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  #81  
Old 11-02-2019, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Countessmeout View Post
Yes Sophie and Edward started dating in 1993 so the other two were around.

There were rumors that Diana called Sophie 'Miss Goody two shoes' and her and Sarah both complained Sophie got special treatment from the queen. But the tabloids always spread such rumors. Look at the Kate vs Meghan feuds and so on. Any time a royal woman enters the picture certain stories pop up.

Sophie was said to be close to Anne. That Anne befriended Sophie unlike either of her previous sister in laws.
I remember hearing a story (although given the UK press take it with a grain of salt), that Diana really didn't like Sophie because she thought the BRF was using Sophie to replace her.

This would have been post-separation/divorce and young Sophie superficially resembled Diana. Whether it had any basis in fact or not, Diana seemed to believe the BRF was going to build-up Sophie as the more controllable Diana replacement, and it rubbed her the wrong way. Of course, this wasn't Sophie's fault, but it probably colored Diana's perception of her
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  #82  
Old 11-02-2019, 08:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Countessmeout View Post
Like the tiara or not, and many don't, the queen had it crafted personally for Sophie from pieces from her personal collection. That doesn't sound like something she would do for someone she didn't welcome into the family.

She could have given Sophie something from the vaults to wear once and taken back. Or bought something from auction for cheap. Instead she chose to have it made for Sophie.

Its much nicer now that it has been redone in recent years for Sophie.
I like the re-do very much.

I also thought that HM giving Sophie a tiara made of elements worn by Queen Victoria was a significant show of confidence in Sophie.
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  #83  
Old 11-03-2019, 06:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Susan D View Post
The Countess of Wessex's wedding tiara was an insult and while I'm sure that Sophie Rhys-Jones gets along okay with the Queen, I do not believe that she was welcomed into the Royal Family.
What on earth are you talking about ? Sophie's tiara was made with elements from Queen Victoria' s coronet. It was a HUGE honor to be able to wear such a significant and historical item.

Sophie was definitly more than welcomed in the BRF ( she was even included in some royal events while not yet married to Edward). But Diana was notoriously not that pleased ...
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  #84  
Old 11-03-2019, 07:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Nico View Post
What on earth are you talking about ? Sophie's tiara was made with elements from Queen Victoria' s coronet. It was a HUGE honor to be able to wear such a significant and historical item.
In its original state, that tiara was described as cobbled together from pieces of Victoria's coronet, and that's what it looked like.

I never heard anyone speak admiringly of that tiara (probably the reason Sophie had it altered).
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  #85  
Old 11-03-2019, 07:42 AM
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I think there are similarities in looks between Diana and Sophie but a lot of that is due to being blonde women in the 90s. I think they seem like very different personalities but in terms of Sophie being more a compliant replacement? She was planning on keeping her own career and not being a working royal and was much older when she met Edward than Diana was when she married Charles. Different circumstances.

I don't think you can say Sophie gets on with the Queen (and everyone agrees that's true) but wasn't welcomed into the Royal Family, individual relationships notwithstanding. She has become a very good asset professionally as well after her PR business became untenable.

Her father has often been seen at events with the family and invited to important occasions, after her mother died. That would not be the case if it had been a chilly reception. It's been said that that paved the way for Kate's family to be more included and now to a certain extent Meghan's mother.
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  #86  
Old 11-03-2019, 07:46 AM
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I have always wondered about the tiara - it seems unfinished. Its seems an oversight at the weeing which made me wonder if there was something to it - maybe Sophie didn't originally want a tiara, maybe the tiara she was to originally wear broke or was considered incorrect for her to wear. I even wrote the the palace asking for the piece pedigree and was told that it was not part of the royal collection - which always bothered me - if it was Victoria's ? I was later told that was because it was not originally a tiara at all. But enough off topic.
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  #87  
Old 11-03-2019, 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Mirabel View Post
In its original state, that tiara was described as cobbled together from pieces of Victoria's coronet, and that's what it looked like.

I never heard anyone speak admiringly of that tiara (probably the reason Sophie had it altered).
She waited 20 years to make the alterations. So i guess she was quite pleased with the original state during that period of time.
Sophie was later showered, literally, with jewels from HM's personnal collection. So to insinuate that the wedding tiara was some kind of a snub is just pure nonsense.
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  #88  
Old 11-03-2019, 09:14 AM
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One thing I've read several places is that the Queen and Sophie both share a love of horses and military history and that's what has bonded them over the years.

