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  #1  
Old 08-19-2004, 09:54 PM
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Relationship between King Juan Carlos and Queen Elizabeth

Queen Elizabeth calls him "Juanito" and King Juan Carlos calls her "Lilibeth". When Queen Elizabeth went to Spain on a state visit a few years ago, there was one day with no official events. King Juan Carlos invited his cousin "Lilibeth" to a restaurant (King Juan Carlos loves to go to restaurants). Queen Elizabeth replied: "But Juanito, I´ve never been in a restaurant and I don´t expect to go to any for the time being."
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Old 08-19-2004, 10:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Conde Valleverde
Queen Elizabeth calls him "Juanito" and King Juan Carlos calls her "Lilibeth". When Queen Elizabeth went to Spain on a state visit a few years ago, there was one day with no official events. King Juan Carlos invited his cousin "Lilibeth" to a restaurant (King Juan Carlos loves to go to restaurants). Queen Elizabeth replied: "But Juanito, I´ve never been in a restaurant and I don´t expect to go to any for the time being."

Isn't that so sad? In many ways, I feel sorry for Queen Elizabeth. She is so detached from the "real world"
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Old 08-23-2004, 08:55 AM
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I think that maybe because she had never been in a restaurant before,so maybe she can feel ashmed or something like that.In life,sometimes there are some people who had never done,gone something and when other people talk,invite,want..them to do,go..that,they can feel they can't,or they ashmed..So,i think that with Queen Elizabeth,it is normal.It is human feeling.
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  #4  
Old 11-09-2004, 11:43 PM
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always thinking ahead!

I also think that she was just being polite...due to increased security for heads of state, I'm sure that the British government's security forces would have been in such a panic if she had gone...therefore, she saved everyone a headache by declining the invitation.
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  #5  
Old 11-12-2004, 08:54 PM
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Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip dined at Trader Vic's, a restaurant in San Francisco, in 1983.

She is reported to have commented that it had been 17 years since they had eaten at a restaurant.
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  #6  
Old 04-03-2018, 03:12 PM
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Are the two families still close to this day?
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  #8  
Old 08-21-2020, 08:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blog Real View Post
Some pictures of King Juan Carlos with Queen Elizabeth II.

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/--WSYLz4GU...d81a6f9b9d.jpg

Why did Queen Elizabeth II award the Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order to the Prince of Asturias as seen in the picture above, but did not bestow any British order on Queen Sofia, who is wearing the Spanish order of Charles III in the picture?



I believe King Juan Carlos is wearing the Order of the Garter and a very big Golden Fleece on his necklet. Prince Felipe is also wearing a Knight's necklace Golden Fleece, but much smaller than the King's.
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Old 08-22-2020, 12:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Why did Queen Elizabeth II award the Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order to the Prince of Asturias as seen in the picture above, but did not bestow any British order on Queen Sofia, who is wearing the Spanish order of Charles III in the picture?
I don't believe that Elizabeth II has ever awarded an honor to a foreign consort. It's just been her policy not to for some reason.
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Old 08-22-2020, 02:53 AM
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Only female consorts for some reason.

Henrik was an honorary Knight Grand Cross of the RVO, Order of the Bath, and Order of St Michael and St George.

Prince Claus had the RVO. Prince Bernhard was in the Order of the Bath (rewarded in 1958 so by Elizabeth not her father).

It would be nice to see her extend the same to female consorts. Hopefully the tradition of not will end with her and Charles and William will do so. Its a shame to see the BRF get foreign honors during state visits and yet not reciprocate.
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Old 08-22-2020, 02:56 AM
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Originally Posted by LauraS3514 View Post
I don't believe that Elizabeth II has ever awarded an honor to a foreign consort. It's just been her policy not to for some reason.
She did. See Prince Bernhard of the Netherlands (Grand Cross with Chain in the Most Honourable Order of the Bath, Grand Cross in the Royal Victorian Order, Grand Cross of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire, Honorary Bailiff in the Most Venerable Order of the Hospital of Saint John of Jerusalem, the Defence Medal, the France & Germany Star, the Coronation Medal GVIR, the Coronation Medal EIIR). Or see Prince Félix of Luxembourg. See Prince Henrik of Denmark. See Prince Claus of the Netherlands.
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Old 08-22-2020, 08:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LauraS3514 View Post
I don't believe that Elizabeth II has ever awarded an honor to a foreign consort. It's just been her policy not to for some reason.

