Duke and Duchess of Sussex, General News Part 1: May 2018 - December 2018

[Fem]

Originally Posted by Dman

Yeah, the entire tour was very successful and Meghan didn’t put a foot wrong. She did her job while pregnant and that may have ruffled a few feathers. There’s no reason for this backlash other than folks wanting to start some mess between the camps. It ain’t gonna happen.

Yeah, the tour was great. And both Meghan and Harry did awesome. But to say the tour was flawless? I've been in the fandom for too many years to admit it, but I've also never seen a flawless tour. There's always something that will go wrong.

And this tour was not an exception. From small and big fashion missteps to some organizational issues that showed that their team is still pretty new to this, there was a couple of mistakes.

Don't get me wrong - it was an awesome tour. And Meghan did great. But flawless would mean that everything went perfect and that wasn't the case - that's almost always not the case.

[Dman]

Originally Posted by Fem

Yeah, the tour was great. And both Meghan and Harry did awesome. But to say the tour was flawless? I've been in the fandom for too many years to admit it, but I've also never seen a flawless tour. There's always something that will go wrong.

And this tour was not an exception. From small and big fashion missteps to some organizational issues that showed that their team is still pretty new to this, there was a couple of mistakes.

Don't get me wrong - it was an awesome tour. And Meghan did great. But flawless would mean that everything went perfect and that wasn't the case - that's almost always not the case.

When I say flawless, I don’t mean there were no errors. I mean the whole tour was a total success and I think that that may have ruffled some feathers. So it’s silly season time in the media.

[Kataryn]

Let's face it: HM's British subjects contain racists, religious fundamentalists, xenophobics, patriarchists and republicans - and they all can't stand the idea that a woman like Meghan and her husband Harry are to continue the Royal bloodline. So these people will applaud when Meghan is dissed. And as she is not dissed within her own environment (for I can't really see anyone from either family or staff to be obnoxious to her), the tabloids make up stories to cater to this clientele because they are a large part of their readership. And the "better" papers follow up because they believe the establishment will not warm up to the biracial duchess with radical ideas about equality and care for other people. This is not the way the establishment became and stayed rich. Papers are a commercial product, they don't serve the truth but their readership. I'm sure Meghan and Harry are aware of that and don't care. I mean, Harry was raised by Diana and Chalres and both of them knew exactly how that game works.


As for being flawless: even Royals and their spouses are humans. May be a new insight for some, but well, that's how it is.

[Spheno]

Why Prince Harry and Meghan Markle’s royal-tour PDA could be a bad thing

The touchy-feely royals risk looking like mere celebrities, which is not part of their actual job—and that could have consequences down the road, even amid all their good work
https://www.macleans.ca/royalty/why-...e-a-bad-thing/

very well written article

[XeniaCasaraghi]

Originally Posted by Dman

When I say flawless, I don’t mean there were no errors. I mean the whole tour was a total success and I think that that may have ruffled some feathers. So it’s silly season time in the media.

Flawless means without flaw meaning without mistake. The grocery store incident alone disproves the tour was flawless. Things can be imperfect and still be a successful as the tour was.

[Lady Reem]

Originally Posted by Kataryn

Let's face it: HM's British subjects contain racists, religious fundamentalists, xenophobics, patriarchists and republicans - and they all can't stand the idea that a woman like Meghan and her husband Harry are to continue the Royal bloodline. So these people will applaud when Meghan is dissed. And as she is not dissed within her own environment (for I can't really see anyone from either family or staff to be obnoxious to her), the tabloids make up stories to cater to this clientele because they are a large part of their readership. And the "better" papers follow up because they believe the establishment will not warm up to the biracial duchess with radical ideas about equality and care for other people. This is not the way the establishment became and stayed rich. Papers are a commercial product, they don't serve the truth but their readership. I'm sure Meghan and Harry are aware of that and don't care. I mean, Harry was raised by Diana and Chalres and both of them knew exactly how that game works.


As for being flawless: even Royals and their spouses are humans. May be a new insight for some, but well, that's how it is.

I find that very hard to believe, particularly the ‘family’ bit!

(Bearing in mind that before Meghan, the BRF was already stuffed with members into their 2nd marriages, foreign-born brides, and the odd actress)

Also being obnoxious/hurting someone or smearing their reputation doesn’t have to be face to face. It’s usually done via other means or undercover using the media etc.

[Terri Terri]

Originally Posted by Lady Reem

Not going to elaborate but I find that very hard to believe.

I agree! I am not that naive to think that there aren't SOME staff and courtiers who didn't have a problem with a biracial divorced American actress marrying Prince Harry!
We don't live in a perfect world!

[Madame Verseau]

I guess there is no such thing as NDAs when you work in a royal household. So far no one has been fired, probably out of fear they will sell more secrets on the media circuit. Paul Burrell and Ken Wharfe prove you can rake in the cash when you spill royal tea. I hope Harry and Meghan will find staff that will support their causes and that are loyal. Decent paychecks with good benefits should be a consideration. I know it's considered an honor to work for the royals but prestige can't pay the bills.

