Engagement & Marriage of Princess Mako and Kei Komuro: September 2017 - 2021

[Duc_et_Pair]

Oh, we are talking about giving sources of information.

In my understanding as a non-native English speaker "providing evidence" has another meaning. So it probably was a miscommunication on my behalf.

 

[Jiwa]

JunJun, you seem obsessed with hating Kei Komuro - can I ask why? What is your goal with your obsession? What is the harm that you think will happen if Mako marries him? You just compared underestimating him to underestimating a deadly and highly contagious disease, which seems...irrationally extreme.

Excuse me for butting in, as someone who regularly watches jp Twitter i think I might have an idea of why this person is obsessed with kei.
Most of the posts that I see about kei on Twitter are memes (like putting kei komuro on akishino family pictures, or jdrama relationship charts). Of course there are also news Retweet and quote, it is natural to give a commentary when there are some news. However, I also see people who keeps bringing up kei komuro even when its a slow news day, majority of them are imperial watchers. In general I could profile them who are obsessed with kei komuro into two types :

Type A : conservative/netouyo
1. Using kei komuro as a reason why admitting female-line and females as heirs are dangerous.
2. Constant doomposting on kei komuro's children as heirs/future emperors.
3. The 11 Pre war imperial branches >>> commoner men. Revive the old shinnoke into the imperial register/give them throne rights.

Type B : empress regnant Aiko faction. (This one is very confusing, I think there are lots of overlap with imperial/monarchy abolitionists groups who jump into this bandwagon)
1. Using kei komuro as a reason to reject prince Akishino's family.
2. Constant doomposting on prince Hisahito (and his family) as future emperor.
3. Posts how Princess Aiko is a "super princess" (I'm not making this up lol, a cartoonist/mangaka Yoshinori Kobayashi literally call her that).
4. "Empress Aiko, right now! Or republic!!"
5. Generally this type allow empress regnants and her non-paternal line offsprings (B-1), but I've seen comments like Aiko as last emperor (not continuing the monarchy, B-2).


This is why this "marriage" is difficult, many parties/factions using mako and kei for their own agendas.

I'm quite surprised that they have reach this place (..)

 

[iceflower]

This thread has once more been cleaned up. As said before please stay respectful towards each other and accept that opinions can differ. You are free to share your opinion in a civilized manner but refrain from persuading. In addition to that this is not a place to discuss fellow members and if you wish to continue personal discussions please do so via private message. Further off-topic, speculative or similar posts will be deleted without notice. Thank you for your understanding!

 

[kikunohana]

There was a round-table discussion between Keiji Emori (Imperial Family expert and member of the Mainichi Newspaper Editorial Board), Morihide Katayama (political scientist and professor at Keio University), Hideya Kawanishi (historian and associate professor at Nagoya University) and Dr Mayu Yamaguchi (Shinshu University professor who also practices law in Japan and New York) on Komuro’s 28-page document. Bunshun has released a partial transcript of discussion (the full transcript will be available in the June issue of Bungei Shunju): https://bunshun.jp/articles/-/45465

One thing Professor Katayama noted that I had not shared was that in his document, Komuro confirmed the ex-fiancé’s story (that was missing from the summary (Post 152) of this Josei Prime article)about asking the ex-fiancé to deposit 2 million yen in his bank account that he was to immediately return after he had obtained his student visa to study at UCLA, and instead of returning the money, used it toward a trip to Spain. (When applying for a student visa, you must show proof that you have a certain amount of money in your bank account.)

Komuro clarified this money was never going to be used for his study abroad expenses because those expenses were already covered with scholarships, financial aid and his part-time job money, and was only needed temporarily to obtain his visa. He claimed that, when he tried to return the money through his mother after obtaining his student visa, the ex-fiancé said they could keep the 2 million yen and use it toward their living expenses since it would be “a pain” for him (the ex-fiancé) to continually have to deposit money into their bank account when they needed it. So that is why Komuro did not return the 2 million yen according to him. (Annotation 11-2)

Anyway, the discussion is a must read if you are interested in expert opinions on the engagement issue.

By the way, Bungei Shunju is not a tabloid. It is the same literary magazine that grants the prestigious Akutagawa Prize. Keiji Emori, who moderated the discussion, represents Mainichi, which is a major newspaper.

Savannahs (417) and Jiwa,
The Crown Prince himself has admitted he does not think much of the public approves of Komuro and has said the marriage should not proceed until Komuro has provided a satisfactory explanation to the public about his problems, and that should at least give an indication that the distrust of Komuro is not just from a minority or fringe groups trying to push a specific agenda. Even Western media cite widespread public disapproval as the cause for the delay in Princess Mako’s marriage. The New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/30/world/asia/japan-princess-mako-wedding.html

(If you did not notice, I also have never actually voiced my personal opinion on whether or not I think Princess Mako should be allowed to marry Komuro. I have only shared why public disapproval of Komuro is great. The sources I have shared are mostly the same publications Prisma has referenced and I do not belong to either of the groups you described, Jiwa.)

