The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #381  
Old 10-24-2021, 07:29 AM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Posts: 2,318
Quote:
Originally Posted by monarhiero View Post
Can Pavlos' children even speak Greek? Especially Constantine-Alexios, as he is in line for the head of the family after his father.

It unfortunately seems to me that the children are abusing their titles to advance their own socialite agendas in other countries. But they seem to have no interest at all in Greece. Shameful...

I'm comparing them with Romania's King Michael's granson, Nicholas. Despite all he's been through, he has dedicated his work to contributing towards Romania. Not only does he now live here now, but he's involved with various NGOs and doing volunteer work.

What are Pavlos' children planning to do?
This has been discussed in this forum in the past years over and over again. From my point of view the CP´s children are not pushed in any kind of direction having to deal with their grandparent´s country in any way or task. By marrying Marie-Chantal 26 years ago, Paul/ Pavlos married into the realms of jet set and billionaires - and that´s the world their children were born into. They know nothing else.

As Marie-Chantal once put it, she and her husband would "face the reality and do not lose themselves" in phantasies about a monarchy which is long gone and would hardly be reinstalled again. As I understood she meant it would be best to acknowledge the facts and go on with life instead of pretending to be in an official capacity to serve Greece one day again.
The only child of Constantine and Anne-Marie who really seems serious and passionate about his country is Nicholaos and his wife who both speak fluent greek and live near Athens since many years now.
You cannot compare Romania with Greece and at the same time you can. Both former Balkan monarchies, but one occurs like a constitutional monarchy within a republic, with its members, in accordance with the romanian government, having more or less "official" royal duties to fulfill, while the other one, Greece, is largely anti-monarchist.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #382  
Old 10-24-2021, 07:41 AM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 11,560
And as I repeatedly stated: a few years ago Greece was at the total verge of a breakdown. The notoriously corrupt, nepotist, kleptocratic, autocrat and olichargic republican elite had totally ruïned the country, despite an unimagineable amount of EU-money flowing to Athens since 1981.

But even then, with the Hellenic Republic rocking on its core foundations and with protestors daily swarming the streets of Athens, fighting with riot police: there was no one advocating the return of the monarchy.

If even in such a total chaos and in an existential crisis, there is zero comma zero appetite for the monarchy, how can one expect Crown Prince Pavlos and his children hunting phantoms of the past? They are wise to focus on their own career and on making their own life.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #383  
Old 10-24-2021, 06:22 PM
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Warsaw, Poland
Posts: 10,347
Maria Olympia's boyfriend of more than a year now, Honourable Peregrine Pearson, accompanied her at the wedding of her uncle:

https://eurohistoryjournal.blogspot....s-nina-of.html

It means that their relationship is serious.
Reply With Quote
  #384  
Old 10-25-2021, 10:48 AM
lula's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: , Spain
Posts: 19,790
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post

The Hellenic Republic does not even allow their former royals to have Greek nationality! (They travel around on Spanish and Danish diplomatic passports).

How can you expect state-less citizens to perform public duties in Greece if the very country does not even acknowledge them? Apart from that: they are HRH Prince (Princess) of Greece and Denmark. They are not "abusing" any title. It simply is theirs, from generation on generation.
This is a contradiction. If Greece is a Republic, then the title of Prince / Princess of Greece does not exist... does not have any legal support. In that case, perhaps only those who received the title while the monarchy was legal would have the right to use it, and not their wives or children.

These titles are not an inheritance, or ordinary surnames that are passed from generation to generation ... they are titles that are linked to an institution that is governed by the laws of each country. So if they are not even interested in sharing some connection with their family's native country, they can adopt the surname Glücksburg or Miller.

When Irene received Spanish nationality, the documentation did not include the title of Princess, a title that Spanish laws reserve for the heir to the throne, and she had to adopt the two surnames that her sister Sofía uses since her arrival in Spain.
Reply With Quote
  #385  
Old 10-28-2021, 05:45 AM
monarhiero's Avatar
Commoner
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bucharest, Romania
Posts: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by lula View Post
This is a contradiction. If Greece is a Republic, then the title of Prince / Princess of Greece does not exist... does not have any legal support. In that case, perhaps only those who received the title while the monarchy was legal would have the right to use it, and not their wives or children.

