Bowing and Curtseying

[marmi]

Watching the above link, I must say I found it quite rude of Princess Marie to not even acknowledge the crowd as she left the car. Poor form!

Form which will hopefully improve with time

 

[Madame Royale]

Hopefully when Marie has been married the same amount of time she too will have impeccable manners, or is it just the ability to "make like a duck"!

You mean Marie having "made like a duck"?

I just observed with interest how she left the car and didn't even so much as look at the waiting public before joining Joachim on the steps. He waved of course. He always does (god bless his designer cotton socks...)

Manners (whether impeccable or otherwise) come not with marriage, I'd have thought.

so in future will behave accordingly and greet the gathered crowd in a most recommendable way.

I hope you're right.

 

[Jo of Palatine]

Y
I just observed with interest how she left the car and didn't even so much as look at the waiting public before joining Joachim on the steps. He waved of course. He always does (god bless his designer cotton socks...)

Manners (whether impeccable or otherwise) come not with marriage, I'd have thought.

Marie comes from a French family of the Bourgeoisie with connection to the nobility and attended a reknown finishing school in Switzerland, thus I'd dare say she has impeccable manners. Still, it's not easy to be thrown into a Royal existance and so far, she did well. I don't think you learn to curtsey before the queen in any finishing school or professor's household anymore, so she obviously took her cue from Mary who had to learn it as well as a young wife.

 

[Menarue]

Well Marie will do well to follow Mary´s cue as she has done remarkably well.

I remember a highly born Englishman who had the wonderful sobriquet of "the rudest man in England" everyone used to like to meet him to see for themselves.
Being highly born doesn´t give manners for sure, but a finishing school is a good place to learn.
A friend´s father a colonel in the old Indian army was a very good polo player and it was said that people travelled all India to HEAR him playing..... that always makes me smile.
Marie will learn. She seems to be wearing almost identical clothes to Mary which makes them both very "chic".

 

[MARG]

You mean Marie having "made like a duck"?

No, no. I was forgetting that some expressions don't travel well internationally. My apologies. I was in such a hurry that the hamster fell off the wheel.

The term "Make like a duck" means to copy a duck. . . smoothly gliding effortlessly across the water but, underneath the water those little webbed feet are going like the clappers! So it was with Marie. She smiled, she shook hands and nodded elegantly, then scooted up those stairs like the hounds of hell were after her. Or more correctly, to her husband who was waiting with his arm out for her to join him. Ah romance!

Manners (whether impeccable or otherwise) come not with marriage, I'd have thought.

And you would be absolutely correct. However, I was thinking more along the lines of "when she has been married to a royal Prince the same amount of time that Mary has, she will most probably be as graciously polished as Mary has become".

Marie's curtsey was too deep.

magnik, when you are curtseying to your Mother-In-Law it is never too deep!

 

[Madame Royale]

Marie comes from a French family of the Bourgeoisie with connection to the nobility and attended a reknown finishing school in Switzerland, thus I'd dare say she has impeccable manners.

Then I'd have expected better from her...

Still, it's not easy to be thrown into a Royal existance and so far, she did well.

I wouldn't have considered her to have been thrown into a royal existance, myself. She has had, what I'd consider to be, ample time to accustom herself with the bare necessities of a royal existance. And acknowledging an awaiting crowd is dare I say, a no brainer.

I don't think you learn to curtsey before the queen in any finishing school or professor's household anymore, so she obviously took her cue from Mary who had to learn it as well as a young wife

Compared with their British counterparts, the continental royals seem to observe a curtsy of impressive depth...quite interesting and always a delight to see...

 

[Menarue]

No, no. I was forgetting that some expressions don't travel well internationally. My apologies. I was in such a hurry that the hamster fell off the wheel.

The term "Make like a duck" means to copy a duck. . . smoothly gliding effortlessly across the water but, underneath the water those little webbed feet are going like the clappers! So it was with Marie. She smiled, she shook hands and nodded elegantly, then scooted up those stairs like the hounds of hell were after her. Or more correctly, to her husband who was waiting with his arm out for her to join him. Ah romance!

Marg you have made my day, just imagining that little duck paddling like an old paddle-steamer and keeping his serene little duck expression above water. Priceless.
Someone said that Frederick didn´t wait for Mary but Joaquim waited for Marie - well I think Frederick has been married a little longer than Joaquim....

 

[carlota]

Then I'd have expected better from her...

what did she do? i can't recall any flaws in her (very short) time as princess.

Marie comes from a French family of the Bourgeoisie with connection to the nobility and attended a reknown finishing school in Switzerland, thus I'd dare say she has impeccable manners.

i agree. i have no doubt she will do well. her education seemed to be perfect, or quite appropriate, for her current role.