Also, Savannah, as Junjun mentioned in 360, Princess Mako already receives the equivalent of a salary for her duties. The lump sum, which is from the state, is additional, and security is also paid by taxpayers. Komuro has already been costing taxpayers since the official announcement of the engagement or earlier. As I shared before, he has a 20-member security team when he is in Japan, which costs an estimated 6 million yen a month, which is about 55,000 USD. He also has a security team in New York where he studies and his mother has security as well. Altogether, Komuro has already cost taxpayers in the millions (USD) even though he has not married Princess Mako yet. The article I shared before estimates the first year of their marriage alone could cost taxpayers almost 3 million USD if they live in Japan. The situation would be a lot less complicated and there would probably be far less public opposition if it did not involve taxpayer money.

MichaelB (sorry, I am working backwards here),

As I described in 329, two students from different schools said they stopped going to class due to severe bullying from Komuro. One dropped out of high school entirely and did not leave their home for 2 years, while the other went to a different middle school to avoid Komuro and had to seek counseling later. Classmates and guardians at these schools confirm these allegations, and Student A spoke on video and provided texts from Komuro. This is different from the usual, trivial schoolyard accusations.

Last week, Bunshun released another 3-part series on A’s allegations with more information that had been behind a paywall (1 2 3), and the other student who bullied A with Komuro also confirmed that everything A said was true. Though he excused the bullying as light teasing, even he said Komuro should come clean and address his problems so he can move on.

Komuro did communicate with A after his engagement to Princess Mako (hence the texts). Despite admitting the great amount of support he and his mother received from A’s family (text), he did not apologize to A after learning that A was forced to seek counseling due to his actions.

Komuro has not denied any of these allegations.


By the way, the New York Times, The Guardian and the BBC all consider Bunshun a reliable source on Japanese politics and scandals, and have even praised their proactive investigative reporting.


Here is an article from the BBC highlighting the importance of Bunshun and other weeklies as reliable sources of news media, and how press clubs have caused regular newspapers to self-censor, so they will not risk losing access to government officials and important press conferences: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-35557838

Here is an article from the New York Times highlighting Bunshun’s investigative reporting and the reluctance of mainstream media to cover certain sensitive subjects, including the Imperial Family, due to the press clubs which are established by government ministries: https://www.nytimes.com/2000/01/30/world/in-japan-tarnishing-a-star-maker.html

Here as a detailed article about Bunshun about their reporting practices from Nippon.com, written by freelance journalist Kiwamu Kabe: https://www.nippon.com/en/japan-topics/g00898/

The articles above are all in English and I hope readers will read them before dismissing Bunshun and their reporting. I also highly recommend anyone who is interested in media coverage of the Imperial Family and the engagement matter in Japan read the New York Times and BBC article.

 

[kikunohana]

MichaelB,

I think you forget that I came here pointing out that the way information has been shared in this thread has been one-sided for Komuro, and was asked to share sources to the contrary, so naturally the facts/news I share are not going to cast Komuro in a positive light because that has already been done and would defeat the point, and we are here to discuss the engagement with all of the facts available.

And you say I do not consider the positives of Komuro, but I already did a long time ago. As you noted, I have greater access to media in Japan, which moves at a much faster pace than this thread, and the reality is there have not been any real news updates that can be considered positive for the Komuros for some time. Kei’s document was supposed to put an end to the loan dispute and be a good thing, and you know what happened.

I am still having trouble understanding how you believe Komuro’s actions regarding the recording can be seen as respecting the ex-fiancé’s privacy, when the act of secretly recording the ex-fiancé and his mother having a discussion that did not concern him seems like a gross violation of their privacy. Perhaps this can be chalked up to a difference in cultural values because it created quite a backlash in Japan, with even the great-great-grandson of the Meiji Emperor and grandson of Prince Tsuneyoshi Takeda, Tsunayasu Takeda, criticizing the recording on the radio. Radio Nippon AM1242+FM93: https://news.1242.com/article/288042

[FONT=&quot]Prisma does not translate, but summarize Japanese articles they read and interpret through Google Translate. Google Translate is an automated translation tool that is primarily designed for those who cannot read the original text language. If you or others are not comfortable taking me at my word, you can always use Google Translate like Prisma and check the sources I have provided for everyone to see. The tool is free. Please remember that I have mostly shared from the same sources that has been posted here and even two of the same articles that were summarized before. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Keep in mind, however, machine translation can be rather inaccurate, particularly when going from an Asian language like Japanese to English, and Google Translate is no exception. (If you want to learn more, here is an article from Translation Geek about the pitfalls of Google Translate which includes an example from Asahi Newspaper: https://translationgeek.de/blog/machine-translation-how-accurate-is-google-translate/)[/FONT]

But that said, I think you can still get the “gist” of the articles, and you do not need any knowledge of the Japanese language to recognize screenshots of emails and texts, audio, and video, and know that these Japanese publications are not just making stuff up.


I had a whole explanation written out about bias and presentation regarding what you addressed in the rest of your post, but I do not want this thread to get closed again, so I am going to leave that out and I hope we can move on.

However, I agree that I can be pointed or direct and that can come across as confrontational, especially on a unique message board like The Royal Forums where many users try their utmost to appear courteous and adopt a genteel tone, and I apologize to you and Prisma. If you still find my posts upsetting, I will not be offended in the slightest if you or others choose to skip my posts.

 

[Junjun]

Three Opinion Polls

The most objective measure in the world to indicate the public’s opinion is polls.　Denial of them is a denial of democracy, while some kind of conspiracy theorists would insists on invalidity of election or poll.


Now I share 3 web researches carried out by separate Japanese media immediately after release of Komuro’s 28-page document.

