The Duke and Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 1: September-December 2020

[Claire]

I have wondered that myself to be honest. Time will tell.
Nothing to do with the British public, Charles he can do what he wants. It will of course be spanned for PR benefits on both sides.

 

[Alison H]

It's very unseemly that an argument should have broken out over Remembrance Sunday, of all things. I think the last time this happened was in 1981, when Michael Foot, the then leader of the Opposition, turned up at the Cenotaph in a scruffy old coat instead of being respectfully dressed. That was nearly 40 years ago. Everyone else - Royals, politicians, religious leaders, other dignitaries - knows that this is not time for making personal points or airing personal differences.


I'm sure that Harry genuinely wanted to pay his respects, but doing it in this publicity-seeking way is not at all appropriate. And presumably the story about his request to have a wreath laid in Whitehall being denied was leaked to the press by him, because I can't see that it would have been leaked by anyone at this end.

 

[Hallo girl]

I just reread this thread and it is just hilarious.
Even when the couple does what their critics suggest they are criticized.

The more I think of it the more genius of a move this was.
It now looks simply vindictive of BP to decide not to honor the Duke's request to lay a wreath on his behalf given his longstand support for veterans and he himself being one. But even so had they done that, I'm sure the couple's detractors would be asking why they didn't do something in honor of the day.

So Harry did a most honorable gesture by observing the Remembrance Sunday where he was located. He covered bases by honoring servicemen of the commonwealth and at a location that had ties to Meghan's grandfather's service.
Well done Harry & Meghan!

That is interesting that there is a link to Meghan relatives.

 

[Betsypaige]

In all online publication, they credit the photos to Lee Morgan/PA.
According to his website, he's a Afro-American/Brazilian professional photographer specializes in fashion and celebrity portraiture, currently residing LA and his client list include Vogue.

So yes, it can be confirmed that it's not paps photo.

I can completely understand why the palace refused their request. The Queen hold the Remembrance Services as sacrosanct. Everything from divorces, family arguments and everything in between was placed on hold or told to be moved aside for Remembrance Day by order.
Harry knows this - so his actions show very bad judgement. I simply do not know what he was hoping for. Personal I think the rejection was what was wanted and expected.

I have been told by a number of people that Harry simply needs to wait around. Prince Charles has promised to give him his half half royal life as soon as he is King. All he has to do is wait. But H& M are worried about his popularity and reputation at the moment so I expect more PR like this so that it can be used later.

What people ? People in the know? I’m skeptical ..but if it’s true, that’s a mistake.

 

[Claire]

The people been members of the royal rota, including TV royal correspondents. Like I said - time will tell. There must be a reason why some feel this way, or they might be speculating just as we do.

 

[Hallo girl]

I have wondered that myself to be honest. Time will tell.
Nothing to do with the British public, Charles he can do what he wants. It will of course be spanned for PR benefits on both sides.

I have a different view on it being nothing to do with the British people. I would also like to put in a reminder the posters were saying on the forums that they left because it had been made clear there was no place for them, no role for them to play, so they left. The photo of the 4 had been the last straw etc etc, yet here we are now saying Charles has asked them to wait and they will get back.

 

[Hallo girl]

The people been members of the royal rota, including TV royal correspondents. Like I said - time will tell. There must be a reason why some feel this way, or they might be speculating just as we do.

These are the same people that get roasted on here for their articles in the tabloids or Twitter feeds. The clickbait that posters love to talk about.

Going by Kate's face at the commonwealth servjce if she has a say in it there will be no chance

 

[RoyalNight]

These two...
IMO a photo of a wreath they laid on the 11th with couple meainingful words would be much better. Or a grand gesture - donation or sth to organisation working with vetetans. Or buying flowers for the graves and helping local florists.
They could also go, pay respects privately and say nothing. Or, when questioned, say they did "celebrate" the day in this or that way.
It was never about being private individuals, it was about having their own royal family.

 

[QueenMathilde]

It's weird they dressed formally and staged their own "Remembrance Day" photo shoot especially considering Veteran's Day in the US is on a different day. If they wanted to honor vets why not volunteer on Veteran's Day to work at an organization serving them? That would have been better.

 

[Denville]

I would like to know the source for Charles giving him what they want once he is king. Nobody else has mentioned that, if so they should be lying low not aggravating people.
The British public might have another opinion on that.

I find it hard to beleive that Charles woudl be any more willing than the queen was to allow them to be half in and half out. He might be willing ot allow some flexibility but I think that money making activities and living abroad for long periods would be out. If he DID want to hold on to them.. because he needs them as royal workers, he would harldy want them to be causing controversy, in their "free" periods, and the way they've behaved in the past year shows that he CANT rely on them to err on the side of caution and to put the monarchy before their own wishes. The more they do these kinds of things, the more the public will turn against them and the message Ch will get form the public is "even if you feel you need these two as workers, do wihtout them - we dont want to see them..."