It stands to reason also that with Sophie's home at Bagshot Park and the Queen preferring to be in residence at Windsor Castle, they would be able to get together more often. Lady Louise also shares the love of horses and is often seen riding with her grandmother.
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  #89  
Old 11-03-2019, 09:17 AM
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Guys, Sophie was never snubbed by The Queen.

If you remember, the British press accused The Queen of snubbing both, Edward and Sophie, because they felt the couple should’ve been made a Duke and Duchess on their wedding day. Instead The Queen honored the couple with the titles the Earl and Countess of Wessex. Some people didn’t like Sophie’s tiara and the chatter of the snub continued.

The truth is...the two ladies has always been close. In fact, they spend lots of time together to this day and The Queen goes to visit the Wessexes at their home very often.
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  #90  
Old 11-03-2019, 10:24 AM
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I don't think the Queen has ever snubbed Sophie, a lot of people didn't like her wedding tiara but it was made from historically significant pieces, you could say then the Queen really must have not liked Fergie as hers was purchased for the wedding from a jewellers just before.

The Queen and Sophie clearly have an excellent relationship as seen in so many ways. I guess like any relationship it has developed over time and probably wasn't as visibly close back just before and after the wedding as it is now.
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  #91  
Old 11-03-2019, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Nico View Post
She waited 20 years to make the alterations. So i guess she was quite pleased with the original state during that period of time.
Sophie was later showered, literally, with jewels from HM's personnal collection. So to insinuate that the wedding tiara was some kind of a snub is just pure nonsense.
But she rarely wore that tiara during the 20 years.
Maybe my memory is faulty, but I only recall her wearing the wedding tiara more often after it was changed.
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  #92  
Old 11-03-2019, 02:53 PM
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The Queen liked Sophie quite a lot in the 1990s from what I can gather but that's because she didn't bring any drama or baggage with her, she simply did her thing and dated Edward. Which could be why she was given the privilege of being invited to events, by the end of the 90s she was pretty much a glorified member of the Royal Family, she even went to Diana's memorial service in 1998.

Also we have to remember Sophie was 2nd lady in the land in the early-mid 2000s post Diana / Fergie and following the deaths of Princess Margaret and Queen Mother. She really did arise when the Queen needed her and realised she needed to support the Queen so gave up her PR career. Plus Sophie's own mum died not long after she had Louise so I guess they supported each other in a way.

At the end of the day she is the only daughter in law that hasn't had an affair (or the mistress) which would have earned the trust of the Queen and

As for Kate and Sophie, they always seem chatty at Royal Events (Ascot etc), again I imagine they are friendly with each other, Sophie may be a generation older but Anne and Camilla are two generators. Both had young children, both commoners, both went out with husband for a long time before marriage.
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  #93  
Old 11-03-2019, 03:30 PM
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Chatty yes, but friends might be pushing it.

Sophie, Anne and Camilla are not the only royal women. Kate is of an age with Zara and Autumn. Zara's children are of age with the Cambridge kids, and Autumn's youngest is only a year older then George. At family events there are also the likes of Lord Freddie and his wife, who again are a similar age to the coupe as their children.

While James and Louise are much younger then their cousins, they are still not at the same 'young kid' stage of the Cambridges. James is six years older then George, which at that age is a good gap. The Cambridges are still in diapers, play dates, kindergarten run phase. The Wessexes are dealing with a teen and almost teen, and decisions about whether boarding school or not and such.

Quote:
But she rarely wore that tiara during the 20 years.
Maybe my memory is faulty, but I only recall her wearing the wedding tiara more often after it was changed.
And Kate has never worn her wedding tiara again.

The fact that Sophie has been given access to many royal pieces in her marriage and had options, seems more of a sign of acceptance.
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  #94  
Old 11-03-2019, 05:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Claire View Post
I was reading an article about William and harry's girlfriends and the fact that they haven't been seen at church and other family functions.
The writer brings up that Sophie had unpredecented access to the royal family from the first months of her relationship with Edward, appearing regularly at church and at family events.

