The Prince Andrew and Jeffrey Epstein Controversy 2: Sep 2022 -

[Marengo]

Arms of The Duke of York​

Welcome to The Prince Andrew and Jeffrey Epstein Controversy
Thread, Part 2

Commencing September 1st, 2022 ​

The previous thread can be found here
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[Tatiana Maria]

Virginia Giuffre, Prince Andrew's accuser, now admits that she may have been mistaken when she accused Alan Dershowitz. It's hard for me to understand how she could have been mistaken in this case. She never alleged that she was assaulted by someone she didn't know so she should be able to identify her attacker.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/08/nyregion/epstein-victim-giuffre-dershowitz.html

It is a useful reminder of the documented phenomenon that victims (as well as witnesses) of crimes misidentifying the perpetrators is quite common, and presumption of innocence for accused suspects is not the same as denial that a person was victimized.

The Telegraph recently reported - without citing any source - that the settlement between the Duke of York and Virginia Giuffre included a one-year gagging clause on both parties, which will be lifted, also for both parties, upon the expiration of the one-year period in February.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/royal-f...raced-accuser-virginia-giuffre-freed-gagging/

 

[rmay286]

Prince Andrew is reportedly building a 'war chest' to overturn the Virginia Guiffre settlement. I'm not sure this will be possible, but apparently this door has reopened after she admitted she may have misidentified Alan Dershowitz: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/royal-f...w-looks-overturn-virginia-giuffre-settlement/

 

[sophie25]

Prince Andrew is reportedly building a 'war chest' to overturn the Virginia Guiffre settlement. I'm not sure this will be possible, but apparently this door has reopened after she admitted she may have misidentified Alan Dershowitz: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/royal-f...w-looks-overturn-virginia-giuffre-settlement/

The idiotic Andrew hasn't grasped that he hung himself in that terrible interview. Yes the Roberts case was a factor in him being exiled from public life but his whole association with Epstein and his utter lack of repentance when talking about it will never be forgotten. He absolutely cannot understand that neither charities nor the military want him back representing them. He's trying to bully his way back into public life because he wants to feel important again.

 

[victor1319]

Prince Andrew is reportedly building a 'war chest' to overturn the Virginia Guiffre settlement. I'm not sure this will be possible, but apparently this door has reopened after she admitted she may have misidentified Alan Dershowitz:

I hope, this is not true! It would be like Prince Andrew is gambling his pension plan (the inheritence from Queen Elizabeth) on a horse race. In Germany there is this saying: On the high seas and in front of a judicial court you are in God's hand. Meaning it can go all ways.

And what is he hoping to achieve anyway?

BTW The Virginia Giuffre girl "may have misidentified" Mr. Dershovitz, the cunning lawyer, who sued her? What if this case was only not worth the effort for her with all the risks, which come with such an endevour?

 

[Moonmaiden23]

Ghislaine Maxwell was in the NY papers over the weekend saying Andrew was 100% set up. So the DoY might be feeling emboldened by these new developments.

But as another poster pointed out, Andrew's problems are not so much the(unproven) allegations against him, as the train wreck interview where he described himself as too honorable to disassociate himself from a convicted pedophile pimp. THAT is what sunk him.

The fact that he can't quite grasp that is just sad at this point.

 

[Toledo]

To this day I wonder why this repulsive person, Ghislaine Maxwell, is used by the media on specific celebrities while leaving many other clients out. I can't understand why the police and court has possession of her Black Book, the secret list of clients that was probably in her computer(s) and not made it public.

 

[MARG]

Since Ghislaine is now claiming the photo of Prince Andrew and Virginia is a fake, and a case has already been dropped on those grounds for another man, one wonders if his seeming lack of empathy has its roots in trying to remember a photo he doesn't remember being taken with a person he didn't remember ever meeting.

While he is not the most upstanding of people, I still find the fact that he figuratively threw himself on his sword to make the "ugly" go away for his mother in an interview and without a doubt did the same thing for her Jubilee, he has received not a scintilla of credit, nor doubt at the veracity of the accusations.

