Hypothetical- Succession to the brother of the king instead of the son

[Daenerys]

Hello everyone!
I'm new here :) I recently developed an interest to the monarchy system and I'm glad to have found this forum, I've found already a lot of answers!

I have an hypothetical question though:

A king dies, survived by her queen and a son who's the prince (adult).
(let's say we are in the UK today).

Is there a way for the brother of the king to get to the throne? (without killing the nephew and her mother?)

I'm guessing he's 2nd in line for the Throne, correct?

Is there a law, or rule where he can say that the prince is incompetent and take the throne for himself?


Sorry for the weird question

[Tatiana Maria]

That would naturally depend on the factors involved in the succession to that specific monarchy, including what the laws of succession are (does the brother have a better legal claim than the son?) and its political situation (e.g., is the son politically less popular than the brother?).

There is a general thread for rules of royal succession so you may want to ask your question there.

Rules of Succession

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by Daenerys

Hello everyone!
I'm new here :) I recently developed an interest to the monarchy system and I'm glad to have found this forum, I've found already a lot of answers!

I have an hypothetical question though:

A king dies, survived by her queen and a son who's the prince (adult).
(let's say we are in the UK today).

Is there a way for the brother of the king to get to the throne? (without killing the nephew and her mother?)

I'm guessing he's 2nd in line for the Throne, correct?

Is there a law, or rule where he can say that the prince is incompetent and take the throne for himself?


Sorry for the weird question

The most successions follow the closest order of consanguity:

1. The King

1.1 eldest child of the King
1.1.1 first child of the eldest child of the King
1.1.2 second child of the eldest child of the King
1.1.3 third child of the eldest child of the King

1.2 Second child of the King
1.2.1 first child of the second eldest child of the King
1.2.2 second child of the second eldest child of the King
1.2.3 third child of the second eldest child of the King

1.3 Third child of the King
1.3.1 first child of the third eldest child of the King
1.3.2 second child of the third eldest child of the King
1.3.3 third child of the third eldest child of the King

2. Eldest sibling of the King

2.1 eldest child of the eldest sibling of the King
2.1.1 first child of the first child of the first sibling of the King
2.1.2 second child of the first child of the first sibling of the King
2.1.3 third child of the first child of the first sibling of the King

2.2 second child of the eldest sibling of the King
2.2.1 first child of the second child of the first sibling of the King
2.2.2 second child of the second child of the first sibling of the King
2.2.3 third child of the second child of the first sibling of the King

Etc. Etc. Etc.

In some Constitutions a successor can be excluded from the succession indeed. In my country (the Netherlands) by engaging into marriage without an Act of Consent. Or by Parliament voting (with a 2/3rd majority) to abjure a successor.

[Daenerys]

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

That would naturally depend on the factors involved in the succession to that specific monarchy, including what the laws of succession are (does the brother have a better legal claim than the son?) and its political situation (e.g., is the son politically less popular than the brother?).

There is a general thread for rules of royal succession so you may want to ask your question there.

Rules of Succession

thank you ! i'll ask there as well!
Yes, let's say that the prince is less popular than the brother politically speaking!

is there a monarchy where the brother can have a better legal claim than the son of the king?

[Daenerys]

Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair

The most successions follow the closest order of consanguity:

1. The King

1.1 eldest child of the King
1.1.1 first child of the eldest child of the King
1.1.2 second child of the eldest child of the King
1.1.3 third child of the eldest child of the King

1.2 Second child of the King
1.2.1 first child of the second eldest child of the King
1.2.2 second child of the second eldest child of the King
1.2.3 third child of the second eldest child of the King

1.3 Third child of the King
1.3.1 first child of the third eldest child of the King
1.3.2 second child of the third eldest child of the King
1.3.3 third child of the third eldest child of the King

2. Eldest sibling of the King

2.1 eldest child of the eldest sibling of the King
2.1.1 first child of the first child of the first sibling of the King
2.1.2 second child of the first child of the first sibling of the King
2.1.3 third child of the first child of the first sibling of the King

2.2 second child of the eldest sibling of the King
2.2.1 first child of the second child of the first sibling of the King
2.2.2 second child of the second child of the first sibling of the King
2.2.3 third child of the second child of the first sibling of the King

Etc. Etc. Etc.

