Oldest to Newest Monarchy?

[Ish]

I would say the British and the Norwegians are tied.

Wikipedia dates the Norwegians to about 872, with the unification of Norway and the rule of Harald Fairhair.

The English monarchy became clearly English around the same time with the reign of Alfred the Great and, more importantly, his son Edward the Elder - so between about 880 and 925. Their family had ruled Wessex since (according to the Anglo-Saxon Chronicle) the reign of Cedric in 519.

The first Scottish monarch, however, was Kenneth MacAlpin whose reign began around 858. Given that the current British monarchy is the result of a union between the English and the Scottish kingdoms (and the English kingdom is in many ways the result of the Wessex conquest of the rest of England...) it's kind of hard to say just when the British monarchy began. And that's without getting into the Dukes of Normandy, from whom the Queen's claim to the throne descends. William the Conqueror didn't arrive on the scene until 1066, but his house had ruled Normandy since 911.

[Foss]

Again acording to Gregor of tours the first danish monark is Chochillaicus (a latin form of Hugleik) from 515 AD. Which means that the danish monarchy i 1499 years old.



Gregor af Tours Historia Francorum III.3 [= "Gregorii Historia Francorum" in Monumenta Germaniae Historica: scriptores rerum Merovingicarum vol.1, Hannover, 1885]

[Marengo]

I believe that usually Japan is recognised as the eldest monarchy, since emperor Jimmu in 660 AD of the Yamato dynasty. Denmark is usually considered the oldest European monarchy, starting in the 9th century.

I don't think that you can regard the present Norwegian monarch as a successor to the medieval monarchs. Neither was the king of Italy a continuation of the Roman emperors for example. Instead I think that Norway can be considered the youngest monarchy in Europe, followed by Belgium (1830) and The Netherlands & Luxembourg (1815). Though the Benelux countries did belong to the Habsburg monarchs and earlier to the French kings and German kings/emperors.

Technically the pope is also a monarch so that would beat all the others.

[Nawfal Kinana]

Now that we are in 2015, the age of the Moroccan Monarchy is 1227 years old but you didn't mention it at all. NOw its the Alaouite dinasty that is reigning from 1666 and the current king is the king Mohamed VI and this dinasty is from the strain Messenger of Allah Mohamed peace be upon him.

[Duc_et_Pair]

The Netherlands are a monarchy since 1813/1815 but the same dynasty was already a monarchy de facto since 1585 when a son of Willem I of Nassau, Prince of Orange ('The Silent') succeeded him as Stadtholder (Maurits, and then subsequently followed by Frederik Hendrik, Willem II, Willem III, etc.)

In 1674 the Lords States-General declared the office of Stadtholder hereditary for Willem III of Nassau, Prince of Orange (and King of England, Scotland and Ireland) and for his male descandants. So since then it was a monarchy de jure. The Stadtholder however died without issue.

In 1747 the Lords States-General declared the office of Stadtholder hereditary for both the male and the female issue of Johan Willem Friso of Nassau-Dietz, Prince of Orange. So since then it was a monarchy de jure again. Today's royal family directly stems from this Prince.

As a monarchy means a system in which the highest function of State is delivered by hereditary succession, we can say that the Netherlands, despite the disguising name "Republic" has been a monarchy for the longest time.

[Meraude]

If counting monarchies that no longer exist, don't forget Egypt and its pharaohs, from a united Egypt under Menes in 3150 BCE, it existed until 30 CE, the death of Cleopatra VII, a total of three millennia. There were kings before Menes in Upper Egypt and Lower Egypt so its history as a monarchy is even longer.

[haha]

what about the british monarchy?????? and also I think it is the oldest because it was formed in 400ad

[Meraude]

Originally Posted by haha

what about the british monarchy?????? and also I think it is the oldest because it was formed in 400ad

There were several separate kingdoms on the British isles, one of them was the kingdom of Wessex, going back to 519, but the first one who is considered to be a king of England was Alfred the Great in 871, and it was his grandson Æthelstan who was the first with the title King of the English in 927.

Also Denmark and Sweden got their first historically acknowledged kings about the same time, Denmark in 940 and Sweden around 970, but there had been several semi-historical kings in both countries a couple of hundred years before that, the first known by name Danish king in 515, and legend names a king in Sweden at the time of emperor Augustus in Rome (63 BC - AD 14).

