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  #2181  
Old 05-07-2021, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
Meghan doesnt have a title. Harry was given one by his grandmother the Queen on his wedding day. By custom all wives married in the British Isles take their husbands styling and rank (if they want, and most do.)


Therefore the Duchess of Sussex is her legal name. Meghan Markle isnt. It was the professional name she used as an actress. She hasnt used it since she married. Nor would Meghan Mountbatten Windsor be strictly correct for a Duchess.


Meghan has every right to use her styling. If the couple using their titles in any of their endeavours was unacceptable to the Queen then she would have asked them not to (as she did with the HRHs) or moved to remove Harrys Dukedom, difficult though that might be. She hasnt.

I agree; Duchess of Sussex has every right to use the styling of her husband.
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  #2182  
Old 05-07-2021, 11:28 AM
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When you publish a book, fiction, especially, you're allowed a pen name. Like George R.R. Martin whose real name I can't even imagine. When you submit to various outlets, there is usually a line reserved for your pen name and some outlets only ask for your legal one when they have liked your work and want to sign a contract with you.



I don't know if The Duchess of Sussex is Meghan's legal name now but I know for sure that she was by no means obliged to use it. It was her choice, not her restrictive circumstances.She might be entitled to it but to me, the use of this title, name or whatever it is only points at awareness that should she decline to use it, if she chose plain Meghan Markle, Meghan Sussex or, heavens forbid, a pen name unrelated to her real life, the sales might not be what she would like. And yes, in my eyes it doesn't speal well of her to cling to The Duchess of Sussex for dear life after all her efforts to thrash the family, the institution, the Firm that gave it to her.


Or perhaps it was the editors' insistence to have the title splashed on the cover. The people they have worked with this far have been mostly insistent to showcase the royal connection.
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  #2183  
Old 05-07-2021, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moran View Post
When you publish a book, fiction, especially, you're allowed a pen name. Like George R.R. Martin whose real name I can't even imagine. When you submit to various outlets, there is usually a line reserved for your pen name and some outlets only ask for your legal one when they have liked your work and want to sign a contract with you.



I don't know if The Duchess of Sussex is Meghan's legal name now but I know for sure that she was by no means obliged to use it. It was her choice, not her restrictive circumstances.She might be entitled to it but to me, the use of this title, name or whatever it is only points at awareness that should she decline to use it, if she chose plain Meghan Markle, Meghan Sussex or, heavens forbid, a pen name unrelated to her real life, the sales might not be what she would like. And yes, in my eyes it doesn't speal well of her to cling to The Duchess of Sussex for dear life after all her efforts to thrash the family, the institution, the Firm that gave it to her.


Or perhaps it was the editors' insistence to have the title splashed on the cover. The people they have worked with this far have been mostly insistent to showcase the royal connection.
She has every right to use it and she did.
  #2184  
Old 05-07-2021, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Or perhaps it was the editors' insistence to have the title splashed on the cover. The people they have worked with this far have been mostly insistent to showcase the royal connection.
I think all parties involved want to use the titles. Harry didn't need to have PH,DOS splashed across his Chief Impact Officer info page on the website 7 times if he didn't want to. Once would have made it clear who he was. Likewise the announcement about Netflix and Spotify both used the titles as much as possible. We know that the Sussexes were upset that they couldn't use the word "royal" from their own mouths so *they* know where their value or interest actually lies so all parties want to use it as much as possible.
  #2185  
Old 05-07-2021, 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Fijiro View Post
She has every right to use it and she did.
Who said she doesn't have the right? I'm only saying it was exercizing of a right that didn't make her look good in my eyes and not a legality that she was forced to follow.


It was either her choice or the publishing house's. I know a thing or three about publishing and I'm stating with full conviction that people go for what sells within the legal boundaries.



Clearly someone thought that Meghan Markle wouldn't sell and a pen name even less, so they used the title given to her by the despicable RF. Once again, she was entitled to use the title. She isn't entitled to get only positive opinions from people for using the title.
  #2186  
Old 05-15-2021, 03:50 PM
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This thread will be re-opened after a clean-up and a well-needed break.

