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  #1221  
Old 04-21-2021, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Heavs View Post
Maybe not, I can't keep track of which came from where tonight. But the Harpers article (from Scobie) I posted early was at pains to say that Harry didn't in fact write to Charles before the funeral, that Charles left for Wales almost immediately and that he DID spend time time with HM. Whilst not mentioning the talk they apparently had for two hours on Saturday. Allegedly.

And now People (who don't print anything without a publicists say so) are at pains to say (again!) how very, very, very close Meghan is to HM and how much she admires her. Whilst doing their best to destroy everything else she holds dear.

Whilst the "Harry couldn't fit Charles in his busy schedule" didn't make Harry look particularly good (but also came with "Harry was ganged up on"), it just seemed that the sources we can be pretty sure were 100% authorised played down reconciliation with Charles and played up "the Queen still loves us 100%! She and Meghan zoom all the time!"

With no sort of acknowledgement that just maybe HM has been a little bit frustrated with them for the storm they caused during the last month of her husband's life.

We can't know for sure what's true and what's not on either "side" but it's a pattern for me and a pattern that it's coming out on HM's birthday.
I'll be honest, I haven't read anything about Meghan/HM - If I run across that stuff, I avoid it, lol. That said, I'm not surprised......and it's the kind of thing I'm tired of. This just smacks of deep insecurity - if M is really that close (which, I'm sorry, I don't believe) to HM - or anyone - she wouldn't have to keep publicizing it. She and Harry care way too much what people think - hence they read comments on-line, hence they have thin skins.

Harry thinking it was "two against one" - if true - bothers me, as if he already assumed his father and brother were tag teaming him. It's rather defensive.
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  #1222  
Old 04-21-2021, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by lirienn View Post
OK, so the Sussex' camp gave away that the relationship between the royals is still bad. I believe the firm "prays" Meghan won't travel to the UK with Harry too much and do lots of drama because the funeral showed how perfect everyone is for the job and Kate got a lot of compliments.
Where did you read this? Thank you
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  #1223  
Old 04-21-2021, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
Harry thinking it was "two against one" - if true - bothers me, as if he already assumed his father and brother were tag teaming him. It's rather defensive.
To be honest, that's one of the things that don't surprise me. Harry's behavior after the interview - heck, even during the interview - smacks of a man who had no idea about the real consequences of his little TV tantrum. I do think it was calculated and meant to do harm but I've always wondered what harm meant in Harry's eyes. I was left with the impression than in his eyes, it shouldn't have been as bad as to justify him a cold shoulder for a very long time. I mean, all the things he and Meghan said and then - I'll work on repairing the relationship, we'll repair it when I go to unveil that statue as if it's this easy? The surprise that his family didn't apologize humbly to his suffering wife? He seems to still be living in the world where everything he did was excused as Harry being Harry the lad, Harry being Harry and never meaning anything bad. That was the image crafted for him and it might have been his image with the family as well. If so, I can totally see why he'd see Charles and William as warring with him when all he wanted was to have his say on TV and then have it waved away as it always was before.


He didn't expect a strike back.
  #1224  
Old 04-21-2021, 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Heavs View Post
We can't know for sure what's true and what's not on either "side" but it's a pattern for me and a pattern that it's coming out on HM's birthday.
Agreed. And I have to say, itís a pattern that has long been noticed and commented upon in very negative terms. I kind of have to wonder exactly what Sunshine Sachs is getting all that big money for when they canít even be a little bit more creative and less obvious.
  #1225  
Old 04-21-2021, 06:56 PM
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The Duke & Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 4: April 2021 -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
Of course the Queen and Philip are/were very close to Meghan. All because there was a statement issued the day after the interview, where so many detrimental things about the Queen's monarchy and her family were thrown under the bus, stating it was *not* the Queen or Philip that made a racist remark. That endeared Meghan to their hearts in gratitude and admiration. They appreciated her kindness.



BTW: Queen Elizabeth, the Queen Mother and Wallis Simpson were secretly best friends. Film at 11.


Indeed.

I can buy into HM and Philip being nice to Meghan for many reasons- starting with Archie. Close? Close implies a level of trust and ease with a person that I find it difficult to imagine exists/ed post interview.

