Engagement & Marriage of Princess Mako and Kei Komuro: September 2017 - 2021

[Duc_et_Pair]

She is so beautiful and he is so handsome. I wish them all the happiness in the world. They have suffered and they deserve it. I can't believe all this mess was caused because Kei's mother has a debt. There are countries (mine) where a couple living together ("common law") share their money while they are together and no way an ex partner could claim in so harsh way for a money he gave to the woman that was considered his family. I know that having money debts is a great dishonour in Japan, and that there is a high inequalitly in women's rights, but this story has been really sad. I'm sure Mako will have a better life outside the Imperial Family. It is wonderful the way Kako embraces her, so touching. I cannot understand her mother not doing the same.

God bless the young couple.

I read the comments and I want to ask you: did Empress Michiko say anything to her grandaughter?

I hope my English to be understable.

I am not so sure Kako will have "a better life" outside the imperial family. We tend to see the highly protocollary pictures of the New Year's Levée or the imperial ceremonies and see meticulously dressed princesses.

But Mako and Kako, and their brother Hisahito, have a completely careful life, with all what they wish for, on a fabulous lush green imperial compound in the middle of a densely populated gigantic urban area.

Outside the two or three times we see the imperial princesses, there is a whole lifestyle they are used to. It is to hope that the princess can cope with not so imperial life outside Japan, living in an apartment somewhere in New York.

 

[Eloisa]

Mako&Kei

To be honest, I didn't think they would get married.
Postponements, Komuro family problems and, some days ago, the hospitalization of Mako's maternal grandfather... But luckly they made their dream come true. They deserve to be happy.
According to the present rules, for Aiko and Kako the only way to stay within the Imperial family, would be to marry noble men? I mean, their distant cousins, those belonging to the cadet branches, reduced to commoner status after the Second World War. Is that a possibility?

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

To be honest, I didn't think they would get married.
Postponements, Komuro family problems and, some days ago, the hospitalization of Mako's maternal grandfather... But luckly they made their dream come true. They deserve to be happy.
According to the present rules, for Aiko and Kako the only way to stay within the Imperial family, would be to marry noble men? I mean, their distant cousins, those belonging to the cadet branches, reduced to commoner status after the Second World War. Is that a possibility?

The Kazoku was a peerage with around 1000 families. After WWII the use of peerage titles was abolished, with exception of the imperial family. The Kazoku ended as the official Peerage of the Empire and became an association of families which belonged to the Kazoku.

But of course, like for an example in Austria or in Germany, the former royal and noble families are still very much existing, with or without the use of a title. In my understanding imperial princesses remain princesses indeed when they marry a partner from families belonging to the Kazoku, so not necessarily cousins from other branches of the imperial family. This expectation (to marry a royal or an aristocrat) was pretty general in all Royal Houses until -let us say- the 1960's, when the first, fully accepted, non-noble partners arrived on the royal scene and are now normal in all Royal Houses.

Many of the utmost strict rules ate derived from the Constitution imposed by the USA: for the continuation of the monarchy the strictest possible conditions were written down.

 

[Somebody]

Are their English translations available of Kako's statement, the bride's parents' statement, the answers by Kei and Mako? Would love to read those in full.

It was wonderful to see how supportive Kako is for her sister. I am sure they will find a way to keep in touch (just like Mako had to do for years with her now husband) as much as possible. While she is clearly excited for her sister, it cannot be easy for her.

 

[Eloisa]

Thanks for your thorough reply Duc_et_Pair.
So if Kako and Aiko will fall in love with members of Kazoku, they could keep their status. There are so few members in the Imperial family, and the older ones will be leaving in the next years, that it would be nice if at least the young princesses stayed in the family. I am already missing Mako

 

[Blog Real]

I am not so sure Kako will have "a better life" outside the imperial family. We tend to see the highly protocollary pictures of the New Year's Levée or the imperial ceremonies and see meticulously dressed princesses.

But Mako and Kako, and their brother Hisahito, have a completely careful life, with all what they wish for, on a fabulous lush green imperial compound in the middle of a densely populated gigantic urban area.