[Chubb Fuddler]

01 Japan -0660
02 Cambodia 0069
03 Oman 0751
04 Great Britain 0800
05 Norway 0862
06 Denmark 0935
07 Sweden 0970
08 Thailand 1238
09 Andorra 1278
10 Brunei 1363
11 Spain 1479
12 Monaco 1604
13 Liechtenstein 1627
14 Kuwait 1718
15 Saudi Arabia 1744
16 Swaziland 1780
17 Bahrain 1783
18 Luxembourg 1815
19 Netherlands 1815
20 Lesotho 1822
21 Belgium 1831
22 Canada 1867
23 Qatar 1868
24 Tonga 1875
25 Australia 1901
26 Bhutan 1907
27 New Zealand 1907
28 Jordan 1921
29 Vatican City 1929
30 Malaysia 1957
31 Jamaica 1962
32 Samoa 1962
33 Barbados 1966
34 United Arab Emirates 1971
35 Bahamas 1973
36 Grenada 1974
37 Papua New Guinea 1975
38 Solomon Islands 1978
39 Tuvalu 1978
40 Saint Lucia 1979
41 Saint Vincent and the Grenadines 1979
42 Antigua and Barbuda 1981
43 Belize 1981
44 Saint Kitts and Nevis 1983

I've included all the Commonwealth Realms because they are independent monarchies, and if Andorra is included, so should all other monarchies without a resident monarch. The Vatican City is in a sense the continuation of the Papal States (751 AD), but I think the unification of Italy disrupted things enough, and left the Pope with so little, that the Vatican City should be dated from 1929. I've put in Samoa because I think the jury is still out on what sort of state it is. I once asked the Samoan Police Commissioner if the Ao o le Malo is best described as a monarch or a president. He said neither, the Ao o le Malo is best described as a head of state. But he did go onto say that the current Ao o le Malo will probably remain in office for the rest of his life, and that future heads of state will always come from either the Malietoa or Tupua chiefly families.

[Iluvbertie]

Based on the fact that each of the states of Australia had to pass the Succession to the Crown Act it could be argued that each of the states are separate monarchies as well which would add to the list e.g. NSW from 1788.

[Chubb Fuddler]

Yes, that would bring in a whole new category. There's also the Malaysian state monarchies, and the monarchies within republics (e.g. the Ugandan kingdoms, the Indonesian and Nigerian sultanates etc. etc.) I'm not sure where the Canadian Provinces come into it though.

[Dangerous Liaisons]

Originally Posted by Chubb Fuddler

Yes, that would bring in a whole new category. There's also the Malaysian state monarchies, and the monarchies within republics (e.g. the Ugandan kingdoms, the Indonesian and Nigerian sultanates etc. etc.) I'm not sure where the Canadian Provinces come into it though.

In Canada, each province is also a monarchy. Canada has been officially continuously a monarchy since 1534. In Canada we inherited the French, English, British and Canadian crowns. King Louis XIV is officially recognised as the longest reigning monarch of Canada. Canada is the only country in the world which recognises the French, English and British monarchs.

Since 1534, when the King of France claimed possession of what is now Canada, the history of our country has been marked by the reigns of an uninterrupted succession of monarchs, both French and British, who have had a significant influence on our country's development.

Source: Parliament of Canada

When the Queen became Canada’s sovereign, she inherited a tradition of the Canadian Crown that includes the French as well as British empires. That means there’s one French monarch, officially a Canadian sovereign, who still beats her record: Louis XIV, who reigned for 72 years in the 17th and 18th centuries.

Source: QUEEN ELIZABETH II: THE MATHEMATICS OF THE MONARCHY

[Mbruno]

If one counts Danish and Swedish kings as part of a continuous Norwegian monarchy, shouldn't Burgundian, Soanish, Austrian and Dutch rulers be also counted as part of a continuous Belgian monarchy ? Using similar criteria, I would say the current Norwegian monarchy dates back to 1905 only and is actually the youngest in Europe.

[Dangerous Liaisons]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

If one counts Danish and Swedish kings as part of a continuous Norwegian monarchy, shouldn't Burgundian, Soanish, Austrian and Dutch rulers be also counted as part of a continuous Belgian monarchy ? Using similar criteria, I would say the current Norwegian monarchy dates back to 1905 only and is actually the youngest in Europe.