 

[Denville]

I have wondered that myself to be honest. Time will tell.
Nothing to do with the British public, Charles he can do what he wants. It will of course be spanned for PR benefits on both sides.

he certainly can't "do what he wants". Charles is the servant of hte public and he has to do what's best for the monarchy.. which is there to serve and represent the British public.

 

[Hallo girl]

You are correct Denville, it has been claimed in the past that it was Charles and William that pushed them out and influenced the queen accordingly now the comments are that Charles wants them back once the queen is gone . I give up.

 

[Denville]

You are correct Denville, it has been claimed in the past that it was Charles and William that pushed them out and influenced the queen accordingly now the comments are that Charles wants them back once the queen is gone . I give up.

I dont think that they had to "push" the queen. I think she didn't want Harry to go, and she mgiht have agreed to a bit of flexibility too, in order to hold ont him....but H and Meghan seem to have clearly intended to lean towards the "Money making and "living in America" side of any half in half out arrangement.
I think it was very clear that when they asked to be half in and half out, it was because they wanted to hold onto royal status and a bit of royal work in order to promote themselves and as security in case the money making side of life didn't go too well. I am sure that the queen, William and Charles were all in agreement that they didn't want Harry and Meg to leave or to do the half in and half out but they were firm in their saying that he had to choose, and they probably expressed how disappointed they were that he had chosen this lifestyle over the one he had committed to, what they'd see as the path of royal duty.
In short I dont think there was any fundamental disagreement among the 3 Will, Charles and the queen, on what their answer to Harry must be....and i dont think that will change...

 

[yukari]

So someone on twitter has made a note about the wreath laid by the royals from David Dimbleby's commentary during the Remembrance Sunday ceremony.

Prince Charles
The Monarch's Wreath (not Elizabeth Windsor's wreath)
Prince of Wales Wreath (not Prince Charles' wreath)

Capt of the Intelligence Corps (on behalf of Prince Phillip)
Consort Wreath (not Prince Phillip's nor Duke of Edinburgh's wreath)

(Monarch/Soverign, Consort and Prince of Wales counted as a specified role within the Monarchy. The three represent the nation)

Prince William
Royal Air Force Wreath (not Duke of Cambridge's wreath)

Prince Edward
Royal Wessex Yeomanry Wreath (not Earl of Wessex' wreath)

Princess Anne
The Royal Navy Wreath (not Princess Royal's wreath)

Prince Edward of Kent
The Field Marshall Wreath (not Duke of Kent's wreath)

None of the above are personal wreath. The royals laid the wreaths on behalf of those institution, they were representing them.

I wonder, if the story of rejected wreath is true, whose wreath was it that was supposed to be laid "on behalf of Harry"? The Duke of Sussex' Wreath?

 

[Denville]

So someone on twitter has made a note about the wreath laid by the royals from David Dimbleby's commentary during the Remembrance Sunday ceremony.

Prince Charles
The Monarch's Wreath (not Elizabeth Windsor's wreath)
Prince of Wales Wreath (not Prince Charles' wreath)

Capt of the Intelligence Corps (on behalf of Prince Phillip)
Consort Wreath (not Prince Phillip's nor Duke of Edinburgh's wreath)

(Monarch/Soverign, Consort and Prince of Wales counted as a specified role within the Monarchy. The three represent the nation)

Prince William
Royal Air Force Wreath (not Duke of Cambridge's wreath)

Prince Edward
Royal Wessex Yeomanry Wreath (not Earl of Wessex' wreath)

Princess Anne
The Royal Navy Wreath (not Princess Royal's wreath)

Prince Edward of Kent
The Field Marshall Wreath (not Duke of Kent's wreath)

None of the above are personal wreath. The royals laid the wreaths on behalf of those institution, they were representing them.

I wonder, if the story of rejected wreath is true, whose wreath was it that was supposed to be laid "on behalf of Harry"? The Duke of Sussex' Wreath?

I think if he had ASked if a personal wreath from him could have been laid perhaps on the 11th, but privately, that would have been OK.. He is an ex serviceman and I dont think it would be unacceptable or improper for him to have some gesture made but not on the day of remembrance when the focus is on hte dead and the wreaths laid are done by the RF on behalf of their organisations...and of the nation...

 

[ACO]

Apparently here was a wreath made worth over £1000 that went unused. Not sure the accuracy but was stated on Loose Women this morning.

Harry served 10 years. He can honor however he feels.

 

[Mirabel]

I think if the Sussexes had a social media platform that they used such as Instagram (I realise SussexRoyal is no longer used) then they could have posted one image and made a remark about marking the day. It would not have been dissimilar to what was shared on Kensington Royal or as another poster mentioned the members of parliament.