These titles are not an inheritance, or ordinary surnames that are passed from generation to generation ... they are titles that are linked to an institution that is governed by the laws of each country. So if they are not even interested in sharing some connection with their family's native country, they can adopt the surname Glücksburg or Miller.

When Irene received Spanish nationality, the documentation did not include the title of Princess, a title that Spanish laws reserve for the heir to the throne, and she had to adopt the two surnames that her sister Sofía uses since her arrival in Spain.
Thank you, lula. This is exactly what I mean. I do agree that a comparison between the Greek and Romanian royal families is not suitable, due to the different environments and attitudes the respective countries have towards the royal families. So I retract my statement in that regard. But not with regard to the behavior and attitudes of Pavlos' children. I entirely disagree with @Duc_et_Pair assessment that the children are entitled to claim royalty and owe no duties whatsoever. At the end of the day, the title bears some responsibilities as well. @wartenberg7 pointed out very correctly the decision that Marie-Chantal made for her children, and I'm not disputing whether it was wrong or right. The reality is that Greece does not favour the Greek royal family. My question is whether the children should so easily use their titles as Greek royals when they don't speak Greek (as far as I know) or volunteer their time in any way to contribute towards Greek society?

As @wartenberg7 correctly pointed out, Prince Nikolaos and Princess Tatianna are significantly more involved in Greek society and contribute a lot more (without the need of having official duties). The King and Queen partook in many activities when he was still able. And they all decided to take the step of moving to Greece, despite the hostile environment. They more than deserve their titles. On the other hand, Pavlos and his children are very distant from the country and the people, and the children increasingly so. Expect during times when they are able to flaunt their royal title as socialites and advance their own personal goals.

If Marie-Chantal, Pavlos and their children have made the decision of accepting the (unfavourable) reality of the royal family in Greece, and have chosen to distance themselves from the country and are not willing to take on any informal responsibilities that come to with the title, the right step is also to relinquish their claim to the Greek title and simply be princes and princesses of the Danish royal family and that's that.

On a side-note, it is an unfortunate reality that Prince Nikolaos is not crown prince and that he does not have children. With his involvement in Greece and with having children brought up in Greece, the Greek royal family would have had a chance of having a more favourable position in Greece in the long-term. Seeing the future is the hands of Pavlos and his children, that hope is gone (at least for me).
Reply With Quote
  #386  
Old 10-28-2021, 05:59 AM
Marengo's Avatar
Administrator
Royal Blogger, TRF Author
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Posts: 23,405
Tja, if that were the definition there are many other royals apart from the Greeks who should stop using their titles & we could tear up almost all pages of the Almanach de Gotha.

IMO the crown prince and his family do not owe the country a thing. Greece has kicked the family out and has behaved appalingly towards the RF for decades. Unlike in Romania or Serbia there are few informal responsibilities that come with being the heir of the Greek throne. I imagine it is a healthy thing that they do not cling on to long lost dreams and have moved on.

It is interesting that this discussion only pops up with the CP Pavlos & family, while nobody mentions a simular issue for f.e. the Bulgarians, Don Luis Alfonso de Borbon, who puts on airs about the French throne, the Italian pretenders, the many archdukes and archduchesses or even for Pavlos' younger brother and sister Philippos and Theodora.
__________________
TRF Rules and FAQ
Reply With Quote
  #387  
Old 10-28-2021, 06:11 AM
monarhiero's Avatar
Commoner
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Bucharest, Romania
Posts: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
It is interesting that this discussion only pops up with the CP Pavlos & family, while nobody mentions a simular issue for f.e. the Bulgarians, Don Luis Alfonso de Borbon, who puts on airs about the French throne, the Italian pretenders, the many archdukes and archduchesses or even for Pavlos' younger brother and sister Philippos and Theodora.
Moot point. The claim to French throne is disputed and each pretender has a varying degree of involvement in France (and they can speak French). And the Italian pretenders actually live in their countries and speak the respective national languages. And archdukes and archduchesses do not lay claim to the head of state of a country. Whilst Prince Philippos and Princess Theodora are not in the immediate line of succession to the head of the Greek royal family. Whilst Pavlos and his eldest son, Constantine Alexios, are.