Dear posters and readers, my personal conclusion is that, if you are a businessperson who have relationship with Japanese people and have a chance to discuss this topic, the best way would be to say: “Japanese people’s concern about this marriage is understandable. I learned the background of it on the web.”because adults are more concerned being well- informed of this topic.
On this very point, discussion made in this forum will most benefit you.

The Aera dot. which is a web magazine issued by Asahi Shinbun featured
the result of its web research on 17 April.

“No Affection to Mako Felt in Komuro’s Document” : 28,641 Voices to Our Emergency Web Research


1 % was favor for this marriage and 97% was opposite, according to this article.
As for the question about degree of satisfaction to the Komuro’s 28-pages document in explaining the financial problem,
1 % answered “very satisfied” where “not satisfied” was 94% and “no opinion” 4%.

Another web enquirer was made by Shukan Josei Prime in the same month, where similar result was obtained:

90% Was “Not Satisfied” with Komuro’s Document : Severe Comments Were Seen in Emergent Web Enquirer


According to the article above, 90% of 2,300 people who answered on the web were “Not Satisfied” with the document, and 8% didn’t read it, 2% was “satisfied”.


The 3rd research was done in April and featured in this month by Bunshun Online which 1,370 questionees subscribed:

Only 6.7% “Satisfied” with Komuro’s 28-Pages Document, the Lowest Pro-Marriage of 11.2% in the Past: Results of Questionnaire on the Marriage between Mako and Komuro

6.7% answered “Satisfied” with the Komuro document, with 80.9% “Not satisfied” and 12.3% “no opinion”.

Regarding the opinion about the marriage, 72.0% was “Opposite”, with 11.2% “Favor” and 16.8% “No Opinion”.


How do you think about them? No further research was conducted on this topic beside the above, so I did not pick up these favorable for my personal opinion.

And no party is behind these results, no party can manipulate or fake them.

It is supposed to be helpful for you to understand what is background for the public’s opinions demonstrated in these results, when you want to make a chat on this topic with your Japanese friends.
I'm willing to help you as far as necessary, as objectively and with evidences as possible.

 

[Eskimo]

I don’t understand what the issue is here. She marries him and leaves the imperial family. If I remember correctly while she got a decent amount, Sayako did not get enough to set her up for life. It’s probably the same with Mako

 

[Junjun]

In addition to the #426 post of kikunohana, allow me to point out that Daily Shincho is also one of most reliable source in Japan, second to Bunshun.

It has carried many unique stories about Imperial Family, with thorough interviews to peoples concerned, including that on abusing allegation within Akishino families, which was followed by many media to support it, though some of them have been ever subject of complaint from IHA.

I think its stories should be included in this forum.

I don’t understand what the issue is here. She marries him and leaves the imperial family. If I remember correctly while she got a decent amount, Sayako did not get enough to set her up for life. It’s probably the same with Mako

Thank you, Eskimo, for posing question.

Yes, I don't know whether the amount of "lump sum money" is enough or not, since if Komuro had sufficient earning it would don't matter, and beside it, a large amount of guard fee would be required if they were married, as kikunohana said.
Apart from them, there is still "female monarchy" problem. Akishino family is reported as very very eager to establish it, according to this story:

Is They Aware of Voices for Aiko Tennoh? Whole Akishino Family Attended to Funeral of an Elder Statesman of LDP

And I'm sorry, I made a mistake on how much a female monarchy will cost before.
The truth is that some 46 m yen (some $0.42 m) will be paid in total for the head of a female monarchy and her spouse annually, according to the story below:

https://www.kunaicho.go.jp/kunaicho/kunaicho/pdf/kouzokuhi.pdf


The total amount is calculated by:
30,500,000 yen for an independent monarchy head plus 15,750,000 yen for his/her spouse.

This amount of money seems to add oil to the fire.


In addition, there have been many many scandals which are kind of "disgusting" about himself and his mother including semi-criminal episodes.
which I won't repeat the detail of them here. This can be called "ethical aspect" of the background for the opposition.
A lot of people here say:"If she were my daughter, I wouldn't let her marry him, I would persuade her to give up this marriage."


I hope when I talk about this "ethical aspect", people here don't regard it as a partial opinion. It is supported by a number of evidences, you know.
And all I do is to explain the background of people's opposition.

 

[Sunnystar]

I don’t understand what the issue is here. She marries him and leaves the imperial family. If I remember correctly while she got a decent amount, Sayako did not get enough to set her up for life. It’s probably the same with Mako

I would be concerned, as long as he has these outstanding debts and is not established in his career that he cannot earn enough to support her without additional, ongoing assistance from the IF. And, that also leaves them susceptible to the type of scandals that have plagued many royal houses - cash for access, bribery, etc. I can understand how the Japanese public would find all of that as problematic unless resolved to everyone's satisfaction.

 

[Jiwa]

Game of thrones? Aiko vs status quo?

Kikunohana, your posts is very confusing to me. In which part of my writing is contradicting yours? I do agree that the majority is against kei. But Savannah is not asking about that, right? "Why do that person seems obsessed?" Something along those lines. And I said "imperial watcher" as the answer. Proof:

when its a slow news day, majority of them are imperial watchers.

Afterall, people who aren't interested in royalties won't be in this forum.

