Royals and Religion

[carlota]

Originally Posted by Madame Royale

It was required of Mary, that upon marriage to the Crown Prince, that she henceforth relinquish her Presbyterian teachings and remain a practicing Evangelical Lutheran which, as we know, is the official state religion.

To imply that the change of her denomination was decided as if on a whim, and solely her choice, is not in any way accurate.

i totally understand that, madame royal. changing her religion was something that was required and not something she chose, but i wouldn't say that implies at all some sort of devout-ness, in fact quite the opposite. it shows to me she is not that religious, but that's nothing blamable at all and her very own private decision. in fact, i see nothing wrong if she has to "accept" a religion for public purposes within the royal family just to keep a family tradition.

[Duke of Marmalade]

Originally Posted by carlota

i totally understand that, madame royal. changing her religion was something that was required and not something she chose, but i wouldn't say that implies at all some sort of devout-ness, in fact quite the opposite. it shows to me she is not that religious, but that's nothing blamable at all and her very own private decision. in fact, i see nothing wrong if she has to "accept" a religion for public purposes within the royal family just to keep a family tradition.

I think it's easier if a person can remain within the christian faith, eg a catholic marrying a protestant and having to convert. There are differences but not as much as changing to a completely different religion, eg a christian getting married to a muslim, jew etc. Does anyone know if this has happened in Royalty? Maybe Queen Noor?

[carlota]

Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade

I think it's easier if a person can remain within the christian faith, eg a catholic marrying a protestant and having to convert. There are differences but not as much as changing to a completely different religion, eg a christian getting married to a muslim, jew etc. Does anyone know if this has happened in Royalty? Maybe Queen Noor?

yes, queen noor changed religion. she was christian and decided to learn more about islam after marrying.

[Madame Royale]

Originally Posted by carlota

i totally understand that, madame royal. changing her religion was something that was required and not something she chose, but i wouldn't say that implies at all some sort of devout-ness, in fact quite the opposite. it shows to me she is not that religious, but that's nothing blamable at all and her very own private decision. in fact, i see nothing wrong if she has to "accept" a religion for public purposes within the royal family just to keep a family tradition.

I appreciate your reply, Carlota.

I'm in no position to say who or who is not a devout christian or catholic. How can I, or anyone here, possibly know? I personally, wouldn't think so either but I cannot not know.

Though, the fact Mary became a Lutheran does little to inform me of her personal ideology. It does however exhibit a regard and understanding for what is required of her position, and of course, herself I'm sure.

[principessa]

IMO Crown Princess Mathilde is the most religious crown princess! I cannot explain why, but this is my gut feeling.

[Veram98]

Originally Posted by carlota

yes, queen noor changed religion. she was christian and decided to learn more about islam after marrying.

Queen Noor changed religion at the morning of her wedding day. In her autobiography she reports that it was her very own decision (not her husband's who could marry a Christian like every Muslim man), that she was not raised by her parents in a specific religion (while being formally a Christian), that she started to learn more about Islam after she had decided to marry King Hussein and that Islam impressed and convinced her more than any other religion did before.

Princess Muna, King Hussein's second (British) wife (and mother of the actual king) also converted to Islam before marrying the king.

[Vanesa]

Well. I think that if you are a really Christian (not only a Catholic) you must not travel with your boy friend. Faith goes not with changing of fashion as other people seems to think. Nowadays, there is people who even doesn't know they must not do this or that..They does something for "fashions" changed and if yesterday something was a bad thing , today is a good one. Faith has nothing to do with fashion or social changing points of view. Is for that that I don't care about modern society..For it thinks that morals and Faith are also submited to "fashions". I even know about people who does things forbidden by Catholic faith and believes they are good and even devoted Catholics..."Oh, yes! -they said- I goes every Sunday to Church and gives money to poor people".

But besides all these arguments (that I'm certain, most of you will not share with me ) Princess Maxima COULD have been or not a good Catholic, but whatever she was regarding this Faith she isn't any more.. She must be from the same Protestant Church than her husband, since a day or another she will be Netherlands new Queen and she can't be a Catholic.

Vanesa.

[Henri M.]

Originally Posted by Vanesa

Well. I think that if you are a really Christian (not only a Catholic) you must not travel with your boy friend. Faith goes not with changing of fashion as other people seems to think. Nowadays, there is people who even doesn't know they must not do this or that..They does something for "fashions" changed and if yesterday something was a bad thing , today is a good one. Faith has nothing to do with fashion or social changing points of view. Is for that that I don't care about modern society..For it thinks that morals and Faith are also submited to "fashions". I even know about people who does things forbidden by Catholic faith and believes they are good and even devoted Catholics..."Oh, yes! -they said- I goes every Sunday to Church and gives money to poor people".

But besides all these arguments (that I'm certain, most of you will not share with me ) Princess Maxima COULD have been or not a good Catholic, but whatever she was regarding this Faith she isn't any more.. She must be from the same Protestant Church than her husband, since a day or another she will be Netherlands new Queen and she can't be a Catholic.

Vanesa.

Dear Vanessa, four facts:

1.
In the Netherlands there is an absolute Freedom of Faith. This counts for all citizens and -of course- also for the King and the members of the royal family. The King (and the Queen, and all members) can have any Faith. Or no any Faith at all. So there is no any need for Princess Máxima to become a Protestant.

