General News about the Sussex Family, Part Two: April-August 2020

[Betsypaige]

My view is that Charles will continue to support them for some time (his life time?), but perhaps to the tune of say, £2m per year or thereabouts. In addition, there will be the interest on the c£15-20m that Harry is meant to have, say another c£0.5-1m per year. In theory, they could comfortably live on c£2.5-3m per year, but even that will not give them the lifestyle of private jets and £100,000 single use gowns that she probably seeks.

So, all in all, they will need to, and probably want to, cash in their royal status to try and build a lifestyle and philanthropy empire. Part Angelina Jolie, part Gwynneth P, part Oprah. Add in branding like Beyonce, and you see where this could go.

But to address the question of how long Charles will pay, I think he will put a reasonable amout of money towards Harry for the rest of his life. This is what he would have done had Harry remained in the royal fold, and that is what he will continue to do as he probably does not wnat Harry to go looking at less than kosher sources of financing in his quest for financial independence.

I can’t disagree with any of this. I have to say, though, that the kind of branding they want is to me.

 

[Denville]

When Charles is King he will fund his siblings who are working royals (except maybe Andrew). Harry is no longer working so why would William be funding him living in a foreign country. Harry shouldn't even be funded now.

YOu may feel that but I don't think that Charles feels like that. He may not want to shell out money but Harry is his son and he will take care of hm.

 

[Betsypaige]

William has been involved with the talks with Harry and Im sure that he has been discussing the future, when WIll is DUke of Cornwall and after he is gone when William is king. What is hypocritical about it? Charles didn't fund his siblings because he is not their father, the queen has done so. Now his son is In an unprecedented situation, of leaving the RF.. and Im sure that WIll's been involved in the talks of what to do with Harry and how to manage if he's not that well off when he's older. William is Harry's older brother and will be King and will have more money than him, and im sure that even if there is tension between them, he wont leave his brother stuck..

I agree with you, and Nice. I would also add that I’m sure Charles will or has spoken to William about making sure that Harry is taken care of.

 

[KellyAtLast]

William has been involved with the talks with Harry and Im sure that he has been discussing the future, when WIll is DUke of Cornwall and after he is gone when William is king. What is hypocritical about it? Charles didn't fund his siblings because he is not their father, the queen has done so. Now his son is In an unprecedented situation, of leaving the RF.. and Im sure that WIll's been involved in the talks of what to do with Harry and how to manage if he's not that well off when he's older. William is Harry's older brother and will be King and will have more money than him, and im sure that even if there is tension between them, he wont leave his brother stuck..

Well like you said Charles doesn't fund his siblings because he is not their father. William is not harrys father why should William fund him now or in the future. And Harry won't be stuck he's not even stuck now because he has millions he inherited from Diana. He just selfish and wants more.

 

[Muhler]

But can they? THe economy is going to be depressed and as you say they don't have anything all that special. I think that Meghan will be the same as harry in that her "special thing" is that she's a Duchess, the wife of a British prince.. and after a while Im not sure that being the wife of a British Royal will be all that much of a draw.
They may WANT to earn money but I think that for some years, they are going to struggle.. so who is going to pay something towards their lifestyle? Charles. Maybe he will get fed up but I don't think he would ever totally cut them off. It might be the best thing for Harry but I don't relay believe that Charles would do it. So I don't think one can say that It wont happen.
He will also leave money to Harry and he's probably been discussing with William over the last few months about what will happen if H still needs payments later on. I don't say that William will be all that happy either to shell out, but I don't think he will totally refuse his brother.

Good points.

Well, if they don't earn enough money over the next few years, cashing on their royal status, because as it has been pointed out, that's really all they have, to invest so they can live of the interests. There will be only one option left, if they are to remain independent:
Cut down seriously on their lifestyle.

A much more modest home. Living in a considerably more modest neighborhood, probably not even in LA. No maid, no cook, only hired nannies and other help. No go jetting on holidays to exotic parts of the world every year. No super-expensive dresses, more modest jewellery.
Even then it will still be a comfortable life - I would happily live the life I envision for them! - A life of lower end millionaires. I.e. with a fortune of 5-10 million $.
BTW from the impression I personally have of W&K I think that would suit them fine. But that's another discussion.