 

[Marengo]

That is a rather kind way of looking at it. If that scenario is true it would indeed be a personal tragedy.

The most surprising thing about this all is still that absolutely nobody else has been convicted. There must be people, friends of Epstein, with a more clear cut case than the one of Andrew. But that was all polished away.

It would be like Prince Andrew is gambling his pension plan (the inheritence from Queen Elizabeth) on a horse race.

It would indeed. However, if he truely thinks that he is innocent, I can see why he would like to take the gamble. I think more of us would do the same in such a situation, financially unwise as it may be.

--
We must of course bear in mind that Ms Maxwell is a convicted sex trafficer. So why on earth would we believe a word she is saying?

 

[sophie25]

What exactly is he planning to do? If it involves taking questions from Virginia's lawyers I couldn't see that working out. He was easily muddled by Maitlis in the interview so can you imagine what her lawyers would do to him and she has some of the absolute best out there?

I'm actually amazed that this circus seems ready to start again, Charles just doesn't need it on top of everything else right now.

 

[wbenson]

Revealed: Prince Andrew tells friends mystery 'development' within the next month will restore his reputation - and that the Queen had told him his exile from royal duties would only be 'temporary'

"It is when out shooting that the Duke of York tends to talk most freely. 'He says that details are about to be made public which will change people's perceptions of him,' I'm told. 'He says that it will happen next month.' "

 

[yukari]

Oh dear, please tell me it's just the usual tabloids stirring the pot. But if he indeed has that thought, it won't surprised me if he's still in close contact and exchange with his godson. Both of them are quite delusional and out of touch with reality.

Should we expect another book titled "The Previous Spare"? I'm sure it will be best-seller, just name drop few American politician and guaranteed people would buy it if not out of curiosity.

 

[Denville]

what evidence is there that Andrew might be planning to write any sort of book?

 

[Lilyflo]

Revealed: Prince Andrew tells friends mystery 'development' within the next month will restore his reputation - and that the Queen had told him his exile from royal duties would only be 'temporary'

"It is when out shooting that the Duke of York tends to talk most freely. 'He says that details are about to be made public which will change people's perceptions of him,' I'm told. 'He says that it will happen next month.' "

I can't imagine what would restore his reputation. Regardless of any claims made against him being proven false, there's hard evidence that Andrew was still friends with a convicted sex offender after his release from prison. He even stayed at his house in New York and he said on TV that he didn't regret that friendship because it was useful to him. Those things can never be undone and no charity, organisation or regiment will opt to be associated with him now or in future.

 

[Denville]

True he has behaved pretty badly and deserves to be cut off from pulblic royal life, albiet i DO doubt if he misses it all that much, except for the demotion in status. ALl the same, if someone reliable were to say Yes Andrew did have girls found for him, and they were young but they were not under age, they were not trafficked and he did not force any of them, he would look a little better

 

[Mirabel]

Andrew should never have settled that suit.
Once he did that, many took it as an admission of guilt.
It's too late to restore his reputation.

 

[Denville]

He was absolutely right to settle. It would not be kind to the queen to go on fighting a legal suit of that sordid nature, in her last months of life and at the time of her Platinum jubillee.

 

[wbenson]

I think we have the mystery development. It's the Telegraph's front page story. The photograph is the most bizarre thing I have ever seen. I do not think this is going to be the total vindication he was hoping for.

Exclusive: The photo that ‘clears Prince Andrew’ over bath sex

The image shows the bath in which the Duke is alleged to have engaged in sexual activity with a teenage girl.

Two of Maxwell’s acquaintances are sitting in the bath, fully clothed, wearing makeshift masks depicting the Duke and Virginia Giuffre.

They posed for the image in an effort to prove that the bath was too small for the kind of behaviour alleged by Ms Giuffre, and planned to use it as part of her defence during her sex trafficking trial.

 

[Lilyflo]

Oh My Giddy Aunt!!!

I've laughed solidly for about five minutes as I'm imagining all the jokes and memes that will be generated by that ridiculous photo! It's also a failure of imagination to state that the bath is too small for any hanky-panky.