I honestly cannot imagine how HM felt knowing that her beloved husband was getting called racist, while seriously ill, all over the internet courtesy of her own grandson and grand daughter in law. Iím sure Harryís clarification fixed everything, like it had never happened at all. I donít recall that it came with an apology. Did it? I can only hope there was a private apology. (And that is me setting aside everything else that got said in that interview about her family and lifeís work.)

ETA- Iíd really like to know how Harryís clarification came about. Did he himself see the comments on the internet and realize....ooops? One of his staff? Someone in the family? Some combination of the above. He and Meghan let the interview air with that blanket racist statement out there. And they let it lie until the next day. So.....what happened....
  #1226  
Old 04-21-2021, 07:15 PM
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Indeed.

I can buy into HM and Philip being nice to Meghan for many reasons- starting with Archie. Close? Close implies a level of trust and ease with a person that I find it difficult to imagine exists/ed post interview.

I honestly cannot imagine how HM felt knowing that her beloved husband was getting called racist, while seriously ill, all over the internet courtesy of her own grandson and grand daughter in law. Iím sure Harryís clarification fixed everything, like it had never happened at all. I donít recall that it came with an apology. Did it? I can only hope there was a private apology. (And that is me setting aside everything else that got said in that interview about her family and lifeís work.)

ETA- Iíd really like to know how Harryís clarification came about. Did he himself see the comments on the internet and realize....ooops? One of his staff? Someone in the family? Some combination of the above. He and Meghan let the interview air with that blanket racist statement out there. So.....what happened....
I doubt HM was happy even after Harry clarified that he wasnít referring to she or Philip as being racist given that he made that accusation against the entire family, knowing people would assume it was Charles or William.
  #1227  
Old 04-21-2021, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Erin9 View Post
Thanks. That was the trip I was thinking of. It didnít seem like a big deal to me since it was clearly after the official tour, but I remember there being a lot of backlash. So, I can see Charles not wanting a repeat.

And Washington DC to CA isnít that close at all. Iím not sure what the European equivalent would be.
4,320.4 km, USA is a huge country
  #1228  
Old 04-21-2021, 07:26 PM
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The Duke & Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 4: April 2021 -

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Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
I doubt HM was happy even after Harry clarified that he wasnít referring to she or Philip as being racist given that he made that accusation against the entire family, knowing people would assume it was Charles or William.


Iím sure ďhappyĒ was the last word that could possibly be used to describe HM in the aftermath of that interview.

As awful as it is IMO that more of the focus shifted to William and Charles after the clarification- I can see that some family members might have considered it absolutely unforgivable if Harry allowed his grandparents to continue to be accused of racism. Especially with Philip being so ill. I find it hard to believe he didnít so much as get a text, a VM or a phone call on that point alone. (Not that I have any clue, of course, as to how forgiving they feel period. But I could see that being something that could never be gotten past. Iím trying not to project my own feelings, but I find this so utterly appalling.)
  #1229  
Old 04-21-2021, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
Of course the Queen and Philip are/were very close to Meghan. All because there was a statement issued the day after the interview, where so many detrimental things about the Queen's monarchy and her family were thrown under the bus, stating it was *not* the Queen or Philip that made a racist remark. That endeared Meghan to their hearts in gratitude and admiration. They appreciated her kindness.

BTW: Queen Elizabeth, the Queen Mother and Wallis Simpson were secretly best friends. Film at 11.
This is hilarious!
  #1230  
Old 04-21-2021, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Erin9 View Post
Iím sure ďhappyĒ was the last word that could possibly be used to describe HM in the aftermath of that interview.

