Royals Visiting The Pope

[Marchesina]

If now Princess Charlene was allowed to dress in white when visiting the Pope, why was she wearing black during the Inaugural Mass of Pope Francis?
And since, as I understood, she never converted to Protestantism, can it be possible for queen-to-be Maxima to wear white when she will be visiting the pope in the future?

 

[NGalitzine]

If now Princess Charlene was allowed to dress in white when visiting the Pope, why was she wearing black during the Inaugural Mass of Pope Francis?
And since, as I understood, she never converted to Protestantism, can it be possible for queen-to-be Maxima to wear white when she will be visiting the pope in the future?

Charlene was received into the Roman Catholic faith prior to her wedding in 2011. Having the right to wear white does not mean you are obliged to wear white, it is still a personal choice.

Maxima may be a Roman Catholic but she is not a Cathloic monarch nor is she married to a Catholic monarch. According to the Vatican statement when Charlen wore white in January the privilege du blanc was for female Catholic monarchs and the wives of Catholic monarchs.

 

[maria-olivia]

A Visit is not an Inauguration.
In the past, Princess Grace and Princess Gina were always in black as Serene Highnesses, Queen Sophia, Queen Fabiola and Grand Duchess Josephine Charlotte
in "blanc" as Royal Highnesses .

 

[An Ard Ri]

A Visit is not an Inauguration.
In the past, Princess Grace and Princess Gina were always in black as Serene Highnesses, Queen Sophia, Queen Fabiola and Grand Duchess Josephine Charlotte
in "blanc" as Royal Highnesses .

Exactly it wasn't a private visit or audience it was a Papal Inauguration Ceremony Mass which is a very solemn event for Roman Catholics.

I'm pretty sure that the remaining European Royal Houses are aware of Papal protocol.

 

[Saschana]

Former Princesses of Liechtenstein and Princesses of Monaco wore black because they did not have the privilège du blanc. The privilege was granted to Most Catholic Monarchs, later more commonly known as Most Catholic Majesties, or their wives. The only remaining Most Catholic Majesties are the King of Spain, the King of the Belgians and the Grand Duke of Luxembourg. The title was given to one of their respective ancestors and is hereditary unless taken away by the Pope. To become a Most Catholic Majesty, one was to embody Catholic principles both in your private life as well as your state decisions.

Back in January, the Vatican press office said that the privilege had been extended to Princess Charlene. This would mean that - unless the Vatican changed the rules for Monaco - Prince Albert has become a Most Catholic Majesty.

If Princess Charlene has been granted the privilege, she would have been allowed to wear white for the inaugural mass. Usually, the women granted with the privilege chose to wear black for papal funerals or for private visits (like Grand Duchess Josephine-Charlotte in 2000).

And regarding Princess Maxima: No, she would not be allowed to wear white as the is not the wife of a Most Catholic Monarch.

 

[maria-olivia]

The actual Princess of Monaco knew perfectly the dress code for an Inauguration.
Well done and Amen!

 

[princess gertrude]

Former Princesses of Liechtenstein and Princesses of Monaco wore black because they did not have the privilège du blanc. The privilege was granted to Most Catholic Monarchs, later more commonly known as Most Catholic Majesties, or their wives. The only remaining Most Catholic Majesties are the King of Spain, the King of the Belgians and the Grand Duke of Luxembourg. The title was given to one of their respective ancestors and is hereditary unless taken away by the Pope. To become a Most Catholic Majesty, one was to embody Catholic principles both in your private life as well as your state decisions.

Back in January, the Vatican press office said that the privilege had been extended to Princess Charlene. This would mean that - unless the Vatican changed the rules for Monaco - Prince Albert has become a Most Catholic Majesty.

If Princess Charlene has been granted the privilege, she would have been allowed to wear white for the inaugural mass. Usually, the women granted with the privilege chose to wear black for papal funerals or for private visits (like Grand Duchess Josephine-Charlotte in 2000).

And regarding Princess Maxima: No, she would not be allowed to wear white as the is not the wife of a Most Catholic Monarch.

Thanks so much for the information.
Personally, since seeing her wear black to the Mass this week, I keep thinking that someone messed up and she ended up wearing white at the audience when she probably should not have. Thus the Vatican helped take some of the heat off of her and put out a statement. Realizing her mistake, she wore black this week, since indeed she would be in the presence of women that do have the privilage. A humble opinion of course.
Another thing, I love Pope Francis so far! And I'm not even Catholic!!

