The Habsburg Monarchy and Dynasty

[paul-louis1998]

http://newscom.com

 

[Toledo]

This is another Habsburg link I wanted to share, the Hapbsburg-Tuscany branch with photos from past and present: http://www.royaltyguide.nl/families/habsburg/hbltuscany.htm

some more must-read links on the House Habsburg-Lothringen
Genealogy of the Imperial and Royal Family of Austria-Hungary

The current head of the Hapsburg-Toscana branch:
Dinastia Gran Ducale Di Toscana

The Hapsburg-Iturbide Imperial family

and Mexico's Imperial Coat of Arms during the Hapsburgs' period.

the Mexican Hapsburgs' Chapultepec Castle

 

[branchg]

I ahve a queston about the acceptance of Fransesca in the Hasburg family. I know some brothers of Archduke Otto did not approve of the marriage and considered it morganatic. Has the family accepted Fransesca now, or are there still doubts? Which archdukes did not approve of the wedding (or did not attend it?)

Furthermore I would like to know if Archduchess Eilika converted to catholisism prior of during her marriage?

Fransesca was accepted by Archduke Otto largely because of her father's immense fortune. There is no way the marriage of a German industrialist's daughter with a Hungarian barony style would be considered an equal marriage to the Hapsburg Imperial House. But once Archduke Otto approved it, that was the end of that.

 

[kelly9480]

Eilika remains Lutheran, though their children are Catholic.

 

[thequeenofcastile]

A Habsburg Marriage

Hello Everyone!

I am brand new here and stumbled across this board very recently and I must say the structure and setting is quite impressive. I have just graduated from university with a degree in history, however my hobby for years has been the Royal Families of Europe. Some time ago, it was suggested to me that I should write a book and I have chosen such a topic.

I wanted to look at the consequences of a marriage with the Habsburgs, both Spanish and Austrian. I have narrowed it down to roughly 30 different marriages which ended up making a significant impact on history. I will also be focusing on the poor girls, whose marriages were used purely for political gain.

If there are any books, articles or respectable websites that anyone knows about, could I please be pointed in the right direction.

Although I expect this project to take quite some time, I do have some spare time at the moment and could use a good distraction.

Cheers thequeenofcastile

 

[Toledo]

Welcome Queen of Castille! Nice to meet you.
You choose a facsinating subject, History to Major in, and I wish you the best now that you are out of college.

On the Hapsburgs, I read in Hola that one of the still around Spanish Hapbsburgs, Catalina de Hasburgo wrote a book on the family that just came out. I don't know if it's in english. But it has a lot of facts and dismisses the myths like Empress Elizabeth of Austria, who was never called Sissi. She also wrote that the so called suicide pact between the lovers was made up, it was a political murder covered up by politicians who did not wanted to start WW I decades before. Rudolph, according to his own relative, was killed and everyone in the family knew it even though the history books converted his end into a Romeo and Juliet love story.

I'll see if I can find a link for the book for you.

In the meantime here is something you can use for future reference, is the PDF work of an exaustive study in genealogy for all royals that do include the illegitimate kids, morganic weddings etc. It's a researcher's jewel of a site and even though is in Spanish you can make up the names easily since it's one detailed and well organized family tree after another one.

The Spanish Hapsburgs: http://www.homar.org/genealog/pagina.asp?pag=ibe22

The Spanish Royals until 1975
http://www.homar.org/genealog/pagina.asp?pag=ibe27

The main section with all the PDF genealogical trees on Spain
http://www.homar.org/genealog/pais.asp?pais=ibe

And he, the author, just finished his research on the Byzantine family trees too http://www.homar.org/genealog/pais.asp?pais=biz

Happy reading! Now I'll see if I can track down that Habsburg book for you

 

[Toledo]