As awful as it is IMO that more of the focus shifted to William and Harry after the clarification- I can see that some family members might have considered it absolutely unforgivable if Harry allowed his grandparents to continue to be accused of racism. Especially with Philip being so ill. I find it hard to believe he didnít so much as get a text, a VM or a phone call on that point alone. (Not that I have any clue, of course, as to how forgiving they feel period. But I could see that being something that could never be gotten past. Iím trying not to project my own feelings, but I find this so utterly appalling.)
Oh of course, I agree...but no one wants to be branded a racist if they arenít. I also imagine the family wasnít thrilled that Harry threw Charles and William under the bus and then drove the bus over them. There was a level of cruelty in what he did - thinking about how hurt Charles must be pains me. It feels like H and M needed their pound of flesh. I believe H loves his father and brother deeply, which makes this especially disturbing.
  #1231  
Old 04-21-2021, 08:28 PM
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To be honest, that's one of the things that don't surprise me. Harry's behavior after the interview - heck, even during the interview - smacks of a man who had no idea about the real consequences of his little TV tantrum. I do think it was calculated and meant to do harm but I've always wondered what harm meant in Harry's eyes. I was left with the impression than in his eyes, it shouldn't have been as bad as to justify him a cold shoulder for a very long time. I mean, all the things he and Meghan said and then - I'll work on repairing the relationship, we'll repair it when I go to unveil that statue as if it's this easy? The surprise that his family didn't apologize humbly to his suffering wife? He seems to still be living in the world where everything he did was excused as Harry being Harry the lad, Harry being Harry and never meaning anything bad. That was the image crafted for him and it might have been his image with the family as well. If so, I can totally see why he'd see Charles and William as warring with him when all he wanted was to have his say on TV and then have it waved away as it always was before.


He didn't expect a strike back.
I said yesterday that I think Harry is naive, and I still think that. He may not have reckoned on how angry and especially hurt his family would be, especially I assume his father (since heíd already been feuding with William for a long time). I think children sometimes donít think of their parents as having real feelings, that a parent will generally forgive most anything their child does. That might be the case with H.
  #1232  
Old 04-21-2021, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
Oh of course, I agree...but no one wants to be branded a racist if they arenít. I also imagine the family wasnít thrilled that Harry threw Charles and William under the bus and then drove the bus over them. There was a level of cruelty in what he did - thinking about how hurt Charles must be pains me. It feels like H and M needed their pound of flesh. I believe H loves his father and brother deeply, which makes this especially disturbing.


IA. Itís all terrible. I think cruel is a good word for it.

I just find it particularly egregious that HM and Philip were ever dragged into it.

Meghan is the one who brought the whole thing up. One reason I am so very cynical about her is this. She had to know HM and Philip would take a hit. And yet- it seems that now there are repeated reports about her closeness to them. Itís....interesting.
  #1233  
Old 04-21-2021, 10:04 PM
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At this point, the PR game from Team Sussex is fairly predictable. What I'm curious about is what their PR plan will be in another 4-6 years after HM passes on. There is a very finite window on being able to use the "Oh, Harry & Meghan are still totes tight with the Queen!" angle. By continuing to play this as the Queen = good, Charles/William = bad/trapped, they're going to paint themselves into a corner that will be hard to exit from with any hope of good press after HM passes away. And, frankly, I don't think William is going to be all that keen on letting H&M get away with this game, especially if they continue to attack him or Kate (or potentially their kids - can you just imagine Meghan crying in the another Oprah bombshell interview in a few years about how awful G, C & L treated her kids at Balmoral a couple summers prior?). It's going to be interesting to observe how they try to pivot out of the corner they're boxing themselves into after the Queen is gone.
  #1234  
Old 04-21-2021, 10:44 PM
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Originally Posted by ACO View Post
Everyone making EVERYTHING people say or do about Meghan about the royals is just over the top to me. I seriously doubt the Queenís birthday was on Chrissyís mind. But thatís just me. LOL
But the Sussexes want people to make everything they say or do about the BRF. This is their meal ticket for life, this is what makes them different from your run-of-the-mill celebrity in California.

They get not only the huge Netflix/Spotify deals, the mansion with 16 bathrooms, the celebrity lifestyle, the talk-shows appearances, but also the pomp and pageantry of BRF that cannot be replicated elsewhere. Especially not in the US.

Harry and Meghan Mountbatten-Windsor don't bring home the cash. Duke and Duchess of Sussexes do. There is a reason they are reminding everyone of their titles ad nauseam. This is what makes them special and this is what makes them money - no matter if they praise or criticize the institution, they are making money on their connection to it.
  #1235  
Old 04-21-2021, 10:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
I said yesterday that I think Harry is naive, and I still think that. He may not have reckoned on how angry and especially hurt his family would be, especially I assume his father (since heíd already been feuding with William for a long time). I think children sometimes donít think of their parents as having real feelings, that a parent will generally forgive most anything their child does. That might be the case with H.
I donít think heís naive at all, at least not when it comes to this sort of thing. Harry may not have been academically bright, and heís led a sheltered life in many ways, but heís always been able to read people and emotions. He would have known very well that publicly trashing his family in such a way went waaay over the line. That would be true even for normal families - imagine your brother and his wife went to a big party and spent an hour describing your family to the guests in the same way Harry and Meghan described the BRF. Would there be any doubt about whether they knew how hurtful they were being? And thatís with you having the opportunity to vigorously and publicly defend yourself, an opportunity that Charles, William and the rest donít have.
  #1236  
Old 04-21-2021, 11:07 PM
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IA. Itís all terrible. I think cruel is a good word for it.