[Osipi]

Nobody is flawless. Event's are hard to come by that are described as flawless. Even flawless diamonds are rare to find. Everything has its own little imperfections that make them unique. Like snowflakes. (The kind that fall out of the sky on a cold day). The Queen, herself, looks for those little goof ups during events because, to her, they liven up the party. If everything was perfect and flawless, it'd be quite boring for her.

Meghan is human like the rest of us and has good day and bad days and wonderful qualities and flaws. I don't think the tour was flawless but I do think that Meghan gave it her best effort to do a good job. That's all that can be asked of anyone. The difference is with different people. Some people only focus on the negative when looking at something while some people prefer to focus on the positives. A well balanced view is to look at a person or situation in a balanced way that sees both the negatives and the positives for what they are. The tabloid stories are not fair and balanced reporting but a personal view of what they see. The court circular reports and lists the events and occasions the royal family participate in and is, frankly, a boring read.

We come here to discuss the life and the times and the goof ups and blessed events that happen to these people. Its a wonderful past time among people from all over the world who are unique individuals in and of themselves. I don't consider this a "fan" site as I'm really not a fan of anybody in particular but I do find the British royal family and British royal history and the monarchy interesting. If Meghan or Harry or one of the Queen's dogs has a bad day, I can identify with that as I have bad days too.

One thing I can say positively about Meghan is that she's doing her best as she's learning the ropes. She's trying and that, to me, is what really counts.

Originally Posted by Madame Verseau

I guess there is no such thing as NDAs when you work in a royal household. So far no one has been fired, probably out of fear they will sell more secrets on the media circuit. Paul Burrell and Ken Wharfe prove you can rake in the cash when you spill royal tea. I hope Harry and Meghan will find staff that will support their causes and that are loyal. Decent paychecks with good benefits should be a consideration. I know it's considered an honor to work for the royals but prestige can't pay the bills.

Just a tidbit of information here. Ken Wharfe actually didn't work for a royal household. He was employed by the Metropolitan Police and answered to them and received his paycheck from them. You're absolutely right though stating that the pay isn't something to write home about working for a royal household. From all accounts of what I've read, the prestige of working for the royal family far outweighs what goes into the bank account. Most likely, that is why there is a constant flow of staff changes in low levels of service to the royal households. Meghan's only been a part of the family for six months or so and is still adjusting to her staff and they are still adjusting to her.

[Kataryn]

Originally Posted by Spheno

Why Prince Harry and Meghan Markle’s royal-tour PDA could be a bad thing

The touchy-feely royals risk looking like mere celebrities, which is not part of their actual job—and that could have consequences down the road, even amid all their good work
https://www.macleans.ca/royalty/why-...e-a-bad-thing/

very well written article

Yes, but they forget that Meghan is newly wed, in a completely new environment and is pregnant to boot. She is a bit touchy still (and a lot with her husband) but she will settle into Royal life and that much public cuddling will surely stop. Especially after enough people have shown her that they don't want to be hugged by a Royal, people normally don't feel overjoyed when hugged by a "superior".



The situation with Kate and William was different - they had to hide their affections so much while they were just together as girl- and boyfriend to not give the papers feast after feast. Just imagine the outcry if they had behaved like Meghan and Harry do without being married! And when they finally married, they were so used to only cuddle behind closed doors, they never changed that attitude.



But for me it is lovely to see how much they love each other!

[Kataryn]

Originally Posted by Terri Terri

I agree! I am not that naive to think that there aren't SOME staff and courtiers who did have a problem with a biracial divorced American actress marrying Prince Harry!
We don't live in a perfect world!

But will they dare to be obnoxious to her? Apart from Princess Pushy?

[Osipi]

Some people are comfortable with displaying their emotions in public while others aren't. Harry always was a person that you could tell what he was feeling by just looking at his facial expressions. William is more reserved and "down to business" and keeps his emotions to himself when in public. Both men have married women that mirror their personalities. That's why they're a good fit for each other.

Both Meghan and Harry stoop down to child level when interacting with them. Both Harry and Meghan are outgoing when it comes to talking with the public. Meghan definitely mirrors Harry and although I do agree that random hugging of staff or people she doesn't know may make them feel uncomfortable, I think she'll catch on to when it appropriate to remain aloof as a royal and when its OK to be her own huggable self. I don't personally see a problem with Harry and Meghan displaying their love and affection for each other in public and in fact, I find it endearing but other people may not see it that way.

Myself, I'm a hugger and believe that hugs make the world go 'round but I also know of people that do not wish to be hugged at all or touched. Each person does what they're comfortable or not comfortable with and it takes knowing a person first before knowing what is acceptable and what is not. Meghan's learning and she'll catch on and adapt, I'm sure.

[O-H Anglophile]

Originally Posted by Lady Reem

Not going to elaborate but I find that very hard to believe, particularly the ‘family’ bit!