I remember Sophie appearing with the royal family at Brittania in 1995 and the headline read "The Royal family" at the bottom. She was also at the decommissioning of Brittania later in 1997. Why?
HM and Prince Philip were anxious to make sure that Sophie felt welcome, so much so that she was allowed to move in and live with Edward, shack up no less, at Edwards BP rooms and, after their marriage, despite being the only useable "couple", they were encouraged in their attempt to have a private life and a real job. Needless to say, they are the modern standard by which the BFR can measure that viability of that way of life for a younger son. It wasn't and the press did not respect their right to have a non-royal way of life and when they weren't trying to "set them up" they were running them down.

For those who use Sophie's wedding tiara as a measure of acceptance, I think you are right. Both Sarah and Sophie's wedding tiaras were gifted to them personally. Diana had the use of the Lovers Knot and her family tiara. I think that was because she was the heir's wife and would, over the years, have more access to QE's Private Collection. Even Catherine has worn three family tiaras, the LK, the Papyrus and the Halo. But as she is HM's grand-daughter-in-law.

Basically, we can only speak about what we see or read in reputable biographies and it seems all members of the Wessex family take tea with HM quite regularly and use the Windsor estate for riding and carriage riding, etc. and Sophie often accompanies HM to church when they are at Balmoral.
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  #95  
Old 11-03-2019, 05:45 PM
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Quote:
But she rarely wore that tiara during the 20 years.
Maybe my memory is faulty, but I only recall her wearing the wedding tiara more often after it was changed.

I know that she'd wear it to the royal wedding events from the 2000's.
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  #96  
Old 11-03-2019, 06:09 PM
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I'm not the best at keeping up with tiara appearances but I'm only aware of her having worn the modified tiara once so far.

I'm a big Sophie fan but we do need to remember she has probably given the Queen stress at times to, she gave up her PR business after getting herself into trouble for suggesting her royal connections would help clients.
In fairness that should be a lesson to all royals that hard work and dignity representing the crown will always help them bounce back from bad PR. I think that in the end the way Sophie acted after her own troubles probably helped endear her to the Queen.
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  #97  
Old 11-03-2019, 10:11 PM
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I think Sophie had the best of intentions pursuing a career in PR post her marriage, after all the British public have been banging on about for many years that all minor royals should get real jobs.

But it just got too complicated, I don't believe she used her royal connections to get clients, it is just there was too many conflicts of interests which was bound to happen, probably a lot of naivety on her part.

At least they both had the smarts to realise it just wasn't going to work, especially after the Queen Mother died and their miscarriage.

The stuff that was said in the News of the World Interview wasn't that bad, sure not great press or good form on her part but nothing compared to the scandals of Diana, Fergie and Camilla. The Queen didn't seem to mind they were still fairly buddy, Sophie rode in the car at Christmas in 2001 and she was in the same carriage with Queen Mother at Ascot in 2001. So it obviously it didn't harm their relationship, lot of stuff was misreported too.

And we have to remember she spent the 1990s pretty much low key, from what I remember the stuff in the press was mostly positive about her, or she was just mentioned as Edward's girlfriend etc.

I do think there was a lot of scrutiny on Edward and Sophie careers in the early 2000s because there was nothing else for the tabloids to write stories on, Anne, Fergie and Diana's marital issues had worn thin. Plus there was scrutiny on their marriage not ending in divorce.
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  #98  
Old 11-04-2019, 04:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirabel View Post
But she rarely wore that tiara during the 20 years.
Maybe my memory is faulty, but I only recall her wearing the wedding tiara more often after it was changed.
> From 1999 to 2012, the only tiaras Sophie had access to were her wedding tiara and from around 2005, a convertible aquamarine necklace / tiara. Other than these two, she once wore a previously unseen tiara in 2004, which was meant to have been loaned from a jeweller; the tiara was never seen again on her.

> Her wedding tiara has only been worn once publicly after the alterations, which was at the state banquet for the US President in June 2019

> Since 2012, she has worn a 5 Aquamarine tiara on several occasions. This tiara had previously been used by the Queen, if I am not mistaken, once in Canada in the late 1960s or early 1970s.
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  #99  
Old 11-04-2019, 05:19 AM
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Please be reminded that discussion about the Countess of Wessex's jewellery can take place in the http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...llery-256.html thread. Lets get back on topic please.
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