Duke and Duchess of Cambridge: Official Visit to Norway - February 1-2, 2018

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY

Telegraph article from Jan 27:
Duke and Duchess of Cambridge to be given tour of Sweden and Norway by their young Royal counterparts to 'build relationships of the future'

Express article from Jan 28 (very similar to that above), for those who don't have a Telegraph subscription:
William and Kate to 'bond over kids' with Scandinavian Royalty on first official tour

NTB article for NRK and other media outlets with google translation and quotes translated by me:
Oslo-besøket: Her kan du møte William og Kate - translation

1. As I've said in other threads, yes, the King is without any doubt the most popular head of state (in his own country) and the support for the Norwegian monarchy is at a record-high right now (despite the bad choices of the CP-couple), but we are a laid-back country and we are not known for showing up in large crowds for royal celebrations/tours. - Why? Some of it has to do with the Law of Jante (which is much more present in Norway than in the other Scandinavian countries).

Read about it in these posts: http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...ml#post2051615

Wikipedia article: Law of Jante

2. But we were surprised during the Silver Jubilee in 2016 when 40-50 thousand people showed up (on January 17th) in the freezing weather to see the King and Queen. - And there are always large crowds for Their Majesties when they are on their county-trips (especially during the Silver Jubilee and 80th birthdays tours).

3. Will there be crowds for the Cambridges? Of course there will be some people who want to se them, but I think it would be an exaggeration to call it crowds.

Another quote from the NTB article above:

As one can read in post 4, the media interest has been enormous.

I can't help noticing the differences in the Swedish and Norwegian programs.

• In Sweden: staying at the British ambassador's residence, lunch with the King and Queen, and no local TV coverage.
• In Norway: staying as guests at the Royal Palace, official dinner with the King and Queen, and lots of local TV coverage.

Is it only my impression or the Swedes in particular are downplaying this official visit ?

On the point above in the Telegraph article that the goal of the visit is for William and Kate to bond with Scandinavian royals of similar age (most notably the Swedes), that is fine, but why didn't the BRF do that while William and Harry were growing up ?

It is well known that Madeleine and William were born one month apart and that Victoria is only 5 years older, and CP three years older. Many royal watchers even thought that William would marry Madeleine one day when they both grew up. However, as Madeleine said once in an interview she gave already as an adult, she actually had never been introduced to either William or Harry. In fact, even today, I am not sure they have already formally met. Victoria and Daniel attended William's wedding, so I suppose they were introduced to each other on that occasion, but I don't recall them being together in any other occasion besides William's wedding.

I was particularly struck by Lady Finn's post on CP Victoria being briefed by the Swedish Foreign Ministry on the current political situation in the UK ahead of William and Kate's visit. Although that may be a standard procedure before any official visit, I can't imagine the Swedish RF taking it so strictly professionally and "business-like" so to speak if it were a visit from European royals they are closer to and if the shadow of Brexit were not hanging over the visit as it is. I feel like the Norwegians seem to be much warmer given perhaps the proximity between King Harald and Queen Sonja and Queen Elizabeth and Prince Charles.

[wyevale]

The [then] 'young Princes' were given a protected upbringing, and especially once at School and after their Mothers tragic death, had no contact with Foreign Royals whatsoever. Outside observers may [or may not] consider this an error, but it was a decision made by those that knew them best [and had their 'best interests at heart']...

I'm not sure anyone else is really in a good position to question the wisdom of their decision.

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by wyevale

The [then] 'young Princes' were given a protected upbringing, and especially once at School and after their Mothers tragic death, had no contact with Foreign Royals whatsoever. Outside observers may [or may not] consider this an error, but it was a decision made by those that knew them best [and had their 'best interests at heart']...

I'm not sure anyone else is really in a good position to question the wisdom of their decision.

Quoting from the Telegraph article:

In Sweden they will be accompanied by Crown Princess Victoria and Prince Daniel, while in Norway they will be escorted by Crown Prince Haakon and Crown Princess Mette-Marit.