While Charles may feel obliged to help his son and grandson to make ends meet, William is much more unlikely to be able to afford that.
Partly because the rift there seemingly is between the brothers may not have healed by the time William becomes king.
Partly because William will also have to think of his own three children, one of whom may have to earn a living on his/her own. So pumping millions into subsidizing an "exiled" brother who lives above his means is hardly likely to be something he will be keen to do. Especially because in 20-25 years from now H&M will be totally irrelevant to most Britons, even hardcore royalists.
Partly because we don't know how Britain will look in 25 years. The economy may be booming and the UK a part of a prosperous Commonwealth. - Or it may not... In which case the BRF will face cutbacks as well.
Each time H&M will need to "borrow" say 250.000 £, William will have to cut back on other things, or take from the family fortune. He may do that grudgingly a couple of times, but that's it IMO.
And last but not least, because of the public view. Seeing the king funding a runaway brother will be an irritant for the public, and something the papers and republicans will happily trumpet about whenever there is a dull period.

 

[Denville]

Well like you said Charles doesn't fund his siblings because he is not their father. William is not harrys father why should William fund him now or in the future. And Harry won't be stuck he's not even stuck now because he has millions he inherited from Diana. He just selfish and wants more.

You may feel that -but by royal standards, the money Harry has from Diana isn't nearly enough to pay for that sort of lifestyle. Charles has been funding his 2 sons, helping with their working expenses. William may not be thrilled at the prospect of helping out Harry in 20 years from now but he is his brother, he will be his king and he wotnt leave him stuck.

 

[KellyAtLast]

YOu may feel that but I don't think that Charles feels like that. He may not want to shell out money but Harry is his son and he will take care of hm.

Just like the Queen takes care of Andrew and we are seeing the results of that now. And I see the argument that Charles may want to give something to harry so he doesn't get involved in some questionable business. Well guess what the Queen gives into Andrew the Queen gives Andrew everything he wants and he still gets involved in questionable business.
Why must everyone concede and"take care" of Harry. Is he not a grown up and adult who is able bodied. People are talking like he's a child who needs to be spoon fed with a bib around his neck it's pathetic and thats the reason why he is the way that he is now arrogant and entitled. And if they keep treating him like that it's going to make things worse. I hope William is a better parent than the queen and Charles. I don't want to have this same conversation when Charlotte and Louis is in their mid 30s.

 

[KellyAtLast]

You may feel that -but by royal standards, the money Harry has from Diana isn't nearly enough to pay for that sort of lifestyle. Charles has been funding his 2 sons, helping with their working expenses. William may not be thrilled at the prospect of helping out Harry in 20 years from now but he is his brother, he will be his king and he wotnt leave him stuck.

Exactly William is Harrys king not the other way around. Harry should be in the service of his King not the King in the service of the baby brother who ran away from working for the family. Harry is a grown up William is not obligated to take care of him i don't care if he is his brother. Charles doesn't take care of his brothers and i doubt he will be very generous with them when he becomes king. So why should William be. And like i said Harry is not stuck he has is own millions if he doesn't live beyond his means he will be ok with what he has.

 

[Osipi]

Well like you said Charles doesn't fund his siblings because he is not their father. William is not harrys father why should William fund him now or in the future. And Harry won't be stuck he's not even stuck now because he has millions he inherited from Diana. He just selfish and wants more.

Its a known fact that since the 14th century, the Duchy of Cornwall was established such that "The Duchy of Cornwall is a private estate established by Edward III in 1337 to provide independence to his son and heir." Its been that way ever since then. When William is Duke of Cornwall, it'll be his own family he takes care of. Charles may deem it that he still wishes to provide for Harry once he's king from his private income from the Duchy of Lancaster. As such, once William is king, it will be at his own discretion what he does or doesn't do.

I do have to admit that since January, reading about the Sussex family and their exodus and what we *do* know to be true, it all seems to be so convoluted and haphazard and reminds me of trapeze artists working high in the sky without a safety net. Nothing concrete and definite is delineated as far as financial support going into the future and nothing is concrete of a serious business plan that is actually going to work and prosper. COVID-19 didn't do the Sussexes any favors either.

As my beloved Irish grandmother used to say, "They're flying by the seat of their pants".

 

[Denville]

Good points.


BTW from the impression I personally have of W&K I think that would suit them fine. But that's another discussion.