It is disappointing that some members seem incapable of being respectful towards one another when opinions differ.

It is a further disappointment that some members are unable to make references to the Duke and Duchess of Sussex without resorting to attacking them with inflammatory and often spiteful remarks and comments.

Such posts are not only unnecessary for a discussion or debate, but also an unreasonable way to react to the topic of the thread.

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  #2187  
Old 05-15-2021, 07:55 PM
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After listening to Harry's guest appearance on the Armchair Expert Podcast, I have to admit this is worse than the Oprah's interview. It's not just because of the timing (not long after Prince Philip's death), but also the content, where Harry appeared to be attacking Charles and The Queen's parenting skills. I'm not saying that royal family members are perfect parent, but I just think criticising their parenting skills in public is a terrible idea, given that they have tried to provide what is best for their children. Harry seem to not have learn from Charles's mistake on publicly criticising The Queen and Prince Philip's parenting skills, which impacted family relationship, especially between Philip and Charles.

It was very difficult for me to take Harry's word by word when he mentioned about compassion, given that he just recently throw his family under the bus in the Oprah's interview and just then the podcast. The same could be said about mental health, where he appeared to be unaware about the impact of "airing family's dirty laundry" on their mental well-being, especially not long after Prince Philip's passing.

For me, the revelation that Harry wanted to leave as working royals in his 20s just added more questions or even confusion. Yes, I know this has been touched on before, but I think it's interesting that Harry openly said it by himself in hindsight. If Harry really wanted to leave (as working royal) even after strong persuasion from his family, would he had a lavish public wedding? Would he received The Duke of Sussex title upon marriage? Would he still remain in the UK? Would Meghan be allow to continue her acting career? Would the changes to Archie and his sister's future title or even just Letter Patent happen earlier (rather than "up in the air" as of now)?

There are so many things in that podcast that I have issues with, but I'm afraid that I cannot expressed them articulately and concisely. Here is the link to the Armchair Expert podcast:

Prince Harry
Prince Harry, Duke of Sussex, is a member of the British royal family. Prince Harry joins the Armchair Expert to discuss how to approach mental health issues, growing up with privilege, and how healing it is to perform a service for someone. Harry discusses how much like the Truman Show his life is, unconscious bias, and how people can change their mindset once they acknowledge it. Harry talks about his time in the military service, how it opened his eyes to the trauma people face around the world, and how much more important mental health is than physical health.
https://armchairexpertpod.com/pods/prince-harry
  #2188  
Old 05-15-2021, 08:58 PM
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AC, I could agree more. I got blowback on Twitter from Sussex stans who said that Harry never called Charles a bad parent. Even respected historian Marlene Koenig states this. He didnt have to say those exact words. Break the cycle of genetic pain and suffering? Making sure that what happened to him doesnt happen to his children? That Charles treated him as hed been treated? Feeling like he had to escape ? No time ever would have been good, but while his father is still deeply mourning his own father? While his grandmother is grieving for the man she loved for 70 plus years? Its the height of cruelty.

Reports are that Harry was rather happy by the response to this interview (from American fans, I suppose). Well, buckle up because aside from the updated Finding Freedom, Angela Levin claims that Harry and Meghan are making a tell-all documentary that even includes videotaped conversations. If this is true, I dont see any way back, ever.....At some point, H is going to go too far - and this goes beyond his familys reactions. I have to believe that at some point people are going to wonder when public therapy becomes bitter revenge.



Quote:
Prince Harry and Meghan Markle are in the process of making a new tell-all documentary, according to the Duke of Sussex's own biographer. Angela Levin told talkRADIO that there was "a lot more to come" in terms of disclosures from the couple about royal life. She said that there was "another documentary in the making" where the couple "go into detail about how terrible certain things were".

....

She continued: "I think there is another documentary in the making where they will have taken films of various rooms and maybe even of various conversations.

"They can then go detail by detail about how terrible certain things were. I'm waiting for that one.