I do agree, however, that they don't owe anything to Greece, considering how they were booted out. At the same time though, if they no longer want to be associated with the country, they should no longer use the royal title either - at least in such a flaunting manner for personal gains outside the country (which in the end does bear some informal responsibilities - such as at least speaking the national language and living the country, if legally possible, as the King and Prince Nikolaos have decided to do).

LE: I mean Constantine Alexios' instagram is literally "alexiosgreece". I can just see a Greek person rightly exclaiming "Ela re, 'greece', the guy doesn't live here or speak the language". He's claiming something that he's not willing to bear any responsibility for. At least Prince Boris, as you pointed out the Bulgarians, makes no such attempt of flaunting his royal status, and he simply goes by Boris de Sajonia-Coburgo-Gotha y Ungría (his instagram is Boris Saxe-Coburg or "borissaxe"- not "borisbulgaria"). Although it might be unfair bringing the Bulgarians in this topic, as maybe Prince Boris would have had a different path if not were for the tragic incapacitation and later death of his father, Prince Kardam.
Reply With Quote
  #388  
Old 10-28-2021, 07:47 AM
Blog Real's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lisboa, Portugal
Posts: 7,465
They use titles because titles are part of the family. I believe that Pavlos and Marie-Chantal's children like Greece but don't feel the obligation to live in the country or to do anything for the country.
The same happens with Alexia, Theodora and Philippos.
I don't criticize them, not least because the Greek state has always misbehaved with the royal family.
Nikolaos and Tatiana live in Greece and enjoy being in the country. If Nikoalos were the heir, the situation might be different.
King Constantine and Queen Anne-Marie also live in Greece. Fortunately they had the opportunity to return to their country.
The King loves Greece, although he has not always been treated well by the country's governments. And I believe your children and grandchildren love Greece too.
__________________
My blogs about monarchies
Reply With Quote
  #389  
Old 10-28-2021, 11:19 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: St Thomas, U.S. Minor Outlying Islands
Posts: 4,155
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
It is interesting that this discussion only pops up with the CP Pavlos & family, while nobody mentions a simular issue for f.e. the Bulgarians, Don Luis Alfonso de Borbon, who puts on airs about the French throne, the Italian pretenders, the many archdukes and archduchesses or even for Pavlos' younger brother and sister Philippos and Theodora.
There are people who are much more strongly criticized for their title usage in royal watching discussions than the former royal family of Greece, whose usage of Greek royal titles still enjoys the approval of most royal watchers. Female-line, adoptive, and out-of-wedlock children of German royals are roundly criticized by royal watchers for using the royal titles which are incorporated into their legal names, when they are fully entitled to them under the modern egalitarian laws of the German state. The late Prince Henrik and the Danish royal court were widely criticized for recognizing Henrik's premarital French courtesy title of Count, when his family had used the title for centuries without the French state taking issue.

So there are indeed some inconsistencies in the discussions of titles among royal watchers, but in regard to the French and Italian pretenders, their position is not quite comparable. In France, the titles of all three former royal families and of the former noble families receive legal recognition and protection from the state. In Italy, the legal recognition of nobility titles has ceased, but the state appears to have no issue with their widespread usage in daily life. I am not knowledgeable about the situation in Bulgaria.