 

[An Ard Ri]

Former Princesses of Liechtenstein and Princesses of Monaco wore black because they did not have the privilège du blanc. The privilege was granted to Most Catholic Monarchs, later more commonly known as Most Catholic Majesties, or their wives. The only remaining Most Catholic Majesties are the King of Spain, the King of the Belgians and the Grand Duke of Luxembourg. The title was given to one of their respective ancestors and is hereditary unless taken away by the Pope. To become a Most Catholic Majesty, one was to embody Catholic principles both in your private life as well as your state decisions.

Back in January, the Vatican press office said that the privilege had been extended to Princess Charlene. This would mean that - unless the Vatican changed the rules for Monaco - Prince Albert has become a Most Catholic Majesty.

If Princess Charlene has been granted the privilege, she would have been allowed to wear white for the inaugural mass. Usually, the women granted with the privilege chose to wear black for papal funerals or for private visits (like Grand Duchess Josephine-Charlotte in 2000).

And regarding Princess Maxima: No, she would not be allowed to wear white as the is not the wife of a Most Catholic Monarch.

It was anounced in January of this year that Pope Benedict XVI had indeed granted The Princess of Monaco the Privilège du blanc.The Grand Duke of Luxembourg is not a Most Catholic Majesty,he's a Catholic Monarch but a Prince non the less and styled HRH and not H.M.

Prince Albert II is a reigning Catholic Monarch as the head of state of the Principality of Monaco.

 

[KittyAtlanta]

Charlene may have chosen to wear black as it is Lent.

 

[Saschana]

It was anounced in January of this year that Pope Benedict XVI had indeed granted The Princess of Monaco the Privilège du blanc.The Grand Duke of Luxembourg is not a Most Catholic Majesty,he's a Catholic Monarch but a Prince non the less and styled HRH and not H.M.

Prince Albert II is a reigning Catholic Monarch as the head of state of the Principality of Monaco.

Traditionally, you can't be granted the privilège du blanc but you or your husband can be granted the title of a Most Catholic Monarch / Majesty. Originally, the title was Most Catholic Monarch but later changed to Most Catholic Majesty though you did not have to be a Majesty to get the title, case in point was Grand Duchess Charlotte. In fact, the Latin version of the title isRex Catholicissimus which literally translates to Catholic King. Nevertheless there were also Holy Roman and Austrian Emperors who held the title.

Simply being a Catholic monarch is not enough!

Everyone saying that Princess Charlene, despite having the privilège du blanc, was right to wear black because it was a solemn occassion and not an official visit would implicate that Grand Duchess Maria Teresa of Luxembourg and Queen Paola of the Belgians made a grave mistakes. And not only this time but also at the inaugural mass of Pope Benedict XVI as did Queen Sofia of Spain and Grand Duchess Josephine-Charlotte at the inaugural masses of Pope John Paul I and Pope John Paul II.

Of course, she could have done it by choice but I'm inclined to be with princess gertrude that the mistake was indeed done in January.

 

[Pranter]

Surely Monaco (those who are supposed to know) would be advising Albert and Charlene as to proper attire??


LaRae

 

[Jacknch]

I think someone is going to have to contact the palace in Monaco or the Vatican to solve the issue once and for all! The Vatican has granted Charlene the privelage du blanc. She therefore wore White when she met Benedict but not so for the inauguration mass. She can't have made an error nor would Paola or Marie-Therese.
Maybe her White outfit is at the dry cleaners or something happened to it that morning or it got stolen or was forgotten to be packed or she just woke up and thought "I feel like confusing everyone at TRF so I'll wear black not White" or simply prefers to wear black at a Mass and White at an audience.

 

[An Ard Ri]

I think someone is going to have to contact the palace in Monaco or the Vatican to solve the issue once and for all! The Vatican has granted Charlene the privelage du blanc. She therefore wore White when she met Benedict but not so for the inauguration mass. She can't have made an error nor would Paola or Marie-Therese.
Maybe her White outfit is at the dry cleaners or something happened to it that morning or it got stolen or was forgotten to be packed or she just woke up and thought "I feel like confusing everyone at TRF so I'll wear black not White" or simply prefers to wear black at a Mass and White at an audience.