To be frank, I'm glad you and junjun are here. For the longest time many people here thought that the uber-conservatives are the ONLY ones against kei and mako.(Aiko, abolitionists, etc) I have difficulties in trying to inform them since I'm not japanese and I prefer to lurk. I'm glad that I don't have to do anything extra.

Also it's refreshing to see Aiko Tenno faction here. I want you and junjun to show there's "a fight for succession" currently going on.
What you guys posts here about kei and akishino family are not new to me. But still, I'm looking forward to seeing it for the second time in English, keep it up. It would be better too if the faction of akishino/hisahito is also here (alas they don't seem to be the type to care about foreigners opinion, from what I see on twitter), while I'm watching those "rap battles" with Ramin djawadi's game of thrones soundtracks and popcorn.

 

[Junjun]

I would be concerned, as long as he has these outstanding debts and is not established in his career that he cannot earn enough to support her without additional, ongoing assistance from the IF. And, that also leaves them susceptible to the type of scandals that have plagued many royal houses - cash for access, bribery, etc. I can understand how the Japanese public would find all of that as problematic unless resolved to everyone's satisfaction.

Thank you for your post, Sunnystar, I felt released and encouraged by it.
I suppose that you are a knowledgeable person with good intellectual appetite and practical way of thinking.
If you want to be well informed, your right-to-know should be respected to a maximum extent here, I believe.

Kikunohana, your posts is very confusing to me. In which part of my writing is contradicting yours? I do agree that the majority is against kei. But Savannah is not asking about that, right? "Why do that person seems obsessed?" Something along those lines. And I said "imperial watcher" as the answer. Proof:



Afterall, people who aren't interested in royalties won't be in this forum.

To be frank, I'm glad you and junjun are here. For the longest time many people here thought that the uber-conservatives are the ONLY ones against kei and mako.(Aiko, abolitionists, etc) I have difficulties in trying to inform them since I'm not japanese and I prefer to lurk. I'm glad that I don't have to do anything extra.

Also it's refreshing to see Aiko Tenno faction here. I want you and junjun to show there's "a fight for succession" currently going on.
What you guys posts here about kei and akishino family are not new to me. But still, I'm looking forward to seeing it for the second time in English, keep it up. It would be better too if the faction of akishino/hisahito is also here (alas they don't seem to be the type to care about foreigners opinion, from what I see on twitter), while I'm watching those "rap battles" with Ramin djawadi's game of thrones soundtracks and popcorn.

Well, polls show the Japanese public overwhelmingly supports the idea of a female emperor.
Over 80 % of people are proved to be favor for female emperor of male lineage,, which is interpreted as support for “Aiko Tenno”. And these results seem to have more certainty than “97% opposition to the marriage” since the researchs were conducted by random interview, not a web questionnaire.

https://english.kyodonews.net/news/...idea-of-japan-having-female-emperor-poll.html

https://news.yahoo.co.jp/articles/e6c7ef3ca32ebecddd877da4ccc8ef2288547876?page=2


Any party or fraction is unlikely behind these overwhelming results. If you insist on it, you’re asked to provide evidences to support it.

Now I talk about myself. I’m an ordinary housewife in Japan who worked for a news agency for a while and worked as a business instructor for managers for more than ten years afterward.

When I was lying after a small operation this spring, one idea came to my mind that Komuro would hold his press conference in NY and says: “There is no freedom of marriage for Japanese princesses!” or something as Henry and Meagan did in a TV show.

Then, I started searching English text articles on the web, and found this forum.
No stories were found which describe this controversy in Japan exactly. And when I saw this forum, I was a little shocked and felt sad, as I mentioned before, for discussion here was too far from that in Japan. Many results of opinion polls, as well as the comment of our adorable Emperor Naruhito were ignored.
Dear readers and posters, how do you feel when your own nation is misunderstood?

(..)

As far as this forum’s title is “Engagement between Princess Mako and Kei Komuro”, people here automatically expect something to celebrate, I believe. And it would have been driven when people are depressed under the coronavirus circumstances. It seemed that everything supposed to be inadequate to promote this marriage was ignored here.
(..)

So I started posting here. I was obsessed, as someone said before, to make full explanation about this topic, since people here were so short of information. As long as this is a forum for respectable and intelligent people, they should be more informed before making discussion, I felt.

And now, regarding this marriage, my personal opinion is that: Mako can be married with Komuro, after exit from IF, with smallest amount of lump-sum and without “female monarchy” , because she deserves him. She was proved to be a person who forces a poor old man to give up his money. And I don’t want to see her in official occasions any more.
As for Komuro, I’d recommend him to be a celebrity in western world, maybe there are a lot of his fan. He can contract with Netflix or other sponsors and earn money to support Mako. It doesn’t matter for Japanese people, as long as we don’t have to hear of him. And if he and Mako disclosed some secrets of Akishino family, Japanese public would welcome it.
Isn’t it the way in which everyone become happy?
People in US won’t care about his reputation in Japan…

 

[Denville]

Surely its up to the Japanese people and their IF to decide what to do? If Mako is going to marry him, then its her choice. if the Japanese tax payers dont want to give her a pay off, then its up to them to arrange that she gets none or only a small pay off.

 

[Junjun]

Surely its up to the Japanese people and their IF to decide what to do? If Mako is going to marry him, then its her choice. if the Japanese tax payers dont want to give her a pay off, then its up to them to arrange that she gets none or only a small pay off.