 

[Jo of Palatine]

Then I'd have expected better from her...

Madame, Madame, I wish I could see a "reality show" on TV with you in the role of a Royal princess. I know that I in this case would walk from error to error - curtsey 0,5 cms too low/high, ankle of hand winking 0,5 cms too sassy/shy.... You get the picture.

 

[Iain]

The Bible says nothing about men going without covering their heads and women must. That is a manmade relgious dictum.

1stCor.Ch 11Every man praying or prophesying with his head covered, disgraceth his head. But every woman praying or prophesying with her head not covered, disgraceth her head: for it is all one as if she were shaven.
For if a woman be not covered, let her be shorn. But if it be a shame to a woman to be shorn or made bald, let her cover her head.

 

[Madame Royale]

You get the picture

I 'get' that adding a flower doesn't necessarily disguise sarcasm...

And I'm not one for reality TV, so don't wish too hard..hehe.

what did she do? i can't recall any flaws in her (very short) time as princess.

Oh no, it is but one instance that I talk of....Refer to previous page if it so pleases you for a response, for within my statement you shall find your answer.

 

[Madame Royale]

No, no. I was forgetting that some expressions don't travel well internationally. My apologies. I was in such a hurry that the hamster fell off the wheel.

Not a problem, MARG. I wasn't sure, so thought it best I ask..haha

The term "Make like a duck" means to copy a duck. . . smoothly gliding effortlessly across the water but, underneath the water those little webbed feet are going like the clappers! So it was with Marie. She smiled, she shook hands and nodded elegantly, then scooted up those stairs like the hounds of hell were after her. Or more correctly, to her husband who was waiting with his arm out for her to join him. Ah romance!

Hahaha...How I do enjoy your posts...

 

[Queen Angelique]

Compared with their British counterparts, the continental royals seem to observe a curtsy of impressive depth...quite interesting and always a delight to see...

Very much so! Delightful, beautiful and I believe, as it should be..

Angelique

 

[COUNTESS]

1stCor.Ch 11Every man praying or prophesying with his head covered, disgraceth his head. But every woman praying or prophesying with her head not covered, disgraceth her head: for it is all one as if she were shaven.
For if a woman be not covered, let her be shorn. But if it be a shame to a woman to be shorn or made bald, let her cover her head.

Nice try. New testament. Written by men. Some believe in the New Testament. Some only the Old. All written by men. God, who loves all people, doesn't care one way or the other. That's why he created all people in his image and loves them all. Bowing and curtseying is still an archaic form of obdience. It is not respect, it is demeaning. You can nod, shake hands and smile. No man is beneath another.

 

[Queen Angelique]

Bow or Curtsy..........

Nice try. New testament. Written by men. Some believe in the New Testament. Some only the Old. All written by men. God, who loves all people, doesn't care one way or the other. That's why he created all people in his image and loves them all. Bowing and curtseying is still an archaic form of obdience. It is not respect, it is demeaning. You can nod, shake hands and smile. No man is beneath another.

Dear Countess,

I agree, both the old and new testament were instrumental in setting up the overly patriarchal society that continues to this day, albeit not as extreme as before. And indeed, our Divine Friend does not care one way or the other. The formalities and formal observances are not the real thing.... The real depth lies in one's state of mind; the sincerity and purity of Love.

However, I have to say that I do not agree with you regarding bowing and curtsying. In itself they are not demeaning, since that depends on one's own attitude and intention. It is never the act itself that matters, but with what attitude it is performed. Are you saying that loving respect and admiration/adoration is demeaning?? Heaven help us if it is.....
I would happily curtsy to One that I really admire and adore for the right reasons. Of course that is personal. But I would not feel "humbled" in the slightest. Similarly, when someone curtsies to me I would take that in the same vain.

Furthermore, we live in a time where the notion has been advanced that all humans are equal. This is patent nonsense, as some are clearly more evolved, refined and spiritually advanced than others; some of whom have yet to shed their brutish tendencies. For the latter it would be advantageous to become open to the uplifting and benign influence of the former. The inculcation of respect and receptivity would aid considerably in that endeavour. However, there might have to be a major shift in general attitudes currently in vogue for most people to consider this as valid......

A

 

[royaltywatcher]

Furthermore, we live in a time where the notion has been advanced that all humans are equal. This is patent nonsense, as some are clearly more evolved, refined and spiritually advanced than others; some of whom have yet to shed their brutish tendencies.

I agree that not all human being are equal in the sense of being "the same" or "as talented, kind, intelligent, good, etc." But as we say in the U.S., all men (presumably women, too) are created equal.

