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  #101  
Old 08-10-2021, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavs View Post
King is still an automatically higher title than Queen, which is why husbands of a Queen Regnant are usually Prince Consort, so it's actually a case of gender bias in the opposite direction which means men have to take a lower title than their female consort counter parts.

I personally do think it would be awkward to say "here come the King and Queen" when it is the Queen who is Regnant, or at least in English it would be.

I understand your point, but I must say that such awkwardness is mostly a cultural perception. As mentioned before in TRF, the husbands of reigning queens in Spain and Portugal, and earlier even in Scotland, held the title of king (consort), but did not outrank their wives.

It is unfortunate that Spain has now abandoned that tradition and switched to a British-like system where, under the terms of the Royal Decree 1368/1987, future husbands of reigning queens (e.g. Leonor's husband) will be titled Prince with the style of Royal Highness.


In the case of same-sex royal couples, which I agree will happen eventually, maybe sooner than expected, I am pretty sure that Prince/Princess will be the title of choice for consorts and I would be very surprised otherwise.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JR76 View Post
Norwegian royal journalist and writer Trond Norén Isaksen has written an article in Aftenposten about the title of a potential future husband of Princess Ingrid Alexandra stating that "if the Princess marries a man he should have the title of king". He goes on writing that it was the custom in European monarchies until Queen Anne ascended the throne of England etc in 1702 and that there are nothing in the Norwegian Constitution stopping it from happening.
The article was written as a commentary on a piece by "language reporter" (?) Kristin Storrusten that I unfortunately haven't been able to read because of a paywall.

https://www.aftenposten.no/meninger/...r-kalles-konge
I haven't read the Norwegian constitution in Norwegian, but the English translation uses the word "King" to refer to the monarch/ head of State/ (nominal) holder of the Executive power. In Denmark, where the constitution is similarly worded, that has been used in the past as an excuse, see our friend Mr. Muhler's posts, to argue against the reigning queen's husband (e.g. Prince Henrik) being called "King".


The modern Swedish constitution, which appears to have been written already envisaging a possible future transition to a republic, avoids this problem as the monarch is mostly referred to simply as "the Head of State" or, alternatively, in the form "the King or Queen who occupies the throne", or "the King or Queen who is the Head of State", which is a very clever wording in my opinion to avoid any ambiguity.
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  #102  
Old 08-10-2021, 09:18 AM
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While I will quote my response here, I think the thread Title & Role of a Consort would be a good place to continue the general discussion about titles of consorts which extends outside of Norway.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
The perception that King is a "higher title" than Queen only seems to emerge in discussions of titles of consorts, and never elsewhere.

Nowhere in the many discussions I have read on royal websites and social media have I ever heard admirers of Queen Elizabeth II of the UK or Queen Margrethe II of Denmark bemoan that they were given "lower titles" than their fathers and other male monarchs.

Royal watchers to my knowledge have never argued that monarchies whose constitutions strictly regulate the powers and duties of a King will provoke a constitutional crisis if and when Princess Elisabeth of Belgium, for example, accedes to the throne as a Queen. On this issue, royal watchers easily accept that a Queen is precisely the same thing as a King, and therefore the constitution's regulations for reigning Kings will extend to a reigning Queen.

As for consorts, it is frequently brought up in conversations about the British royal family that under British common law, a wife has the right to take the rank and title of her husband and morganatic marriages for female consorts are impossible. But no one has claimed that if the future King Charles's wife Camilla is styled Queen, it would introduce morganatic marriages as Queen is a "lower title" than King.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR76 View Post
Norwegian royal journalist and writer Trond Norén Isaksen has written an article in Aftenposten about the title of a potential future husband of Princess Ingrid Alexandra stating that "if the Princess marries a man he should have the title of king". He goes on writing that it was the custom in European monarchies until Queen Anne ascended the throne of England etc in 1702 and that there are nothing in the Norwegian Constitution stopping it from happening.
The article was written as a commentary on a piece by "language reporter" (?) Kristin Storrusten that I unfortunately haven't been able to read because of a paywall.

https://www.aftenposten.no/meninger/...r-kalles-konge
Trond Norén Isaksen is a reliable historian, and his article is worth the read.

It is very questionable that commenters usually plead tradition regarding gender-discriminatory titles of European consorts, but willfully exclude the hundreds of years of tradition which were set by kings consort prior to the recent trend begun by the UK.
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  #103  
Old 08-18-2021, 07:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
I haven't read the Norwegian constitution in Norwegian, but the English translation uses the word "King" to refer to the monarch/ head of State/ (nominal) holder of the Executive power.
The only exceptions are Articles 6 and 48, which govern succession and election to the throne, and Article 3, which references the aforementioned articles.

§ 3.
Den utøvende makt er hos kongen eller hos dronningen, hvis hun har ervervet kronen etter bestemmelsene i § 6, § 7 eller § 48 i denne Grunnlov. Når den utøvende makt således er hos dronningen, har hun alle de rettigheter og plikter som ifølge denne Grunnlov og landets lover innehas av kongen.

Article 3.
The executive power is vested in the King, or in the Queen if she has succeeded to the Crown pursuant to the provisions of Article 6 or Article 7 or Article 48 of this Constitution. When the executive power is thus vested in the Queen, she has all the rights and obligations which pursuant to this Constitution and the law of the land are possessed by the King.

The difference with the language for prince(sse)s is interesting. Every use of "prince(s)" in the Constitution from before 1990 has been substituted with "prince or princess" or "princes and princesses", but for Article 21's "De kongelige prinser må ikke bekle sivile embeter" (The royal princes must not hold senior civil offices).

https://lovdata.no/dokument/NL/lov/1814-05-17
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