Outside the two or three times we see the imperial princesses, there is a whole lifestyle they are used to. It is to hope that the princess can cope with not so imperial life outside Japan, living in an apartment somewhere in New York.

Mako and Kako studied abroad, have already traveled, for these and other reasons I believe they will do well outside the Imperial Family. But it's a shame that these rules still exist in the Japanese monarchy, so we won't see Princess Aiko on the throne of Japan.

 

[Somebody]

Thanks for your thorough reply Duc_et_Pair.
So if Kako and Aiko will fall in love with members of Kazoku, they could keep their status. There are so few members in the Imperial family, and the older ones will be leaving in the next years, that it would be nice if at least the young princesses stayed in the family. I am already missing Mako

No, they cannot keep their status. The nobility was abolished. Because of that imperial princesses will always loose their status as princess and become a commoner upon marriage. They are raised with the idea that one day they will leave their imperial life behind, i.e., when they marry.

 

[Prinsara]

I am not so sure Kako will have "a better life" outside the imperial family.

Good thing it was Mako who got married.

Again with the riches and luxury and privilege guaranteeing happiness? Strange that commoner women have been so hesitant to marry in, then.

I wish Mako luck and happiness but I am not certain, either, that her life will be "better" from now on. I don't foresee losing her Imperial seclusion as the sole issue, though.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

No, they cannot keep their status. The nobility was abolished. Because of that imperial princesses will always loose their status as princess and become a commoner upon marriage. They are raised with the idea that one day they will leave their imperial life behind, i.e., when they marry.

The cadet royal families lost membership in the Imperial Family by the American Occupation Authorities in October 1947, as part of the abolition of collateral imperial houses and the kazoku (hereditary peerage). However, there are still unofficial heads of the living collateral families and unofficial members of the former hereditary peerage.

It is the same as an European princess marrying someone who is in his homeland "Herr Habsburg" (not even a "von" allowed in Austria) while his -unofficially- an Archduke of Austria and a Prince of Hungary.

"Commoner" Herr Habsburg has most likely more blue blood in his veins than his "royal" spouse. When Aiko dates someone from the former imperial, princely, Japanese Peers, abolished in 1947, I still have to see she has to leave the Imperial House.

 

[Tatiana Maria]

The difference between Japan and Europe is that the surviving European monarchies have no legislation mandating that a princess who marries a commoner take the legal rank of her husband upon marriage. (Were that the case, then a hypothetical princess marrying a Mr. Habsburg would become Mrs. Habsburg indeed, regardless of Mr. Habsburg's blue blood.)


In Japan, the Imperial House Law which came into force in 1947 states:

Article 12. In case a female of the Imperial Family marries a person other than the Emperor or the members of the Imperial Family, she shall lose the status of the Imperial Family member.​

http://www.kunaicho.go.jp/e-kunaicho/hourei-01.html

Without a change in the law, Aiko can remain a member of the imperial family after marriage only if Hisahito is her groom. For Kako, it is impossible.


The rule that a female member of the imperial family took on the status of her husband upon marriage was also included in the previous Imperial House Law, introduced in 1889, so this rule was not (as is often claimed) introduced by the American occupation authorities.

The true difference between 1889 and 1947 is that in 1889, princesses were able (indeed, required) to marry members of the imperial family or the nobility, whereas in 1947 the members of the cadet branches of the imperial family and the members of the nobility were legally downgraded to the status of private citizens (commoners).

The Imperial Household Law (1889)

 

[CrownPrincessJava]

Mako and Kako studied abroad, have already traveled, for these and other reasons I believe they will do well outside the Imperial Family. But it's a shame that these rules still exist in the Japanese monarchy, so we won't see Princess Aiko on the throne of Japan.

Eaxctly - Mako, Kako and even Aiko have been exposed to non-Imperial life from a young age. The Crown Prince couple have said multiple times they raised their daughters with the expectation they will leave the Imperial Family and as such gave them more flexibility to where they studied - including exchange programs in Western countries.

I don't understand those who think she will falter simply because she is no longer living in a palace. That makes no sense!