Crown Princess Victoria and Prince Daniel attended the Royal Wedding in 2011, but it is understood the Duke and Duchess do not know either very well.

Also, they have never met the Crown Prince and Princess of Norway.

I am afraid the Brits may be trying too hard to forge a relationship or bond between the Cambridges and the Scandinavian CP couples, which doesn't exist as of today, and should have emerged naturally instead over the years.

I know Kate got on very well with the royals in Luxembourg and the Netherlands when she went there solo and was very charming. I am not so confident about William's social skills though, but I am looking forward to seeing how this Scandinavian tour will unfold.

[wyevale]

^ And has the Sky fallen because of this ?

William is not yet heir..but now relationships can be made, and [hopefully] good ones...

[Dman]

Both Charles and Diana made sure to bond their family with the Greek and Spanish royal families. They took William and Harry to vacation with them. I think once their marriage broke up, things changed. Of course they weren’t taking family vacations like they used to.

William, Catherine and Harry’s relationships with foreign royals could’ve been established already. The Queen would only send the Wessex’s to foreign royal events. So the Wessex’s have the established relationships. I guess this is now changing now that the Cambridge’s are full time working royals and now participants in State Events. Also now that William is being groomed for his future role.

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by Dman

Both Charles and Diana made sure to bond their family with the Greek and Spanish royal families. They took William and Harry to vacation with them. I think once their marriage broke up, things changed. Of course they weren’t taking family vacations like they used to.

William, Catherine and Harry’s relationships with foreign royals could’ve been established already. The Queen would only send the Wessex’s to foreign royal events. So the Wessex’s have the established relationships. I guess this is now changing now that the Cambridge’s are full time working royals and now participants in State Events. Also now that William is being groomed for his future role.

Maybe I'm being too political or skeptical, but I suspect the Swedes in particular believe that this official visit has some hidden agenda connected with Brexit and that explains why the Crown Princess is being briefed by the Foreign Ministry, among other things, on the "current political situation in the UK" ahead of her meeting with the Cambridges. They are clearly seeing it as a diplomatic visit and not as trip to forge bonds between families as the Brits are describing it. The Norwegians seem to be more relaxed about the visit, maybe because they have the benefit of not being EU members and not having any say then on the Brexit negotiations.

[Dman]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

Maybe I'm being too political or skeptical, but I suspect the Swedes in particular believe that this official visit has some hidden agenda connected with Brexit and that explains why the Crown Princess is being briefed by the Foreign Ministry, among other things, on the "current political situation in the UK" ahead of her meeting with the Cambridges. They are clearly seeing it as a diplomatic visit and not as trip to forge bonds between families as the Brits are describing it. The Norwegians seem to be more relaxed about the visit, maybe because they have the benefit of not being EU members and not having any say then on the Brexit negotiations.

Yes, of course this visit from the Cambridge’s have something to do with Brexit. The royals are sent to conduct soft diplomacy on these trips. It’s also an opportunity for the Cambridge’s and their royal counterparts to get to know each other.

We’ve had these conversations before on how the younger British royals should become more familiar with their royal counterparts. This can’t happen if the Wessex’s are the main ones that’s being sent to European royal events and not second in line to the thrine and future Queen Consort.

[xenobia]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

Maybe I'm being too political or skeptical, but I suspect the Swedes in particular believe that this official visit has some hidden agenda connected with Brexit and that explains why the Crown Princess is being briefed by the Foreign Ministry, among other things, on the "current political situation in the UK" ahead of her meeting with the Cambridges. They are clearly seeing it as a diplomatic visit and not as trip to forge bonds between families as the Brits are describing it. The Norwegians seem to be more relaxed about the visit, maybe because they have the benefit of not being EU members and not having any say then on the Brexit negotiations.

The royals are always briefed by the Foreign Ministry (UD in Swedish) before foreign royals or heads of state are visiting, so the briefing in itself doesn't say anything about how this visit is viewd.

