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  #541  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poppy7 View Post
Nobody cared. Nobody really cares. That point has been a non issue in the UK. Feeling now is the less members to pay for the better.

I mean Meghan being appalled that she was asked if she wanted to keep working because theybdidnt have money for her was another one. I actually think that was incredibly modern of them. Why shouldn't a self made woman keep on working. All the men did. I actually think that was pretty progressive of them. Acting wasn't a political job that could have brought issues to the family.

Meghan may have been much much happier
She would definitely get plushy roles as a senior royal member, as opposed to now, an ex-royal.
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  #542  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:30 PM
Gentry
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by US Royal Watcher View Post
Given the fact that the monarchy is favored by a majority of Britons and the Queen and William enjoy high popularity ratings, I don't think it matters. The monarchy consists of human beings who are always under a microscope - there is always going to be some drama. As long as the British people - who are represented by the monarchy support it, it will survive.
I said that at the beginning but nobody noticed. This started out as a fun way to play Devil's Advocate for me. An intellectual exercise with socialization in my own isolation. My only stated opinion that the Title controversy in regard to race could have been avoided easily. Somehow that's twisted into something else. Maybe it was a bad idea to give my thoughts a way out.
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  #543  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrissyM View Post
That's hardly a fact.
But certainly unlikely unless you can think of a reasonable scenario that would be acceptable to all involved including the public for them to return.
  #544  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrissyM View Post
I said that at the beginning but nobody noticed. This started out as a fun way to play Devil's Advocate for me. An intellectual exercise with socialization in my own isolation. My only stated opinion that the Title controversy in regard to race could have been avoided easily. Somehow that's twisted into something else. Maybe it was a bad idea to give my thoughts a way out.
Please grant me that it is a little difficult to keep track of what each person has said over the past few days - this is been a very active thread. It would be a very boring board if we all agreed, so I enjoy reading everyone's comments. None of this is life and death.
  #545  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:37 PM
Gentry
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texankitcat View Post
But certainly unlikely unless you can think of a reasonable scenario that would be acceptable to all involved including the public for them to return.
I'm a writer, there's very little I can't come up with.
  #546  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:39 PM
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Originally Posted by texankitcat View Post
Itís difficult to make the argument that Harry is as ignorant as Meghan pretends to be since he was born into it and raised within its protocols, rules and history. There is just no way he doesnít know how things work and there is no way she is truly ignorant since these rules either considering the special team that was put in place to educate her on all areas of being a Royal duchess.

As for why Harry allowed these deceptions could only be for two reasons. The first is they discussed and planned the deceptions together for maximum dramatic affect and sympathy for the American audience who wouldnít question or know anything about how the Monarchy works or this was Meghanís doing and Harry was afraid to contradict her in order to keep her happy. Either way, Harryís complicity in these deceptions is inexcusable.
I still wonder what they were trying to achieve with the interview, did they expect, Dr. Biden, to call HM and ask Her Majesty to give Archie a title?
  #547  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrissyM View Post
However, would the risks be equal. In my own one-light town people are willing to start trouble with interracial couples. (despicable but true) it only takes one crazy on the either side of the racial divide to do something awful. IMO security worries are very real worldwide.
And yet all these other interracial couples manage to get on with their lives without their children having an HRH styling.
  #548  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:40 PM
Gentry
 
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The 'order of things' in the BRF is not immutable.

If it was, surely Camilla would be known as HRH The Princess of Wales? :)
  #549  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Queen Ester View Post
But that's not how the Monarchy works, there is an order to things and it can't be changed just because Archie is bi-racial
Yes it can change, if it didn't it would still be the same as it was during Alfred the Great's time. Or I could be boiled alive like in Henry VIIIth's England. The argument that "it can't be changed" is totally invalid.
  #550  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sionevar View Post
The 'order of things' in the BRF is not immutable.

If it was, surely Camilla would be known as HRH The Princess of Wales? :)
It's not immutable but Camilla is the "Princess of Wales", she voluntarily doesn't use the title. Edward and Sophie's children are eligible to be HRHs but don't use it. That is different than not giving a title to a person who is currently ineligible.
  #551  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:46 PM
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Why? To be the center of attention for their brand/media projects and make a lot of money and get back at his family cause they did not get their way.
  #552  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sionevar View Post
The 'order of things' in the BRF is not immutable.

If it was, surely Camilla would be known as HRH The Princess of Wales? :)
The thing with Camilla is that she *is* actually The Princess of Wales. She had the choice to be known as The Duchess of Cornwall as that is also the feminine version of one of Charles' titles along with Prince of Wales. It could be said that Camilla chose to use Charles' *oldest* title. When Camilla is in Scotland, she is known as The Duchess of Rothesay.
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  #553  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrissyM View Post
I'm a writer, there's very little I can't come up with.
Fair enough! However, even the most talented writer canít fix this mess.
  #554  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrissyM View Post
I said that at the beginning but nobody noticed. This started out as a fun way to play Devil's Advocate for me. An intellectual exercise with socialization in my own isolation. My only stated opinion that the Title controversy in regard to race could have been avoided easily. Somehow that's twisted into something else. Maybe it was a bad idea to give my thoughts a way out.
I get where you started with this but I also think that your fictional scenario/devil's advocate argument would have more merit if they were politicians or this was just some messy entertainment industry family, not a literal monarchy, since you can pivot to the popular optics quite quickly to appease an audience. That the LPs exist make a devils advocate argument seem pretty absurd since, literally, the whole manufactured controversy is quite foolish and easily disproven by their existence.
  #555  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sionevar View Post
The 'order of things' in the BRF is not immutable.