But to release so many photos, and have them look so staged, just sends the wrong message IMO.

They chose to leave and live in California, to no longer be working members of the royal family and this decision ultimately has consequences. I don’t judge them in this decision and do believe they made it with the best interest of their family life at the heart of it. But they, particularly Harry I feel, need to appreciate that this has hurt many people. The armed forces that he represented, the British people as well as his family will have been so disappointed by his choice. For all their sakes it is time to start using a little tact and consideration for others.

I think they are still trying to establish a half in/half out existence, where they are free to cash in in the USA, but fly back to the UK for glam events like Trooping to keep their "brand" viable.

I agree that the PR stunt with the wreath was cringe-worthy.

 

[Denville]

Apparently here was a wreath made worth over £1000 that went unused. Not sure the accuracy but was stated on Loose Women this morning.

Harry served 10 years. He can honor however he feels.

No, he can't. as a private individual he can do so but he can't send wreaths to a state event like the Rem Sunday ceremony... And private individuals dont take pictures of themselves with a professional photographer when they are honouring the dead.
And preparing a wreath back in March was odd IMO. at the time I doubt if people knew that there would be difficulties travelling in November.. so if he wanted to honour the war dead, I'd have siad he could have planned to fly back and be there in the UK at the time and placed the wreath in a private capacity, not on Rem Sunday. So if htat's true, he was clealry looking ahead to November and thinking "I probalby will be unable to fly back then due to commitments here, but I want to have a wreaht placed in my name...."

 

[RoyalNight]

It's weird they dressed formally and staged their own "Remembrance Day" photo shoot especially considering Veteran's Day in the US is on a different day. If they wanted to honor vets why not volunteer on Veteran's Day to work at an organization serving them? That would have been better.

That almost looks comical. Dress-up, medals, solemn faces with a hired photograph for private citizens. Really embarassing.

 

[csw]

I think they are still trying to establish a half in/half out existence, where they are free to cash in in the USA, but fly back to the UK for glam events like Trooping to keep their "brand" viable.

I agree that the PR stunt with the wreath was cringe-worthy.

Cringe-worthy is the word I was looking for. Heart-breaking too because I think H wants to be home in the UK doing the work that he did so well

 

[evolvingdoors]

Wonderful remembrance ceremony!
It was lovely seeing the family honoring the sacrifice of others.
Fashion wise: Catherine and Sophie looked amazing!, I especially loved Catherine coat, which I feel was a repeat? (i'll have to double check).


As for the duo..
I'll start by saying I served in the army of my country- so I too am a veteran. My country has a very strong connection to the military as over half of the citizens serve due to the mandatory service law. So we take our fallen soldiers very seriously with an entire day including TV stations and Radio switching to mourning songs and shows and documentaries about the wars and the fallen. Therefore in my country you are highly likely to have known a soldier who died, or had one in your family, or know someone who did (this is mostly true with the older generations.
I would always respect anyone who wishes to honor the fallen who gave their lives for freedom and democracy. So I respect Harry's wish to do so. However, the news cycle in regards to the Sussexes in the last 24/48 hours have been mind boggling angering! I literally saw red when I saw the string of images of them at the cemetery, looking as if they were plucked out of the Official remembrance day and placed in LA.
I saw Eugenie and Beatrice posted about the day, I think they each used a picture of their respective wedding bouquet?, and added a short heartfelt message
That should have also been Harry. start by not leaking about the wreath, don't bring a pro photographer!! to your private visit, lay a small wreath with a heartfelt message. Don't advertise it, only say anything if asked!, or at most send a single image of the wreath, or use the image of Meghan's wedding bouquet (like the York sisters) on top of the tomb of the unknown soldier.

I don't whose idea this was, this very! very! hollywood style photoshoot, be it Harry's, Meghan, the couple, their PR.. who ever thought this was a good idea, to not only do the photoshoot but release, god what was it- 10 images?!, is not not only not reading the room, but the entire building! and they are shitty at PR work! (sorry for my french)

Of course their stans on social media, and those who did not the minute to educate themselves on why Harry couldn't lay a personal wreath are cheering them on.

For me? as a fellow veteran this was one of the most disrespectful things Harry has ever done to soldiers (don't care whose idea it was, if not his he should have known better!! and put his foot down!). He used their sacrifice for some disgusting influencer style personal PR grab. I am literally pissed, and hurt, and after the last week, following the US elections, exhausted: using fallen soldiers who gave their lives for your freedom, who served besides you.. This, imo, ranks up there with his racist slurs (in which he also disrespected soldiers) and nazi suit.

I'll cut here, because I am getting worked up again, and I know I may not be able to control my words..