Well, thank you for being interested in this topic, Denville.
I personally doubt Mako has sound judgement, as well as accountability and autonomy as a person,
(..) I hope her to go out of our country as soon as possible, even if it would mean their marriage.

And I forgot to mention Akishino family and suspected yakuza connection, to cut it off, I’d propose that Akishino family should be included in Inner Court IF 内廷皇族　, so that their finance would be reduced and strictly monitored not to freely give or donate their money to others.
Originally Crown Prince family had been a part of ICIF, it’s unnatural that Akishino is not so. The finance of an independent monarchy is not monitored at all.

 

[Jiwa]

Gotcha

Ah I see. So you are concerned about what if people might not believe these polls. In which part of my posts that I deny these polls?

Any party or fraction is unlikely behind these overwhelming results. If you insist on it, you’re asked to provide evidences to support it.

Quite a Paranoia, I literally never claim this.

I didn't talk about the polls before in this thread, i mostly talks about social media (twitter) and the factions/parties inside it (generalized into two factions/parties). I think you misinterpreted things here.

I understand your enthusiasm on supporting Aiko, Junjun. Plenty of people in this forum do wishes for empress regnant Aiko, even before you and Kikunohana came here. So I never think of what you did on akishino, mako and kei is needed in the first place to support Aiko in this forum. It's just too extra, and may rub some people up the wrong way.

"The foreigners" here are unlikely to come to Twitter to demo for Aiko. Because "we are"- (I'm not the representative of this forum lol) because "I'm" not part of your democracy. I respect your democracy by not taking part in it.

--------------

Just curious
How well do these polls reflected in places?
I sometimes see comments on Yahoo news supporting Aiko, the ratio of like and dislike does hover around 8:2 and even more.
The poll somewhat has a basis or well reflected in that place.

But how well do these polls reflected in SNS such as twitter?
Keisuke tsumura and shiori yamao vocally supports Aiko. But I didn't see them having "Aiko boost/buff".

https://twitter.com/x/status/1388691872952901639

(just posting a link to a tweet isn't enough, I have troubles digging up tweets)

Other political parties could take advantage of it too, is it reflected well on elections?
No, LDP still reign on top. I thought type B will grow more presence in SNS after 2 years but It's stagnant.

How serious/enthusiastic are the people on that 80%? Have you tried growing an online presence at least? I saw some effort, There's a petition circulated online, but only 4k people signed it since two years ago.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1393180012912648192

Heck, gosen dojo also creating a website for her (aiko-sama.com)
Why there are not many people talking about this on SNS?

Seeing this lack of seriousness/enthusiasm, No wonder the politicians in LDP is ignoring Aiko.

What kind of layer enthusiastically comments and upvotes on Yahoo news, but has a presence less on Twitter? I have no answer to this

Note:
I was ready to posts a lengthy essay but I was force log-out and lost everything, even now I'm still raging because of it. ?

 

[MichaelB]

I agree that I can be pointed or direct and that can come across as confrontational, especially on a unique message board like The Royal Forums where many users try their utmost to appear courteous and adopt a genteel tone, and I apologize to you and Prisma.

I appreciate the matter-of-factness of your last posts and I appreciate your apology to Prisma. I do not quite understand why you apologize to me as you have not accused me of anything. But if that is what you want to do, it is probably not my place to object to it.

Here is an article from the BBC highlighting the importance of Bunshun and other weeklies as reliable sources of news media, and how press clubs have caused regular newspapers to self-censor, so they will not risk losing access to government officials and important press conferences: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-35557838

The article highlights the well-known problems of the Japanese media system and why, due to its shortcomings, tabloids like Shukan Bunshun and Shukan Shincho play an important role in it. But the way it describes both of them does not seem very flattering overall:

Shukan Bunshun has been winning the scoop battle this year but its rival Shukan Shincho also recently exposed an extramarital affair of Hirotada Ototake, known for publishing a popular book about being born without arms or legs, who had been rumoured to run for parliament.

If you did not notice, I also have never actually voiced my personal opinion on whether or not I think Princess Mako should be allowed to marry Komuro.

Well, let me put it that way: I´d be very surprised to hear that you support Princess Mako marrying Komuro. But feel free to tell me if you do. I like to be surprised.

Perhaps this can be chalked up to a difference in cultural values because it created quite a backlash in Japan, with even the great-great-grandson of the Meiji Emperor and grandson of Prince Tsuneyoshi Takeda, Tsunayasu Takeda, criticizing the recording on the radio. Radio Nippon AM1242+FM93: https://news.1242.com/article/288042

Maybe you would like to explain a bit further who Takeda is, what background he has and why he feels that he should participate in this conversation. Most members of the former collateral branches of the IF have refrained from publicly commenting on imperial matters. Takeda is an exception in this regard as you probably well know.
Those who have been following the imperial succession debate closely would recognize his name. But I suppose most people don´t.

 

[MichaelB]

Excuse me for butting in, as someone who regularly watches jp Twitter i think I might have an idea of why this person is obsessed with kei.

Thank you for the background information. Very interesting indeed.

3. Posts how Princess Aiko is a "super princess" (I'm not making this up lol, a cartoonist/mangaka Yoshinori Kobayashi literally call her that).