The formula the thread uses seem to be based on continuous monarchy. For example, the United Kingdom was formed in 1707, but Great Britain has been a monarchy longer than that. I don't know about Norway but using their criteria, Canada should be listed as the 12th oldest monarchy because it was established as New France in 1534 and we officially recognise the French kings as sovereigns of Canada.

Also, why is Spain listed as #11? Spain is not a continuous monarchy, it was a republic several times, Spain lost most of its colonies because of this (the Spanish Empire going bankrupt from civil wars), and it was a dictatorship, the monarchy was restored in the 1975.

[sandratatiana]

Is Luxembourg really a monarchy? Or is is just a principality, I hope I
translate this correctly

[Ish]

Originally Posted by sandratatiana

Is Luxembourg really a monarchy? Or is is just a principality, I hope I
translate this correctly

A monarchy is a realm with a monarch. There are several different forms of monarchs and realms - Kings and Queens rule kingdoms, Princes and Princesses rule principalities, Emperors and Empresses rule empires.

Luxembourg is a realm in the form of a grand duchy with a monarch in the form of a Grand Duke.

[sandratatiana]

Originally Posted by Ish

A monarchy is a realm with a monarch. There are several different forms of monarchs and realms - Kings and Queens rule kingdoms, Princes and Princesses rule principalities, Emperors and Empresses rule empires.

Luxembourg is a realm in the form of a grand duchy with a monarch in the form of a Grand Duke.

Thank you, I didnt know that

[House of Your Dad.]

There are many factors that can criticise this list. For example, Tonga has been an absolute monarchy up until 2007/8 if memory serves me correctly. The House of Tupou was created in 1875 (140 years ago) as King Siaosi (George) wanted to adopt an English style monarchy. But before then he was a Tu'i Kanolupolu, which is one of the three lineages of Tongan royalty. The Tu'i Kanolupolu started their rule around 1600, thus the lineage of the House of Tupou has been around for 415 years give or take. Before that though, there were two more royal lineages prior to the ruling of the Tu'i Kanolupolu, the Tu'i Ha'atakalaua ruled from 1470 to 1600 when the Tu'i Kanolupolu took over. Prior to the Tu'i Ha'atakalaua though, there was the Tu'i Tonga who ruled from 950AD to 1470 give or take a few years. So how is this list determined? Tonga didn't become a united nation until 1875. Do we start count from there? Or do we become more technical and say Tonga's monarchy started in 950AD?

[House of Your Dad.]

Originally Posted by House of Your Dad.

There are many factors that can criticise this list. For example, Tonga has been an absolute monarchy up until 2007/8 if memory serves me correctly. The House of Tupou was created in 1875 (140 years ago) as King Siaosi (George) wanted to adopt an English style monarchy. But before then he was a Tu'i Kanolupolu, which is one of the three lineages of Tongan royalty. The Tu'i Kanolupolu started their rule around 1600, thus the lineage of the House of Tupou has been around for 415 years give or take. Before that though, there were two more royal lineages prior to the ruling of the Tu'i Kanolupolu, the Tu'i Ha'atakalaua ruled from 1470 to 1600 when the Tu'i Kanolupolu took over. Prior to the Tu'i Ha'atakalaua though, there was the Tu'i Tonga who ruled from 950AD to 1470 give or take a few years. So how is this list determined? Tonga didn't become a united nation until 1875. Do we start count from there? Or do we become more technical and say Tonga's monarchy started in 950AD?

Sorry there's a spelling error. It's Tu'i Kanokupolu.

[JR76]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

If one counts Danish and Swedish kings as part of a continuous Norwegian monarchy, shouldn't Burgundian, Soanish, Austrian and Dutch rulers be also counted as part of a continuous Belgian monarchy ? Using similar criteria, I would say the current Norwegian monarchy dates back to 1905 only and is actually the youngest in Europe.

Atleast from 1814 Norway was an independent country with its own constitution, parliament, flag etc... It was never a part of or subjugated to Sweden. In practice of course Sweden took the lead in the union and made many attempts to weld the two countries together even more but Norway was still to all intents a sovereign nation with a King who just happened to be the King of Sweden too.


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