General News about Joachim, Marie and Family Part 5: September 2019 - December 2020


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As many posters have mentioned, a 'stroke' can either be caused by :
- a blood clot - which can either cause temporary (a TIA) or permanent (a full-blown stroke) disability
- a bleed (which doesn't seem to be the case here, since sources mention a clot)

Treatment for a stroke caused by a blood clot can either be :
- medical - with blood-thinning medication
- 'surgical' - most often, this is not actually an operation on the brain through the skull, but rather a relatively more straightforward procedure performed through an artery in the groin by an Interventional Radiologist (rather than a Neurosurgeon), under sedation rather than full General Anaesthesia - called 'clot retrieval'

Let's hope that it was this latter procedure, and that all is well with the Prince.
 
Muhler said:
Well, because once the initial life-saving treatment is over. Joachim is basically a foreign citizen taking up a bed and resources instead of a French citizen - who may not have the means to be transferred to a private hospital.
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He's not though. Joachim is an EU citizen living and working in France. He's every bit as entitled to that bed and those resources as, say, the French ambassador to Denmark would be to treatment at a hospital in Denmark.

If he's transferred home, it'll be out of comfort (because while France undoubtedly means a lot to him, at the end of the day Denmark is his home and obviously it's more comfortable to be treated at home). It won't be because he'd be a burden to the French public health system or because there's a public expectation that he should be treated in Denmark.
 
He has been taken in time that is the most important ! Let us hope !!
 
Thank you for your many suggestions regarding "mén" I'm almost not confused. ;)
I think I will use impairment, so when I do that in the future you'll know what I mean.

- Unfortunately, dictionaries, thesauri and Google aren't always adequate. :ermm:

Clot it is then - and not a bloody rag...;)

Well, it doesn't really matter where Joachim is treated, as long as he is getting a good treatment, and he will get that in both DK and France.
Having said that, yes, there will be some criticism, if he is only treated in France. Sad to say, I'm convinced of that.

The wording "considering the circumstances" is very common here in DK and doesn't have a deeper meaning.
It simply means he is well, considering that he had a blood-clot hours before.
Just as someone who has had his arm ripped off by a machine "is well considering the circumstances."
It's just in idiom.

- The DK press have surrounded the hospital in Toulouse, but there really isn't any news today, except that we Danes have been educated about blood-clots, and hemorrhages in the brain. - Putting focus on something that serous affect (and sometimes kill) several thousands of Danes each year, is a good thing.

I guess we will get more news in the main news tonight.
 
Fwiw, I dragged a family member into this. He happens to be a neurologist with a stroke specialty, so I informed him it was a good thing he's not in Denmark, or he'd be getting consulted by the press, not just me.

Professional opinion:

Me-"they keep saying clot, not stroke, but he had to get surgery. I guess they couldn't dissolve it."
Him-"that sounds serious"
M-"and he's only 51... And he's a smoker"
H-"That'll do it."
M-"Really?" (that's it?)
H-"Yeah."
M-"And they said he's awake, and he can move his arms and legs and talk."
H-"Well that IS good."
 
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Smoking causes:
Decreased oxygen to the heart and to other tissues in the body
Decreased exercise tolerance
Decreased HDL (good) cholesterol
Increased blood pressure and heart rate
Damage to cells that line coronary arteries and other blood vessels
Increased risk of developing coronary artery disease and heart attack
Increased risk of developing peripheral artery disease and stroke
Increased risk of developing lung cancer, throat cancer, chronic asthma, chronic bronchitis and emphysema
Increased risk of developing diabetes
Increased risk of developing a variety of other conditions including gum disease and ulcers
Increased tendency for blood clotting
Increased risk of recurrent coronary artery disease after bypass surgery
Increased risk of becoming sick (especially among children: respiratory infections are more common among children exposed to second-hand smoke) - which is surely why he quit

Unless we find out Joachim has some other complication, aside from a family history of atherosclerosis, this would seem to do it.

https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/articles/17488-smoking
 
Prinsara said:
Smoking causes:
Decreased oxygen to the heart and to other tissues in the body
Decreased exercise tolerance
Decreased HDL (good) cholesterol
Increased blood pressure and heart rate
Damage to cells that line coronary arteries and other blood vessels
Increased risk of developing coronary artery disease and heart attack
Increased risk of developing peripheral artery disease and stroke
Increased risk of developing lung cancer, throat cancer, chronic asthma, chronic bronchitis and emphysema
Increased risk of developing diabetes
Increased risk of developing a variety of other conditions including gum disease and ulcers
Increased tendency for blood clotting
Increased risk of recurrent coronary artery disease after bypass surgery
Increased risk of becoming sick (especially among children: respiratory infections are more common among children exposed to second-hand smoke) - which is surely why he quit

Unless we find out Joachim has some other complication, aside from a family history of atherosclerosis, this would seem to do it.

https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/articles/17488-smoking
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Thanks for this; I hope the Danes and their Royal Family take this unfortunate Prince's case as an example to stop smoking!
 