While Charles may feel obliged to help his son and grandson to make ends meet, William is much more unlikely to be able to afford that.
Partly because the rift there seemingly is between the brothers may not have healed by the time William becomes king.
Partly because William will also have to think of his own three children, one of whom may have to earn a living on his/her own. So pumping millions into subsidizing an "exiled" brother who lives above his means is hardly likely to be something he will be keen to do. Especially because in 20-25 years from now H&M will be totally irrelevant to most Britons, even hardcore royalists.
Partly because we don't know how Britain will look in 25 years. The economy may be booming and the UK a part of a prosperous Commonwealth. - Or it may not... In which case the BRF will face cutbacks as well.
Each time H&M will need to "borrow" say 250.000 £, William will have to cut back on other things, or take from the family fortune. He may do that grudgingly a couple of times, but that's it IMO.
And last but not least, because of the public view. Seeing the king funding a runaway brother will be an irritant for the public, and something the papers and republicans will happily trumpet about whenever there is a dull period.

William will be a very wealthy man when he is King. He will have the resources of the Duchy of Lancaster and he will have some of Charles' private wealth.. When the queen goes he will have the Duchy of Cornwall funds..
He's not going to be handing out massive "loans" to the couple but he will probably give tehm an allowance if their money making does not succeed all that well.
He may end by cutting them off but Im sure he wont do so completely.. As the King and elder son he will almost certainly feel some degree of obligation to his younger brother...He may impose conditions if they do become crazy spenders.. and possibly they might have to come back and live in Frogmore and live more quietly but I am sure he wont just give up on them...

 

[Osipi]

Why am getting a sense of flashbacks as to how Bertie had to deal with his wayward brother back then. IIRC, although the fences were never really mended, Bertie did buy back Sandringham and Balmoral from David and granted him £25,000 annually for life.

We have no idea what the future holds and there are no concrete "settlements" in place that are being released into the public domain about the personal finances between family members and most likely, it will never be in the public domain either.

We just have to wait and watch and see what happens as time passes.

 

[Denville]

Why am getting a sense of flashbacks as to how Bertie had to deal with his wayward brother back then. IIRC, although the fences were never really mended, Bertie did buy back Sandringham and Balmoral from David and granted him £25,000 annually for life.

We have no idea what the future holds and there are no concrete "settlements" in place that are being released into the public domain about the personal finances between family members and most likely, it will never be in the public domain either.

We just have to wait and watch and see what happens as time passes.

It was easier for Bertie as in their time it wasn't likely that a former king would want to set up his own business.. Edward managed to salt away a lot of money and to finagle Bertie into also giving him an allowance. And it was likely that Edward would stay living abroad and would not come back that often. Eventaully I think we will know what is happening to them financially, if Charles is allowing them X amount and later on William...

 

[Durham]

Accounts for both duchies are of public record. Any use of them to help relatives overseas will cause controversy. It's a can of worms.

 

[Queen Claude]

Both The Queen and Charles have been drawing income from their respective duchies for over sixty years and as such have been able to accumulate considerable personal wealth. William will be a very wealthy man on paper but will likely not have nearly the liquid / disposable wealth that his father and grandmother have. Of course it is conjecture, but Harry's situation may result in William being more tight-fisted because William has two non-heir children that he may need to have a slush fund for in case they follow in the footsteps of their uncle Harry.

I agree with those who state that it should be Charles, and of course Harry and Meghan themselves, who will and should be primarily responsible for the Sussexes financial support.

 

[Mirabel]

William will be a very wealthy man when he is King. He will have the resources of the Duchy of Lancaster and he will have some of Charles' private wealth.. When the queen goes he will have the Duchy of Cornwall funds..

BUT...he cannot flaunt his wealth.
To do so will provoke public criticism.

(And although some may argue from now to doomsday that it is his private fortune, you know many will not make that distinction. They will say it all comes down to the taxpayer, and no amount of explanation will convince them otherwise).

 

[HereditaryPrincess]

At this point the Sussexes will be damned if they do and damned if they don't.

 

[poppy7]

Thanks. I can't remember her saying anything particularly political... but then I did't pay that much attention to her..Does a foundation not let you use some of the money to pay for costs such as office, staff salaries, postage IT all that kind of thing? So a foundation need a big capital outlay, and periodic inputs of capital when all your computers break down at once or whatever?

Im not sure what they wanted, but I think its money and general freedom more than "freedom to say things or choose tehir own charities". I thnk they did not like the set up that was in the RF, where they had engagements, maybe some were very dull and they fancied a night off, but would probably be told "you have to go Sir, its your duty" and possibly being reminded that Dad/the RF was paying a lot of their expenses. They wanted to be able to say "no, we're not doing X and we can say no because we make our own money..."