Why not volunteer and solve this enigma?

 

[gerry]

Why not volunteer and solve this enigma?

I must admit that I have lost track of when white was worn, but because the Prince and Princess of Monaco maintain a Facebook site, contact to resolve this contentious issue should be easy for those who REALLY want to resolve the question.

 

[Grandma828]

Why does anyone care?

 

[USCtrojan]

Queen Sofia at the inaugural mass of Pope Benedict.

What does the Queen wear under her veil to hold it high like that?

 

[jneugeba]

I personally think she pulled a "Cherie" and should not have dressed in white for the earlier visit. I can't see any reason why the priviledge would have been granted to her and Albert when it had never been before to the family.

 

[Marchesina]

Charlene was received into the Roman Catholic faith prior to her wedding in 2011. Having the right to wear white does not mean you are obliged to wear white, it is still a personal choice.

Maxima may be a Roman Catholic but she is not a Cathloic monarch nor is she married to a Catholic monarch. According to the Vatican statement when Charlen wore white in January the privilege du blanc was for female Catholic monarchs and the wives of Catholic monarchs.

So one has to be a monarch in her own right and not by marriage (when you're husband is not Catholic). Ok...such a pity, though. I would have loved to see Maxima wearing white.
About Charlene, of course it's a personal choice but if it's called a privilege, I assume it's something you should be happy to show anytime you can. Also, this was a joyful occasion (if it was a funeral I would have understood, no one wore white for John Paul II's funeral mass). anyway, it was her personal choice and I totally respect that

 

[NGalitzine]

Was it also a mistake for the late Grand Duchess Josephine Charlotte to appear in black at the Vatican on occassion, or was it simply a choice she made?
If Charlene had made a mistake in January it would have been smarter for The Vatican to issue no statement at all on the matter instead of saying she and the other wives of Catholic monarchs have the privilege du blanc ( note a privilege is not an obligation).

 

[KittyAtlanta]

I think many people participating here would go to great lengths to prove that Charlene does not have the privilege of white, even though the Vatican has confirmed that she does have the privilege.

 

[Ish]

I think many people participating here would go to great lengths to prove that Charlene does not have the privilege of white, even though the Vatican has confirmed that she does have the privilege.

I don't think it's a case of we're trying to prove that she doesn't have it so much as it's a case of we're confused as to why she does have it - the requirements are not simply a case of being a monarch/monarch's wife that is Catholic, and beyond the religious connection Monaco does not meet said requirements.

 

[NGalitzine]

I don't think it's a case of we're trying to prove that she doesn't have it so much as it's a case of we're confused as to why she does have it - the requirements are not simply a case of being a monarch/monarch's wife that is Catholic, and beyond the religious connection Monaco does not meet said requirements.

Then I suggest you go back and read the statement from The Vatican Press Office in January 2013. They seemed pretty clear that the Privilege du Blanc applied to all Catholic monarchs or the wives of said Catholic monarchs. One assumes that they actually do know what the rules/requirements are or are not being that they do speak on behalf of 'The Vatican".
The rules that may have applied in earlier times are not necessarily applicable anymore. There are fewer monarchs than in the old days and even fewer that are Catholic. Even The Vatican has to change with the times, even though it may take decades or even centuries for them to do so.

 

[kbk]

Then I suggest you go back and read the statement from The Vatican Press Office in January 2013. They seemed pretty clear that the Privilege du Blanc applied to all Catholic monarchs or the wives of said Catholic monarchs. One assumes that they actually do know what the rules/requirements are or are not being that they do speak on behalf of 'The Vatican".
The rules that may have applied in earlier times are not necessarily applicable anymore. There are fewer monarchs than in the old days and even fewer that are Catholic. Even The Vatican has to change with the times, even though it may take decades or even centuries for them to do so.

Can you actually quote that statement here? What exactly does it say? Is it true then that the Prince of Monaco was given the very old and special status of, let's name it, Most Catholic monarch (Catholicissimus; the titles vary on certain monarchs)? Because historically, the privilege du blanc (not eiglibility to wear white while visiting the Pope in general) was accorded to the consorts of the said Catholic monarchs (and by Catholic I mean not all those of Catholic faith) and the monarchs themselves if they were females, of course.

The rules that may have applied in earlier times are not necessarily applicable anymore. There are fewer monarchs than in the old days and even fewer that are Catholic. Even The Vatican has to change with the times, even though it may take decades or even centuries for them to do so.