I think it will be yet another nail in the coffin of his relationship to his father and his brother. They can't trust him anymore."
https://www.express.co.uk/news/royal...latest-news-vn
  #2189  
Old 05-15-2021, 09:11 PM
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Wax on, Wax off

Nope. It's not the Karate Kid here. Harry and Meghan have relocated. Their wax figures have been moved to Madame Tussauds' 'party zone'.

"In 2020, the pair's statues were moved away from Queen Elizabeth and the rest of Britain's royal family following their decision to step down from official duties. Now, more than a year later, the museum has announced that they have a glitzier permanent home: the "Awards Party" zone."

https://www.cnn.com/style/article/me...uds/index.html

As far as the recent podcast, the words "Armchair Experts" tells me everything I need to know and that was that it was something I couldn't wrap my head around.
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  #2190  
Old 05-15-2021, 09:15 PM
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I get it when people feel they have to get completely away from their toxic families due to abuse, and I don't know what Harry's life was like inside palace walls, but I have a hard time believing things were so bad it warrants this level of vitriol.

I mean, this is a burn all the bridges, salt the earth, crossing the Rubicon level of rage. And once it's done, will it be enough? Will his anger be resolved? It won't make his mother come back, it won't solve the problems he faced as a child, and it won't make his life perfect now.

Harry and Meghan really, REALLY need to rethink this.
  #2191  
Old 05-15-2021, 09:16 PM
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I think Katie makes good points...

Quote:
"I think it's inevitable that every time Harry speaks out about personal family relationships, it is going to be damaging to the healing of this rift, particularly between William and Harry," she says. "I think there is a desire on the part of both of the brothers to move on, to try and heal this relationship. The problem is, when Harry sits down and gives a really personal interview like this... it really does set back that healing process."

....

"... I think there's a feeling over here in the U.K [that] no one has a problem with Prince Harry talking about mental health. I think most people think it's an important campaign [and that] raising awareness about it can only be a good thing... but a lot of people here think Prince Harry has overstepped a mark in talking so personally about his father, and his relationship with his father, in what most people have interpreted to be quite a critical way."

Nicholl adds that the perception of Harry's comments is different in the U.K. and the U.S. "I think certainly stateside there is a lot more sympathy for Prince Harry than there is here over in the U.K.," she says.

While it's unclear if Harry has spoken to members of the royal family since the podcast aired, Nicholl believes that the duke's comments may slow the progress of any reconciliation.

"I think it goes without saying that clearly some of the things that he has raised in this podcast have been hurtful to the royal family, I think particularly for the queen and Prince Charles, who are very private when it comes to their personal emotions," Nicholl says. "This idea of Harry venting, airing publicly, his private grievances is going to be problematic."
https://www.etonline.com/how-the-roy...o-royal-expert
  #2192  
Old 05-15-2021, 09:21 PM
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I listened to the podcast in full and encourage others to do so.

For me the biggest takeaway from this interview was that we can understand that whatever Harry says during his interviews, podcasts, promotions, whatever, it is not grounded in truth or even "his truth," it is grounded in whatever he needs to say to suit the message of whatever program he's on/ whatever he is trying to get across personally or for his next project. I think it is unfair to jump on everything this couple says to prove they are "lying" because no one remembers everything from their own past perfectly and recollections differ with time, but it is clear between this and the Oprah interview that Harry is telling stories to suit "the moment" and banking on the (true) hope that most people have not "followed" him long enough to realize it.

This was the most bizarre moment for me:

Dax: "What was the moment for you that led you to therapy- what was your 'moment at the bar'?"

Harry: "It was" (pausing to think) "A conversation I had with my now wife. And she saw it, she saw it straight away. She could tell that I was hurting...."

[I cannot be the only one who was stunned when this came out of his mouth.]

And in response to encouraging others to enter therapy: "Rule No. 1 is that when you actually want or feel as though someone needs help, telling them to their face you need help is probably the best way for them to go uhhh no, no I dont."

Yet in 2017, Harry bravely and famously said that he sought therapy not only at the urging of his brother, but because his brother employed the exact method described above- repeatedly told him to his face that he needed help, something was not right, and would not take no for an answer.