If it was, surely Camilla would be known as HRH The Princess of Wales? :)
I seem to remember a discussion about this very topic, and the consensus was that Camilla herself did not want to be the Princess of Wales, as it would attract unnecessary parallels with Diana
  #556  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrissyM View Post
Forgive me, but I already knew and understood the LP's I'm not ignorant of the facts. I mentioned this before. Repeating them isn't educating me at all. It's not that I meant to be rude. But, Tatiana Maria missed the entire point of my imaginary scenario. In it I acknowledged that the current LP's don't discriminate on Ethnicity.
I apologize for misunderstanding you. I think I am unclear on the point that you, as the Queen's hypothetical advisor, were making with the comment which I highlighted and responded to in my last post:

Quote:
Originally Posted by KrissyM View Post
Okay this is my first real 'opinion' rather than just playing devil's advocate. Putting on my CJ Cregg hat, if I was an advisor, the minute I heard The Sussex's were expecting I'd sit down with the Queen and this would be the scene...

"Ma'am, I strongly urge you to re-write the LP's to say that starting from this birth all Great-grandchildren on the Monarch are automatically granted HRH unless specifically refused by their parents,"

"Why?" Her Majesty would reasonably ask.

"Ma'am, if you don't, someone, somewhere could and likely would say that this child isn't given it because of his ethnic makeup."

Possibly Her Majesty would say "But that's untrue, and ridiculous. The rules were made in 1917."

"That's correct ma'am. However, in 1917 people of color were lynched in the US and couldn't even use the same lavatory until the late 60's.
Someone will bring it up, and the only way not to have a horse in that race, is to cancel the race. This is the world we live in now."

Quote:
Originally Posted by AC21091968 View Post
Tatiana Maria just gave you a very comprehensive and detailed response with evidence that Royal Titles are not based on race (but rather on gender). You come across very badly and rude here by not even acknowledging her contribution, but rather dismissing it simply because it does not reflect your (or even Meghan's) perspective.
No worries, I did not interpret KrissyM's response as dismissive and I don't believe it was intended as such. But thank you for your considerateness.
  #557  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:54 PM
Gentry
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texankitcat View Post
Fair enough! However, even the most talented writer canít fix this mess.
Oh I can think of quite few who could. Not myself probably but Megan Whalen-Turner could easily.
  #558  
Old 03-14-2021, 08:59 PM
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I fail to see why Meghan wants her son to have HRH "now"? Why are they demanding things after they stopped being working royals by their own volution? And what is going on with this biracial talk? As far as I can see, HRH Prince was not given to Archie because he is not the grandson of a monarch, yet...not because of his heritage...


As for the Monarchy. Of course, it adapts with time, many other Monarchies have adapted in order to survive, for example, Sweden and the change of succession rights to allow females to inherit the throne. But it adapts along with the society, and not because of one single person.
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  #559  
Old 03-14-2021, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KrissyM View Post
Yes it can change, if it didn't it would still be the same as it was during Alfred the Great's time. Or I could be boiled alive like in Henry VIIIth's England. The argument that "it can't be changed" is totally invalid.
The fact is that the Queen issued letters patent to amend and update the titles of the children of an heir to the throne. That came about because the *law* was changed by Parliament on the sex of an heir to the throne. The key words in this scenario are *heirs*. There has been an Act of Succession to the Crown in the UK since 1701. It's just been amended in 2013.

Just as another tidbit that keeps coming up with Harry and Meghan should have their peerage titles stripped. The Queen can't just decide she doesn't like the Sussexes anymore and take those away. It required an Act of Parliament to do that and the *only* reason it's ever been done before in the UK is for treason. If Parliament stripped Harry of his peerage title because he flew the coop to the US and gave a disastrous interview, it'd open a can of worms and the same would have to be done for Andrew because he behaved badly and also had a very disastrous interview. Only Harry would be stripped of a ducal title. Meghan has the courtesy of using the feminine form of that title because she is married to him. Actually, I noticed in the letter sent to the school recently from Meghan, I noticed that she signed that letter "Meghan, Duchess of Sussex". According to the way titles and styles work in the UK, Meghan signed that letter denoting that she was divorced from Harry. That's why you see Diana, Princess of Wales or Sarah, Duchess of York. The courtesy title they have denoted that that they *once* were married to the person that actually holds the title.

When changes are made to our US Constitution it affects *every* American and not just one person or one group of people. This is how things should be seen when it comes to the monarchy and it's titles and styles and rules and regulations.
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  #560  
Old 03-14-2021, 09:02 PM
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A Newsweek article on various security issues ref Harry and Meghan and also Andrew. Iíd forgotten that the Queen stepped in to pay for his security when the Home Office recommended a lessening of it.

https://www.newsweek.com/how-meghan-...ndrews-1574435
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