[JR76]

Not the right thread for it but now that you're talking about Sweden I wanted to comment.
The Swedish Royal Family is always briefed before a State & Official visit no matter if its from Finland, Denmark or Mongolia.
This is a visit by representatives of the British government and it's being treated as such. If the Cambridges just came to hang with the Västergötlands they'd be sneaked into the country like other Royal friends have been before.
Regarding the tv-coverage there's rarely any at all regarding foreign visitors unless it's someone very special like Barack Obama a few years ago. I'm sure there'll be a few snippets in the news but nothing much. It's not the way national news works in Sweden. If they mention anything I'm quite sure Brexit will be the main focus.

[wyevale]

hidden agenda connected with Brexit

ALL the visits undertaken by the Cambridge's last year in Europe were OPENLY part of a 'charm offensive' ordained by the Foreign Office in the light of our decision to leave the EU.. NOTHING 'hidden' about it whatsoever..

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by wyevale

ALL the visits undertaken by the Cambridge's last year in Europe were OPENLY part of a 'charm offensive' ordained by the Foreign Office in the light of our decision to leave the EU.. NOTHING 'hidden' about it whatsoever..

Yes, but this Scandinavian tour is different in the sense that the official line from the Palace is that the goal of the tour is for the Cambridges to connect with "other young royals". They even made a point, as Royal Norway reminded us, of not scheduling any meeting between the Cambridges and local politicians or government officials, which is not what happened in France, Poland and Germany for example. So, if this official visit has anything to do with Brexit, the Palace is sure trying to hide it or play it down.

The odd part is that the Brits are depicting it almost as a private tour to get to know the Swedish and Norwegian Crown couples and share common interests with them, when technically the Cambridges are officially representing the British government, which is how the Swedish government is treating the tour.

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

I can't help noticing the differences in the Swedish and Norwegian programs.

• In Sweden: staying at the British ambassador's residence, lunch with the King and Queen, and no local TV coverage.
• In Norway: staying as guests at the Royal Palace, official dinner with the King and Queen, and lots of local TV coverage.

Is it only my impression or the Swedes in particular are downplaying this official visit ?

I wrote this in post 9:

Some facts about protocols when it comes to royal official visits to Scandinavia:

The Scandinavian official visit of Charles and Camilla in 2012 to celebrate the Diamond Jubilee of QEII:

1. When Charles and Camilla visited Norway, the King and Queen participated in all events.

2. When they visited Sweden, King Carl Gustaf and Queen Silvia also participated in most of the events.

3. But that was not the case when they visited Denmark. There, QMII gave a black tie dinner while the CP couple participated in the other events.

The Danish CP couple's Business Visit to Sweden in 2017 - described by the Swedish court as an official visit:

King Carl Gustaf and Queen Silvia gave a Luncheon while the CP couple participated in the other events.

What does this tell us?

1. That Charles and Camilla get to be accompanied by the monarch/consort in Norway and Sweden, but not in Denmark.

2. That the Danish CP couple didn't get to be accompanied by the monarch/consort in Sweden (although they are at the same rank as Charles and Camilla). And yes, that could of course have somthing to do with the fact that Charles and Camilla are closer in age to King Carl Gustaf and Queen Silvia.

I think this proves that the Swedes are not downplaying this visit:

No engagements or official dinner with King Carl Gustaf and Queen Silvia (with the exception of a Luncheon) for the Danish CP couple either, and they are of higher rank than the Cambridges.

Charles and Camilla on the other hand, were accompanied by King Carl Gustaf and Queen Silvia during most of their events (and there even was a private dinner for them at Drottningholm), and they are of the same rank as the Danish CP couple.

Why are the Cambridges received differently in Norway?

1. I think that has a bit to do with the King's personality.

2. It happened for Charles in 2012, and I'm sure the same had happened if the Danish/Swedish CP couples had come for an official visits.

3. The same had also happened (I think) to WA and Maxima, Philippe and Mathilde and Felipe and Letizia while they were still CP-couples.

