The Duke and Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 1: September-December 2020

[Jacknch]

Once again, the Moderation team have had to edit or delete posts that are inappropriate within this thread and the current discussion.

We expect members to treat the sad news of miscarriage with the empathy, understanding and restraint that it deserves - not only for the sake of the couple but also for the members/readers who may have been faced with a similar loss.

Any posts that cross the line will be immediately deleted.

With regard to Privacy, the discussion has gone round and round in circles for months. Meghan and Harry are not going to live a quiet life completely hidden from the public, so let’s refrain from bringing up that topic every single time they do an interview, or make an appearance in the media.

[Lee-Z]

How very tragic for the both of them, such a turbulent year...

[Durham]

Originally Posted by Purrs

I personally have never had a miscarriage but I've been close to people who have. However, I have lost a child (5 years ago). The grief you experience makes some people actively avoid you. Sometimes other people will be so uncomfortable that they say hurtful things because their discomfort without thinking about how it will hurt you. In the case of loss of a child, some people will become visibly uncomfortable when you even mention your late child's name in passing. Both types of grief are so isolating in our culture.

Although the 2 losses (miscarriage/stillbirth and loss of a child) are not the same, they share many similarities including this stigma. The bereaved support group I attended after my son's death, also offers support groups for families who've experienced miscarriage/stillbirth as well as for losses of other family members than children.

Although I've questioned some things Meghan and Harry have said or done, I have no issue with this article and I view it positively as a way of lessening stigma and the isolation these couples feel as well as coping. I've written about my son's death although I haven't had it published (don't know where it could be published) but I've shared it. I've read books /articles about other people who've lost a child and it does help. I've also been quite public about the cause of my son's death (SUDEP - Sudden Unexpected Death in EPilepsy) & have done some things to raise awareness. None of the things were for attention.

Deeply touched to read of your loss. Thank you for sharing your story.

Originally Posted by adjovie

Harry and Meghan are very very VERY popular…it behooves them to use their "popularity" for the good of mankind; it'll irresponsible otherwise!

Without wishing to sound churlish that's really not at all true in Britain at least. Maybe they are in America?

Of course people in Britain will be sympathetic. That's only human. What a traumatic experience for any woman to have to go through. Dreadfully sad.

[adjovie]

Originally Posted by Durham

Without wishing to sound churlish that's really not at all true in Britain at least. Maybe they are in America?

…having lived on/visited four continents…on a global scale, how BIG is Britain!?

I understand others not wanting to admit it, but Meghan Markle, is indeed, a very very VERY (globally) popular woman It'll be irresponsible of her to not use her popularity for the good of mankind!

[tommy100]

I'm sorry they have been through this. Hopefully the experiences of Sophie Wessex and Zara will give them hope and reassurance for the future.

[Durham]

Originally Posted by adjovie

…having lived on/visited four continents…on a global scale, how BIG is Britain!?

I understand others not wanting to admit it but Meghan Markle, is indeed, a very very VERY (globally) popular woman

Britain's really really tiny. If you squint really carefully you can just make it out north west of France (that's the one with the Eiffel Tower & onion soup).

Your assertion is hyperbole of course. Unless you can provide some evidence to the contrary?

Take your time.

[soapstar]

Let’s move on from debating Meghan’s popularity.

[RoyalNight]

Originally Posted by Claire

Actually very confused about the letter. It is buttery and all over the place. [...]

There are several problems here - why the NYT? Because SS have friends there. This could easily been provided for Thanksgiving even Christmas and New Years actually.

Again - Her message is completely unclear in the style and language. Unsure if it is an attempt to be poetic or sound intelligent - but if people don't understand what you are writing your main reason to write has failed.

I completely agree with you. The style is bad, especially dramatic first part. The topic is unclear. I'm sympathetic and support being open about miscarriges, but leave it Sussexes to announce it in NY Times.

[adjovie]

It's very brave of Meghan and Harry to share their heart breaking story.

I for one, am grateful for their candidness. It spoke to me; I'm sure it'll speak to others as well.

[Diotima]

First of all, this is very sad news. I have gone through several miscarriages between the births of my four children, and they have left me with a lingering sadness that I have only recently began to understand (it was decades ago). It's a difficult topic to talk about. Until not so long ago, all this "women's stuff" was simply not discussed. I remember when it was expected for women to hide their pregnancies or themselves.

Post-partum depression, infertility, miscarriage - they all carry a stigma, and it's important to take this stigma away. Meghan has done something important today.

She and Harry must have thought about publishing the text or not. They must be aware that many people will criticize them about it, and that must be painful. she published it nevertheless, and I'm grateful she did.

I'm reminded of Angelina Jolie and her double mastectomy. Afterwards, many women went to get tested.

I hope that we'll all learn to become more open, more empathic, kinder.

Meghan's text was much more eloquent than the way she talks. In my opinion, her piece would have been stronger without bringing up other tragedies and crimes - I understand it's all traumatizing and overwhelming, and in her vulnerable state she must feel the sufferings of others even more strongly. But somehow it blunted the deeply personal aspect for me. Well, I read it only once, so I won't judge.

I wish her and the whole family that they heal and that her words resonate in the minds of all people who were touched by loss, grief and mourning. I'm not one of her fans but in her text, I could feel more truth and real emotion than in many other things she has said or done.

[crm2317]

I think it is very brave of any woman to share a loss so publicly, if Meghan felt this was right for her then that is for her and Harry and nobody else to judge.

I would be interested to know how the article came about. Did she request to write it? Did they ask her to do an opinion piece and this is the topic she chose?