Found it:
the book is named Las Austrias (the women of the House of Austria)

here is a review http://www.esferalibros.com/libros/libropcapitulo.html?libroISBN=8497342690

an interview on her life as a spanish Hapbsburg and her work as an historical writer:
http://www.colpisa.com/motor/motor.php?id_noticia=154354&seccion=48

and a bio on her:
Catalina de Habsburgo, archiduquesa de Austria, descendiente directa de Carlos V y nieta del último emperador de Austria, ha analizado la vida de nueve reinas y princesas de la rama española de su dinastía, desde el excepcional punto de vista que le concede el hecho de pertenecer a su misma estirpe. Además, nos descubre el lado más humano de estas mujeres que, a pesar de haber nacido en una época en la que sus matrimonios eran una pieza del ajedrez jugado por los hombres, demostraron tener valor propio, gracias a la fuerza de sus convicciones morales o la sabiduría de sus acciones de gobierno.
Catalina de Habsburgo-Lorena, archiduquesa de Austria, es nieta del emperador beato Carlos I de Austria y de la princesa Zita de Borbón-Parma. Licenciada en Ciencias Políticas, con especialización en Derecho, por la Universidad de Lovaina (Bélgica), es autora de una obra sobre la realpolitik en Napoleón, Bismarck y Margaret Thatcher, en comparación con Franco.


English translation on the above two paragraphs by me (sorry if I missed anything, I added extra content inside parenthesis to round up the meaning of the article better than just translating it verbatum word by word):

Catherine of Hapsburg, archduchess of Austria, direct descendant of Charles V and granddaugther of the last Austrian emperor, has analyzed the life of nine queens and princesses belonging to the spanish branch of her dinasty, from the exceptional point of view that she is entitled to on the fact she belongs to the same lineage (family). Also, she uncovers the most humane side of these women that, even thought they were born in a time where the weddings were just a chess game controlled by men, they showed to have their own courage thanks to their own moral convictions or to the knowledge (and understanding ) on the actions of the government (means the ladies knew the reasoning of the political chess game and their duty as political chess pieces/players themselves).

Catherine of Hapsburg-Lotringen, archduchess of Austria, is the grand daugther of beatified Emperor/Kaiser Charles I and Princess Zita of Bourbon-Parma. She has a degree in political sciences specializing in Law from the Lovaina University (Belgium) and she is the author of a book on Realpolitik about Napoleon, Bismarck and Margaret Tatcher in comparison to Franco.

 

[Warren]

The main section with all the PDF genealogical trees on Spain
http://www.homar.org/genealog/pais.asp?pais=ibe

Wow, these PDF files are among the best genealogical charts I have seen, for any dynasty. Thanks!

I would suggest you post these links somewhere in the Spanish Forums (if in doubt as to where, check with the Spanish Moderators: Ennyllorac, Anna_R, Elsa M. ).
I'm sure many of the Spanish Forum regulars would be very interested and appreciative.

W

 

[Toledo]

They are a treasure!

Let me share my secret way to find these things. When I'm looking for unusual data, I add the word PDF right after the thing I want and it pops out not the websites but articles and school works available on line that gives you an extraordinary amount of information you can't find by standard searches.

Some things I find by pure coincidence too. For example, one day I wanted to read a bio on San Martin, the freedom figther from Argentina during the Napoleonic times and stumbled not just with his bio but with data I've never knew on the attempts of Carlota de Borbon, sister of the King of Spain, who attempted in the early 19th century to separate Argentina from Spain and declare herself the ruler to protect the colonies from Napoleon. I think she escaped to Brazil with the portuguese court when Napoleon invaded Spain and Portugal. This so called Projecto Carlotista (the Charlotte Project) was done a few years before San Martin, who also wanted to install a South American monarchy.

 

[jacadenasso]

... one day I wanted to read a bio on San Martin, the freedom figther from Argentina during the Napoleonic times and stumbled not just with his bio but with data I've never knew on the attempts of Carlota de Borbon, sister of the King of Spain, who attempted in the early 19th century to separate Argentina from Spain and declare herself the ruler to protect the colonies from Napoleon. I think she escaped to Brazil with the portuguese court when Napoleon invaded Spain and Portugal. This so called Projecto Carlotista (the Charlotte Project) was done a few years before San Martin, who also wanted to install a South American monarchy.