(Bearing in mind that before Meghan, BRF was already stuffed with members into their 2nd marriages, foreign brides, and the odd actress)

As you say the BRF has a lot of different folks that have married in and several of them are on second marriages. Why then do you believe these family members would “diss” Meghan”?
Because Kataryn said she didn’t see family being obnoxious to her but you think they would be? Please elaborate. I’m sure I’m not the only one failing to connect the dots.
ETA: other than maybe Princess Michael as later mentioned, but the rest are not going to be rude to her. Neither the Queen or Charles would be happy about that.

[Dman]

Originally Posted by XeniaCasaraghi

Flawless means without flaw meaning without mistake. The grocery store incident alone disproves the tour was flawless. Things can be imperfect and still be a successful as the tour was.

Yeah, it was a very successful tour. I don’t think some folks expected her to do so well on her very first major tour. She’s done excellent job since the engagement announcement.

As for the PDA’s, this is Harry and Meghan. It’s who they are. There’s no royal rule book that frowns upon PDA’s.

[AlowVera]

Originally Posted by Dman

Yeah, it was a very successful tour. I don’t think some folks expected her to do so well on her very first major tour. She’s done excellent job since the engagement announcement.

As for the PDA’s, this is Harry and Meghan. It’s who they are. There’s no royal rule book that frowns upon PDA’s.

There is no royal book and frankly whenever OTHER royals show PDA it is celebrated but Harry can't even hold his wife's hand to escort her up the stairs. Also holding hands is not PDA.

[AlowVera]

Originally Posted by Osipi

I don't think being an English rose makes a difference. They would have found fault with *anyone* that married into the family. Its what they do. Conflict sells unfortunately.

Camilla Tominey a so called "well respected" reporter used the phrase "english rose" to distinguish one Duchess from Meghan. So it is a way in which the media is trying to say Meghan is not "one of us".

[Osipi]

Originally Posted by AlowVera

Camilla Tominey a so called "well respected" reporter used the phrase "english rose" to distinguish one Duchess from Meghan. So it is a way in which the media is trying to say Meghan is not "one of us".

I get what you're saying here. My opinion on it is that if Meghan was "one of them", Harry wouldn't have fallen in love with her or married her. What matters is that to Harry, she is "the one". Harry didn't marry someone to appease the public in any way, shape or form. Let 'em think what they want. We don't have to pay attention to it.

[Fem]

Originally Posted by Dman

When I say flawless, I don’t mean there were no errors. I mean the whole tour was a total success and I think that that may have ruffled some feathers. So it’s silly season time in the media.

So basically you're saying now that you said grass is pink, but you know the grass is green? Maybe, for the sake of better communication, we could... explain things a bit or use words according to their meaning.

Flawless means without any mistake. That tour was not that. It was great, highly enjoyable, but it had weird moments. No one here is saying that Meghan didn't do a great job - because she did - just that the tour had some ups and downs, like every royal tour ever.

Originally Posted by AlowVera

There is no royal book and frankly whenever OTHER royals show PDA it is celebrated but Harry can't even hold his wife's hand to escort her up the stairs. Also holding hands is not PDA.

There is no royal book nor a rule on PDA - but there is, at least at some level, a custom or a practice, however you want to call it, that the couples keep things simple.

And I love PDA from royals - I love the little moments between William and Catherine or Edward and Sophie, I always smile when I see Prince Charles and Camilla being cute. But they don't show a lot of that.

I explained it to a friend once, that it's like with your favourite, but very sweet cookies. You love to have one, or two, or even three, but when someone would give you a whole box and told you to eat them all, you would get sick. We love the PDA from other royals, because it's a special moment, it's not something that happens all the time.

And sorry, haven't noticed that Harry can't hold his wife's hand. Especially since he's doing it almost all the time?

[Ista]

Originally Posted by Fem

And I love PDA from royals - I love the little moments between William and Catherine or Edward and Sophie, I always smile when I see Prince Charles and Camilla being cute. But they don't show a lot of that.

I explained it to a friend once, that it's like with your favourite, but very sweet cookies. You love to have one, or two, or even three, but when someone would give you a whole box and told you to eat them all, you would get sick. We love the PDA from other royals, because it's a special moment, it's not something that happens all the time.

:

This is a good explanation, and where I land, too, with PDA from royals--actually, it's how I feel about PDA from anyone. It's sweet and touching when you only see it occasionally, but when the stroking, cuddling and fondling is constant, it begins to feel overdone, insincere, and generally as though outside observers are being forced to participate in something that should be private. I thought Harry and Meghan came pretty close to the too much end of the spectrum during the tour, but gave them a pass because it was her first big tour, they had just announced her pregnancy, and she may have wanted some extra support (or maybe Harry was the one wanting the support;-)) I am hoping they will dial it back a bit in the future.

To me it has nothing to do with Harry and Meghan exclusively, although they are younger and attractive, so they can probably get away with more public demonstrations. But if, say, Charles and Camilla were doing the same thing, would it be inappropriate, or make you feel uncomfortable? If so, then younger royals should probably lower the temperature level a bit. I recognize that everyone has a different tolerance level for this stuff.

[Osipi]

I think a good rule of thumb is that if you're looking at a couple displaying fondness and affection for each other to the point that the words "get a room" crosses your mind, its too much.