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  #161  
Old 04-18-2021, 02:16 AM
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This is a picture taken on-board of Britannia during the festivities of HM's and prince Philip 's golden wedding anniversary. You can recognize some of Philip' s nephews and nieces. I think the brown haired lady in the front row is princess Xenia.
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  #162  
Old 04-18-2021, 02:22 AM
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This is a picture taken on-board of Britania during the festivities of HM's and prince Philip 's golden wedding anniversary. You can recognize some of Philip' s nephews and nieces. I think the brown haired lady in the front row is princess Xenia.
Thanks. Never seen this pic before. There is Hereditary Prince Bernhard of Baden next to Crown Prince Frederik and i believe his brother Michael next to hin. His other brother, Prince Leopold is the fourth standing between Kardam of Bulgaria and Margarita of Romania.
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  #163  
Old 04-18-2021, 03:53 AM
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Originally Posted by andrew View Post
This is a picture taken on-board of Britannia during the festivities of HM's and prince Philip 's golden wedding anniversary. You can recognize some of Philip' s nephews and nieces. I think the brown haired lady in the front row is princess Xenia.
I see Prince Willem-Alexander of the Netherlands, Prince Frederik of Denmark, Princess Margareta of Romania and her husband Prince Radu. Very interesting picture.
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  #164  
Old 04-18-2021, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by andrew View Post
I think the brown haired lady in the front row is princess Xenia.
To me, it doesn't look like Xenia.

The brown haired lady looks more like Prince Philip's other grand-niece Countess Irina von Schönburg-Glauchau, nee Princees of Hesse, Sophie's granddaughter.
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  #165  
Old 04-18-2021, 10:37 AM
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There was a brief glimpse of one of Philip's nephews as a young man in the movies of "Elizabeth at 90" and it seemed he looked almost exactly like Philip. I wonder if the resemblance held?
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  #166  
Old 04-18-2021, 02:06 PM
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She speaks really good English and it's nice when a family member can say such warm statements about a relative.
It was really nice to hear princess Xenia speak about how appreciative they are as a family that they invited three representatives to join the limited number of mourners for the funeral.

I was a bit surprised how she described the German nieces and nephews as 'a huge number'; when there were 'only' 16. That's a sizable number but nowhere near 'huge'.

The more striking part imho is that all of these cousins (including of course Philip's 4 children) are/were princes and princesses! There is only one consort left in Europe that can say the same - and that one happens to be from the same family: queen Sophia of Spain; but in her case, it is only her brother's children and not children from 5 different marriages/royal families.
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  #167  
Old 04-18-2021, 05:15 PM
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Do we know what language Phillip spoke with his sisters? They lived in Paris until his parent spit I think. His mother was a German princess
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  #168  
Old 04-18-2021, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Frelinghighness View Post
Do we know what language Phillip spoke with his sisters? They lived in Paris until his parent spit I think. His mother was a German princess
Princess Alice was born at Windsor castle and spoke both English and German and later learnt French and Greek.

I assume both English and German was their language?
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  #169  
Old 04-18-2021, 06:18 PM
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Do we know what language Phillip spoke with his sisters? They lived in Paris until his parent spit I think. His mother was a German princess
I think German.

Prince Philipp of Hohenlohe-Langenburg shared some fond memories with his great-uncle Philip from the time he attended family events in Germany. "It was such a joy having a conversation with him. His memory was extraordinary. He could remember playing hide-and-seek in the castle when he was a boy, and he always enjoyed talking to the local people. He could switch from German to English and back, whether he was talking about Winston Churchill or the local wildlife," recounted the Prince while speaking to royal author Robert Hardman.

He indicates that Philip spoke German with locals in Germany. The family lived in exile in Germany, it was also their mother tongue and I assume they spoke German among themselves and English when abroad.
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  #170  
Old 04-18-2021, 06:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Frelinghighness View Post
Do we know what language Phillip spoke with his sisters? They lived in Paris until his parent spit I think. His mother was a German princess
From an interview with Prince Philip:
'If anything, I've thought of myself as Scandinavian. Particularly, Danish. We spoke English at home,' Prince Philip recalls today. 'The others learned Greek. I could understand a certain amount of it. But then the (conversation) would go into French. Then it went into German, on occasion, because we had German cousins. If you couldn't think of a word in one language, you tended to go off in another.' For Princess Alice, who had been almost completely deaf since catching German measles at the age of four, conversations in whatever tongue had to be translated into sign language.
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  #171  
Old 04-18-2021, 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
From an interview with Prince Philip:
'If anything, I've thought of myself as Scandinavian. Particularly, Danish. We spoke English at home,' Prince Philip recalls today. 'The others learned Greek. I could understand a certain amount of it. But then the (conversation) would go into French. Then it went into German, on occasion, because we had German cousins. If you couldn't think of a word in one language, you tended to go off in another.' For Princess Alice, who had been almost completely deaf since catching German measles at the age of four, conversations in whatever tongue had to be translated into sign language.
As said in another thread, though, the part about Princess Alice is contradicted by a host of facts. Her deafness was congenital and she lip read, not signed.
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  #172  
Old 04-18-2021, 06:46 PM
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As said in another thread, though, the part about Princess Alice is contradicted by a host of facts. Her deafness was congenital and she lip read, not signed.
Being able to lipread doesn't exclude that you can also sign. Many hearing impared can do both but do so in different contexts. Pamela Hicks has told that her aunt was often quite lonely at large gatherings because she couldn't hear what people were saying and, I imagine, because few were talking directly to her making it possible for her to read lips.
The part about the cause of Alice's deafness is indeed quite strange but is it possible that it wasn't publicly known at the time?
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  #173  
Old 04-18-2021, 07:08 PM
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Being able to lipread doesn't exclude that you can also sign. Many hearing impared can do both but do so in different contexts. Pamela Hicks has told that her aunt was often quite lonely at large gatherings because she couldn't hear what people were saying and, I imagine, because few were talking directly to her making it possible for her to read lips.
The part about the cause of Alice's deafness is indeed quite strange but is it possible that it wasn't publicly known at the time?
Yes, people can, but it's mentioned extensively in Alice's biography (which postdated this interview) that she lip-read and all the ways she did so, but never once that she signed anything. (For one thing, signing requires the other person to know what you're doing and understand sign language, and Alice didn't seem to move among very many people who would. For another, given the enormous amount of energy she put into lip-reading and dealing with the rest of her life, when would she have been able to pick up signing? As far as her authorized biography is concerned, she never learned it and she didn't know how.) The book also mentions a conversation she and her husband Andrea had when the room was dark, but not how it happened.

