Revenge? Exposure? ALl of the above - no such thing as bad press. people lap up drama one way or another and she is rolling in it.

And last but not least they are taking a huge risk!
Every single word said during the interview is going to be dissected and fact-checked by detractors (remember that they accused the British press - it's war!)
What if these detractors find something?
There are witnesses coming forward saying it was indeed Kate who cried and not Meghan.
There are no records of any wedding ceremony.
There are witnesses coming forward with examples of erratic behavior by H&M.
The BRF issuing an official statement flatly refusing the allegations of racism.
Slowly but surely H&M's credibility will be eroded, if what they said is not ironcast verifiable.
And then what?
Much of the interview has already been rebuttal.
1. the Wedding
2. Archie's lack of title
3. Harry/Meghan not knowing what to do when feeling suicidal despite having Harry's mental health contacts and his own doctor.
4. The press getting parties for good press that it appears no-one in the press has every been invited to.
5. Changing her story with every interview - I did my homework , I have no idea what I am getting myself into.

Is that stopping the people online or believe everything they hear out of her mouth. People believe the monarchy is racist - without Meghan telling them that. It is an old British white institution, there is not more to say.
  #704  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
[...] from what Harry said, it was in a private conversation. Even if he names someone, if they then deny it, who's to know whether they're lying, Harry's lying, or something was said but taken the wrong way? Unless someone steps forward and says "It was me, and I said exactly what Harry claimed", this is a mess that can't be cleared up.
Yes, unless someone comes forward and says "yes it was me, I didn't mean it maliciously but I'm very, very sorry for unintentional harm, I know better now" it's not going to get cleared up.

And "Meghan's mental health was taken seriously with offers of X but the place she suggested wasn't suitable because of security issues"

"Discussions with the Sussexes that HM wasn't going to grant LPs for HRH but Archie would get one in time was very acceptable to them and they themselves decided "Earl of Dumbarton" wasn't suitable. They wanted him to live a normal life at the time.

"Actually it was the Canadian Government that decided that taxpayers shouldn't fork out for private citizens and Charles contributed £XXXX for a long time".

And other point by point rebuttals. But even then it probably wouldn't work since the narrative has already been created and people won't bother fact checking any of it.

I doubt Thomas Markle on GMB is going to help the situation either.
  #705  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UglyAmerican View Post
I really, really hope Philip is being kept ignorant of this for the time being. How could they possibly have thought this wouldn't upset a 99-year-old still in hospital after cardiac surgery?


I know they didn’t know he’d be in the hospital when this aired. They knew he was 99 though. That speaks for itself. But let’s tack on that he’s had health problems in recent years.

There is no excuse for this. None. You don’t treat people like this. Much less your own family.

I’d be surprised if Philip was totally in the dark right now about all this. One can hope.
  #706  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:26 PM
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Why did they only talk about the, so to speak, "attacks" from the british royal court and not also about the attacks from the Markle family, which started even before the wedding....?!


It is really beyond me how Prince Harry could hope that "wounds will hopefully heal" in the future after this!
  #707  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:27 PM
ACO ACO is offline
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Thomas Markle going on GMB with Piers tomorrow will be a trainwreck but it is just adding to the mess.
  #708  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:28 PM
Queen Ester's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duchess_Watcher View Post
All of the ABOVE. I don't care. The attacks against the monarchy are bad.
You are so right, I think if HM asks the Parlament to remove their titles, it should not take very long, even with everything else going on
  #709  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
Why did they only talk about the, so to speak, "attacks" from the british royal court and not also about the attacks from the Markle family, which started even before the wedding....?!
Because that is not a part of the desired narrative?
Because involving and accusing the BRF sell much more?
H&M may not know where they are going, but Oprah is a professional, she did know where she was going.
  #710  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:30 PM
Majesty
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Claire View Post
Much of the interview has already been rebuttal.
1. the Wedding
2. Archie's lack of title
3. Harry/Meghan not knowing what to do when feeling suicidal despite having Harry's mental health contacts and his own doctor.
4. The press getting parties for good press that it appears no-one in the press has every been invited to.
5. Changing her story with every interview - I did my homework , I have no idea what I am getting myself into..