Once there were rumours circulating that Aiko was allegedly autistic. A Japanese top politician publicly expressed his deep concerns that she might fall in love with a „blue-eyed foreigner“ and make him the father of the imperial heir if she ascended to the throne. The Akishinos, meanwhile, were seen as the „ideal family“. I remember even the wording of someone here (written some time after Hisahito´s birth by a Japanese member) because I found it so odd: „The reliable father, the elegant mother, the bright and dutiful daughters... and now this little saviour“.
15 years later, Aiko is a „super princess“, and the Akishinos should preferably be thrown out of the family. Can they make up their mind already?

If I were Aiko, I´d be scared that ten or twenty years from now, I´d become the target of their hatred, yet again.
And if I were Mako I would not want those people to make my life´s decisions for me. Sure, it is possible that Mako idealizes Komuro too much because she is in love. But this sort of twitter frenzy does not seem to be a good source of advice either.

I'm quite surprised that they have reach this place

People worldwide unfortunately get more and more used to being in those informational echochambers which feeds an attitude of „Either you agree with me, or you are the enemy.“ Sources of information that aim at giving facts in a relatively neutral unbiased way are - by their very existence - perceived as a serious threat to this worldview.

 

[Savannahs]

The tabloid media and social media trolls seem especially awful in Japan.

I remember reading that Princess Aiko left elementary school for a while because of bullying. That seemed crazy: why would anyone bully a princess? Wouldn’t people want to be friends with her, or at least not get on her bad side? But now I get it - it’s socially acceptable to tear the Imperial Family apart without any acknowledgement of their humanity.

I wonder if Prince Hisahito will refuse to have children and make the whole thing end.

Getting back to Kei Komuro, a lot of the criticism seems based in classism. Imperial princesses are supposed to marry rich men. But he’s from a family that’s, at best, middle class. Money has been tight. In that position, people do things that seem sketch to those who have plenty of money, like move money into a bank account to get a US visa or not get married legally to maintain pension benefits. I don’t think that condemns him; I think it humanizes him.

I am baffled at why he periodically releases such long winded explanations of the situation with his mom’s ex-fiancé. It seems like that’s something that could be summed up in a simple one-pager: “we lived with my mom’s fiancé and he paid some of our expenses, including my school fees; we understood these payments to be gifts; after they broke up (and after I started dating the princess), he approached my mom and insisted she pay him back for everything he’d paid for when they were together; we tried to negotiate but it didn’t go anywhere; he refused to consider a payment installment plan; $36K is a lot of money so we can’t pay him back all at once; and BTW, based on my mom’s ex’s actions, it seems like he doesn’t want to get paid back, he’s just using this situation to get as much attention as possible. Nevertheless, I’m about to graduate law school and have a high-paying job lined up and I will pay him $36K from my income over the next x years.” Explanation done.

I figured this was a lost-in-translation thing, but someone here posted a panel with Japanese legal experts who were also baffled at why he releases such verbose, disorganized statements. It is weird.

 

[yukari]

The tabloid media and social media trolls seem especially awful in Japan.

I remember reading that Princess Aiko left elementary school for a while because of bullying. That seemed crazy: why would anyone bully a princess? Wouldn’t people want to be friends with her, or at least not get on her bad side? But now I get it - it’s socially acceptable to tear the Imperial Family apart without any acknowledgement of their humanity.

I wonder if Prince Hisahito will refuse to have children and make the whole thing end.

(...)

TBF, I'm sure I've seen a similar remarks but with different country mentioned. And in the case of royal watching, British tabloids and Sussexes troll come to mind. And talking about BRF, if I'm not mistaken, wasn't there's a story of young prince Charles being bullied when he was in boarding school? So I don't think Japan is so special in that case.

(...)

Getting back to Kei Komuro, a lot of the criticism seems based in classism. Imperial princesses are supposed to marry rich men. But he’s from a family that’s, at best, middle class. Money has been tight. In that position, people do things that seem sketch to those who have plenty of money, like move money into a bank account to get a US visa or not get married legally to maintain pension benefits. I don’t think that condemns him; I think it humanizes him.

(...)

Actually, even among ordinary family, expecting someone to have stable income before they marry is rather common. Now before we blame it to patriarchy culture or even call it archaic, as a daughter, I don't see anything wrong when a family (family, because sometimes it's not just parents, but can include siblings, grandparents or even uncles/aunts) thinking that daughter is precious so a man has to prove himself before he can marry her. The family bond (and with it, the obligation) doesn't stop after a family member married. Many still consider marriage not only about a man and a woman, but their families too. And I can attest that it's not exclusive to Japan. It happens in China, India, Middle East (I've been told even their ancestry matters, not just their income, something about 'nas' or 'nasb'), maybe even every country in Asia. In many case, it's not about the amount but stability, so a civil servant may be prefered than an artist even though the latter can earn more money. (no worry, the daughter-in-law candidate would have her own criteria to be approved by the man's family too).

And the thing is, some of us may prefered to be prepared than being spontaneous and "wing it", or even just being pragmatic since in the end of the day, no matter what shown in the movies, love can't buy food nor pay rent. What works in one place (read: culture) may not work in other and it also doesn't mean that one is better than other.

If it applies to common folks, why can't royalty? I don't think anyone would make a fuss if Mako married, say, an ordinary university professor with humble origin. It's just there's a lot of red flags about Komuro. Princess Ayako announced her engangement to a commoner not long after Mako, yet no dubious story resurfaced about him, isn't it saying something?

