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  #2121  
Old 03-06-2020, 07:45 AM
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I have no doubt David thought that just as his previous scandals had been spun, this too would pass. I don't think he ever even thought that he was essentially banished from the Country for life.

It didn't seem to occur to him that there was no way the UK could have two Kings! He had been and still was very popular with the people. But then "The People" had no idea of the things that had been covered up and hidden about he and his now wife.

But, more importantly, it looked I increasingly like the country was headed for war and David's querilous demands were of no interest to anyone.

Sadly he seemed to spend his entire life buying expensive trinkets to keep Wallis happy. Sadly, a cache of letters discovered in the late 20th century proved once and for all that she didn't love him, never had and had never intended to divorce the love of her life, Earnest, whilst for him she was the love of his life.
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  #2122  
Old 03-06-2020, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
David just looked very sad as an older man - it's in his eyes. I'm not saying he regretted abdicating, but no matter how he acted, no matter what kind of dilettante he was, I'm sure down deep he still loved and missed his family. I don't think he ever expected that he'd essentially never see them again. Of course he behaved badly, but by the time he was an old man, weakened with age, those days were a long time ago. It's a rather pathetic life.
I think he was sad because of his lack of status.. He was still rich and feted in café society, but he was not King any more and he missed the status if not the responsibility. And I doubt if he was that deeply upset about his family, he was cool abuot them, even his mother.. in his letters. He and Wallis sneered at Eliz the queen mother and David was rather chilling, as I remember, about his mother. I think as long as he had Wallis he was OK and certianly didn't miss the family. but he must have realised that on many levels Wallis wasnt' all that much in love with him..and that hurt.

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Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
It was quite strange how things got out of Wallis's control - I don't think she was looking for anything more than a bit of fun, and she ended up being vilified as the woman who stole the king. The idea that a king, especially one who'd already had a load of other affairs which had all fizzled out, would abdicate to make an unsuitable marriage was unthinkable: I'm sure she never in a million years imagined that that was what he'd do. Until he did.
I doubt if it was "a bit of fun" to her.. it was an important feather in her cap, socially to be recognised as the mistress of the Prince of Wales. She enjoyed the holidays, the gifts, the admiration of certain people in Society.. It wasn't that she enjoyed it as a romp in the hay.... She probably thought that when the affair ended, and it would problaby have to end when he was kng and would be expected to get married - she would be given a generous set of jewels and would return ot her marriage, to the husband she cared for, and she'd have a nice nest egg.

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Originally Posted by Hallo girl View Post
I have read the situation like that also, they were trying to meet the right people in London , to improve their status , and basically hit the jackpot with the royal circle. From what I have read Wallis didn't intend to divorce Ernest, she was happy as things were and thought it could continue even when David became king. Likewise David thought he could marry Wallis and still be king.
There are very few photographs of them really smiling or happy , even on their wedding day they appeared subdued.I think that is why there has always been this idea that he spent the rest of his life regretting his actions or at least unhappy. Not sure if that is correct but there does appear to be evidence that they thought they could come back to the UK and just carry on as before , lead a party life style and do bits of work.
The rest is history as they say.
Yes, I think that they didn't seem to realise that they could not just be "still part of the RF " while he had walked out on his duty and kingship..
So the hard reality was
Tthey were barely received by the RF, there were no royal engagements, and they could not live in the UK... and also that after a while, the British public at lesast lost interest in them and their "great love affair" and didn't admire him any more for "giving up his throne for love". And I think he did not realise that he could not go on phoning Bertie and giving him advice.. that Bertie was now King and would get fed up and stop taking the calls..

I think that's why they looked subdued at their wedding.. they had had to marry abroad, none of the RF came and they had gottne some clergyman who agreed to marry them and was then told off by his Bishop..

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Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
Probably because he didn't actually intend to abdicate when he came to the throne. It appears that he, at least initially, thought he could tell the government that he was going to marry and that would be that. I think it really came as a bit of a shock to him when his plans weren't just blindly accepted by those around him.
I think he did the painting because it was expected.. but I think he was ambivalent abot the situation. He DID hope to marry Wallis and keep the throne.. but if the establishement would not wear it, that would give him a way out and part of him DID want a way out, he was scared/bored/put off, by the idea of being King..
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  #2123  
Old 03-06-2020, 04:07 PM
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As early as April 29, 1929 Time Magazine was reporting that Prince Edward (King Edward VIII) was expressing the view that he might renounce his rights to the throne.

Was Edward VIII concerned for the ceremonial and symbolic responsibilities of kingship?

