General News & Information for King Harald V and Queen Sonja: 2006 -

[Tatiana Maria]

Thank you for clarifying the facts about the arrest, Royal Norway.

When you mentioned British royal security, it struck me that in all likelihood Princess Astrid and Princess Märtha Louise would not enjoy everyday police protection if they were British princesses, and yet the danger to Norwegian royals is probably lower than with British royals.

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Originally Posted by Muhler

Thanks, Royal Norway, for your always well-informed posts.

Have there been calls for amalgamating the royal protection detail for the rest of the security apparatus?

I can imagine that some segments of the political spectrum would consider that a "private police force" under the King - as well as reducing costs.

You're very welcome!

And likewise to you for your always more that well-informed posts in DRF threads.

No, there have not been any calls from the political spectrum to do that.
Why? Well, The Royal Police Escort was established in 1945 to protect King Haakon VII and other members of the Royal Family after WWII, and is seen as an integral part of the Norwegian monarchy (they even have their own coat of arms).
And if an MP or the government had suggested that it would be better to merge the Escort with PST's bodyguard unit LVPST (who protects the Government/politicians), because they consider it to be a ''private police force under the King'' - and (or) want to reduce costs, it could in fact be seen as anti-monarchy or republican propaganda.
So, I don't think they would dare to do that.

However, there was some whining (and rightly so) from one of the Escort officers in 2016 about that they don't earn as much as those in LVPST, and that PST don't share enough information with them, and a rang of other issues. - He therefore suggested a merging, but that wasn't listened to at all, I think.
And there was some news last year that the cooperation between the two units is much better now, especially after that criticism.

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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

Thank you for clarifying the facts about the arrest, Royal Norway.

When you mentioned British royal security, it struck me that in all likelihood Princess Astrid and Princess Märtha Louise would not enjoy everyday police protection if they were British princesses, and yet the danger to Norwegian royals is probably lower than with British royals.

You're welcome!

1. Although not a member of the Norwegian Royal House, Princess Märtha is the daughter of the monarch, and would probably have been a full-time working royal with the style HRH if she were British.

2. Although not a member of the Norwegian Royal House, Princess Astrid is the daughter of a monarch, and was (as I wrote in the ''May 17th'' thread) in reality a full-time working royal until her health began to decline in the early 2000s.
Had she been British, she would probably have been the same, but with the style HRH.

3. When it comes to the two Princesses, the security is based on assessment of the threats.

Märtha: According to Norwegian media, 14 so-called stalkers was after her in 2006, and the The Royal Police Escort still struggles with several persons who is mentally obsessed with her.

Astrid: She lives in an ordinary apartment surrounded by neighbours, and must therefore be protected.

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Well, the Norwegian government does everything they can to make friends with China again after Liu Xiaobo received the Nobel Peace Prize in 2010.

But how do we do it?
Hmm, perhaps we can send the CP couple down, because if the visit goes well, they might actually (for once) get some much needed credit from the media.
Or do we send our frail 81-year-old super-popular monarch, who doesn't need any credit at all, on a state visit, along with his 81-year-old Queen.

Well, the government has decided to go for the last option.
Why? Because President (I think DICTATOR is a better word), Xi Jinping in his 80th Birthday greetings to the King last year inviteid him to pay a state visit to China.
And we can't say no to them, because then they will be ANGRY with us again, which could be very expensive for Norway (kindergarten, anyone?).

The Royal couple to travel to China - Norway Today

[Muhler]

Interesting. Why not send all four, or three (Haakon)?
The Regent Couple are, as you say, old and frail, so they could need all the support they can get.

Does the government not trust Haakon and Mette-Marit to do a good job?!?
That would be most... remarkable... especially as Haakon could be king tomorrow.
I mean as long as they don't mention Winnie the Poo, surely not much can go wrong.

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Originally Posted by Muhler

Interesting. Why not send all four, or three (Haakon)?
The Regent Couple are, as you say, old and frail, so they could need all the support they can get.