Some years ago, there's an attempt kidnapping (six were convicted of trespassing and illegal possession of weapons and sentenced to prison) to the former Suga-no-miya (daughter of Emperor Showa and sister of the current Jōkō) after she married. Who know if something similar could probably happen to Mako if they just let her live in an LDK in an ordinary neighbourhood because it's the one the couple could afford?

 

[Savannahs]

TBF, I'm sure I've seen a similar remarks but with different country mentioned. And in the case of royal watching, British tabloids and Sussexes troll come to mind. And talking about BRF, if I'm not mistaken, wasn't there's a story of young prince Charles being bullied when he was in boarding school? So I don't think Japan is so special in that case.

The British tabloid culture is terrible too, absolutely.
(..)

Actually, even among ordinary family, expecting someone to have stable income before they marry is rather common. Now before we blame it to patriarchy culture or even call it archaic, as a daughter, I don't see anything wrong when a family (family, because sometimes it's not just parents, but can include siblings, grandparents or even uncles/aunts) thinking that daughter is precious so a man has to prove himself before he can marry her. The family bond (and with it, the obligation) doesn't stop after a family member married. Many still consider marriage not only about a man and a woman, but their families too. And I can attest that it's not exclusive to Japan. It happens in China, India, Middle East (I've been told even their ancestry matters, not just their income, something about 'nas' or 'nasb'), maybe even every country in Asia. In many case, it's not about the amount but stability, so a civil servant may be prefered than an artist even though the latter can earn more money. (no worry, the daughter-in-law candidate would have her own criteria to be approved by the man's family too).

And the thing is, some of us may prefered to be prepared than being spontaneous and "wing it", or even just being pragmatic since in the end of the day, no matter what shown in the movies, love can't buy food nor pay rent. What works in one place (read: culture) may not work in other and it also doesn't mean that one is better than other.

Why is it necessary for someone to have a stable income? Historically, yes, because the couple would immediately start having children. But now we have birth control. Kei Komuro and the princess could’ve married three years ago and lived in crappy student housing while he went to law school. It would’ve bonded them. I don’t know why that would be a problem.

Princess Ayako announced her engangement to a commoner not long after Mako, yet no dubious story resurfaced about him, isn't it saying something?

This is exactly what I’m talking about! Princess Ayako’s husband was from a rich and well connected family. Her mother introduced them to each other. On paper he’s a commoner (I don’t know the point of saying that, since the formal Japanese aristocracy no longer exists and so everyone is a commoner), but he’s upper class.

Some years ago, there's an attempt kidnapping (six were convicted of trespassing and illegal possession of weapons and sentenced to prison) to the former Suga-no-miya (daughter of Emperor Showa and sister of the current Jōkō) after she married. Who know if something similar could probably happen to Mako if they just let her live in an LDK in an ordinary neighbourhood because it's the one the couple could afford?

This is horrible. If that’s the case, Japanese princesses should continue to receive security after they leave the family. If the Japanese public doesn’t want to pay for that, then there shouldn’t be an Imperial Family. You can’t make someone a public figures based solely on birth, so they had no choice in the matter, and then deny their safety. That’s an example of dehumanizing the Imperial Family.

BTW, someone in a prior post said that the Japanese government is paying for security for Kei Komuro’s mom and for himself in NYC. I highly, highly doubt that. Reputable sources, please.

 

[Denville]

There's nothing to stop the Japanese IF from paying for their daughters who marry out, is there? They are not completely penniless.

 

[Junjun]

There's nothing to stop the Japanese IF from paying for their daughters who marry out, is there? They are not completely penniless.

Unfortunately, IF is banned to freely use their money, Denvill. As I mentioned before, they cannot freely give or donate others a large amount of money. If they want to do so, it needs Diet’s decision.

As for why the 28-page document of Komuro to explain his financial problems was released on 8 April, I have one hypothesis on it.

There is no evidence to support it, of course, I just bring it to the table for readers’ information.

Mr.Nishimura, Imperial Household Secretary, urged Komuro to give full explanation of his financial problem in last December.
However, explanation was not done for a long time, and it was predicted to be prolonged until his NY State bar exam. Then, the document was released suddenly on 8 April.
What happened beforehand?
Most likely explanation for the timing is:

Japanese government’s budget for 2021 fiscal year was passed in the Diet in the end of this March.
Then, the lump-sum money for Mako’s marriage was reported as not booked in the budget by Bunshun Online on 31 March.

https://news.yahoo.co.jp/articles/0684d81a3b394229e4b2e320bc5f9572ec837e98

More specifically speaking, it was not put in IHA’s budget. It was likely to show that IHA wasn’t preparing for their marriage.
Mako and Kei Komuro might be upset. Few days before, Mako was witnessed to be glaring Emperor Naruhito for a while when she passed by him at the Ceremony of beginning of songs 御歌始めの儀.

It was obvious that Mako was cursing Emperor who gave a severe comment for their marriage in February.
So, Mako hustled Komuro to make the 28-page explanation document to demonstrate he is positive about the marriage.
Komuro was reported to had written letters to explain the same problem to Akishino every month, so if he pieced the content of these letters, he would be able to finish the document in a few days.

The report of “no lump sum money” on 31 March drove them to release the document, this is my deduction.