You are right that the Greek issue exists too for the numerous "archdukes and archduchesses". As with Greece, the Austrian state has long made clear that their former imperial family is expected to move on from their nonexistent titles. On the other hand, there seems to be very little royal watching discussion in the first place about most members of the Habsburg family, with the exception of the family of the head of the house (who at least appear to refrain from using archducal titles when they are in Austria), the family of Princess Astrid of Belgium (who nearly always use their Belgian titles), and the family of Princess Marie-Astrid of Luxembourg (and I seem to recall that family has indeed been criticized for using the revoked titles).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
IMO the crown prince and his family do not owe the country a thing. Greece has kicked the family out and has behaved appalingly towards the RF for decades. Unlike in Romania or Serbia there are few informal responsibilities that come with being the heir of the Greek throne. I imagine it is a healthy thing that they do not cling on to long lost dreams and have moved on.
Quote:
Originally Posted by monarhiero View Post
I do agree, however, that they don't owe anything to Greece, considering how they were booted out. At the same time though, if they no longer want to be associated with the country, they should no longer use the royal title either - at least in such a flaunting manner for personal gains outside the country (which in the end does bear some informal responsibilities - such as at least speaking the national language and living the country, if legally possible, as the King and Prince Nikolaos have decided to do).
I am not the most knowledgeable on this issue, but it is not my impression that the state or the people of Greece are clinging to their former royal family. It seems to be the family which claims that Greece owes them the title and name of the country.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Blog Real View Post
They use titles because titles are part of the family.
I understand your point and that is probably the family's view of the matter. On the other hand, I suspect that Zara Phillips for example would be roundly condemned if she used Princess Zara of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, despite being an official member of a family that still reigns over the UK and living in the country. And as I mentioned above, there are Germans who receive criticism for using their legally-acknowledged titles despite living in Germany and being legitimate (according to modern equality laws) members of former ruling families.
Reply With Quote
  #390  
Old 10-28-2021, 05:34 PM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Posts: 2,318
I will never get that discussion... Royalty almost never gave up titles after being deposed. The Kaiser remained "The Kaiser" up until now although he is a very unpopular figure in Germany these days (nobody would ever call him "Wilhelm Hohenzollern"! I guess no German would know who was meant by that. Even today`s head of the Hohenzollern Dynasty, Georg Friedrich, is always called "GF, Prince of Prussia"). The former King of Portugal died as King Manuel and not as Manuel Braganza in Exile. The younger sister of Empress Elisabeth of Austria, Marie of Two Sicily, remained Queen Marie after she and her weak husband were driven out of the country. Zita, wife of the Emperor Charles of Austria-Hungary was known as Empress Zita until she died. King Michael of Romania was King Michael. King Umberto, former King of Italy was King Umberto, the Shah is the Shah (don´t know if Reza Pahlavi would be familiar to everybody..?)... The list could go on and on. So why of all Royals the greek royal family are always confronted with criticism using titles unjustified is beyond me!
They were born into it, no matter if they hold official roles in a society or not and by that it´s part of their birthright and personality. You cannot compare these things with jobs ordinary people have ("once I was a taxi driver, now I am a teacher") - royal titles are not just a job discription, but they mark the complete (family) background, legacy and biography of these people.
Zara Philips was never a "Princess of GB and NI" - she was not born as such as her father remained a commoner even after marrying Zara´s mother and because, if true what is claimed, Pcss Anne refused royal titles for her children. The same counts for the offspring of norwegian Princesses Ragnhild and Astrid, which both married commoners who remained so after their wedding so that their children have average commoner names. So Zara or the norwegian Princesses children as well as Princess Christina, Mrs. Magnusson´s children, cannot be compared with a former reigning King and Queen and their children ( Alexia, Pavlos and Nikolaos were even born when their parents were still in office) who were both born as children of reigning monarchs.

What could be criticised and what would really be illegal and unlawful, if a pretender of a former throne would style him/ herself "King" or "Queen" after the death of the predecessor, That is why Margarita of Romania is a "Custodian" and not the new "Queen of Romania". That she styled herself a "Majesty" could be discussed and argued upon indeed...!
Reply With Quote
  #391  
Old 10-28-2021, 05:53 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: St Thomas, U.S. Minor Outlying Islands
Posts: 4,155
Quote:
Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
I will never get that discussion... Royalty almost never gave up titles after being deposed. The Kaiser remained "The Kaiser" up until now although he is a very unpopular figure in Germany these days. The former King of Portugal died as King Manuel and not as Manuel Braganza in Exile. The younger sister of Empress Elisabeth of Austria, Marie of Two Sicily, remained Queen Marie after she and her weak husband were driven out of the country. Zita, wife of the Emperor Charles of Austria-Hungary was known as Empress Zita until she died. King Michael of Romania was King Michael. King Umberto, former King of Italy was King Umberto... The list could go on and on.
One could also cite a long list of royals who were stripped of their titles, whether they abided by the decision or not. Germany preserved the title of their Kaiser, but Austria did not. Portugal allowed King Manuel to maintain his title, but King Miguel was stripped of his by Parliament. The Kingdom of Italy continued to recognize the titles of the deposed royal family of the Two Sicilies, but the Republic of Italy officially does not.