Muhler said:
Well, it doesn't really matter where Joachim is treated, as long as he is getting a good treatment, and he will get that in both DK and France.
Having said that, yes, there will be some criticism, if he is only treated in France. Sad to say, I'm convinced of that.
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Right, if by some criticism you mean there would be a handful of ridiculous comments on social media then yes, there always is – no matter the subject.

But let's not go all BT/EB "Danskerne raser!" on this and pretend that 5-6 comments of that sort is representative of the public opinion. I'd venture the vast majority would understand if he opted to receive treatment in the country that – until otherwise stated – is expected to be his home for the coming 3 years.
 
gerry said:
Thanks for this; I hope the Danes and their Royal Family take this unfortunate Prince's case as an example to stop smoking!
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I think the Queen is the only one still smoking. I seem to recall Joachim said he took his last smoke on his 50th birthday, which was last year. I know Marie has been pictured smoking no word if she still does.

Frederik said he quit around Christian's birth, almost 15 years ago. Never read about Mary being a smoker.

:flowers:
 
One of my closest friends has been a heavy smoker since he was about 13. At age 42 he suffered a blood clot to his brain. He was treated non surgically in hospital for about 3 months and had to be taught to read and write again. He has permanent disabilities with his speech and had to give up his lucrative career as a fashion buyer.

He remains a heavy smoker...at least 2-3 packs a day. When i collected him from his last cardiac checkup he asked me to stop so he could buy cigarettes.

When I refused, he became very annoyed with me.:sad:
 
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Archduchess Zelia said:
Right, if by some criticism you mean there would be a handful of ridiculous comments on social media then yes, there always is – no matter the subject.

But let's not go all BT/EB "Danskerne raser!" on this and pretend that 5-6 comments of that sort is representative of the public opinion. I'd venture the vast majority would understand if he opted to receive treatment in the country that – until otherwise stated – is expected to be his home for the coming 3 years.
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Please don't remind me of the comments sections on EB! It's an open stinking sewer!
The editor ought to have his ears ripped off in Presselogen. Not that it would make an impact.

I actually meant when things are quiet the press will "cover" those who are critical of Joachim being treated in France. We have seen it before, we will see it again... :whistling:

There were no news tonight, so I guess they are still assessing Joachim's condition.
Some experts have said it's a good thing Joachim is relatively young. That should be an advantage in order for him to recover fully or recover a lot.
Others have said that a young undamaged brain is more vulnerable to strokes and blood clots, while an older brain isn't affected so much.
- Personally I think being younger will help a lot in regards to regaining motor skills and full control of limbs. But perhaps not so much cognitively.

This is followed closely by the press in the area around Cahors and even Toulouse, where the DRF is a well known sight and appreciated by the locals, because they blend in, speak the language and behave with no airs.
 
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EB is comparable to DM.
But the comments section is a lot worse! They accept comments there you will only find on 4chan.
Its not even trolls but genuinely mean and bitter people who are no doubt loathed by everybody else around them.
Quite a number of them openly expressed glee that Joachim has had a bloodclot.
No matter what they will be mean.

They are people I would not feel embarrassed for doing 60 days for breaking the nose on one of them.

All in the name of freedom of speech...
No wonder the på paper is loosing paying readers.
 
So happy to hear this news. Continued prayers for a speedy and full recovery for Joachim.
 
"Sudden dissection of an artery" sounds like an aneurysm, it seems. In any case, in your brain, sounds much scarier than "blood clot".

I hope everyone's right, and he is really fine, and this turns out not to be a big deal.
 
Joachim is indeed fortunate.

https://www.bt.dk/royale/joachim-slipper-heldigt-derfor-fik-han-en-blodprop

In this article a specialist explains what happened.
There was a minor rupture in Joachim main artery to the brain. The rupture wasn't big enough to cause an external bleeding. But there was a bleeding in between the layers of the wall of the artery. That meant coagulated blood would eventually have formed a blockage of the artery. Basically a kind of bloodclot.

That is typical for younger cases, like Joachim.

What will happen now is that he will get medication thinning his blood and after a while he will be checked again. If there are no problems he can go on as usual. Otherwise the treatment with medication continue a while longer.

He may experience severe fatigue for a period.

-----------

I guess it was quite a shock for him. Something that can lead someone to reflect on their life and future.

And it must have been a serious scare for Marie and not least the younger children!

------------

It is most likely there will be no impairments - at least not physically and cognitional, but mentally and psychologically?
 