No one knows... even if the money is not allocated at IHA’s budget, it could be paid from contingency fund in the case of marriage. But to obtain it, Komuro was supposed to have urgent necessity to offer something to show his commitment.


After all the “job-getting campaign” for him, he is reported to failed to find a job in law firm in NY.

https://news.yahoo.co.jp/articles/32fff596a3c5201ba32ae9496df9817577e0208c

No information to indicate that Komuro got his job is available while many students have already found their workplace where they had done their internship, even before the graduation exam and bar exam, the story said.

Since Komuro is a person who cares much about his reputation as demonstrated in his 28 page document, it’s likely that he sees this forum for this is only forum to talk about him in English, but I’d advise him to concentrate on his study to pass the bar exam, at least.

 

[Prinsara]

On what basis does Komuro qualify for a job (or even a job offer) in New York? I would think it would be very hard to practice as a lawyer on a visa, and he would need to be considered exceptional to be offered one. He has no immigration status in the US, as far as I know.

 

[Savannahs]

On what basis does Komuro qualify for a job (or even a job offer) in New York? I would think it would be very hard to practice as a lawyer on a visa, and he would need to be considered exceptional to be offered one. He has no immigration status in the US, as far as I know.

A U.S. law firm can sponsor his visa, that’s not a problem. Very commonly done.

My recollection is that the law firm Kei worked for as a paralegal in Japan helped pay his law school tuition. In that case, he’d be obligated to return to them after graduation for some period of time, I would think.

Fordham is a good, but not great, law school (which is why all the troll claims that the Imperial Family must’ve bribed Fordham to admit him are absurd; if he was going to improperly use connections to get into law school, he’d go to a better law school!). A Fordham grad needs to be at the top of their class to secure a “big law” (ie highest paying) job in NYC (the type where you intern between your second and third years and then automatically get a job offer and are paid close to $200k immediately). But again, I don’t think Kei was trying to get such a job, since he has a law firm he works for in Tokyo.

 

[Denville]

Unfortunately, IF is banned to freely use their money, Denvill. As I mentioned before, they cannot freely give or donate others a large amount of money. If they want to do so, it needs Diet’s decision.

They have no private fortune that they can use to help out their daughters? Even relatively poor RF's usually have private money...

 

[Savannahs]

They have no private fortune that they can use to help out their daughters? Even relatively poor RF's usually have private money...

My understanding is that the Japanese Imperial Family is much, much more controlled than western royal families. They have no money or property of their own or private source of income. Members who work are only allowed to have part time nonprofit jobs (Mako works at a museum part time). What is allowed in the day-to-day of their lives is severely limited by the Imperial Household bureaucracy. It sounds like an awful life.

 

[Denville]

My understanding is that the Japanese Imperial Family is much, much more controlled than western royal families. They have no money or property of their own or private source of income. Members who work are only allowed to have part time nonprofit jobs (Mako works at a museum part time). What is allowed in the day-to-day of their lives is severely limited by the Imperial Household bureaucracy. It sounds like an awful life.

It seems very odd.. I've never heard of a RF that didn't have some private wealth. But I dont think the tax payer should have to pay out sums of money to princesses who leave the family, when marrying,
However if this is the case, surely the PTB can figure out what would be a relatively small pay off for Mako and her husband, so that the tax payer is not asked to give too much and then it is up to her to see if her marriage works and for herself/her husband to eanr a living.

 

[Savannahs]

It seems very odd.. I've never heard of a RF that didn't have some private wealth. But I dont think the tax payer should have to pay out sums of money to princesses who leave the family, when marrying,
However if this is the case, surely the PTB can figure out what would be a relatively small pay off for Mako and her husband, so that the tax payer is not asked to give too much and then it is up to her to see if her marriage works and for herself/her husband to eanr a living.

The exact amount she gets is determined by the government Cabinet, but I believe the maximum possible is $1 million dollars US. So, we aren’t talking about a large amount of money. Especially considering that she was not allowed to pursue serious employment as a young adult. If she’d been allowed to begin a full time career after graduation, she would’ve earned a lot more than $1 million over the course of her career. I think $1 million is well earned; it’s her money and she should get it and use it for whatever she likes.

 

[Denville]

I think its rather a lot of tax payers money, personally... if her husband's not popular. I dont think he's a monster, but If I were a tax payer I wouldnt want to give him access to that much money. However, I think the people in charge of this should be able to work out a reasonable sum...

 

[Savannahs]

I think its rather a lot of tax payers money, personally... if her husband's not popular. I dont think he's a monster, but If I were a tax payer I wouldnt want to give him access to that much money. However, I think the people in charge of this should be able to work out a reasonable sum...

Yes, the government can work it out.

That said, I hate tying the payment to him in any way. It’s her money; the payment is about her. If she’s performed her Imperial princess duties well, she should get the money regardless of who she marries. To reduce the amount she receives because the public does not like him feels very sexist, in that it’s patriarchal and also punishes the woman for a man’s actions.

 

[Denville]

Yes, the government can work it out.

That said, I hate tying the payment to him in any way. It’s her money; the payment is about her. If she’s performed her Imperial princess duties well, she should get the money regardless of who she marries. To reduce the amount she receives because the public does not like him feels very sexist, in that it’s patriarchal and also punishes the woman for a man’s actions.

OTOH if they dont get a very big amount, and he IS a gold digger he may take off - and that would do her good.