 

[GardenofEden]

The Kazoku was a peerage with around 1000 families. After WWII the use of peerage titles was abolished, with exception of the imperial family. The Kazoku ended as the official Peerage of the Empire and became an association of families which belonged to the Kazoku.

But of course, like for an example in Austria or in Germany, the former royal and noble families are still very much existing, with or without the use of a title. In my understanding imperial princesses remain princesses indeed when they marry a partner from families belonging to the Kazoku, so not necessarily cousins from other branches of the imperial family. This expectation (to marry a royal or an aristocrat) was pretty general in all Royal Houses until -let us say- the 1960's, when the first, fully accepted, non-noble partners arrived on the royal scene and are now normal in all Royal Houses.

Many of the utmost strict rules ate derived from the Constitution imposed by the USA: for the continuation of the monarchy the strictest possible conditions were written down.

So its Americas fault why the princesses lose everything when they get married... is that why its so hard to change this rule because they have to ask america to change it.

 

[CrownPrincessJava]

So its Americas fault why the princesses lose everything when they get married... is that why its so hard to change this rule because they have to ask america to change it.

No - the Japanese government can change the laws and constitution if they wish. And that includes the laws surrounding succession. There is a whole different thread that discusses succession and membership issues of the Imperial Family Succession and Membership Issues

The US have no control over the Japanese parliament

 

[GardenofEden]

Eaxctly - Mako, Kako and even Aiko have been exposed to non-Imperial life from a young age. The Crown Prince couple have said multiple times they raised their daughters with the expectation they will leave the Imperial Family and as such gave them more flexibility to where they studied - including exchange programs in Western countries.

I don't understand those who think she will falter simply because she is no longer living in a palace. That makes no sense!

Well studying and traveling abroad is alot different than actually moving abroad and staying there.. im pretty sure the princesses didnt have to file taxes when studying abroad they were still pretty sheltered as students.

 

[Tatiana Maria]

So its Americas fault why the princesses lose everything when they get married... is that why its so hard to change this rule because they have to ask america to change it.

Please see the links from a few posts earlier.

https://www.theroyalforums.com/foru...ptember-2017-2021-a-42955-37.html#post2433616

The regulation that a daughter of the imperial family takes on the rank and family membership of her husband on marriage was already present in the Imperial House Law of 1889 and therefore was not the "fault" of the American occupiers after World War Two.

 

[CrownPrincessJava]

Well studying and traveling abroad is alot different than actually moving abroad and staying there.. im pretty sure the princesses didnt have to file taxes when studying abroad they were still pretty sheltered as students.

Mako is an intelligent 30 year old woman who is more than capable of learning how to do taxes, set up a home and even get a job in a foreign country. She hasn't been living under a rock! I think people need to give Mako a little more credit here. She won't be "running back to the palace" because she has to do her own taxes!

 

[rominet09]

I am a living example it can be done. I left my family the day of my wedding, I had never known how to manage things, never knew the realities of life (it was like that then) but then learned.... I asked for advice around me and I managed. She will do it too !

 

[Prisma]

Are their English translations available of Kako's statement, the bride's parents' statement, the answers by Kei and Mako? Would love to read those in full.

[...]

Not yet. However, Japan's Yomiuri (aka The Japan News) provided excerpts of the couple's opening remarks. The earlier post with Google translate was pretty accurate.

Newlywed daughter of Crown Prince Akishino holds press conference with husband Kei Komuro - The Japan News

[...]

Mako Komuro: I am aware that there are various views on the marriage between Kei and me. I sincerely apologize to those who have been inconvenienced by this. And I am grateful to those who thought of me and tenderly worried, and to those who were not misled by groundless information and continued to extend unwavering support to me and Kei. For me, Kei is an irreplaceable presence. And for us, marriage was a choice we needed to make in order to live our lives while carefully protecting our feelings.

Kei Komuro: I love Mako. I want to live my one and only life with the person I love. We have shared many feelings and encouraged each other through both happy and not-so-happy times. I am very sorry for the people who were inconvenienced by issues related to this marriage. Many things had happened, but thanks to Mako and the people who have supported us, I have been able to uphold my desire to proceed through life with Mako. I would like to express my heartfelt gratitude.