She awarded the Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian order to Prince Henrik, Prince Consort of Denmark, and to Prince Claus of the Netherlands. I don't understand why she treats male and female consorts differently. Can anyone explain the rationale?
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Old 08-22-2020, 10:51 AM
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I don't believe Queen Sofia was ever awarded an British orders during her 38 year tenure as queen consort of Spain.
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Old 08-22-2020, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by An Ard Ri View Post
I don't believe Queen Sofia was ever awarded an British orders during her 38 year tenure as queen consort of Spain.
No, and either have Silvia, Sonja and Paola. It seems Elizabeth has limited it to male consorts.
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Old 08-23-2020, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Kitty1224 View Post
Are the two families still close to this day?

Queen Sofia is Prince Charles' second cousin (on his father's side of the family) , which also makes Felipe William's third cousin (I suppose), and both King Juan Carlos and Queen Sofia are Queen Elizabeth II's third cousins through Queen Victoria. I don't know how close they are, but I suppose QEII considers them family and she showed it during King Felipe's state visit in 2017. Queen Sofia is said to visit privately when she is in the UK and Charles and Diana, when they were still together, vacationed with the Spanish royals in Mallorca.



The British and Spanish governments (nothing to do with the families) have a diplomatic relationship, but not particularly close, mostly because of Gibraltar, I guess. After the UK left the EU, institutional relations between the two countries have cooled further at the government level.


I was surprised that, during the latest Spanish state visit, the Foreign Minister of Spain recommended that Prince Harry, Princess Anne and Prince Andrew be given only the Encomienda de Número (equivalent to Knight/Dame Commander) of the Order of Isabella the Catholic when I assumed they would get the Grand Cross instead. Furthermore, the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge did not get any Spanish order, which was also odd.
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Old 08-23-2020, 09:44 AM
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The spouse of Queen Wilhelmina, Prince Hendrik of the Netherlands, Duke of Mecklenburg-Schwerin, was - alike his later son-in-law Prince Bernhard - created a Knight Grand Cross with Chain in the Most Honourable Order of the Bath.

In comparison Prince Claus was given the "lower" Grand Cross in the Royal Victorian Order, while his spouse Queen Beatrix is a Dame Grand Cross in the Royal Victorian Order, has the Royal Victorian Chain and is a Dame in the Most Noble Order of the Garter.

So not only differences between male and female spouses but also in between male spouses.

Picture: the ceremonial robe, chain and breast star of Prince Hendrik, exposed in a vitrine at the Chancellery of the Netherlands' Orders.

https://www.modemuze.nl/sites/defaul...?itok=IMdKBAqb

It is remarkable that a born Princess of the blood royal, like Queen Beatrix, staples British Orders, while another born Princess of the blood Royal, Queen Sofía (family of Philip) received nothing at all.

Queen Beatrix already received he Dame Grand Cross in the Royal Victorian Order at the age of 18 from the same Queen Elizabeth II.
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Old 08-23-2020, 10:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
The spouse of Queen Wilhelmina, Prince Hendrik of the Netherlands, Duke of Mecklenburg-Schwerin, was - alike his later son-in-law Prince Bernhard - created a Knight Grand Cross with Chain in the Most Honourable Order of the Bath.

In comparison Prince Claus was given the "lower" Grand Cross in the Royal Victorian Order, while his spouse Queen Beatrix is a Dame Grand Cross in the Royal Victorian Order, has the Royal Victorian Chain and is a Dame in the Most Noble Order of the Garter.