I must not be keeping up with the news. Could you please provide the links to the rebuttals, especially #3, which is the most critical issue IMHO ?

It is curious that Harry's misconception about who is entitled to PPOs in the UK and Canada was not raised either.
  #711  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACO View Post
Thomas Markle going on GMB with Piers tomorrow will be a trainwreck but it is just adding to the mess.
Gods it gets worse and worse. I didn't think Meghan had anything to do with her father. And why was none of that brought up in the interview?
  #712  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:32 PM
Lilyflo's Avatar
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I'll watch the whole thing tonight but I have some main impressions now based on all the CBS clips (including extra ones today) and the live reporting of the interview by the BBC.

* Oprah confirmed to me that she's a great interviewer;

* Meghan stated that everyone was welcoming towards her;

* The Queen isn't blamed for anything and has been warm towards Meghan;

* There was a turning point over the "Meghan made Kate cry" story because it was the reverse but nobody would stand up and refute the story so it perpetuated around the world and after that followed an avalanche of lies and smears, which continued to stand as truths;

* The relentless demonisation of Meghan in the press coupled with her inability to counteract the stories herself or have others stand up for her resulted in a serious deterioration of her mental health (I know it would have driven me to a very dark place);

* Meghan asked "the institution" if she could go to somewhere for help (presumably a clinic) and was refused on grounds that it wouldn't look good. She subsequently asked HR and they couldn't help because she wasn't an employee;

* Someone in the BRF said something racist about their potential baby's skin-tone;

* Harry feels let down by his father but wants to repair their relationship.

Overall, my impression continues to be that people are fallible and situations are complex. Individuals have their faults and virtues, and they rarely fit into villain or hero caricatures but the British Royal Family continues to be a deeply dysfunctional family and institution. It is useless at genuine communication, too often frightened of the press and there are far too many advisers/courtiers spread across distinct households, which don't co-operate effectively and instead prioritise their own fiefdom. The result of all that dysfunction & cowardice is that over the years various royals have been vilified in the press and expected to put up with having their character besmirched by lies and smears. This shouldn't be acceptable for anyone and the culmination is that a biracial newcomer has been expected to endure a torrent of abuse across mainstream and social media with no end in sight and no public statement of support from the institution.

We must have systemic change and even if it's too late for Meghan and Harry, the BRF has to ensure that the next generation is far better protected and equipped to defend themselves against smear campaigns, false narratives and toxic propaganda.
  #713  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Claire View Post
Much of the interview has already been rebuttal.
1. the Wedding
2. Archie's lack of title
3. Harry/Meghan not knowing what to do when feeling suicidal despite having Harry's mental health contacts and his own doctor.
4. The press getting parties for good press that it appears no-one in the press has every been invited to.
5. Changing her story with every interview - I did my homework , I have no idea what I am getting myself into.

Is that stopping the people online or believe everything they hear out of her mouth. People believe the monarchy is racist - without Meghan telling them that. It is an old British white institution, there is not more to say.
People with those opinions need to explain what they mean exactly. How is the monarchy racist?

And of course the monarchy is an old white British institution. It originated in a European country over a thousand year ago why wouldn't it white? What else would it be? It's about as bizarre as saying that the Japanese monarchy is an old ethnically East Asian institution.
  #714  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kellydofc View Post
Gods it gets worse and worse. I didn't think Meghan had anything to do with her father. And why was none of that brought up in the interview?
Think it was in the extras, where she said she was betrayed and has lost her father. He has every right to speak his side, IMO. The man has been vilified time and time again.
  #715  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:37 PM
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I see two people somewhat consumed by hatred and bitterness lashing out. I am sure Harry at least will regret it one day.

Tellingly none of my friends who I thought might watch the interview when it broadcasts here tonight said they will watch it. A few pointed out comments along the line of "I've got enough going on without two millionaires moaning about their life".

Personally I think you know what, fine it didn't work out being royal, whatever the reasons it clearly wasn't for them and that's cool, go off and be whoever and whatever you want to be but why drag down the grandmother you "have so much respect for" and everything she has built up and done to make yourself feel better. That doesn't speak of a particularly good person to me.