Mako: Until today, my opportunities to speak publicly have been limited. I believe that this has led to some misunderstandings. As some of you know, since the news about the engagement came out, Kei has never acted on his own. For example, Kei’s mother’s response to her former fiance was carried out in the direction I requested. Regarding Kei’s studies overseas, I asked him to move forward his plans to study abroad and to establish a base overseas. I was unable to provide any support for his overseas studies, but I am grateful that Kei made the effort to do so despite the difficult circumstances.

[...]

Kei: In April, I made public the details of what is considered to be a financial dispute between my mother and her former fiance. As stated in the document released, my mother and I have expressed gratitude to the former fiance time after time, and we are still grateful to him. I proposed handing over a financial settlement this April, and he replied that it was important for him to meet with my mother. My mother, however, is now psychologically unwell and her doctor advised against meeting with him. Therefore, I told him through my mother’s attorney that I would like to take care of the matter on her behalf. I have received a positive response from a weekly magazine reporter who has been representing the former fiance. I want to do everything I can to resolve the issue. Our wish for the former fiance to accept the settlement money has not changed.

Over the past few years, misinformation has been treated as if it were fact. I am extremely saddened that Mako’s physical and mental condition has been affected by the continued slander.

My mother has also been suffering from mental and physical problems. She has been forced to quit her job and is living in fear for her safety. I am very grateful to the many people who have helped us through this difficult time. I would like to build a warm family with Mako. At the same time, I want to continue to support Mako in any way possible. We would like to continue to be irreplaceable companions, supporting each other through both the happy and not-so-happy times.

[...]

‘He is Indispensable to Me’: Princess Mako Marries Kei Komuro | JAPAN Forward

[...]

At approximately 10:30 A.M. JST, local media reported that the couple had delivered the wedding registration to be processed, formally making them husband and wife. Interestingly, from that point onward, Mako was indicated in media reports as “Mako-san” instead of “Mako-sama,” an appellation reserved to those who are officially part of the imperial family.

[...Recap of the 4-year saga and opening remarks, similar to other articles...]

The couple are expected to move away from the imperial palace and live in an apartment in Tokyo to start preparations for their life in New York, where Komuro trained to become a lawyer. Mako is also expected to start working.

[...]

Mako and Kei leaving the hotel for their apartment in Shibuya, Tokyo on October 26

https://twitter.com/x/status/1452924410436874241

Brief descriptions of Mako's parents and sister's statements

 

[Prinsara]

Are the Imperial Family really the only ones in all of Japan who are referred to formally as "-sama"?

 

[yukari]

The Kazoku was a peerage with around 1000 families. After WWII the use of peerage titles was abolished, with exception of the imperial family. The Kazoku ended as the official Peerage of the Empire and became an association of families which belonged to the Kazoku.

But of course, like for an example in Austria or in Germany, the former royal and noble families are still very much existing, with or without the use of a title. In my understanding imperial princesses remain princesses indeed when they marry a partner from families belonging to the Kazoku, so not necessarily cousins from other branches of the imperial family. This expectation (to marry a royal or an aristocrat) was pretty general in all Royal Houses until -let us say- the 1960's, when the first, fully accepted, non-noble partners arrived on the royal scene and are now normal in all Royal Houses.

Many of the utmost strict rules ate derived from the Constitution imposed by the USA: for the continuation of the monarchy the strictest possible conditions were written down.

I don’t think it’s correct.
The princesses would retain their membership only if they married member of the Imperial family (princes or miyake), but not if they married kazoku.

Chapter VII, ARTICLE XLIV.—A female member of the Imperial Family who has married a subject shall be excluded from membership in the Imperial Family. However, she may be allowed, by special grace of the Emperor, to retain her title of Imperial Princess or Princess, as the case may be.
​

https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Imperial_Household_Law_(1889)

Even before 1889 law existed, take for example, Princess Yoshiko of Arisugawa branch (Arisugawa-no-miya Yoshiko-jō). In 1830, 27-year-old Yoshiko was engaged to Tokugawa Nariaki (of Tokugawa Mito branch). After marriage, she lived a life of a samurai wife (her husband even called her “Yoshiko”). Their oldest (surviving) son was the future Tokugawa Yoshinobu, the last Tokugawa shōgun.