Why is the Norwegian TV-coverage of the Cambridge visit that extensive? Because the BRF (or the A team among royals in the world (as the Norwegian media calls them) is the most prestigious and well known royal family in the world. - And the coverage was equally extensive for Charles and Camilla in 2012 and for QEII's state visit in 2001).

Other visits that has been covered extensively since 2000:

Obama. - On the same scale as the Cambridge visit.

State visits since 2000:

Pre - 2007: Nothing (not even the state visits from Japan in 2005 or Spain in 2006), with the exception of some clips on the ordinary television news.

2007 - present: The procession and speeches during gala dinners is always sent live on TV2 News Channel (launched in January 2007). Other events during state visits is not covered, with the exception of those from Russia and the Netherlands in April and June 2010, when NRK2 and TV2 News Channel sent the arrival of Dmitrij Medvedev and Queen Beatrix live.

[akina21]

Haakon and Mette Marit attended Charles and Camilla's wedding . That was pre Kate obviously but I doubt that William has never met them .

[LadyFinn]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

Yes, but this Scandinavian tour is different in the sense that the official line from the Palace is that the goal of the tour is for the Cambridges to connect with "other young royals". They even made a point, as Royal Norway reminded us, of not scheduling any meeting between the Cambridges and local politicians or government officials, which is not what happened in France, Poland and Germany for example. So, if this official visit has anything to do with Brexit, the Palace is sure trying to hide it or play it down.

The odd part is that the Brits are depicting it almost as a private tour to get to know the Swedish and Norwegian Crown couples and share common interests with them, when technically the Cambridges are officially representing the British government, which is how the Swedish government is treating the tour.

The Royal House of Sweden makes at their press release very clear, how they see the visit "On 30-31 January 2018, the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge will make an official visit to Sweden on behalf of the British Government".

[Skippyboo]

Originally Posted by akina21

Haakon and Mette Marit attended Charles and Camilla's wedding . That was pre Kate obviously but I doubt that William has never met them .

Actually Charles and Camilla’s wedding wasn’t pre Kate. Her and William were already dating then. William, Kate and the CP couple were all at the reception at BP the Queen hosted opening day of London 2012.

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Photo galleries from NTB Scanpix of the most important visits from the UK to Norway during QEII's reign:

QEII's state visit to Norway (24–26 June) in 1955 - 35 photos:
Dronning Elizabeth på statsbesøk i Norge 1955

QEII's official family visit to Norway in August 1969 - 61 photos:
Dronning Elizabeth besøker Norge i 1969

QEII's state visit to Norway (5–8 May) in 1981 - 38 photos:
Dronning Elizabeth II på statsbesøk i Norge 1981

QEII's state visit to Norway (30 May – 1 June) in 2001 - 207 photos:
Dronning Elizabeth II på statsbesøk i Norge 2001

Look at this famous photo of the then Mette-Marit Tjessem Høiby curtsying to QEII:
https://scanpix.no/spWebApp/preview/editorial/sp10c997

Charles and Camilla's official visit to Norway (20 – 22 March) in 2012 - 147 photos:
Charles og Camilla besøker Norge besøker Norge i 2012:

There have also been other visits. - Here are two of them:

Diana's visit (11 – 12 February) in 1984 to attend a performance of Carmen by The London City Ballet - 17 photos:
Diana besøker Norge i 1984

Charles's visit (26 – 27 May) in 2010 to attend the Oslo Climate and Forest Conference - 18 photos:
Charles besøker Norge i 2010:

[Nico]

the Norwegians are "part of the family" , literally actually. I think it's quite normal to see a somewhat special treatment for the "Bristish cousins"...
But the relations between the Swedes and the BRF seem excellent as well, we know that Queen Silvia made at least one private visit to Highgrove ...

[ROYAL NORWAY]

Are Norway ready for the Cambridges? Yes, we are.

From the Royal House calendar:

February 1th:
Their Majesties The King and Queen host the official visit from Their Royal Highnesses The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge 1 - 2 February.