When he was the Prince of Wales, did not Edward speak about any future accomplishments he would like to be involved with when he was the King?
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  #2124  
Old 03-08-2020, 02:17 PM
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Wallis Windsor - The story of two necklaces.
How the only gift from Queen Mary to her daughter-in-law Wallis Windsor was later added to and reworked by the glitz loving duchess.
Like mother-in-law like daughter-in-law?

https://worldofwallis.com/2020/03/08...mpression=true
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  #2125  
Old 03-09-2020, 06:20 AM
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Well, with the great mystery as to how that particular strand of Queen Mary's pearls came to be in the possession of the Windsors, for lack of any reasonable or plausible answer, I decided David probably nicked them from his mother feeling that his wife to be was deserving of at least some regal jewellery.
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  #2126  
Old 03-09-2020, 07:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MARG View Post
Well, with the great mystery as to how that particular strand of Queen Mary's pearls came to be in the possession of the Windsors, for lack of any reasonable or plausible answer, I decided David probably nicked them from his mother feeling that his wife to be was deserving of at least some regal jewellery.
Is that possible? I would doubt if Mary used to leave her necklaces out on her dressing table where David cuodl get his hands on them. It might be a very similar necklace or maybe it was a one off gesture from her, to his wife.. she idd not like the woman but she might have felt that just as she once or twice "sent a kindly message" to Wallis, she should give one gift...
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  #2127  
Old 03-09-2020, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
BP and the British Govt didn't like the visit to Germany in 1937. However they did little to stop it. They didn't like some of the WW2 financial shenanigans or some of David's actions as Governor in the Bahamas but he carried on regardless.

There would have been nothing BP could have done (beyond grumbling among courtiers) to prevent the Duke and Duchess adopting a range of charities in France. Many would only have been reported in France (and possibly the US.) The late 1940s and 1950s aren't like today with international news services 24/7.