San Martin was offered the government of Chile, but he refused so the elite offered it to Bernardo O'Higgins. O'Higgins was against monarchy and nobility, so he declared the Republic of Chile and abolished the few noble titles that existed in my country by then. Today some families have "revived" their titles in Spain but they do not use them here.

 

[Marengo]

Thanks for the new posts on this part of the forum, they are very interesting.

On the german austrian royals MB, poster Arturo Beeche posted the informatio that this weekend Archduke Konrad married in Anif, Austria .Miss Ashmita Goswami, from London (Indian descent). He is the youngest son of Archduke Heinrich and Archduchess Ludmilla (nee Css von Galen).

 

[Warren]

On the german austrian royals MB, poster Arturo Beeche posted the informatio that this weekend Archduke Konrad married in Anif, Austria .Miss Ashmita Goswami, from London (Indian descent). He is the youngest son of Archduke Heinrich and Archduchess Ludmilla (nee Css von Galen).

Do we know if this marriage was "approved" by the Archduke Otto?

 

[Marengo]

it is not yet known, bt as Archduke Otto approved of Archduke Maximilians marriage I do not think that there is a reason to disapprove this one, especially considering his own daughter-in-law.

 

[Warren]

it is not yet known, bt as Archduke Otto approved of Archduke Maximilians marriage I do not think that there is a reason to disapprove this one, especially considering his own daughter-in-law.

We're either seeing the liberalisation of the Imperial House of Habsburg, or standards are slipping!

 

[Marengo]

probably a combination of the two (as in most royal families)

 

[kelly9480]

Archduke Maximilian married an Iraqi from an ancient, but untitled, family, which Otto indicated would be acceptable in the modern era. That's quite different from marrying someone off the streets.

 

[Marengo]

Archduke Maximilian married an Iraqi from an ancient, but untitled, family, which Otto indicated would be acceptable in the modern era. That's quite different from marrying someone off the streets.

her family can be ancient but still commoners. Many chinese families can trace back their roots over 2000 years, more then any european royal family, however this does not make them noble.

I sincerely doubt that the bride was living on the streets, some commoners are actually respectable people who live in houses.

 

[kelly9480]

I think you've made a mistake in your interpretation of what I wrote. I never said Maya was living on the streets. I said Otto indicated that a long lineage, even if not necessarily noble, was good enough to the Hapsburgs. That long lineage is what makes her acceptable, and what would keep someone of less detailed ancestry, someone off the streets, like any of us, from being considered of sufficient equality. That doesn't mean we live in the streets, it's a phrase that basically refers to commoners and/or common people.

 

[truth]

I don't know if it's in english. But it has a lot of facts and dismisses the myths like Empress Elizabeth of Austria, who was never called Sissi.

Sorry but I can't believe it . Where did SISSI ,nickname come from?

 

[Warren]

Where did SISSI, nickname come from?

According to Wikipedia: "From an early age, she was called Sisi (or Sissi in films and novels) by family and friends."

 

[Toledo]

Sorry but I can't believe it . Where did SISSI ,nickname come from?

When the Hola article came out on Catalina's book, she used the interview to refute some made up stories on her family that have entered the history books as truths. One of them was the nickname Sissi. From what I remember, she claims her ancestor was never called that within her family. The other one was the death of Rudolph and his mistress in an apparent suicide. Catalina said that was a lie fabricated to cover up a political murder that could have caused an early war years before the other heir's assasination that caused the chain of events that made WW I happen.

Is anyone around here subscribed to the Hola online that can copy and paste the article?

 

[Warren]

Regular visitors to this thread may notice it has expanded overnight from 2 pages to about 9. I have merged all the Habsburg threads I could find so that they are now in the one place. I intend to go through this thread and take out any extraneous, duplicated or stale material.

