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  #281  
Old 01-04-2023, 06:12 AM
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Originally Posted by CyrilVladisla View Post
Infante Sebastian of Spain (1811-1875) was a grandson of King Charles III of Spain and a grandson of Queen Maria I of Portugal.
He was granted the title of Infante of Portugal by alvara of December 9, 1811.
Please define by alvara.
I assume it means 'by permission' from grandmother Queen Maria I of Portugal.
He was not an Infante of Spain from birth but was granted that title in 1824 by his maternal grand-uncle, Ferdinand VII of Spain.
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  #282  
Old 01-07-2023, 07:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
Stripping royal titles from their adult bearers? As I already mentioned a couple of times in this thread, it was done by King Juan Carlos I of Spain to many adult and teenage members of his family who had enjoyed royal titles under Francisco Franco's dictatorship when he executed his royal decree in 1987 by limiting recognition of royal titles in legal documents to the titles recognized in the decree, i.e., the titles which he and previous heads of the royal house had personally permitted. And while Nikolai of Denmark was "only" 23, Emanuela de Dampierre was already 74 years old when her nephew stripped her of her Franco-recognized Spanish HRH.

Stripping royal titles at a "random" moment? On the face of it, the timing of Juan Carlos's 1987 royal decree, and the concurrent stripping of royal titles which fell afoul of its stipulations, was senseless. It was already 12 years since General Franco's death, and there were no royal weddings or births taking place then. (The rumor is that the decree was precipitated by rumors that one of his HRH cousins was about to marry an actress.)
I am crossposting my comment from the Danish forum because I am interested in why King Juan Carlos I stripping royal titles from adult members of his family is perceived so much less negatively, at least on this forum, than Queen Margrethe II of Denmark doing the same. Is it because the king's move was mainly aimed at branches of the family which had been his competition for the Spanish throne, instead of his own grandchildren? Or perhaps because he was removing titles bestowed by someone else and not himself?
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  #283  
Old 01-07-2023, 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
I am crossposting my comment from the Danish forum because I am interested in why King Juan Carlos I stripping royal titles from adult members of his family is perceived so much less negatively, at least on this forum, than Queen Margrethe II of Denmark doing the same. Is it because the king's move was mainly aimed at branches of the family which had been his competition for the Spanish throne, instead of his own grandchildren? Or perhaps because he was removing titles bestowed by someone else and not himself?
My guess is that it's because it was a long time ago, there has been very little modern controversy about the issue (the Duke of Anjou aside) and therefore many people don't know about it.
Also because those cut off from the royal family weren't immediate family members of the King who also at the time could do wrong.
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  #284  
Old 01-08-2023, 04:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
I am crossposting my comment from the Danish forum because I am interested in why King Juan Carlos I stripping royal titles from adult members of his family is perceived so much less negatively, at least on this forum, than Queen Margrethe II of Denmark doing the same. Is it because the king's move was mainly aimed at branches of the family which had been his competition for the Spanish throne, instead of his own grandchildren? Or perhaps because he was removing titles bestowed by someone else and not himself?

A difference is also that Emanuela de Dampierre was married to his uncle in a morganatc marriage and it wasn't JC or his father or grandfather who had recognized her as HRH but Franco.
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  #285  
Old 01-08-2023, 05:12 AM
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Obviously it has a lot to do with the fact that the Spanish monarchy was reinstated, and started with new laws. Those laws were adapted to the times and for Juan Carlos and the politicians of the time reducing the Royal Family made perfect sense.

All those who, within the previous laws of the Crown, had titles of infants were able to keep them. Since the marriages of the children of Alfonso XIII were morganatic, except that of Juan de Borbón, the other descendants had already lost their rights.
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