Quote:
Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
So why of all Royals the greek royal family are always confronted with criticism using titles unjustified is beyond me!
In my previous post, I have cited a few examples of persons who are confronted with much more expansive criticism for using royal titles.


Quote:
Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
Zara Philips was never a "Princess of GB and NI" - she was not born as such
[...] So Zara or the norwegian Princesses children as well as Princess Christina, Mrs. Magnusson´s children, cannot be compared with a former reigning King and Queen who were both born as children of reigning monarchs.
My understanding was that this particular discussion originally dealt with the grandchildren of the former king.


Quote:
Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
What could be criticised and what would really be illegal and unlawful, if a pretender of a former throne would style him/ herself "King" or "Queen" after the death of the predecessor, That is why Margarita of Romania is a "Custodian" and not the new "Queen of Romania". That she styled herself a "Majesty" could be discussed and argued upon indeed...!
It can certainly be argued, but as she does so with the recognition and support of the reigning Romanian state which allocates her a quasi-official role, it is not unlawful and many of the issues in the Greek case do not apply.
Reply With Quote
  #392  
Old 10-28-2021, 06:07 PM
Prinsara's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: A place to grow, Canada
Posts: 1,895
Quote:
Originally Posted by monarhiero View Post
LE: I mean Constantine Alexios' instagram is literally "alexiosgreece". I can just see a Greek person rightly exclaiming "Ela re, 'greece', the guy doesn't live here or speak the language". He's claiming something that he's not willing to bear any responsibility for. At least Prince Boris, as you pointed out the Bulgarians, makes no such attempt of flaunting his royal status, and he simply goes by Boris de Sajonia-Coburgo-Gotha y Ungría (his instagram is Boris Saxe-Coburg or "borissaxe"- not "borisbulgaria"). Although it might be unfair bringing the Bulgarians in this topic, as maybe Prince Boris would have had a different path if not were for the tragic incapacitation and later death of his father, Prince Kardam.
He's claiming "alexiosgreece" the same way his aunt acts as "Theodora Greece" -- as a last name. Because they don't have another one and King Constantine has never gone for "Glucksborg".

You can be annoyed as you want over their obligations to a role and country that doesn't much care for them, but it ought to be separated from day-to-day realities. Like needing something for a surname.
Reply With Quote
  #393  
Old 10-28-2021, 06:10 PM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Posts: 2,318
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
One could also cite a long list of royals who were stripped of their titles, whether they abided by the decision or not. Germany preserved the title of their Kaiser, but Austria did not. Portugal allowed King Manuel to maintain his title, but King Miguel was stripped of his by Parliament. The Kingdom of Italy continued to recognize the titles of the deposed royal family of the Two Sicilies, but the Republic of Italy officially does not.
It can certainly be argued, but as she does so with the recognition and support of the reigning Romanian state which allocates her a quasi-official role, it is not unlawful and many of the issues in the Greek case do not apply.
If new people in power reckognize titles or not doesn`t necessary mean anything to those who are the holder of these titles! I also would not let anyone else dictate as by what name I would be reckognized or what I woul be called! That´s their point of view, others see it differently.
And no, "Custodian Margarita" is not a Majesty as long as Romania is officially a republic and as long as she neither assumes the titles of an "Empress" or "Queen" which are the only two ranks on this planet a person can be called a "Majesty"! Majesties are only held by persons, and by these persons only, who are, or were, monarchs of an Empire or Kingdom.
Margarita has a rightful title indeed - she was born a daughter of a -former- royal sovereign, so she is a Royal Highness, as long as there is a Republic of Romania.
Reply With Quote
  #394  
Old 10-28-2021, 06:26 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: St Thomas, U.S. Minor Outlying Islands
Posts: 4,155


While I personally do see it differently, from the point of view that no one should dictate what others are called, it would be perfectly rightful for Margareta to assume any title she desires (though she seems to be content to be known with the titles of Majesty and Custodian which the Government addresses her by).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prinsara View Post
He's claiming "alexiosgreece" the same way his aunt acts as "Theodora Greece" -- as a last name. Because they don't have another one and King Constantine has never gone for "Glucksborg".