 

[evolvingdoors]

I've got a poppy, and I've seen quite a few people wearing them. There've been some in supermarkets, but, sadly, there haven't been a lot of poppy sellers out and about, due to the situation.


November 11th isn't a public holiday here, whereas it is in the US, which is why events take place on the nearest Sunday. I believe that the British Embassy in Washington holds a ceremony on Remembrance Sunday, so the idea of British citizens in the US marking the Sunday isn't unusual, but I don't think we needed a photo shoot (and how did Meghan walk round a cemetery in those shoes?!): it smacked of publicity-seeking. One picture on their Twitter feed, preferably of the wreath rather than of themselves, would have been OK, but not this.

oh!! I forgot about the British Embassy! and that they would obviously have an event. He could have just send a wreath there, asking it to be included in their memorial.
ETA: or the British consulate in LA.

 

[Alison H]

I don't know what the set-up at Whitehall is due to security reasons, but anyone is free to lay a wreath at a local cenotaph - whether in a big city centre, a town centre, a village or anywhere else - either on their own behalf, in memory of someone, or on behalf of an organisation. There are war memorials in every community in the country.


This isn't done during the ceremony, and people were asked to stay away from ceremonies this year anyway, due to the pandemic, but I'd think that plenty of people walked down to local memorials to place wreaths, or smaller tributes, later in the day. The idea of Harry's wreath being "unused" is bizarre. There's no reason why he couldn't have had it delivered to Windsor and asked someone to place it on the war memorial there, even if it wasn't possible for someone to visit the National Cenotaph at Whitehall.

 

[princess gertrude]

Cringe-worthy is the word I was looking for. Heart-breaking too because I think H wants to be home in the UK doing the work that he did so well

Cringe-worthy is a nice way to put it. Because I literally did cringe when I say the news. And do I think that he misses his work in the UK, yes. Do I think that he will go back, no. At least not right now. It's all very sad that it had to come to this.

 

[Empress Merel]

Cringeworthy is the perfect way to describe this photo op. It looks so incredibly staged, all the way from their faces to the outfits chosen. I'm sure their intent was perfectly fine, but it shows why this half in, half out approach is, indeed, cringe. At the end of the day, they hired a photographer to take shots of them in a cemetary, with their heavy duty clothing on and it comes across as embarassing.

 

[muriel]

Any idea why H&M have masks on in some pictures and not in others?

 

[Denville]

I don't know what the set-up at Whitehall is due to security reasons, but anyone is free to lay a wreath at a local cenotaph - whether in a big city centre, a town centre, a village or anywhere else - either on their own behalf, in memory of someone, or on behalf of an organisation. There are war memorials in every community in the country.


This isn't done during the ceremony, and people were asked to stay away from ceremonies this year anyway, due to the pandemic, but I'd think that plenty of people walked down to local memorials to place wreaths, or smaller tributes, later in the day. The idea of Harry's wreath being "unused" is bizarre. There's no reason why he couldn't have had it delivered to Windsor and asked someone to place it on the war memorial there, even if it wasn't possible for someone to visit the National Cenotaph at Whitehall.

Of course he could have done that - at Windsor.....

 

[ashelen]

That almost looks comical. Dress-up, medals, solemn faces with a hired photograph for private citizens. Really embarassing.

They tried to look like they were in England , just Meghan didn't have a hat. All the rest the same. He wanted to have the best of both words and this is not possible

 

[Betsypaige]

The people been members of the royal rota, including TV royal correspondents. Like I said - time will tell. There must be a reason why some feel this way, or they might be speculating just as we do.

I haven’t heard any Royal reporter saying that Charles promised Harry he could be half in and half out eventually. I don’t buy it...no offense. I firmly believe that Charles has been very much in synch with his mother about this entire H and M fiasco: no “court” at Windsor, no half-in, half-out, etc...

The photos - I’m not blaming the photographer at all here as this is his job - look so staged. H and M want us to be impressed with their caring, their gravitas. Sorry, it’s a bad joke.

 

[RoyalNight]

I don't know what the set-up at Whitehall is due to security reasons, but anyone is free to lay a wreath at a local cenotaph - whether in a big city centre, a town centre, a village or anywhere else - either on their own behalf, in memory of someone, or on behalf of an organisation. There are war memorials in every community in the country.


This isn't done during the ceremony, and people were asked to stay away from ceremonies this year anyway, due to the pandemic, but I'd think that plenty of people walked down to local memorials to place wreaths, or smaller tributes, later in the day. The idea of Harry's wreath being "unused" is bizarre. There's no reason why he couldn't have had it delivered to Windsor and asked someone to place it on the war memorial there, even if it wasn't possible for someone to visit the National Cenotaph at Whitehall.

In private? Without media? That doesn't count