Pre-Meiji, with the exception of Tokugawa clan, I don’t think marriage between princess (especially a naishinnō) and noble were encourage (or ever happened), even if it's the Go-sekke (the five regent houses).

Note:

Chapter VII, ARTICLE XXXIX.—Marriages of members of the Imperial Family shall be restricted to the circle of the family, or to certain noble families specially approved by Imperial orders.
​

This “certain noble families” means the Go-sekke: Konoe, Takatsukasa, Kujō, Ichijō, and Nijō. If you notice, almost every empress consorts were Konoe, while other (past) imperial princes if not marrying cousins they’d marry someone from that clan.

Are the Imperial Family really the only ones in all of Japan who are referred to formally as "-sama"?

No. You can refer anyone with –sama, particularly someone you respect or revere highly (a hardcore fan often refers their idol with –sama).

Komuro's NY bar exam results aren't released and the money dispute does not seem to be resolved, I do not understand why the Kunaicho has precipitated the marriage now when the couple does not yet have a stable situation in NY ?

I can think of only one reason why the Imperial Agency precipitated the marriage : the government plans to reform the rules of succession by letting women remain in the imperial family even after marriage and it was out of the question to let Komuro integrate the imperial family. So they forced Mako’s departure before the reforms

Aiko, Kako and their cousins are therefore “condemned” to stay, Mako is saved

You might be on to something there, Kuro-san.

 

[Reinosa]

"My mother has also been suffering from mental and physical problems. She has been forced to quit her job and is living in fear for her safety."

How can this be possible? The man who once was her partner and her fiancé is surely very "proud" of his behaviour that almost ruined the life of three persons.

 

[Prisma]

The former fiance felt bad and responsible after Mako's C-PTSD diagnosis was revealed. He urgently wants to resolve the dispute and since he can't meet Kayo, he awaits Kei's response.

Maybe I'm reading too much into Kei's remarks but he pointed out a "weekly magazine reporter" has been representing the former fiance. The Komuros could be wary of such publications being involved during the actual negotiations. Also, the tabloids have more incentives to continue the drama rather than end it. I recall the Komuros' representative is an attorney and Kei has only released documents on the IHA's request. Now that the marriage has happened, the IHA won't be involved anymore.

If Kei doesn't have 4 million Yen (or whatever negotiated amount) ready to hand over immediately, then there's going to questions of "how much can you afford to pay back monthly? quarterly? interest? any penalties for missing payment?"

Yahoo Japan shuts down comment sections for reports on ex-Princess Mako's news conference - The Mainichi

Yahoo Japan Corp. has hidden the reader comments section of several news reports on the wedding news conference held by former princess Mako Komuro and her husband Kei on Oct. 26.

[...]

A Yahoo Japan public relations office representative said, "Regardless of the media or content of the article, we automatically hide the comments section if the content of the posts violates our rules. We don't only hide the comments for the articles on that wedding, so please don't misunderstand us."

Yahoo Japan, one of the country's largest internet portals, has revealed that it has been hiding the comment sections on several news articles since Oct. 19. It has also said that it plans to hold expert meetings toward making improvements to the comment sections.

[...]

On October 27th, Grand Steward Yasuhiko Nishimura recorded Mako's marriage and departure from the Imperial family under her section in the Imperial family registry "kotofu" around 3pm. This completes the procedures for the marriage.

Photos: Mainichi

Mako's Imperial family departure registered | NHK WORLD-JAPAN News

 

[Prinsara]

No. You can refer anyone with –sama, particularly someone you respect or revere highly (a hardcore fan often refers their idol with –sama).

As I said, formally, not personal choice. I don't think I've ever heard anyone on the news as -sama except the Imperial Family.