The Duke and Duchess did nothing in that line (and David would have been effective. He was very much admired by British and Allied ex WW1 servicemen for example) because they didn't wish to. They liked their social life, or at least Wallis did and she took the lead, and that took preference.
I don't like them, but I wonder if it was a bit the case that if they had set themselves up as philanthropists, the BRF and even maybe the Brit Govt might have seen it as tryng to steal thunder. The RF had only started with doing a lot of charity work 20 or 30 years earlier.. so charities didn't have a long history of being part of the Royal working life. So perhaps there is some small excuse.
I agree that if David had really wanted to do something useful, he probably could have found a way of doing it, and he didn't really care that much, he followed Wallis' lead of their social life being their main occupation. I think that somewhere (I seem to remember reading this) that Wallis had said that David would have made a good car salesman, but of course that sort of occupation was wholly out of the question for a royal or ex royal at the time. so maybe tehre is some small nugget of truth that the sort of occupation that he might have enjoyed and been good at, was not open to him.. and he didn't seem to be able to find anything else to do. But I do think if he had had strong charitable instincts he might have found some way to make use of them... perhaps working for war refugees...
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  #2128  
Old 03-09-2020, 11:40 AM
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Going back to Victorian times, Princess Helena was involved with the Red Cross and nursing, and Prince Arthur was involved with the Boy Scouts, just to give two examples, so the Duke of Windsor was at least the 3rd generation to be involved with charities, but I don't think it was really his scene - he was more a talker than a doer.
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  #2129  
Old 03-10-2020, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
Going back to Victorian times, Princess Helena was involved with the Red Cross and nursing, and Prince Arthur was involved with the Boy Scouts, just to give two examples, so the Duke of Windsor was at least the 3rd generation to be involved with charities, but I don't think it was really his scene - he was more a talker than a doer.
True royals had some modest involvement with charity, like most gentlefolk...in the past but it was Geo V who started the idea that all the royals would get engaged with being seen out doing "engagements" and that it would be their justification for being royal.
He did seem to become more and more selfish as time went on.. that he just did not want to do anything unless he "really really wanted to do it". It had to be his choice and his pleasure. When Diana left the RF, though she cut back her charities I think she still had an instinct towards trying to help people and still "got something back" from trying to do that... and went on with some fo the work.
I don't know If the BRF might have seen it as thunder stealing if he say took up serviceman's charities but there were other things tht he could have done.. instead he and Wallis just ended up with this aimless social life.
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  #2130  
Old 03-10-2020, 12:46 PM
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I suppose he grew up in the days of the upper-classes and the (for lack of a nicer expression) nouveaux riches doing the Season and then going from one house party to another … he was only around 20 when the First World War broke out, and that lifestyle began to die out then, but it was still going in the 1920s. He just stuck with that sort of life, even though society was changing.
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  #2131  
Old 03-10-2020, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
I suppose he grew up in the days of the upper-classes and the (for lack of a nicer expression) nouveaux riches doing the Season and then going from one house party to another … he was only around 20 when the First World War broke out, and that lifestyle began to die out then, but it was still going in the 1920s. He just stuck with that sort of life, even though society was changing.
of course yes it was the lifestyle of the upper classes Edwardian and Victorian - but at least some of them had some duties.. managing estates, being in Parliament, charity things. David had had 20 years of doing royal duties, which he did fairly well but with a lot of complaining abuot how boring it all was. but I think that when he abdicated, he WAS bored... and while he didn't mind the social life, I think that was more Wallis' thing than his. If he had been a reader, he might have put in the empty hours studying or reading.. He had his garden but it seems that that was about it.
there Is that well known story of his telling some American Lady how he had put In the day, waiting for Wallis to finish her French lesson, watching American soldiers playng football, and clearly feeling miserable.
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  #2132  
Old 03-11-2020, 11:27 AM
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I dont think that was the case though? I understood that Wallis received everything and it was her own property absolutely.. Because Im sure I've read that Mountbatten tried to persuade her to leave her property back to the RF or in some way, but it was her property and she could choose to do what she liked with it..
Having looked at some stuff, it appears that Mountbatten did try to persuade hr to leave stuff back to the RF and/or England but after a while, Wallis grew annoyed at his pushing and wrote to him to say that she didn't want to discuss her Will or where to leave her things, and that he was to stop it..
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  #2133  
Old 03-31-2020, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
David just looked very sad as an older man - it's in his eyes. I'm not saying he regretted abdicating, but no matter how he acted, no matter what kind of dilettante he was, I'm sure down deep he still loved and missed his family. I don't think he ever expected that he'd essentially never see them again. Of course he behaved badly, but by the time he was an old man, weakened with age, those days were a long time ago. It's a rather pathetic life.
Yeah... I don't really agree with all the hatred, that David gets from some people. Rather, I feel sorry for him.
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  #2134  
Old 03-31-2020, 07:08 AM
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Originally Posted by MARG View Post
Sadly he seemed to spend his entire life buying expensive trinkets to keep Wallis happy. Sadly, a cache of letters discovered in the late 20th century proved once and for all that she didn't love him, never had and had never intended to divorce the love of her life, Earnest, whilst for him she was the love of his life.
Right... But if Earnest was the love of her life, why did she have an affair with David?
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  #2135  
Old 03-31-2020, 09:27 AM
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Right... But if Earnest was the love of her life, why did she have an affair with David?
He was rich and the Prince of Wales..
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  #2136  
Old 04-01-2020, 02:47 PM
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Yeah... I don't really agree with all the hatred, that David gets from some people. Rather, I feel sorry for him.
Believe me, David’s actions bother me a great deal - his selfishness as a younger man was outrageous, ever after his brother had become king. I do feel sorry for the old man he became ...
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  #2137  
Old 04-01-2020, 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
Believe me, David’s actions bother me a great deal - his selfishness as a younger man was outrageous, ever after his brother had become king. I do feel sorry for the old man he became ...
I woudlnt waste any sympathy on either of them. They led a life of luxury, even during the War when Britain suffered privations. Then after the War they led a very comfortable life, with no taxes, In France...
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  #2138  
Old 04-01-2020, 05:40 PM
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I woudlnt waste any sympathy on either of them. They led a life of luxury, even during the War when Britain suffered privations. Then after the War they led a very comfortable life, with no taxes, In France...
Privations continued after the war as well. For many years in fact. Some rationing remained until 1954. So, no it's hard to feel sorry for them although at the same time there is so much pathos in the sight of a former British monarch leading an empty existence in cafe society.
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  #2139  
Old 04-01-2020, 10:05 PM
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But as we've discussed here, that was the choice both he and Wallis made, at least when they were both younger and in good health. Nothing was stopping either of them from doing good in the world, taking up some charity work instead of filling their days with luncheons and dinner parties and trans-Atlantic jaunts on the big ocean liners. They just weren't interested.
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  #2140  
Old 04-02-2020, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Curryong View Post
But as we've discussed here, that was the choice both he and Wallis made, at least when they were both younger and in good health. Nothing was stopping either of them from doing good in the world, taking up some charity work instead of filling their days with luncheons and dinner parties and trans-Atlantic jaunts on the big ocean liners. They just weren't interested.
I think that David at least got worse and more selfish as he got older. He did do a respectable job at the Tours and so on as POW and he was involved In charities for ex servicemen, wasn't he? But I think he got fed up with it all and just wanted to have no "duties" in his post King life. Or maybe he followed Wallis' lead. I don't think she was ever interested in charity wrok, I don't know if it was an American tradition among "society ladies" in the US in her time, to do charity wrok (I am not disparaging American women, just that I don't know much about "high Society" in the US)…
I think if there was anything "sad" about it, it was that David DID probably feel very bored with nothing planned for him. He was used to someone organising his life and giving him thngs to do.. but IMO He had no strong interests of his own, it seems except gardening. So when he lost his work, as POW, he didn't have anything to do or the initiave to sort out a new life for himself....
I think Wallis was happy enough running her house, organising parties, traveling, buying clothes, going to parties etc... but he wasn't all that fond of it. I got the feeling that while he liked a life of leisure, he didn't want to go out dancing and dining.. he fancied a quiet life of leisure...
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