You can be annoyed as you want over their obligations to a role and country that doesn't much care for them, but it ought to be separated from day-to-day realities. Like needing something for a surname.
But does the family regard Greece as a simple family surname or as a territorial designation? (The government apparently regards it as the latter.) There was a recent discussion about this issue in the British forum.
Reply With Quote
  #395  
Old 10-28-2021, 06:36 PM
Prinsara's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: A place to grow, Canada
Posts: 1,895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post


While I personally do see it differently, from the point of view that no one should dictate what others are called, it would be perfectly rightful for Custodian Margareta to assume any title she desires.



But does the family regard Greece as a simple family surname or as a territorial designation? (The government apparently regards it as the latter.) There was a recent discussion about this issue in the British forum.
The Greek government makes fun of Constantine as "Degrecia", if I recall correctly. It's been a long-standing standoff that they will not issue the family passports because they don't have a last name and Constantine refuses to take one to be considered "Greek" and give in. I doubt either side will budge, but they're within their rights to use Greece if they want. Theodora certainly uses it as a professional name, and she could have picked anything.

Edit: For another thing, if it was meant to be a Greek claim or surname, which it isn't, wouldn't it be "h/ellas"-something?
Reply With Quote
  #396  
Old 10-30-2021, 01:12 AM
iceflower's Avatar
Administrator
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: , Germany
Posts: 60,508
Maria-Olympia attended Annabel's - Halloween party in London last night:


** Pic 1 ** Pic 2 **
__________________
**** Welcome aboard! ****
Reply With Quote
  #397  
Old 11-23-2021, 07:03 PM
eya eya is offline
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: -, Greece
Posts: 21,375
Maria-Olympia attends the Annabel's x Swarovski Holiday façade unveiling party in the nightclub at Annabels on 23 November in London

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...40?s=2048x2048

https://www.gettyimages.com/search/2...alproducts=all
__________________
#ΜΕΝΟΥΜΕ ΑΣΦΑΛΕΙΣ! #StaySafe! and the 2021!!
Reply With Quote
  #398  
Old 11-29-2021, 05:22 PM
iceflower's Avatar
Administrator
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: , Germany
Posts: 60,508
Maria-Olympia attended The Fashion Awards 2021 at Royal Albert Hall in London this evening, November 29:


** Pic ** gettyimages gallery **
__________________
**** Welcome aboard! ****
Reply With Quote
  #399  
Old 11-29-2021, 07:26 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: St Thomas, U.S. Minor Outlying Islands
Posts: 4,155
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prinsara View Post
Edit: For another thing, if it was meant to be a Greek claim or surname, which it isn't, wouldn't it be "h/ellas"-something?
Moved reply. https://www.theroyalforums.com/forum...ml#post2440321
__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Christening Of Princess Maria-Olympia, 22 December 1996 Josefine Crown Prince Pavlos, Marie Chantal and Family 9 06-02-2020 03:07 PM
Christening of Aristidis Stavros, born June 29, 2008 BELTRANEJA Crown Prince Pavlos, Marie Chantal and Family 143 06-02-2020 02:50 PM
Christening Of Achileas-Andreas, born August 2000 Josefine Crown Prince Pavlos, Marie Chantal and Family 13 06-02-2020 02:38 PM
Christening Of Odysseas Kimon Queens Crown Prince Pavlos, Marie Chantal and Family 190 10-07-2009 06:08 AM




Popular Tags
18th birthday america american archie mountbatten-windsor asia asian birth britain britannia british royal family cadwallader camilla camilla parker-bowles camilla parker bowles charles china china chinese ming dynasty asia asian emperor royalty qing chinese clarence house colorblindness crown jewels dresses duchess of sussex duke of sussex edward vii elizabeth ii family tree fashion and style genetics george vi hello! highgrove history japan japanese imperial family japan history jewellery kensington palace king juan carlos liechtenstein lili mountbatten-windsor list of rulers medical meghan markle monarchist movements monarchists mongolia nara period noble families norway crown princely couple politics portugal prince harry prince of wales in jordan queen victoria royal ancestry samurai solomon j solomon spanish royal family state visit st edward sussex suthida thai royal family tokugawa unfinished portrait united states united states of america wales welsh


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:24 AM.

Social Knowledge Networks

Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2021
Jelsoft Enterprises
×