I'm not sure to be honest but they primarily exist to funnel funds to where they need to go. To cover working costs perhaps but all profits go to charity. Which is the difference. Archwell will be able to put money into the organisation.

Both The Queen and Charles have been drawing income from their respective duchies for over sixty years and as such have been able to accumulate considerable personal wealth. William will be a very wealthy man on paper but will likely not have nearly the liquid / disposable wealth that his father and grandmother have. Of course it is conjecture, but Harry's situation may result in William being more tight-fisted because William has two non-heir children that he may need to have a slush fund for in case they follow in the footsteps of their uncle Harry.

I agree with those who state that it should be Charles, and of course Harry and Meghan themselves, who will and should be primarily responsible for the Sussexes financial support.

Let's hope Charlotte and Louis take after Grandma Carole then. In all seriousness I think those two will be fine. I mean the rest are (Andrew excepted). But there are always going to be outliers.

 

[Durham]

BUT...he cannot flaunt his wealth.
To do so will provoke public criticism.

(And although some may argue from now to doomsday that it is his private fortune, you know many will not make that distinction. They will say it all comes down to the taxpayer, and no amount of explanation will convince them otherwise).

It is of course wealth derived from assets (the duchies) that belong to the crown ie the state. Assets that are most definitely not owned in a personal capacity but owned only because of what position the beneficiary occupies in the constitution/state. That would become very clear very quickly if Britain became a republic.

 

[Denville]

BUT...he cannot flaunt his wealth.
To do so will provoke public criticism.

(And although some may argue from now to doomsday that it is his private fortune, you know many will not make that distinction. They will say it all comes down to the taxpayer, and no amount of explanation will convince them otherwise).

Charles is supporting them, and the public while many aren't happy with the idea, aren't exactly rising in rebellion.

It is of course wealth derived from assets (the duchies) that belong to the crown ie the state. Assets that are most definitely not owned in a personal capacity but owned only because of what position the beneficiary occupies in the constitution/state. That would become very clear very quickly if Britain became a republic.

Chalres also has personal wealth as does the queen. Both of them can afford to support Harry, im not sure if it is the best thing for him but I don't see his being able to make money any time soon.. so....they are not likely to stop helping him...

 

[Durham]

Of course if the Prince of Wales were to predecease HM that could complicate any (?) financial assistance to the Sussexes for their security. In that situation the proceeds of the duchy would revert to the crown but the Sovereign Grant would be cut by the same amount.

 

[Denville]

Of course if the Prince of Wales were to predecease HM that could complicate any (?) financial assistance to the Sussexes for their security. In that situation the proceeds of the duchy would revert to the crown but the Sovereign Grant would be cut by the same amount.

Im sure if such a thing were to happen arrangements are in place to ensure that Harry received an allowance.. In addition, he will certainly inherit money from his father. And the Duchy and its funds would go to William.

 

[Durham]

Chalres also has personal wealth as does the queen. Both of them can afford to support Harry, im not sure if it is the best thing for him but I don't see his being able to make money any time soon.. so....they are not likely to stop helping him...

The question is not if they can afford to but by what amount & from where. Wealth is not necessarily ready cash. What assets might they have to liquidate?

Im sure if such a thing were to happen arrangements are in place to ensure that Harry received an allowance.. In addition, he will certainly inherit money from his father. And the Duchy and its funds would go to William.

But the duchy wouldn't go to William. He wouldn't be the Duke of Cornwall. And the Sovereign Grant would have been cut by £20 million pa.

 

[Osipi]

Correct. In this scenario, the next Duke of Cornwall would be George when William becomes king.

I give up on figuring out financial ins and outs and how they'd support or not support H&M over the years. None of that will be made public anyways.

 

[Durham]

The issue is that all of this has the potential to cause a lot of financial controversy. Those worms are itching to get out. The fact that one of the most senior ministers in the government has already had to involve herself in this trivia is bad enough.

 

[Denville]

But the duchy wouldn't go to William. He wouldn't be the Duke of Cornwall. And the Sovereign Grant would have been cut by £20 million pa.[/QUOTE

Do you think that the queen would say "that's it, Im cutting Harry's allowance?"

The issue is that all of this has the potential to cause a lot of financial controversy. Those worms are itching to get out. The fact that one of the most senior ministers in the government has already had to involve herself in this trivia is bad enough.

but it is happening. Charles is supporting them, we all know it, and I don't think the public are really all that bothered, since there are a lot of other issues to worry about right now...