So while it may be well be true that Meghan helped Harry to realize that he had particular issues to work through in therapy and urged him to do so (I applaud her for this), it is completely untrue that a "conversation with his wife" was the lightbulb moment that made him realize he needed therapy. According to him, he had successfully undergone years of therapy already due to being "told to his face" by the brother he has recently described in quite unfavorable terms. I daresay this would not have "sold" quite as well as a soundbite.

There are many other things to unpack from this podcast, but I think it all boils down to the above. I am guessing these inconsistencies come down to being on message/ on brand for his upcoming program with Oprah, and the stories will change again when necessary. (Although they may not, because he now has a massively larger audience watching that would notice.)

I will add only this: The conversation was flowing very naturally about something utterly unrelated when the co-host frog-horned in: "Let's talk about parenting really quickly." The setup was so obvious I might have physically cringed. Things like this are why I encourage everyone to listen to the full thing. In answering about the now quoted-round-the-world genetic trauma, Harry slipped in that he discusses this "at length" in his upcoming programming with Oprah. It changed my perspective on his answer to know that the entire thing was part of a teed-up response for the program.
  #2193  
Old 05-15-2021, 09:26 PM
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Harry said very little about his grandparents parenting that hasnt been said before by his father. I think Harry was speaking within Mental Health Week about how disfunction within families can occur generation after generation and that sometimes that cycle just has to be stopped by going away, trying a different way of parenting, of family life that isnt led in a system that can be inimical to relationships.
  #2194  
Old 05-15-2021, 09:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighGoalHighDreams View Post
I listened to the podcast in full and encourage others to do so.

For me the biggest takeaway from this interview was that we can understand that whatever Harry says during his interviews, podcasts, promotions, whatever, it is not grounded in truth or even "his truth," it is grounded in whatever he needs to say to suit the message of whatever program he's on/ whatever he is trying to get across personally or for his next project. I think it is unfair to jump on everything this couple says to prove they are "lying" because no one remembers everything from their own past perfectly and recollections differ with time, but it is clear between this and the Oprah interview that Harry is telling stories to suit "the moment" and banking on the (true) hope that most people have not "followed" him long enough to realize it.

This was the most bizarre moment for me:

Dax: "What was the moment for you that led you to therapy- what was your 'moment at the bar'?"

Harry: "It was" (pausing to think) "A conversation I had with my now wife. And she saw it, she saw it straight away. She could tell that I was hurting...."

[I cannot be the only one who was stunned when this came out of his mouth.]

I agree with this post.

It's heartbreaking that his personal feelings about his family are his new currency in Hollywood and the media. I think that BP will take a long view and wait it out until interest in him wanes, the money dries up, and he can't come up with any more content. His only content now is therapy-speak and support for his wife's hectoring about compassion communities and lenses.
  #2195  
Old 05-15-2021, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leopoldine View Post
I agree with this post.

It's heartbreaking that his personal feelings about his family are his new currency in Hollywood and the media. I think that BP will take a long view and wait it out until interest in him wanes, the money dries up, and he can't come up with any more content. His only content now is therapy-speak and support for his wife's hectoring about compassion communities and lenses.
That's all they really can do at this point, apart from ending all personal contact. If the Angela Levin report is true and Harry & Meghan really are planning a tell-all with video from "behind the palace walls" and even some conversations, they're going to eventually have nothing left to reveal. Assuming BP is able to ride out the storm, they'll endure and interest in the Sussex branch will wane, even from Hollywood & the media. They're using the Sussexes to make money and I doubt much of it will find its way to the Sussex bank accounts in the end.
  #2196  
Old 05-15-2021, 10:19 PM
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Angela Levin hasn’t spoken to Harry since 2018 when she wrote a biography of him, and has been an unceasing critic of Meghan since she married Harry. I doubt very very much that Levin has any inside information about what sort of broadcasts the Sussexes will be doing next.

In this article Harry talks about William telling him to seek therapy years ago when he felt bad before public engagements. Nowhere here does Harry state that his brother ‘repeatedly and to his face’ told him to seek therapy. He says in quotes that William ‘and others encouraged him to ‘seek help, saying what you are feeling is not right’. That’s hardly telling him repeatedly to his face.


https://www.vanityfair.com/style/201...ss-diana-death


We don’t know whether Harry did seek therapy on that occasion, or if he did that it lasted long enough. Meghan must have picked up on the unresolved issues.
  #2197  
Old 05-15-2021, 10:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighGoalHighDreams View Post
I listened to the podcast in full and encourage others to do so.