I totally agree with you that today the ancient privilege du blanc is not applicable anymore. Everyone, especially Charlese and other women of her status, can absolutely wear white in the Vatican or any other colour they feel is appropriate to wear in front of the Pope. But if we are talking about the privilege we can't change the ancient rules. The Pope can, of cource, but do you have any proof that he did so? Just because the Princess of Monaco wore white once in the Vatican and that its press officers stated that it was not inappropriate for her to do so, means nothing. Many other high-profile women before her without the privilege du blanc wore dresses in other than black colour while visiting the Pope. Cherie Blair's faux pas from several years ago is well-known. I also remind seeing a picture of Danuta Walesowa, the wife of former Polish President Lech Walesa, wearing white during an audience with Pope John Paul II. Gorbachov's wife wore red. Both female Presidents of the Irish Republic did not wear black while visiting the Pope.

 

[GömdNatt]

Can you actually quote that statement here? What exactly does it say? Is it true then that the Prince of Monaco was given the very old and special status of, let's name it, Most Catholic monarch (Catholicissimus; the titles vary on certain monarchs)? Because historically, the privilege du blanc (not eiglibility to wear white while visiting the Pope in general) was accorded to the consorts of the said Catholic monarchs (and by Catholic I mean not all those of Catholic faith) and the monarchs themselves if they were females, of course.


I totally agree with you that today the ancient privilege du blanc is not applicable anymore. Everyone, especially Charlese and other women of her status, can absolutely wear white in the Vatican or any other colour they feel is appropriate to wear in front of the Pope. But if we are talking about the privilege we can't change the ancient rules. The Pope can, of cource, but do you have any proof that he did so? Just because the Princess of Monaco wore white once in the Vatican and that its press officers stated that it was not inappropriate for her to do so, means nothing. Many other high-profile women before her without the privilege du blanc wore dresses in other than black colour while visiting the Pope. Cherie Blair's faux pas from several years ago is well-known. I also remind seeing a picture of Danuta Walesowa, the wife of former Polish President Lech Walesa, wearing white during an audience with Pope John Paul II. Gorbachov's wife wore red. Both female Presidents of the Irish Republic did not wear black while visiting the Pope.

you're grasping at straws. Who cares what these non royal women did? We're not talking about non royalty, we're talking about royals. And so what if they wore other colors? Did the Vatican then release a statement saying they were afford privilege du blanc? No, so it matters not.

the point is that Charlene wore white when meeting with Benedict and the Vatican said she could. Why she wore black to the inauguration of Francis is a moot point. Privilege is a privilege, but it doesn't mean you always have to wear white. As someone else pointed out, Josephine-Charlotte once wore black even though she had the privilege. It is a privilege, not law.

 

[jneugeba]

I will be interested to see if the Queen of Lesotho and/or the Princess of Liechtenstein use their new found ability to wear white. I'm still not buying it.

 

[Lee-Z]

I will be interested to see if the Queen of Lesotho and/or the Princess of Liechtenstein use their new found ability to wear white. I'm still not buying it.

Even if you never see them wear white it doesn't "prove" anything...as said many times before, it is a privilige not a 'must'

it seems you only want to hear that Charlene messed up, but obviously she didn't as the Vatican issued a statement that she it was okay for her to wear white.

Whether it was okay because the rules wrre changed or because the rules were the same but she was granted the privilige is another thing, but Charlene did NOT make a mistake in the eyes of the Vatican and that is all that matters in this case...

 

[An Ard Ri]

King And Queen Of Spain visit the Pope in 1923

King And Queen Of Spain (1923) - YouTube

 

[An Ard Ri]

TSH Prince Rainier III & Princess Grace of Monaco visit the Pope in 1957

Princess Grace Visits The Pope (1957) - YouTube

 

[Lee-Z]

King And Queen Of Spain visit the Pope in 1923

King And Queen Of Spain (1923) - YouTube

Bit of a shame they don't show King, Queen or Pope...but i expect that they didn't realise at the time that 90 years later the whole world could still see the footage

 

[CyrilVladisla]

When Prince Albert and Princess Charlene of Monaco visited Pope Benedict XVI, they gave the Pontiff a book about Cardinal Jerome Grimaldi (1595-1685).
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