The question is not if they can afford to but by what amount & from where. Wealth is not necessarily ready cash. What assets might they have to liquidate?

They have "liquid wealth". Charles has been allowing the boys around £5 million between them for a while. He can go on letting H have £2 million or so, if he wants to.

 

[Eskimo]

They can live a very comfortable lifestyle for $5 million a year. It will be no where near the lifestyle they are used to, but it will be enough to live extremely comfortably. It can be funded by Charles and the interest from Harry trust funds. However, I believe that will not be enough for them. They want the Beyonce, Goop lifestyle. That costs something like a $100 million a year. Their only job right now is figure out how to make up the difference in monies

Charles cannot afford to fund them for any more. The world-wide economy is going to have a massive downturn for the next few years and even the Queen and his incomes will be impacted.

 

[Denville]

They can live a very comfortable lifestyle for $5 million a year. It will be no where near the lifestyle they are used to, but it will be enough to live extremely comfortably. It can be funded by Charles and the interest from Harry trust funds. However, I believe that will not be enough for them. They want the Beyonce, Goop lifestyle. That costs something like a $100 million a year. Their only job right now is figure out how to make up the difference in monies

Of course they can... I agree that they want more, but for the moment, they will have to manage on what Charles gives them and their own money. but of course he can afford to support them to a reasonable extent...

 

[Somebody]

Of course if the Prince of Wales were to predecease HM that could complicate any (?) financial assistance to the Sussexes for their security. In that situation the proceeds of the duchy would revert to the crown but the Sovereign Grant would be cut by the same amount.

I understand the Duchy money going to the crown (because only the eldest living som and heir apparent of the monarch can be duke of Cornwall); however, what is the relation to the Sovereign Grant? Is that maximized to a certain amount and any proceeds form the Duchy of Lancaster and Duchy of Cornwall (if applicable) are subtracted?

Edit: Just read on Wikipedia (sourced) that the Sovereign Grant Act changed the above: the revenue will go to heir whether or not he/she is a the duke of Cornwall:

Until 2011, if there was no Duke of Cornwall at any time, then the income of the Duchy went to the Crown. Since the passing into law of the Sovereign Grant Act 2011, revenues of the Duchy of Cornwall pass to the heir to the throne, regardless of whether that heir is the Duke of Cornwall. In the event that the heir is a minor, 10% of the revenues pass to the heir, with the balance passing to the Crown (and the Sovereign Grant is reduced by the same amount).

However, we should probably discuss this in the finance topic. I will post the full text there.

 

[Betsypaige]

The issue is that all of this has the potential to cause a lot of financial controversy. Those worms are itching to get out. The fact that one of the most senior ministers in the government has already had to involve herself in this trivia is bad enough.

I was getting a headache reading about the financial structures, etc.......lol. I'm sure no one begrudges Charles supporting his son (he's being a good father, regardless of his son's actions), but I understand the public not wanting their tax money to support two people who are no longer working royals. So, does any of Charles' funds come from simply being the Queen's son, the same way any of us might inherit - or be given - funds from our parents?

There's no question this is a bad look - and it's a bad look for Harry and Meghan, no one else. It's just another in a long line of terrible decision, assumptions and behaviors, and it feels like he might have irreparably damaged his relationship with the British people.

Eskimo:

They can live a very comfortable lifestyle for $5 million a year. It will be no where near the lifestyle they are used to, but it will be enough to live extremely comfortably. It can be funded by Charles and the interest from Harry trust funds. However, I believe that will not be enough for them. They want the Beyonce, Goop lifestyle. That costs something like a $100 million a year. Their only job right now is figure out how to make up the difference in monies

Charles cannot afford to fund them for any more. The world-wide economy is going to have a massive downturn for the next few years and even the Queen and his incomes will be impacted.

Yes, this. They want to live like American Royalty...in the manner that Harry has become accustomed to and, frankly, Meghan. Charles' monies should be used only for their security; I HOPE they aren't misappropriating them to fund their Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous.

Your last point is a good one - and even if Charles could, he shouldn't have to. Harry and Meghan want security? PAY for it. They should be doing it now.

 

[QueenMathilde]

If he’s dipping into his private fund, is it the public’s business? It’s still his son - Charles isn’t going to leave Harry with no security. If we’re talking public funds, that’s another story. I agree either way that he won’t be able to keep it up financially.

The public will consider it their business. Charles has never worked outside the royal family a day in his life. All his money comes from the taxpayer one way or another.