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  #141  
Old 07-23-2020, 04:39 PM
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It would be fine if they retained the choir & had another more modern one as well.

The Anglican choral tradition is one of the great treasures of England if not Europe. And linked very much with royal history too.

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  #142  
Old 07-23-2020, 06:58 PM
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Was it Norwich Cathedral where they decided to put a giant helter skelter in the nave to "encourage new perspectives" ?! Each to their own but, if I want to go on a helter skelter, I'll go to a fairground. In the same way, if you go to a cathedral, surely you want to hear cathedral music.
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  #143  
Old 07-24-2020, 12:44 AM
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It is decisions like this that is why the CoE is becoming more and more irrelevant in England. Trying to be 'relevant' isn't getting people to go to church.

Where I am there are a group of former CoE who now worship privately together due to the CoE going to such a 'modern' and 'relevant' stand that it has lost its actual message. Many others I know have gone to another religion altogether - one that hasn't gone down the 'modern' and 'relevant' route but is the fastest growing religion in the world.
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  #144  
Old 07-24-2020, 03:31 AM
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I get changing denominations like going Catholic or some other protestant branch but a different religion??? That seems an extreme leap to change your whole religious view because you found the Anglican church is too 'modern'.

I get the annoyance. I am as modern as most, but when I go to church I like a formal mass and traditional music. I have never liked attending my cousin's church which makes it feel more like a pop concert at times with religious words in the songs. If I go to a cathedral, I expect traditional music.

Its a Christian church of England. Its going to appeal to a certain group of people, not so much immigrants from other cultural and likely at least denominational backgrounds if not religion. Should they encourage children of all backgrounds to join the choir? Of course. But no need to go into some different non choral route to draw them in.
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  #145  
Old 07-24-2020, 08:31 AM
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Well I find myself in the same position as you Iluvbertie. We find ourselves worshipping from the 1662 prayer book. The modern one was facile but with the coming of babies crying and none taken out to settle down and preschoolers given the run of the Sanctuary as sacristant, I spent the entire service waiting for one of them to grab the altar cloth and bring the whole lot down. Too nervewracking by far.
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  #146  
Old 07-24-2020, 06:44 PM
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My CofE church struggles normally with trying to attract new worshippers; but during lockdown they've actually got more people on the Zoom services than they would normally. I think the church as a whole definitely needs to find more ways of attracting a wider range of people - it's not that people don't go to church anymore - more "modern" churches such as Hillsong and others have a huge following, and have their services in former cinemas and stadiums that are often almost full.
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  #147  
Old 07-24-2020, 07:01 PM
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I agree with that, I'm just not sure trying to turn a Cathedral into Holy Trinity Brompton (Sheffield branch) (to take an example of a very modern, very well known and popular CofE church) is the answer either.

You can keep the choir (and the vestments, actual Eucharist etc) and also include other styles of music as well or create different services aimed at younger/different groups.

Hillsong, Kensington Temple and others also often end up kind of fundamentalist in a completely different way to the Anglo-Catholic end of the spectrum.

I've found the Dean of Canterbury's morning prayer has been excellent in lockdown and seems to have attracted a lot of viewers.
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  #148  
Old 07-24-2020, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavs View Post
I agree with that, I'm just not sure trying to turn a Cathedral into Holy Trinity Brompton (Sheffield branch) (to take an example of a very modern, very well known and popular CofE church) is the answer either.

You can keep the choir (and the vestments, actual Eucharist etc) and also include other styles of music as well or create different services aimed at younger/different groups.

Hillsong, Kensington Temple and others also often end up kind of fundamentalist in a completely different way to the Anglo-Catholic end of the spectrum.

I've found the Dean of Canterbury's morning prayer has been excellent in lockdown and seems to have attracted a lot of viewers.


I don’t either. I was making an example of what a lot of younger worshippers like. I could never imagine Westminster Abbey as a concert hall
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  #149  
Old 07-24-2020, 09:54 PM
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While I do agree that the choral tradition is a beautiful one (especially for vespers etc not so much for Sunday worship), I don't think it they are the 'essence' of church: the essence should be the content not the package.