For me the biggest takeaway from this interview was that we can understand that whatever Harry says during his interviews, podcasts, promotions, whatever, it is not grounded in truth or even "his truth," it is grounded in whatever he needs to say to suit the message of whatever program he's on/ whatever he is trying to get across personally or for his next project. I think it is unfair to jump on everything this couple says to prove they are "lying" because no one remembers everything from their own past perfectly and recollections differ with time, but it is clear between this and the Oprah interview that Harry is telling stories to suit "the moment" and banking on the (true) hope that most people have not "followed" him long enough to realize it.

This was the most bizarre moment for me:

Dax: "What was the moment for you that led you to therapy- what was your 'moment at the bar'?"

Harry: "It was" (pausing to think) "A conversation I had with my now wife. And she saw it, she saw it straight away. She could tell that I was hurting...."

[I cannot be the only one who was stunned when this came out of his mouth.]

And in response to encouraging others to enter therapy: "Rule No. 1 is that when you actually want or feel as though someone needs help, telling them to their face you need help is probably the best way for them to go uhhh no, no I dont."

Yet in 2017, Harry bravely and famously said that he sought therapy not only at the urging of his brother, but because his brother employed the exact method described above- repeatedly told him to his face that he needed help, something was not right, and would not take no for an answer.

So while it may be well be true that Meghan helped Harry to realize that he had particular issues to work through in therapy and urged him to do so (I applaud her for this), it is completely untrue that a "conversation with his wife" was the lightbulb moment that made him realize he needed therapy. According to him, he had successfully undergone years of therapy already due to being "told to his face" by the brother he has recently described in quite unfavorable terms. I daresay this would not have "sold" quite as well as a soundbite.

There are many other things to unpack from this podcast, but I think it all boils down to the above. I am guessing these inconsistencies come down to being on message/ on brand for his upcoming program with Oprah, and the stories will change again when necessary. (Although they may not, because he now has a massively larger audience watching that would notice.)

I will add only this: The conversation was flowing very naturally about something utterly unrelated when the co-host frog-horned in: "Let's talk about parenting really quickly." The setup was so obvious I might have physically cringed. Things like this are why I encourage everyone to listen to the full thing. In answering about the now quoted-round-the-world genetic trauma, Harry slipped in that he discusses this "at length" in his upcoming programming with Oprah. It changed my perspective on his answer to know that the entire thing was part of a teed-up response for the program.
Its marketing, but its backed up by a good deal of genuine bitterness and instability.

The problem is this mess of a man is being held up by some as an example of a person who has successfully learned to manage mental health issues.

Harry can afford to do all the wrong things for a great deal longer than the average person. Hes not doing himself any favours in the long run, but hes always going to be cushioned from the most severe potential consequences faced by mentally vulnerable people who dont have his resources. Its not like Archie will wind up in foster care even if his father crashes and burns ten times over. For other people who dont have financial security, supportive friends and a stable family waiting in the wings it can get that bad and worse.

Its not surprising that Oprah is involved in trying to turn Harrys problematic behaviours into some evidence of wisdom or even authority - this is the woman who gave the world Dr. Phil, after all. But it is unfortunate that there are people out there who may get hurt as a result.
  #2198  
Old 05-15-2021, 11:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
In this article Harry talks about William telling him to seek therapy years ago when he felt bad before public engagements. Nowhere here does Harry state that his brother ‘repeatedly and to his face told him to seek therapy. He says in quotes that William ‘and others encouraged him to ‘seek help, saying what you are feeling is not right’. That’s hardly telling him repeatedly to his face.


https://www.vanityfair.com/style/201...ss-diana-death


We don’t know whether Harry did seek therapy on that occasion, or if he did that it lasted long enough. Meghan must have picked up on the unresolved issues.
Here’s a longer quote where he talks about William telling him to seek help and also a quote about how the therapy changed his life.