It's also worth having a look at the 'Old New Royal and Blue' forum where the wedding threads reside. We have coverage of quite a few Habsburg weddings, with lots of pics.

And a happy birthday to Toledo.

Warren

 

[Warren]

The Imperial House of Habsburg thread now re-organised.

Austrian Imperial Standard

image courtesy crwflags.com​

 

[Toledo]

Thanks for putting all things Hapsburg into one thread, makes it not only more coherent but also eases the reading since all the related data is in one place.

Here is a link on another Hapsburg branch, the Teschen: Austrian (Teschen Line) Royal Family

And the dynasties in the order they ruled Austria:
Margraves from c. 960. Dukes from 1155. Archdukes from 1359. An Empire 1804-1918

A Hapsburg family tree worth printing out:
http://www.ac.wwu.edu/~stephan/Rulers/hapsburg2.html

And this other link is a must have/must read on all things Royal:
Directory of Royal Genealogical Data

 

[Sancia]

A new addition to the Habsburg family: archduke Max and archduchess Maya had a son, Nicholas, born on december 6th.

 

[purple_platinum]

THE PRESENTATION OF CATALINA OF HASBURGO'S BOOK "MARIA ANTONIETA" IN MADRID
February 1, 2006
(from LFI)

1 - Beatriz of Orleans
2-3 - Luis Alfonso de Borbon & Catalina of Habsburg
4-5 - Leandro de Borbon & Catalina
6 - Carmen Polo
7 - Catalina
8 - Miriam de Ungria & Carmen Polo

 

[purple_platinum]

more from LFI

1 - Leandro de Borbon
2-3 - Luis Alfonso de Borbon
4-5 - Beatriz de Orleans & father of Catalina de Habsburg

 

[purple_platinum]

more from deadline press

Luis Alfonso de Borbon presenting at Hotel Ritz in Madrid the book "Maria Antonieta" , written by his cousin the Archiduchess Catalina of Habsburgo.

8 - Beatriz de Orleans with her son Thomas and niece Luna Medina
9 - Beatriz de Orleans with her younger son, Thomas, and Duchess de Fernandina.
10 - Miriam de Ungria with Helena Kirby

 

[mtbcm]

THE PRESENTATION OF CATALINA OF HASBURGO'S BOOK "MARIA ANTONIETA" IN MADRID
February 1, 2006
(from LFI)

ELMUNDO. es is preparing a Cyber-meeting for today, with Catalina of Habsbsburg, today, at 12.00 o'clock

Catalina de Habsburgo



When:02 of February of 2006, 12:00 horas​

'María Antonieta' (the Sphere of Books) reflect how the French Revolution of 1789 surpasses the sagacious Queen.

After the decapitation of the King, to Maria Antonieta only it is left to fight to save the life of her son. It is so as the historical truth or one version fed by the romantic historiography? The archiduquesa of Austria presents/displays the facts that marked the life of their ancestor in this book.

One can present the questions at this link.

Enjoy!

mtbcm

 

[Jo of Palatine]

The Ghosts of Mayerling: The death of Crown Prince Rudolf of Austria-Hungary (1858-1889)
... The Austro-Hungarian crown would therefore pass to the Emperor's brother, Karl-Ludwig, and eventually to this archduke's descendants.

That is not true. The Pragmatic sanction that brought Archduchess Maria Theresia of Austria (as wife of Emperor Franz I. Stephan known as Empress Maria-Theresia) the legal right to inherit the crowns of the Habsburg-family was still law in Austria when Crown Prince Rudolph died, leaving as his heiress the littel Archduchess Elisabeth, daughter of Rudolf and his wife, Crown Princess Stephanie (born Princess of Belgium).

Emperor Franz Joseph allowed Archduchess Elisabeth to marry a prince of Windisch-Graetz, but she had to forfeit her rights to the Austrian throne in order to do that. There is some discussion among historians about the reasons why Fran Joseph allowed this marriage.

At the time of Rudolf's death, his daughter Elisabeth had the first claim to the throne.