So not only differences between male and female spouses but also in between male spouses.

Picture: the ceremonial robe, chain and breast star of Prince Hendrik, exposed in a vitrine at the Chancellery of the Netherlands' Orders.

https://www.modemuze.nl/sites/defaul...?itok=IMdKBAqb

It is remarkable that a born Princess of the blood royal, like Queen Beatrix, staples British Orders, while another born Princess of the blood Royal, Queen Sofía (family of Philip) received nothing at all.

Queen Beatrix already received he Dame Grand Cross in the Royal Victorian Order at the age of 18 from the same Queen Elizabeth II.

Although the order of the Bath has higher precedence, to me the RVO is a more significant honor because it is awarded on the personal discretion of the monarch whereas the order of the Bath, as the orders of Saint Michael and Saint George and the order of the British Empire, are awarded by ministerial recommendation.


QEII is pretty consistent. She normally awards the order of the Bath to visiting presidents of republics (and some non-European kings). She awards the RVO to male crown princes and princes consort, and the order of the Garter to European monarchs and emperors of Japan.



There are exceptions, however. King Juan Carlos was already king when he visited the UK in 1986 and only got the Royal Victorian Chain while Queen Elizabeth II got the Collar of the order of Charles III and both Prince Philip and Prince Charles were awarded the Grand Cross of Charles III. Later, in the return state visit to Spain, Queen Elizabeth II awarded the Garter to King Juan Carlos (and the Grand Cross of the RVO to Prince Felipe) and received in return the order of the Golden Fleece (the only Spanish order that is currently awarded on a personal recommendation by the monarch).

I suppose the fact that King Juan Carlos got only the Royal Victorian Chain at first is a sign of the somewhat tense relations between UK and Spain at the time.


EDIT: The Spanish orders of Charles III and Isabella the Catholic have two separate higher grades (Collar and Gran Cruz) which are equivalent to Knight/Dame Grand Cross in the UK. The difference is that only the grade of Collar receives the order's chain in addition to the sash, badge and breast star. In addition, the sash of the Collar has a different design from that of the Grand Cross and the breast star of Knights/Dame with Collar is bigger, I believe, than that of the ordinary Knights/Dames Grand Cross. Excluding supernumerary members, the Collar of Charles III is restricted to 25 living knights/dames.
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Old 08-23-2020, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
(...)Furthermore, the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge did not get any Spanish order, which was also odd.
My guess is that they will get a higher level order when they are Prince and Princess of Wales, or King and Queen.
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Old 08-23-2020, 10:57 AM
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My guess is that they will get a higher level order when they are Prince and Princess of Wales, or King and Queen.

Diana didn't get a Spanish order either as Princess of Wales; only Charles did. But that may have to do with reciprocity as Queen Elizabeth II does not decorate female consorts.



I suspect Charles will change that policy and will start awarding British orders to foreign queens consort. The policy doesn't make any sense really, especially when princes consort are decorated.
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Old 08-23-2020, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Although the order of the Bath has higher precedence, to me the RVO is a more significant honor because it is awarded on the personal discretion of the monarch whereas the order of the Bath, as the orders of Saint Michael and Saint George and the order of the British Empire, are awarded by ministerial recommendation.


QEII is pretty consistent. She normally awards the order of the Bath to visiting presidents of republics (and some non-European kings). She awards the RVO to male crown princes and princes consort, and the order of the Garter to European monarchs and emperors of Japan.

[...]
This male spouse in question has been Knight Grand Cross in the Order of the Bath, Knight Grand Cross in the Royal Victorian Order, Knight Grand Cross in the Order of St John, so ticking all boxes respectively in the Queen's personal discretion, on ministerial recommendation as well by recommendation of the Order's Council.

I surely hope the absurd difference in male and female spouses will be lifted under Charles III.
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