Their Majesties The King and Queen welcome Their Royal Highnesses The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge (The Royal Palace, 12:45).

Her Majesty The Queen and Her Royal Highness Princess Ingrid Alexandra accompany Their Royal Highnesses The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge on a walk in Princess Ingrid Alexandra's Sculpture Park. Their Royal Highnesses The Crown Prince and Crown Princess will also be in attendance (The Palace Park, 15:00).

Their Royal Highnesses The Crown Prince and Crown Princess accompany His Royal Highness The Duke of Cambridge on a visit to MESH (Oslo, 16:00).

Their Majesties The King and Queen host a dinner in honour of Their Royal Highnesses The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge. Their Royal Highnesses The Crown Prince and Crown Princess, Her Highness Princess Märtha Louise and Her Highness Princess Astrid, Mrs Ferner will also be in attendance (19:45).

February 2th:
Their Royal Highnesses The Crown Prince and Crown Princess accompany Their Royal Highnesses The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge on a visit to Hartvig Nissen Upper Secondary School and a meeting with students and the cast of SKAM (10:10).

Their Royal Highnesses The Crown Prince and Crown Princess accompany Their Royal Highnesses The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge on a visit to the Ski Museum and the Holmenkollen Ski Arena (14.00).

Their Royal Highnesses The Crown Prince and Crown Princess accompany Their Royal Highnesses The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge to Øvresetertjern (Øvreseter lake) for out-door activities with children and kindergarten visit (14:45).

As you can see, Kate will not attend MESH (a co-working space for entrepreneurs and start-up companies to grow their businesses and thrive in a creative environment). - Why? Due to her pregnancy.

As you also can see, HM the King will not attend the Princess Ingrid Alexandra's Sculpture Park event. - Why? We don't know, but he hasn't been that well lately.

Read more about the program in post 1.

Television Coverage:
February 1th:
NRK2 will send live from 11:30 to 17:00 (10:30 to 16:00 British time) and from 19:30 to 20:30 (18:30 to 19:30 British time).

February 2th:
NRK2 will send live from 10:00 to 17:00 (09:00 to 16:00 British time).

TV2 News Channel will also send live from all the events.

I will post live links later (if not others do it before me).

Read more about the television coverage in post 2 and 16.

Articles:
Article from TV2's royal expert Kjell Arne Totland with google translation:
Welcome to Norway! - translation

Article from NRK with google translation:
Her kan du lettest treffe prins William og hertuginne Kate - translation

And interesting NRK article with video of QEII's state visit to Norway in 1955 with google translation and a quote translated by me:
Tette band mellom kongehusa i Noreg og Storbritannia - translation

Looser ties today

After King Olav died in 1991, the ties between the royal houses in Norway and the UK have not been as close. One thing is that the kinship ties becomes more distant, but author Bomann-Larsen also draws up the Second World War as a cause.

''While his father lived a large part of his childhood in England, King Harald became stronger linked with the United States through his American war exile''.

This article is written in Nynorsk, which means that the google translation is poorer than usual.

[Countessmeout]

Its great to see Ingrid Alexandra involved in the tour, and just greeting them. Fitting since they will be touring the sculptural garden named for her. Great to see her escorting her grandmother, when her grandfather isn't there. She seems to have such a close relationship with them both.

Thanks as always for your great information

[ROYAL NORWAY]

You're very welcome:

Live link from NRK:
NRK LIVE

Live link from TV2 News Channel:
TV2 LIVE

Live link from VG:
VG LIVE

Royal Center's Norwegian correspondent Oskar Aanmoen reports on twitter throughout the day:
https://twitter.com/OAanmoen

I will have live coverage of some of the events (especially the dinner this evening).

Edit: The plane has landed.

Edit: The Cambridges is received by the CP couple:

Edit: The CP couple and the Cambridges are on their way from the airport to the palace in Norwegian state cars.

Edit: There are other news on NRK, but the coverage will be back when they arrive (the same goes for TV2).