As for whether or not this is the "truth", well there are just a few too many contradictions for me to trust it - e.g.

the "how dark" comment being either while Meghan was pregnant or when the couple had just started dating and the fact no context at all was provided for it. I am not saying it is ever an acceptable comment but saying it about a baby growing inside a member of your family and to your family member when they have just started dating someone have hugely different connotations.

The issue over Archie's titles - either they allowed a false statement saying it was their wish to be issued or they are lying now. Likewise Meghan's interpretation of the rules is incorrect - Archie didn't have the right to a title so he wasn't denied one. They also say at one point they had been talking about leaving the RF for over two years - so why then want a title when you are leaving. Meghan seems to want to tie the "how dark" comment to the title but the two actually seem to be entirely separate - one said just as they start dating, the title issue laid down in law 100 years ago

The incorrect connection made between Archie's HRH/Prince title and him getting royal protection. Surely the couple who want privacy would also want their son to grow up not needing protection (as in because the threat is deemed low enough / non existent enough for him to have none). I don't understand how the couple can get confused with this given that Beatrice and Eugenie have HRH and no state funded protection, even Anne Edward and Sophie are believe to now only get protection when on public duties while Harry's other cousins Zara and Peter get none at all. Harry must have known this and should have explained it to his wife.

The suggestions Meghan could not use her passport or car keys. I'm 35 and my mother still has my passport for safe keeping. I strongly suspect Meghan's was not withheld from her but held for safe keeping and so staff could access it when needed. Certainly we know Meghan flew out for her baby shower, the holiday to Elton John's French house, reportedly to see Doria several times, to NY to see Serena play in the US Open, the Ibiza holiday, apparently to Lake Como after their wedding...I mean fine, the comment may be literally true, someone did take her passport and car keys away but its not like it was to keep her from every flying anywhere again

These are all just factual issues where it seems H&M are plain wrong in what they say and enough to make me see they are speaking from pure emotion not any reason or thought, they are setting out to hurt those they feel have hurt them. If we go down areas we can put some well informed facts to use we see some more things that do't seem to add up (but are hard to say are untrue for sure) e.g. not being able to get support for mental health and well being despite Harry and indeed other RF members strong connections in this area and despite the same issues being brought up by another famous royal lady decades ago. I don't think for a second anyone in the RF or Household would ignore someone saying they needed mental health support, even if just for purely shallow PR, presentational reasons.
  #716  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:42 PM
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I´m pretty much sure Harry feels obliged, unconsciously, to continue the revenge of his late mother against the RF! At times he seemed more balanced and stable than in his late teenage years.

But in reality he was/is a loose canon because of his troubled childhood, a bombshell resting for a long time in him before explosion... And what a team these two make to put things into practice!


Concerning this title-issue I feel M compares herself only to the Cambridges and nobody else! No Anne´s children, no Edward - and they are even the monarch´s grandchildren. If Archie would assume the title of a Prince when the Prince of Wales would succeed, neither H and M nor we can know for sure. But this point was just another opportunity for this woman to style herself and her poor baby boy victims.
  #717  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucy Scot View Post
I think it is admirable that they did this. It shows their committment to each other and the seriousness with which they undertook their marriage vows. It was a separate religious ceremony away from the hullabaloo of the public wedding.

As stated above, a source close to the couple later clarified that, while they did exchange vows in a private ceremony, they were legally married during their official ceremony.

While I do understand their desire to have a quiet ceremony with their own vows, I do wish that Meghan had described it along the lines of a private "blessing" rather than a "wedding."
  #718  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:50 PM
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It's interesting that Harry has already putting words into his family members' mouths for a second time now, I wonder if he liked it if the roles were reversed.
  #719  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:50 PM
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So the interview had 17 million viewers. In British terms that would be about 3 1/2. This article gives some context.

https://www.latimes.com/entertainmen...viewers-on-cbs
  #720  
Old 03-08-2021, 02:54 PM
Aristocracy
 
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The whole crying thing is so random. Did she cry because of something Kate did or was it just the moment? We don't know what Kate was upset about.

Also why would the Palace rebuke this?
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