Quote:
He turned to counseling upon the advice of his brother, Prince William. "It's all about timing. And for me personally, my brother, you know, bless him, he was a huge support to me. He kept saying, 'this is not right, this is not normal, you need to talk to [someone] about stuff, it's OK,'" he said.

"Because of the process I have been through over the past two and a half years, I've now been able to take my work seriously, been able to take my private life seriously as well, and been able to put blood, sweat and tears into the things that really make a difference and things that I think will make a difference to everybody else."

Source
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  #2199  
Old 05-15-2021, 11:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighGoalHighDreams View Post
I listened to the podcast in full and encourage others to do so.

For me the biggest takeaway from this interview was that we can understand that whatever Harry says during his interviews, podcasts, promotions, whatever, it is not grounded in truth or even "his truth," it is grounded in whatever he needs to say to suit the message of whatever program he's on/ whatever he is trying to get across personally or for his next project. I think it is unfair to jump on everything this couple says to prove they are "lying" because no one remembers everything from their own past perfectly and recollections differ with time, but it is clear between this and the Oprah interview that Harry is telling stories to suit "the moment" and banking on the (true) hope that most people have not "followed" him long enough to realize it.

This was the most bizarre moment for me:

Dax: "What was the moment for you that led you to therapy- what was your 'moment at the bar'?"

Harry: "It was" (pausing to think) "A conversation I had with my now wife. And she saw it, she saw it straight away. She could tell that I was hurting...."

[I cannot be the only one who was stunned when this came out of his mouth.]

And in response to encouraging others to enter therapy: "Rule No. 1 is that when you actually want or feel as though someone needs help, telling them to their face you need help is probably the best way for them to go uhhh no, no I dont."

Yet in 2017, Harry bravely and famously said that he sought therapy not only at the urging of his brother, but because his brother employed the exact method described above- repeatedly told him to his face that he needed help, something was not right, and would not take no for an answer.

So while it may be well be true that Meghan helped Harry to realize that he had particular issues to work through in therapy and urged him to do so (I applaud her for this), it is completely untrue that a "conversation with his wife" was the lightbulb moment that made him realize he needed therapy. According to him, he had successfully undergone years of therapy already due to being "told to his face" by the brother he has recently described in quite unfavorable terms. I daresay this would not have "sold" quite as well as a soundbite.

There are many other things to unpack from this podcast, but I think it all boils down to the above. I am guessing these inconsistencies come down to being on message/ on brand for his upcoming program with Oprah, and the stories will change again when necessary. (Although they may not, because he now has a massively larger audience watching that would notice.)

I will add only this: The conversation was flowing very naturally about something utterly unrelated when the co-host frog-horned in: "Let's talk about parenting really quickly." The setup was so obvious I might have physically cringed. Things like this are why I encourage everyone to listen to the full thing. In answering about the now quoted-round-the-world genetic trauma, Harry slipped in that he discusses this "at length" in his upcoming programming with Oprah. It changed my perspective on his answer to know that the entire thing was part of a teed-up response for the program.
Is he saying that Meghan encouraged him to successfully seek therapy but yet they were not able to get therapy when she was suicidal? Wouldnt Harry have just gotten in touch which his therapist and told them about his wifes struggles? Or was that just another lie the told Oprah?
  #2200  
Old 05-15-2021, 11:37 PM
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The Duke & Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 4: April 2021 -

Quote:
Originally Posted by camelot23ca View Post
Its marketing, but its backed up by a good deal of genuine bitterness and instability.



The problem is this mess of a man is being held up by some as an example of a person who has successfully learned to manage mental health issues.

Agreed.

Ive found that problematic too. Harry is not- to me- a success story. Thats not how hes coming across publicly anyway IMO. If he was- we wouldnt be hearing him lash out repeatedly IMO.

There are ways to talk about not repeating past mistakes- and William is a good example of someone who has done it- without being hurtful and bringing up past pain so directly. Unless- of course- thats part of the goal.
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The Duke & Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 3: March - April 2021 Jacknch Current Events Archive 2203 04-06-2021 12:08 PM




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