Well, I've actually thought about that myself, and I think it would be a pretty good idea to send all four (or three) of them.
Not to show that the King have faith in the CP couple, because he has never tried to hide the fact that he does, but because it will show continuity between them.

Originally Posted by Muhler

Does the government not trust Haakon and Mette-Marit to do a good job?!?
That would be most... remarkable... especially as Haakon could be king tomorrow.

Other than that some politicians in the Storting/government have told TV2's royal expert Kjell Arne Totland & royal author Tor Bomann-Larsen that they are worried about the direction Haakon seems to take the monarchy, I really don't know.

Originally Posted by Muhler

I mean as long as they don't mention Winnie the Poo, surely not much can go wrong.

No, except if something Marius-related pops up in their meetings with the media (which will create a lot of noise here at home, but not diplomatically in China), I don't see what might go wrong during a visit like this, either.

[Muhler]

Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY

Other than that some politicians in the Storting/government have told TV2's royal expert Kjell Arne Totland & royal author Tor Bomann-Larsen that they are worried about the direction Haakon seems to take the monarchy, I really don't know.

That's interesting!
Please remind me, who are these politicians?
If they are republicans/far left wing, it really doesn't matter.

But if they are from the center and right parties it's perhaps more worrying.
At what party-political level are these politicians?
What's the history of these politicians?
Do they have a history of criticizing Haakon?
And what was the reaction from the party political top?

Let me explain:
If it's say a center-right politician, pretty far down the hierarchy (back-bencher) it really doesn't matter. That politician may actually mean what he/she is saying, but is hardly speaking on behalf of the party.
But if the politician has a medium level position within the party, say being the spokesperson in a more heavy political field, like economy or foreign politics. Then he is most likely speaking unofficially on behalf of the party.
If it's even higher up, say deputy party leader or a minister, then the politician is "unofficially officially" speaking on behalf of the party!

The reaction from the party top is telling as well. If the party top goes out at once an whacks the politician on the head, the statement is not on behalf of the party.
If they don't or it's only a half-hearted whack, the statement is at least finding a lot of sympathy within the party.

Okay, some politicians have a history of speaking out about absolutely everything including the royals. Sometimes that's how they are and sometimes that's their job. They send up trial-balloons, political decoys, start debates and so on. - Sometimes however they are an unofficial "tapping the finger on the table". I.e. it's an unofficial political: "Hey Haakon, listen..."

However, if the politician has a history of criticizing Haakon, it could be because the politician is genuinely worried about Haakon and dislike him and/or the advisors around Haakon. Or he is a raised party-political index finger. - Here it's the party-top's reaction that is telling. (See also paragraph above.)
If the party leaderships whacks him on the head, he is merely annoying, also within the party.
If they don't, it's either because he is speaking on behalf of the party i.e. the party is annoyed at Haakon as well, at least to some extent. Or he is a decoy.

- Isn't politics fun?

[ROYAL NORWAY]

I have responded in this thread: General News and Information about Haakon, Mette-Marit and family

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Well, there have been a lot of Norwegian royal news this month, but I've been a bit busy, so (with the exception of Märtha dropping the Angel-school) I haven't had time to write about it. - But here we go:

Article from September 11th: Major security breach before King Harald’s visit to Oslo university – Royal Central.

Last week, the Oslo Police Department had a major security breach before King Harald’s visit to the University of Oslo. Only a few hours before King Harald visited the University of Oslo last week, the police’s confidential and detailed plan of action was openly available to everybody to see in the front window of a city police car.

One who passed the civil police car in the afternoon of 6 September was a former criminal who had been in prison for several years. He discovered the graduated document in the front window, which included the time of the King’s visit to the University, threat assessment and a series of measures for several operational police units.

Be aware (as Oskar Aanmoen writes a bit down in the article) that this incident was associated with the Norwegian police (who is called in to assist when the royals are out on engagements), and not The Royal Police Escort (which one can read about in post 84), who protect the NRF on a daily basis.

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In other news: According to the serious liberal-conservative newspaper, Aftenposten, the Court and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs are frustrated with that the Chinese government has not yet given a green light to the Regent-Couple's state visit to China, which is likely to take place in October.
Usually, the date of state visits are set one or two years in advance, so this is a clear breach of diplomatic protocol, the paper says. - Hmm???? Well, I can't say that I'm that surprised.