The bow or curtsey is done specifically to royalty, not to anyone else, including Nobel prize winners and Mother Theresa. It is not a bow to a more highly evolved person, but to a person born to or married into an inherited position.

 

[Queen Angelique]

The bow or curtsey is done specifically to royalty, not to anyone else, including Nobel prize winners and Mother Theresa. It is not a bow to a more highly evolved person, but to a person born to or married into an inherited position.[/quote]

This from one of my earlier posts:

Indeed. It is a formality only to do with tradition and custom now, rather than an assumed inherent superiority which was the basis of these forms of protocol in times past. Originally, in antiquity, Royalty lived devout lives and were expected and thought to be the true leaders/examples on account of their nobility, wisdom, inner refinement and purity, as well as their courage.

A

 

[platinum69]

According www.heraldica.org/faqs/britfaq, a commoner is not the Soveriegn or a holder of a pperage. This includes all members of the British Royal Family who are not peers. HRH Prince William of Wales, HRH The Princess Royal and some others are commoners. Sounds interesting.

 

[PrincessofEurope]

Getty Images - Unsupported browser detected Camilla in Japan - i think she should have gone lower its not quite below eye level

 

[wbenson]

She's not a contortionist like Margaret Thatcher was.

 

[marmi]

We dont know when the picture was taken, she may have still been 'going down'???

 

[Winnie]

We dont know when the picture was taken, she may have still been 'going down'???

You are absolutely correct -- that is the problem with a lot of these pictures -- sometimes they give the incorrect statement [media will do on purpose sometimes to create a story] That is why videos are CLOSER to truth.

 

[Queen Angelique]

Commoners...?

According www.heraldica.org/faqs/britfaq, a commoner is not the Soveriegn or a holder of a pperage. This includes all members of the British Royal Family who are not peers. HRH Prince William of Wales, HRH The Princess Royal and some others are commoners. Sounds interesting.

If I understand your point correctly, it means that since they are not peers, nor the Sovereign, they must automatically be commoners.....right?
Common Princes and Princesses.....??
Interesting indeed.....
A

 

[Queen Angelique]

Too low, or too high...........

We dont know when the picture was taken, she may have still been 'going down'???

You are absolutely correct -- that is the problem with a lot of these pictures -- sometimes they give the incorrect statement (media will do on purpose sometimes to create a story) That is why videos are CLOSER to truth.

Yes, I agree and that is also giving the benefit of the doubt, which I believe is the graceful way to treat anyone. Apart from that, She might have had a knee-problem; or perhaps a little stiff due to the long journey....who knows?
And a video is a better way to remain objective. The total picture and all that.....
A

 

[avgi]

I found this video of the Royal Ascot 2008 - towards the end (min. 4) you see the Queen aproaching her family, Beatrice and Eugenie do not curtsey but at around 4:08 you can see Princess Anne curtseying to -I think -Camilla
YouTube - Guests at the Royal Ascot Festival 2008

 

[platinum69]

Nice try. New testament. Written by men. Some believe in the New Testament. Some only the Old. All written by men. God, who loves all people, doesn't care one way or the other. That's why he created all people in his image and loves them all. Bowing and curtseying is still an archaic form of obdience. It is not respect, it is demeaning. You can nod, shake hands and smile. No man is beneath another.

You are correct but exception HAS to be made for the Royals.

 

[platinum69]

Exactly, the position and that's what makes the tradition.

 

[platinum69]

thanks a lot, Paty.
I find it odd that Mette-Marit curtseying to Victoria

Well, they are both Princesses, but Victoria in her own right, being born a Princess, Mette-Marit is by marriage. In the future they both will be Queens, but Victoria will be a ruling Queen and Mette-Marit a Queen Consort. But for now, they have equal status. I really don't know why MM curtsey to Victoria.....

 

[MARG]

Well, they are both Princesses, but Victoria in her own right, being born a Princess, Mette-Marit is by marriage. In the future they both will be Queens, but Victoria will be a ruling Queen and Mette-Marit a Queen Consort. But for now, they have equal status. I really don't know why MM curtsey to Victoria.....

Actually they do not have equal status. Victoria is the heir apparent and on the death of her father wll become Queen it her own right. Mette-Marit will be a consort and never her equal. When Victoria is Queen, Queen Mette-Marit (and all other consorts) will still curtsey to a crowned head of state.

 

[kimebear]

Consorts of monarchs do not curtsey to monarchs. You will not see Queen Letizia curtsey to Queen Victoria. I can't say the same about Queen Mette-Marit as she seems to have her own ideas about curtseying.