2.
When Miss Máxima Zorreguieta Cerruti engaged with The Prince of Orange, she requested an official dispensation from the Roman-Catholic Church. The Bishop of Rotterdam (the diocese of her residence The Hague) has given an official dispensation. This means that the Church gas given its official permission for her intended marriage with a non-Catholic.

3.
Princess Máxima has stated she wanted to study Protestantism. She has discussed her Faith with the Court Chaplain. She has been to the Bible-class her husband regularly attends, so told the Court Chaplain on television. But in the end she remained loyal and faithful to the Church of Rome.

4.
The Queen and her three sons are very close to the Court Chaplain, the Reverend Ds. Carel ter Linden. Their three weddings and the funerals of Prince Claus and Prince Bernhard were 'done' by this Court Chaplain. Princess Máxima is still close to her family's priest, Padre Rafael Braun. During the wedding on 02-02-2002 the Princess invited Padre Braun to have a role in the wedding and to read from the Holy Gospel in Spanish. Also during this Protestant wedding the Princess requested the choir to sing the Kyrie of Mozart and a soprano to sing the Ave Maria (in Latin and in German). A clear Catholic statement in a Protestant service. I think she has stayed close to her Roman-Catholic roots and I admire that in her.

[Elspeth]

Just a quick note of caution here. The OP asked about the most religious Queen or Crown Princess, not the Queen or Crown Princess with the deepest or most genuine faith. The latter is something we can't possibly know, and this forum isn't the place for debates about who is or is not a True Christian and what it means to be a True Christian. That's the start of a slippery slope that often ends in threads turning into pitched battles, which would be a very good thing to avoid.

Please keep this thread on the topic of public religious observances, and stay well clear of discussions about private faith.

Thank you.

Elspeth

Royal Forums administrator

[TLLK]

I would have to agree Henri. As a fellow Roman Catholic, I am pleased to see that the Church officials in the Netherlands gave their approval for Maxima to marry Prince W-A. I was not aware of this fact.

She has chosen to remain a member of the Roman Catholic Church, but has shown an interest in learning about her husband's Protestant faith. I believe that this will help them to raise their children with a respect for other Christian denominations. There does appear to be a notable R.C. population in the Netherlands and their children should be aquainted with their beliefs and traditions as well. I believe this is especially important for the future Queen Catharina-Amalia, who should IMO follow her great-grandmother's example and learn something about Islam as well. All of this will help her to have a greater knowledge of her kingdom's population.

[Henri M.]

Originally Posted by TLLK

There does appear to be a notable R.C. population in the Netherlands and their children should be aquainted with their beliefs and traditions as well.

From the CIA World Factbook 2006, the Netherlands:

No religion or religion not registered 41%
Roman Catholic 31%
Dutch Reformed 13%
Calvinist 7%
Muslim 5.5%
other 2.5%

The religion is not administered by the municipalities but in the churches and are voluntarily given as statistics to the Central Statistic Office. Therefore the big number of people not registered in any church: 40% simply is not registered in any church. (In many countries you see 70 or 80% Roman Catholic, but in reality only a fraction is a real church-visitor, of course).

[dw2108]

Out of curiosity, does anyone here happen to know some of the prayers of kings, queens, sultans, etc.? I'm NOT trying to engage in controversy, because their prayes are a part of their respective histories.

Dave

[RoyalProtocol]

There is a very good book, All Power and Majesty, by The Chaplain to HM The Queen, Donald Gray, which has prayers for Royalty and by Royalty, both ancient and modern, and all from the Christian tradition is the widest possible sense.

[Lady Jennifer]

Originally Posted by RoyalProtocol

There is a very good book, All Power and Majesty, by The Chaplain to HM The Queen, Donald Gray, which has prayers for Royalty and by Royalty, both ancient and modern, and all from the Christian tradition is the widest possible sense.

You can buy this book from Barnes & Noble online- $20 ($16 if you are a member)
Barnes*&*Noble.com - Books: All Majesty and Power, by Donald Gray, Hardcover

Or from amazon.com for $0.17 if I'm reading the site correctly
Amazon.com: All Majesty and Power: An Anthology of Royal Prayers: Books: Donald Gray

ETA: $0.17 for a used book...it says $4.00 for a new one

[Vanesa]

Thank you for the link! These sounds pretty good!

Vanesa.

[FarahJoy]

I read several times that Her Majesty Queen Fabiola of Belgium has a strong faith.

Why don't you write to her and ask her about the prayers she would recommend you ? She might be happy to advise you or at least I guess you'll get some answer of the Royal Palace ?

Best greetings,

FarahJoy

[Moonmaiden23]

Originally Posted by FarahJoy

I read several times that Her Majesty Queen Fabiola of Belgium has a strong faith.

Why don't you write to her and ask her about the prayers she would recommend you ? She might be happy to advise you or at least I guess you'll get some answer of the Royal Palace ?

Best greetings,

FarahJoy

She and her late husband King Baudouin started each day of their married life together with The Prayer of St Francis(I read that in the Queen's bio)

[RoyalProtocol]

Visit the Church of England website section on prayers, they have lots for The Queen and Royal Family

[Lady Bluffton]

Does anyone know if Princess Maxima is still a practicing Catholic (i.e. where, if indeed she does, does she attend church each week)?

[Shikha Pal]

r any of the Royals related to any Hindus ?