[Muhler]

Hasn't Noway been through a slight hick-up in regards to your relations to China in recent years?

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Well, the Chinese government literally went nuclear with us after, Liu Xiaobo, received the Nobel Peace Prize in 2010. - And until 2016, when the relationship was normalized after a desperate Norwegian government started licking up to them, there were no political contact at all. They even introduced unofficial restrictions on Norwegian salmon and visas.

[iceflower]

.

Quite accidentally Queen Sonja met a group of kindergartners in the castle grounds. They had come to take a look at the sculptures for children and to have a picnic. A lovely photo was made and the children asked Queen Sonja whether they were allowed to take some chetnuts with them - they were


** instagram photo **

[eya]

Queen Sonja about on sitting for Andy Warhol and becoming an artist

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/luxury/a...ing-artist-70/

[Tatiana Maria]

Originally Posted by eya

Queen Sonja about on sitting for Andy Warhol and becoming an artist

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/luxury/a...ing-artist-70/

I wasn't aware that Sonja was trained to take over her father's business. As her father died before she was married, did she actually administer the business for several years? In any event, I'm sure it gave her an appreciation of hard work and enriched her talents as crown princess and queen.

[Somebody]

Originally Posted by eya

Queen Sonja about on sitting for Andy Warhol and becoming an artist

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/luxury/a...ing-artist-70/

Such a pity that the Telegraph didn't get the basic stuff right: Martha Louise is 2 years older not younger than Haakon.

Other than that, an interesting article and apparently she sees Maud as the most artistic among her grandchildren while her children aren't.

[Tatiana Maria]

Originally Posted by Somebody

Other than that, an interesting article and apparently she sees Maud as the most artistic among her grandchildren while her children aren't.

It is interesting that Queen Sonja hopes Maud Behn will become an artist "for [Maud's] sake"; is it simply because of the queen's admiration for artists or does she perhaps see it as a particularly appropriate vocation for a member of the royal family?

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

I wasn't aware that Sonja was trained to take over her father's business. As her father died before she was married, did she actually administer the business for several years? In any event, I'm sure it gave her an appreciation of hard work and enriched her talents as crown princess and queen.

No, she didn't! - After her father died in 1959, the family-business (which now mainly consists of renting out properties, I think) was run by her late brother Haakon Haraldsen (1921-2016), and since by his children.

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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

It is interesting that Queen Sonja hopes Maud Behn will become an artist "for [Maud's] sake"; is it simply because of the queen's admiration for artists or does she perhaps see it as a particularly appropriate vocation for a member of the royal family?

Let's go through what she said:

But this evening there is a party for one of her five grandchildren. Are any of them artistic? I ask.

‘My children, no,’ she replies. ‘But some of the grandchildren, I think. Especially the eldest [Maud]. She’s 15, and I think she may be an artist. I hope so, anyway. For her sake!’

Well, having seen a lot of TV-interviews with the Queen, I'm pretty sure she meant it in a humorous way (without thinking that long before she said it), like: ''For her sake, because she would REALLY miss out of a lot of fun-stuff, if she doesn't goes for it.''

[Tatiana Maria]

Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY

No, she didn't! - After her father died in 1959, the family-business (which now mainly consists of renting out properties, I think) was run by her late brother Haakon Haraldsen (1921-2016), and since by his children.

Perhaps the beginning of her relationship with Harald was involved in the family's decision to hand the business to her brother? I imagine some traditionalists would have been critical of a future crown princess having a career.

Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY

Let's go through what she said:

Well, having seen a lot of TV-interviews with the Queen, I'm pretty sure she meant it in a humorous way (without thinking that long before she said it), like: ''For her sake, because she would REALLY miss out of a lot of fun-stuff, if she doesn't goes for it.''

Thanks! Humor is lost in translation from time to time.

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

Perhaps the beginning of her relationship with Harald was involved in the family's decision to hand the business to her brother?