 

[duchessrachel]

I have been following this story, but not closely, so this question may have already been answered. What is her future relationship with her family going to be like? Will there be a relationship? Will she be able to go back to Japan to participate in any birthday celebrations, anniversaries, etc?

 

[Noble Consort Ming]

Eaxctly - Mako, Kako and even Aiko have been exposed to non-Imperial life from a young age. The Crown Prince couple have said multiple times they raised their daughters with the expectation they will leave the Imperial Family and as such gave them more flexibility to where they studied - including exchange programs in Western countries.

I don't understand those who think she will falter simply because she is no longer living in a palace. That makes no sense!

While the princesses were raised with the knowledge that they would leave the family they were also raised to believe they would leave with money to start their new lives. Leaving without that money or full time employment and possibly being completely dependant on a spouse is much different.

And I am not saying money buys happiness but who here can say they would rather be poor and miserable than rich and miserable.

I'm curious about how Mako will receive treatment for her PTSD. I assume her medical care was taken care of while she was a member of the imperial family. Does Japan have free healthcare or is their system more like that of the US where she would have to pay for her medical care?

 

[yukari]

As I said, formally, not personal choice. I don't think I've ever heard anyone on the news as -sama except the Imperial Family.

But honorific is a personal choice.
Often -sama is used for a guest (hotel/ryokan guests) or customer. -sama is not exclusively associated to royal, it's just more flattering than -san.
In a, say, conference or some formal event, the emcee or coordinator often use "mina-sama" instead of "mina-san" to call everyone or something like "ladies and gentlemen" in the beginning of a speech (come to think of it, "mina-san" does sound a bit informal/too casual in some occasion).

Edit:
Out of topic of the thread, but here is a bit about honorific
https://gogonihon.com/en/blog/sama-san-kun-chan-the-many-japanese-honorifics/

If you happen to be at an airport in Japan or board a Japanese flight, you might catch airport personnel or flight attendant addressing passenger as "okyaku-sama", basically mean "sir/ma'am/dear passenger".

 

[Reinosa]

The former fiance felt bad and responsible after Mako's C-PTSD diagnosis was revealed. He urgently wants to resolve the dispute and since he can't meet Kayo, he awaits Kei's response.l]

I'm sorry Prisma, I don't understand. Is it true or is it a joke?

 

[Osipi]

I'm going to take a stab at this from the very little I know about Japanese/Asian cultures. One's reputation is everything (it's not only in The Last Kingdom) and perhaps the ex-fiance, once Mako's diagnosis became known, to "save face", he wants to resolve the issue.

"The concept is a core social value in Asian cultures, among others. The meaning has remained stable across time. Saving Face signifies a desire—or defines a strategy—to avoid humiliation or embarrassment, to maintain dignity or preserve reputation."

 

[Prisma]

I'm sorry Prisma, I don't understand. Is it true or is it a joke?

It's true. Here's the Asahi English article published on October 11

No progress over financial issues, says ex-fiance of Komuro’s mother | The Asahi Shimbun

[...]

“I am asking Kei to tell me what he's thinking, but he has not told me that yet.” He said, “I want to know what Kei, who released the document in April, has in mind when making his proposal."

Regarding Kayo’s ill health and Mako’s recent announcement that she has developed post-traumatic stress disorder, the man said, “I feel a strong responsibility and am truly sorry from the bottom of my heart.”

He said that he had planned to wait to sort out the issue between himself and Kayo, but that changed after the Komuro and Mako settled on a marriage date.

“I intended to wait until Kayo recovered, but I cannot ignore the feelings of Kei, who is going to marry soon. I am trying to think hard to figure out what I should do,” he said.

[...]

Recently, Kei Komuro’s lawyer and the man’s representative have been talking about the issue, but negotiations have not led to a resolution.

[...]

As for the honorific -sama, it's more respectful than -san so -sama is typically used when addressing customers, "everyone" (mina-sama), royalty, or gods (kami-sama), etc. Yes, it can be applied to anyone but not normally. People wouldn't call a friend "Jane-sama" or "Smith-sama" except perhaps as a joke.

 

[Alisa]

Did the family not attend her wedding?