Quote:
But others fear modernisation could jettison centuries-old traditions they believe are the essence of the church: choral music, clerical dress, ancient buildings, rituals and liturgy.
Source: The Guardian article previously linked
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  #150  
Old 07-28-2020, 01:25 PM
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Apparently, the Queen will be attending services at Crathie Kirk when she goes to Balmoral, but will probably be wearing a mask. I'm not quite sure why "the Queen will probably wear a mask to church" needs to be in the news, but, hey, maybe pictures of Her Majesty wearing a mask will make people realise that masks are for everyone's safety.
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  #151  
Old 07-28-2020, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
Apparently, the Queen will be attending services at Crathie Kirk when she goes to Balmoral, but will probably be wearing a mask. I'm not quite sure why "the Queen will probably wear a mask to church" needs to be in the news, but, hey, maybe pictures of Her Majesty wearing a mask will make people realise that masks are for everyone's safety.
I dont think she's been seen wearing one, so Its probably because of that that i t is a news item
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  #152  
Old 07-28-2020, 01:57 PM
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I'd imagine there would only be small numbers of worshipers at Crathie Kirk ,here in Ireland its restricted to under 100.
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  #153  
Old 07-28-2020, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
Apparently, the Queen will be attending services at Crathie Kirk when she goes to Balmoral, but will probably be wearing a mask. I'm not quite sure why "the Queen will probably wear a mask to church" needs to be in the news, but, hey, maybe pictures of Her Majesty wearing a mask will make people realise that masks are for everyone's safety.
Maybe one of her beautiful headscarves, which of course she wears instead of a riding hat, could be re-fashioned into a 3-layer mask??
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  #154  
Old 07-28-2020, 04:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
Apparently, the Queen will be attending services at Crathie Kirk when she goes to Balmoral, but will probably be wearing a mask. I'm not quite sure why "the Queen will probably wear a mask to church" needs to be in the news, but, hey, maybe pictures of Her Majesty wearing a mask will make people realise that masks are for everyone's safety.



Does Balmoral have a private chapel where the Queen could worship? I don't find it safe for her to be with a congregation given the current situation.
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  #155  
Old 07-28-2020, 05:47 PM
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Only 30 people max are allowed at services at the moment, and have to be well apart, so hopefully it'll be OK.


It's only what the media re saying: it might not even be accurate! I'm sure she won't go if it's considered at all unsafe. I assume Balmoral must have a chapel.
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  #156  
Old 07-28-2020, 05:56 PM
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I've never heard of a private castle chapel at Balmoral.
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  #157  
Old 07-28-2020, 06:24 PM
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IIRC the royals use Crathie Kirk when they are staying at Balmoral.
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  #158  
Old 07-28-2020, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Does Balmoral have a private chapel where the Queen could worship? I don't find it safe for her to be with a congregation given the current situation.
No. Craithie Church it the only church for Balmoral. Due to the closeness of the church the decision was made to not built a chapel in the castle when Prince Albert designed Balmoral Castle.

It is the same at Sandringham - the nearest church is St Mary Magdelene with no private chapel in the House.

When doing some research there is mention of a chapel being added at Osbourne after Albert died but no mention of any chapel being added at Balmoral or Sandringham.
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  #159  
Old 07-28-2020, 10:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irish_royalist View Post
Maybe one of her beautiful headscarves, which of course she wears instead of a riding hat, could be re-fashioned into a 3-layer mask??
I doubt the queen would transform one of her gorgeous scarves into a mask.

Certainly her staff who handles her wardrobe can purchase one, or can use some other material on hand. Could take a page from Camilla (though hers seemed to have been a gift to her) and wear a mask that raises money for a local charity during these times. Something for her staff to consider.

But I expect if we do see her in a mask it will be made by her dress maker.


Quote:
Does Balmoral have a private chapel where the Queen could worship? I don't find it safe for her to be with a congregation given the current situation.

With only 30 people allowed there isn't much risk. And it isn't like the queen would be sitting and moving among the congregation anyways.

They will just be extra careful about sanitizing the area she sits in. And not have her accepting flowers and such outside the chapel for now. Control the flow of people in and out of the church for her safety.
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