[SLV]

Having had two miscarriages myself, I completely agree with Countess.

Originally Posted by Countessmeout

Even when she is mourning a child people have to attack her really

Miscarriages are one of the most painful things a woman can go through. And for her husband as well. To even talk about it with people you love is hard. To open up about it to the public is even worse.

The stigma about talking about miscarriages and the depression is still alive.

One could hope people could set aside their dislike of Meghan to actually feel some compassion for a couple who have lost a child.

Its important people like Meghan and others in the spotlight actually discus struggles like this. It helps people realize that its not a shame to be hidden.

[Mbruno]

Do you think the RF, I mean, the Queen, The PoW and the Cambridges were informed of the pregnancy and of the miscarriage in July ? Or did they get to know about it from the NY Times like the rest of us?

[amaryllus]

Really? Because reading every post on the subject for the last several hours will tell you people most certainly have voiced sorrow, empathy and compassion for this loss. But that does mean everyone automatically has to give her or them a complete pass Or not critique things they do that are odd, questionable, grating ETC.

[.....]

[UglyAmerican]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

Do you think the RF, I mean, the Queen, The PoW and the Cambridges were informed of the pregnancy and of the miscarriage in July ? Or did they get to know about it from the NY Times like the rest of us?

I had the same thought when I first read it.

[Empress Merel]

That's really terrible. I cannot imagine how powerless you must feel when you know you're losing your unborn child, but have to keep it together for the toddler who has no idea what's going on

[Ista]

Just a reminder that we don't do pregnancy speculation here, so any further posts along those lines will be deleted or edited.

[HereditaryPrincess]

That's sad news to hear.

My mother suffered from a miscarriage a few years before I was born so I know how it can personally affect someone, and how much courage it can take to speak out. As others have said there is still a stigma around miscarriages so I'm glad that Meghan has spoken out about her own. Criticising a woman for speaking out about such a personal thing seems pretty low, no matter whether you like Meghan as a person or not.

Many people online, at least, have appreciated Meghan's statement. She was trending for a time this morning on both Twitter and the newsfeeds for smartphones.

[Frelinghighness]

Originally Posted by camelot23ca

Yes. I have a lot of sympathy for the couple as the miscarriage was clearly traumatic for them. I do think it’s worthwhile to point out that not everyone experiences a miscarriage as a tragedy or as something that’s stigmatized. I’m always a little wary when celebrities write these pieces about their personal traumas because the underlying implication is always that THEIR experience is the normal one. There are many women who could write something along the lines of, “I had a miscarriage, I was somewhat sad for a period of time, I got all the support I felt I needed and the experience wasn’t something that left me with any sense of trauma or unresolved grief.” But those women aren’t going to feel there’s a need to write about their experience for the NY Times, and they’d have a harder time getting that less eye catching narrative published, anyway, so the experiences we do read about aren’t necessarily representative of what all, or even most people would go through in similar situations.

And I think it’s valid to point out that it’s impossible to put an experience into the public domain in a vacuum, and that once you put even a painful personal trauma out there you open that experience up not just to sympathy but to comments and opinions of all kinds, including thoughts on how seeking the biggest platform you can find to talk in detail about your personal experience of what many consider a sensitive topic relates to your well known need for privacy.

Thank you for pointing out that not every miscarriage needs to be characterized as a trauma. I had an early miscarriage between my two children and the cause was what is known as a “blighted” ovum. The egg was defective enough so the embryo could only progress up to a certain point and then miscarry, with no complete genetic information. I was proud of my body for dealing with it. Also, I felt relieved as I really didn’t feel ready for another child. Six months later I was pregnant and felt ready.
Also, the chances of Megan miscarrying are much higher at her age.

[Frelinghighness]

Originally Posted by Purrs

I'm usually a lurker but I had to reply to this...

I think that there is a stigma about miscarriage/stillbirth in most of the English speaking world. Not only because of it involves "reproductive issues" but also because it involves loss and grief which our culture handles very poorly. People in our culture are often very uncomfortable with grief and talking about loss and the resulting grief makes people uncomfortable. There is a silent expectation that you are expected not to talk about it - "stiff upper lip". (This stigma is gradually diminishing). People do differ in how they cope with grief, it's very individual and not everyone will wish to talk about it. However, even if the pregnancy has not been publicly shared, some people will still wish to tell others about a miscarriage/stillbirth because of the emotional impact. Others will not. Both approaches should be respected.

I personally have never had a miscarriage but I've been close to people who have. However, I have lost a child (5 years ago). The grief you experience makes some people actively avoid you. Sometimes other people will be so uncomfortable that they say hurtful things because their discomfort without thinking about how it will hurt you. In the case of loss of a child, some people will become visibly uncomfortable when you even mention your late child's name in passing. Both types of grief are so isolating in our culture.

Although the 2 losses (miscarriage/stillbirth and loss of a child) are not the same, they share many similarities including this stigma. The bereaved support group I attended after my son's death, also offers support groups for families who've experienced miscarriage/stillbirth as well as for losses of other family members than children.

Although I've questioned some things Meghan and Harry have said or done, I have no issue with this article and I view it positively as a way of lessening stigma and the isolation these couples feel as well as coping. I've written about my son's death although I haven't had it published (don't know where it could be published) but I've shared it. I've read books /articles about other people who've lost a child and it does help. I've also been quite public about the cause of my son's death (SUDEP - Sudden Unexpected Death in EPilepsy) & have done some things to raise awareness. None of the things were for attention.

Please accept my sincerest condolences for your loss. How wonderful and courageous of you to raise awareness about the cause of his death