I just find it particularly egregious that HM and Philip were ever dragged into it.

Meghan is the one who brought the whole thing up. One reason I am so very cynical about her is this. She had to know HM and Philip would take a hit. And yet- it seems that now there are repeated reports about her closeness to them. Itís....interesting.
Terrible indeed...Itís heartbreaking that sheís had to go through all of this at her age, and now with her beloved Philip gone.

Good point about Meghan bringing it up, and...itís just so unfair anyway. Just because someone may have asked about the baby does not mean they are racist. Thatís pretty much the worse thing you can call someone. The snide, vague insinuations were awful in large part because they left it up to people to use their imaginations. No, they wanted to do this. If they cared about clearing the air, they would have done so in private; Harry would have written his father letters.
  #1237  
Old 04-21-2021, 11:22 PM
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I donít think heís naive at all, at least not when it comes to this sort of thing. Harry may not have been academically bright, and heís led a sheltered life in many ways, but heís always been able to read people and emotions. He would have known very well that publicly trashing his family in such a way went waaay over the line. That would be true even for normal families - imagine your brother and his wife went to a big party and spent an hour describing your family to the guests in the same way Harry and Meghan described the BRF. Would there be any doubt about whether they knew how hurtful they were being? And thatís with you having the opportunity to vigorously and publicly defend yourself, an opportunity that Charles, William and the rest donít have.

Good points....and thatís I guess why I said it was cruel. Maybe I was trying to give Harry the benefit of the doubt because I donít want to think that he could do that deliberately to hurt his father ...and his brother, but mostly his father. Harry never came off as mean to me, but since heís with Meghan, I do think that much of the harshness she has has rubbed off in him. No, Iím not laying this all at her feet - H is responsible for what he said- but IMO she has a hardness about her. She has often cut out people from her life, and now H has done the same.

I DO want Charles, William and Harry to reconcile, but that wonít be possible until H acknowledges what heís done. Charles and William, IMO, never set out to deliberately hurt H, but he actually set out to hurt them. I kind of hope that C and W just get on with things and donít worry so much about H. Iím so glad that C and W have grown much closer, that C obviously has a wonderful relationship with Kate and his grandchildren. It makes it just a little easier to bear
  #1238  
Old 04-21-2021, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Alisa View Post
Perhaps the latter. Charles and Camilla have traveled ahead multiple times in the past to far away locations for the tour and have stayed behind. I can't imagine them continuing to do it if there was public outcry.
If they want to see the family they can and will find away. They can fly to California or the family can travel to Washington
I feel that Harry and Meghan have to make the first step and travel to Washington if they want to meet with Charles. It's pretty obnoxious to ask Charles to make a visit after he was publicly trashed by his son. If Charles goes to California, the optics would be terrible, it would look like Charles indeed went to apologize. Meghan can't use the excuse of being pregnant, she did after all, travel to New York for the baby shower.
  #1239  
Old 04-22-2021, 02:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
I doubt HM was happy even after Harry clarified that he wasnít referring to she or Philip as being racist given that he made that accusation against the entire family, knowing people would assume it was Charles or William.
One thing about the Queen being on the throne for so very long and also for Philip being right by her side through it all is that these two people have mastered the art of never letting their displeasure with anyone show. That's true diplomacy. That's true class, grace and dignity. Something sorely missing these days with Harry and Meghan.

Then again, Philip did have a way with words didn't he?
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  #1240  
Old 04-22-2021, 02:26 AM
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So the [Sussexes] still can’t help themselves with regard to privacy by using their unofficial spokesthing Scobie to spread details of the visit to Windsor:


Meghan and Archie 'spoke to the Queen before Prince Philip's funeral'
https://mol.im/a/9496829

https://www.harpersbazaar.com/celebr...hilip-funeral/
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