Edit: Vickers also mentions in the biography how Alice was strictly raised by her mother VMH to not let people know that she was deaf and not let them make any allowances for her, so her total reliance on lip reading makes sense.
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  #174  
Old 04-18-2021, 08:51 PM
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Thank you for this. English and French as I suspected and then some German. My husbands aunt was also born deaf in 1917 and she lip read in English and French and could follow if you switched. It was also to not call attention to the disability
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  #175  
Old 04-19-2021, 12:37 AM
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I watched yesterday a documentary about Princess Alice , containing asking some rare vidéos , especially of Era around Philip's marriage and then.
It shows her arriving at the airport in London for her son's wedding, and then, and somme short when Philip is talking to her, or some staff members.
Philip talks to her and she seems lip reading and understand normally and this match the information we know. He would not talk to her normally If he knew she did not understand.
As for the period of her youth, around 1890, when she was found deaf, was the sign language already developed? Out of some specialist, was it known among normal people, even if royals?
And a last point. She was able to read lips in 4 language, but which language did she speak? For a person who never heard, like she was, how did she learn to talk?
Someone had to spent time to teach her.. I can presume her mother did it for German and English, but what about French and Greek? This happened after her 20s and out of her home. Was it her husband? Did she hire a specialist? For Greek it is possible, but French? She was broken and in exile.
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  #176  
Old 04-19-2021, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by fandesacs2003 View Post
I watched yesterday a documentary about Princess Alice , containing asking some rare vidéos , especially of Era around Philip's marriage and then.
It shows her arriving at the airport in London for her son's wedding, and then, and somme short when Philip is talking to her, or some staff members.
Philip talks to her and she seems lip reading and understand normally and this match the information we know. He would not talk to her normally If he knew she did not understand.
As for the period of her youth, around 1890, when she was found deaf, was the sign language already developed? Out of some specialist, was it known among normal people, even if royals?
And a last point. She was able to read lips in 4 language, but which language did she speak? For a person who never heard, like she was, how did she learn to talk?
Someone had to spent time to teach her.. I can presume her mother did it for German and English, but what about French and Greek? This happened after her 20s and out of her home. Was it her husband? Did she hire a specialist? For Greek it is possible, but French? She was broken and in exile.
I replied to this in Alice's thread here.
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  #177  
Old 04-19-2021, 04:03 PM
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I am new and have just read this interesting thread.

So much has been said about royal bonds and relations, concerning Prince Philip's sisters.
Times and moods were very different from today's. One fact struck me a little, Margaritas's husband Gottfried was once engaged with Gloria Vanderbilt who was although connected romantically to the then Prince of Wales.
So M. was not his first choice and though Gloria had been expected to bring a fortune to Gottfried's little town but huge castle after the break-up of the engagement he was lucky enough to find Margareta.
And somebody mentioned M. was not ready to convert for a catholic prince before Gottfried's proposal, but finally did when she married Gottfried as his house is protestant which is a much bigger thing than converting from orthodox to catholic church.
They had a love match finally.
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  #178  
Old 04-19-2021, 04:37 PM
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Times and moods were very different from today's. One fact struck me a little, Margaritas's husband Gottfried was once engaged with Gloria Vanderbilt who was although connected romantically to the then Prince of Wales.
When she wasn't allegedly having an affair with the Marchioness of Milford Haven, Philip and Margarita's aunt! She seems to have had a very busy life ...
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  #179  
Old 04-19-2021, 04:40 PM
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When she wasn't allegedly having an affair with the Marchioness of Milford Haven, Philip and Margarita's aunt! She seems to have had a very busy life ...
i thought that it was Thelma V\anderbilt who was the mistress of the Prince of Wales, (later Edward VIII), not Gloria
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  #180  
Old 04-19-2021, 05:02 PM
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It was Thelma Furness that was involved with David (Edward VIII). She was sister to Gloria Vanderbilt and great aunt to Anderson Cooper (CNN). Thelma also introduced Wallis Simpson to David. We know how that ended.
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