I found the information in the article above a bit confusing, as it mentions a rupture in the artery wall in a carotid in the neck, and that it had not bled out in the artery, just between the walls of the artery. Was the blood clot just in the carotid, restricting the blood flow to the brain, and causing symptoms, or had a blood clot traveled to the brain arteries? If in the brain arteries, then the information that the rift had not bled out in the artery is wrong. If there was only a blood clot in the carotid, and it was removed, then the brain damage could be minimal, just like a TIA.
 
Its good news that he is recovering well and they aren't worried about long term issues from it.

The carotid arteries are a dangerous place for a blood clot. A blood clot too long in the artery can cut off oxygenated blood supply to the brain and cause a major stroke. Thankfully they caught it early and were able to treat him for the issue before it became more serious and perhaps not reparable.

This type of clot is certainly more common in someone his age.
 
Meraude said:
I found the information in the article above a bit confusing, as it mentions a rupture in the artery wall in a carotid in the neck, and that it had not bled out in the artery, just between the walls of the artery. Was the blood clot just in the carotid, restricting the blood flow to the brain, and causing symptoms, or had a blood clot traveled to the brain arteries? If in the brain arteries, then the information that the rift had not bled out in the artery is wrong. If there was only a blood clot in the carotid, and it was removed, then the brain damage could be minimal, just like a TIA.
Click to expand...

Thank you to Muhler for the B.T. article. The physician quoted in the article, Helle Klingenberg Iversen, chief physician responsible for stroke at the Department of Neurology at Rigshospitalet and chairman of the Danish Society for Stroke, most likely was not one of the physicians treating Prince Joachim in Toulouse, but he did give us a wealth of information. I can't determine either, from what he said, if the tear in the carotid artery causing the clot actually traveled to the brain, known as a cerebral emboli or the emergent fear is that it would. About the clot, the doctor said "it can then tear itself loose and drift with the bloodstream up into the brain", but didn't say that is what actually happened. The early reports kept referring to a clot in his brain which made me think an entirely different scenario. I really liked the way the Danish physician explained the expected outcome and treatment with respect to still maintaining a level of patient confidentiality. It's very possible with Dr. Iverson's credentials he has been consulting with Toulouse.

The great news is Joachim was very very fortunate and his anticipated outcome is very promising for a full recovery. Is he out of the woods, that depends on his original risk factors, medical history prior, and postop recovery. I was glad to hear Dr. Iverson say there was only a small chance of relapse.
 
Glad to hear that Prince Joachim is doing better and in recovery.
 
I'm glad there are people in the know to explain things, I've learned a lot. :flowers:

Also, because I'm a bit out of my depth here and it's difficult to explain something you really don't understand.

There are no news today it seems, but perhaps in the main news tonight?
 
In an interview before the blood clot, Marie and Joachim let it be known that it was not their choice to move to Paris.

Joachim Marie supports the claim that the move to France should not have been their own choice.*The prince would like to emphasize that he has never in his life gone with a burning desire to live in Paris.

https://www.seoghoer.dk/kongelige/marie-om-flytningen-til-frankrig-ikke-vores-valg

- It is not always us who decides, she says and interrupts her husband, who is about to tell about his career change from being a farmer in Møgeltønder to taking a military education and becoming a defense attaché in Paris.
 
polyesco said:
In an interview before the blood clot, Marie and Joachim let it be known that it was not their choice to move to Paris.

Joachim Marie supports the claim that the move to France should not have been their own choice.*The prince would like to emphasize that he has never in his life gone with a burning desire to live in Paris.

https://www.seoghoer.dk/kongelige/marie-om-flytningen-til-frankrig-ikke-vores-valg

- It is not always us who decides, she says and interrupts her husband, who is about to tell about his career change from being a farmer in Møgeltønder to taking a military education and becoming a defense attaché in Paris.
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That's quite a revelation; so, they are basically saying that the DRF looked for a way to get them out of Denmark/royal life - and in cooperation with the Danish and French government came up with this idea?

Or are they trying to express that they would have loved to stay in Mogeltonder instead of moving to France? However, that ship has passed and given the alternative of staying in Copenhagen or moving to Paris; Paris was still seen as more appealing than staying?!
 
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Somebody said:
That's quite a revelation; so, they are basically saying that the DRF looked for a way to get them out of Denmark/royal life - and in cooperation with the Danish and French government came up with this idea?

Or are they trying to express that they would have loved to stay in Mogeltonder instead of moving to France? However, that ship has passed and given the alternative of staying in Copenhagen or moving to Paris; Paris was still seen as more appealing than staying?!
Click to expand...

It can also mean that you are not always master over your destiny.
I.e. they may not have planned to live in France, but a job offer took them there.
I need to read the complete interview to see the nuances.
 
Muhler said:
It can also mean that you are not always master over your destiny.
I.e. they may not have planned to live in France, but a job offer took them there.
I need to read the complete interview to see the nuances.
Click to expand...

We look forward to your interpretation after a detailed reading of the interview.
 
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