 

[Durham]

Well, that's got to be the most bizarre Telegraph front page ever. It's the sort of thing you'd expect to find on the front cover of the Star or the Sun.

 

[yukari]

I can't decide which one is the most bizarre: the fact that anyone would posed for this photo or that Telegraph put it up for their front page (yup, it's not a joke) or that anyone can genuinely believe that it worths to be use as legit defence for a trial.

 

[Granada]

If dim and delusional Andrew is resting his "rehabilitation" on that, he is even worse than I think.
Its over. Done. There is no coming back.

The Emily Maitlis Interview sealed your fate. You expressed zero concern or remorse, you fool. You STILL visited a convicted Paedophile after he served prison time, because incredulously you said that ending the friendship should be done in person, not over the phone.
Go away.....

Charles's REALLY needs to lay down the law and explain to Andrew there is no path back. What does it take for Andrew to realize he is a pariah ?

 

[Denville]

Hes not a pariah. Hes a stupid arrogant man who led a louche sex life, and stupidly and arrogantly ketpt up a friendship with a sex offender. HE will never work again, but he is still part of his family and has friends.

 

[Granada]

I guess we will have to agree to disagree Denville. I see him as a pariah.
For the record, I believe he knew exactly what Epstein was up to and could care less.

 

[sophie25]

I guess we will have to agree to disagree Denville. I see him as a pariah.
For the record, I believe he knew exactly what Epstein was up to and could care less.

I think this too. He's never had any interest far less concern for the welfare for anyone he believes to be inferior to him which I think is most people. He gave terrible abuse to royal staff and others since he was a very young man so those girls around Epstein were, I'm sure, treated with similar contempt. It's always amazed me that the Queen herself seemed to allow this to happen ever since he was a child. No one who experienced this ever said that he was chastised by her when he was growing up which is really appalling. Unfortunately I do believe that she probably did tell him that he could eventually return to public life and her walking in with him at Philip's memorial service was the first attempt at this. I think that rather than telling him to take a long hard look at himself she merely tried to make the consequences of his actions go away.

 

[Durham]

There can be no public role even if new facts come to light that disprove some of the more lurid accusations. The way he conducted his relationship with Epstein & the tone deafness of the interview have sealed his fate.

He would be best advised to be honest about his mistakes, publicly accept with grace & understanding that his former life of duty is over & try to atone in some private way.

 

[Denville]

I guess we will have to agree to disagree Denville. I see him as a pariah.
For the record, I believe he knew exactly what Epstein was up to and could care less.

I dont think he did, because he didn't care much about the lower orders, but frakly Epstein had a lot of rich and powerful men friends who probalby acted the same way, but were not named as Andrew was.
As I understand it, Bill Clinton and Trump were also friends of Epsteins, and probalby made use of him, but they are not being castigated in the same way.
And if he were indeed a pariah, virtually noone would care to associate with him. I dont believe that is the case.

 

[Leopoldine]

I dont think he did, because he didn't care much about the lower orders, but frakly Epstein had a lot of rich and powerful men friends who probalby acted the same way, but were not named as Andrew was.
As I understand it, Bill Clinton and Trump were also friends of Epsteins, and probalby made use of him, but they are not being castigated in the same way.
And if he were indeed a pariah, virtually noone would care to associate with him. I dont believe that is the case.

Not one known Epstein-associated woman has come forward to point a finger at the former presidents and say they were abused by or were expected to be intimate with them. There was a photo of one of Epstein's female travel companions giving Clinton a shoulder massage in an airport waiting room, but that's it.

 

[Denville]

why not then? Do you seriously think that Trump or Bill C just had a glass of milk with these girls if they met them through Epstein

 

[sophie25]

There can be no public role even if new facts come to light that disprove some of the more lurid accusations. The way he conducted his relationship with Epstein & the tone deafness of the interview have sealed his fate.

He would be best advised to be honest about his mistakes, publicly accept with grace & understanding that his former life of duty is over & try to atone in some private way.

He is incapable of doing what you suggest I'm afraid.