I don't know, have unsuccessfully been trying to find some information about it.

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

I imagine some traditionalists would have been critical of a future crown princess having a career.

Well, the ''women staying at home stuff'' was starting to change here during the 1960s, so I don't think many would've had a major problem with that. - And Sonja being in charge of her family's then renowned clothing business would just have made her case even more to the critical voices, I think. I.e. King Olav V, the court, politicians and last but not least, the press.
But she would have had to give it up anyway, when she became Crown Princess, so perhaps both she and her family thought it was easier to just hand it over to her brother.



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In other news. - Those of you who follow The NRF-website, will already know this: King Harald and Queen Sonja to Seefeld.

I for one thought CP Haakon (or perhaps even The Queen by herself) would be the one going, but again, the sports-mad King clearly feels up to it, although it can't be that easy for a frail 82-year-old (as he will be then) to sit out on that cold stadium watching all those competitions.

[Tatiana Maria]

Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY

I don't know, have unsuccessfully been trying to find some information about it.

Thanks!

Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY

Well, the ''women staying at home stuff'' was starting to change here during the 1960s, so I don't think many would've had a major problem with that.

That makes the position clearer. But I wonder if the same side who held it necessary to restrain the crown prince from marrying a commoner (were they a majority or minority in Norway in the 1960s?) really would be "modern" enough at the same time to agree with the changes to women working outside the home.

Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY

- And Sonja being in charge of her family's then renowned clothing business would just have made her case even more to the critical voices, I think. I.e. King Olav V, the court, politicians and last but not least, the press.

In light of your comments here and in the Marius thread, it gives the impression that Norwegians, with respect to their royal family, are refreshingly unconcerned with whether jobs are suitably "royal" and admire a durable work ethic first and foremost.

Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY

But she would have had to give it up anyway, when she became Crown Princess, so perhaps both she and her family thought it was easier to just hand it over to her brother.

An interesting thought, as that line of thinking would signify their regard for Sonja's future acceptance into the Royal House as more likely than not. In light of what you said above, though, perhaps it would have been more astute to enact their original plan.

Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY

In other news. - Those of you who follow The NRF-website, will already know this: King Harald and Queen Sonja to Seefeld.

I for one thought CP Haakon (or perhaps even The Queen by herself) would be the one going, but again, the sports-mad King clearly feels up to it, although it can't be that easy for a frail 82-year-old (as he will be then) to sit out on that cold stadium watching all those competitions.

My guess is that he is too passionate of a sports enthusiast to willingly give it up.

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

That makes the position clearer. But I wonder if the same side who held it necessary to restrain the crown prince from marrying a commoner (were they a majority or minority in Norway in the 1960s?) really would be "modern" enough at the same time to agree with the changes to women working outside the home.

Well, there wasn't really a side, since almost every politician (from all parties) and a unanimous press were against it (the marriage, I mean). - And Sonja had in fact already helped out her brother by working period-wise for the family-business in the years leading up to the wedding.

''Were they a majority or minority in Norway in the 1960s?''
Good question! - And with the word ''they,'' I assume you mean ordinary Norwegians? Hmm, most were probably skeptical at first, but there is broad agreement among living politicians and journalists from the time (and those who have been alive until recently) that a large majority were happy that CP Harald would finally get the chance to marry his Sonja.

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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

In light of your comments here and in the Marius thread, it gives the impression that Norwegians, with respect to their royal family, are refreshingly unconcerned with whether jobs are suitably "royal" and admire a durable work ethic first and foremost.

Yes, but there are exceptions, such as Märtha standing in a room teaching paying-people to speak with angels.

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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

An interesting thought, as that line of thinking would signify their regard for Sonja's future acceptance into the Royal House as more likely than not. In light of what you said above, though, perhaps it would have been more astute to enact their original plan.

They were most likely thinking about the stability of the business.

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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

My guess is that he is too passionate of a sports enthusiast to willingly give it up.

Yes, and today (as you know), he began his two-day stay attending the Norwegian Championships in Cross-country skiing in Meråker.
And as people can see in the current-event thread, he was in great spirit.