In some Constitutions a successor can be excluded from the succession indeed. In my country (the Netherlands) by engaging into marriage without an Act of Consent. Or by Parliament voting (with a 2/3rd majority) to abjure a successor.

thank you!
oh yes, so the parliament can decide that the prince isn't fit to rule and give the throne to the king's brother!
this seems the most doable indeed.
So the wife of the deceased king and her son will be stripped of their titles? or the will mantain their royal status but wihtout the possibility to ever get back to the throne?

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by Daenerys

thank you!
oh yes, so the parliament can decide that the prince isn't fit to rule and give the throne to the king's brother!
this seems the most doable indeed.
So the wife of the deceased king and her son will be stripped of their titles? or the will mantain their royal status but wihtout the possibility to ever get back to the throne?

Parliament can rule that a successor looses his rights but even then not automatically the King's brother will inherit.

Imagine that the British Parliament votes to have the Prince of Wales is stripped of his rights. Then not his brother Prince Harry, the Duke of Sussex, will become the successor, but the eldest child of the Prince of Wales: Prince George. Then Princess Charlotte. Then Prince Louis.

(But most likely such a vote will lead to the fall of the monarchy anyway).

[Daenerys]

Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair

Parliament can rule that a successor looses his rights but even then not automatically the King's brother will inherit.

Imagine that the British Parliament votes to have the Prince of Wales is stripped of his rights. Then not his brother Prince Harry, the Duke of Sussex, will become the successor, but the eldest child of the Prince of Wales: Prince George. Then Princess Charlotte. Then Prince Louis.

(But most likely such a vote will lead to the fall of the monarchy anyway).

ok I see, it might go to Harry only if William didn't have children basically

[Tatiana Maria]

Originally Posted by Daenerys

is there a monarchy where the brother can have a better legal claim than the son of the king?

I think the Saudi tradition until recently was to appoint a brother of the king as heir, although legally any male member of the royal family is eligible be appointed.

[SLV]

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

I think the Saudi tradition until recently was to appoint a brother of the king as heir, although legally any male member of the royal family is eligible be appointed.

In Jordan was well, I believe.

[Daenerys]

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

I think the Saudi tradition until recently was to appoint a brother of the king as heir, although legally any male member of the royal family is eligible be appointed.

so the brother of the king comes before the son?
or do they have another system to choose?

[ruaudladoube]

Originally Posted by Daenerys

so the brother of the king comes before the son?
or do they have another system to choose?

Saudi succession has traditionally been that the eldest (or most capable) male in the family succeed the ruling king. For many decades, the sons of King Abdulaziz have succeeded to the throne. Abdul Aziz died in 1953 and six of his sons have succeeded since. The current king, Salman, is reportedly the 25th son of Abdulaziz, who supposedly had 45 sons.

As the sons of Abdulaziz are aging (King Salman is 87), the next Crown Prince has been chosen from the next generation. Unless he were to change the traditional succession, he will likely be succeeded by a brother (he has at least 11 brothers), though a cousin is also possible.

The selection of the Crown Prince is the decision of the King, but needs the support of the majority of the males in the family, as I understand it.

[CyrilVladisla]

Originally Posted by Daenerys

thank you!
oh yes, so the parliament can decide that the prince isn't fit to rule and give the throne to the king's brother!
this seems the most doable indeed.
So the wife of the deceased king and her son will be stripped of their titles? or the will mantain their royal status but wihtout the possibility to ever get back to the throne?

The wife of the deceased king might keep her title of Queen. She might have the title of Queen Dowager.

[Toledo]

This reminds me of the Saudi Kingdom customs to select the next king via family meeting and not a father-to-son line.

[Daenerys]

thank you all for your answers!