The Prince Andrew and Jeffrey Epstein Controversy (2010-2021)

[HereditaryPrincess]

I feel for Pitch @ the Palace, I do hope they will be able to continue their work whilst disassociating themselves from Andrew's name. I agree that the best thing for him right now would be to retire from his public duties and lie-low at his Swiss chalet or another residence - this case will obviously be mostly associated with him due to how high profile it is.

The case was mentioned on the ITV leaders debate between Johnson and Corbyn tonight; with Corbyn requesting justice for the victims.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a9209846.html

[tommy100]

Pitch@The Palace is Andrew's own initiative, his Private Secretary is also its Director and the staff are all Andrew's staff. It was started after Andrew lost his trade role. There were rumblings when it started that it was another way for Andrew to jet set around the world drumming up business links for the "apprentices". TBF it has turned into a pretty worthy cause.

However, it would be hard to dissociate themselves from Andrew in any short amount of time, it would be a bit like The Prince's trust trying to dissociate themselves with Charles. I do wonder though if there would be a way for Beatrice or Eugenie to take it over, it would be a way for them to support their father but not to be "full time royals" it depends though if it could be completely self funding, I'm not if at the moment it gets some support from Andrew's office, e.g. staff paid by the Queen for Andrew also work on Pitch@thePalace stuff. Ideally it could become a completely separate charity project, its own premises etc, or certainly out of BP with its own staff.
If Eugenie and/or Beatrice worked for it I would suggest such activities not being in the Court Circular, just allow them to do an almost day-to-day non-profit job.

[sndral]

Originally Posted by Muhler

Being the Devil's Advocate again.
...
And after all, Andrew may be right.
He may actually not recall this particular woman. - Bad memory. He meet so many different people, can't possibly remember them all. He was somewhat intoxicated, so can't remember people he may have met at some party and so on...
He finds it much easier to remember things he did with his daughters. Hardly surprising, eh?
...:

He claimed in the interview that he doesn’t drink, so, if he’s telling the truth (a big if w/ Andrew these days given his string of denying other’s versions of various events,) he could not have been somewhat intoxicated.
Perhaps he remembers events with his daughters because they are not among the great unwashed unworthy of his notice.

[O-H Anglophile]

Originally Posted by Somebody

And that whole story about the photograph didn't make things better either. "I have no explanation" - I never went upstairs?! (How do you know this is upstairs?) I also wonder why being friends with Maxwell doesn't seem to be a problem given the growing evidence that she most likely had an important part in all of this.

You can see the railing in that photo that indicates the location was an upstairs hall or landing.


As for how he knew he spent a certain evening with his daughters--it may have been in his calendar--he is a divorced father, I'm sure his events diary has the times listed he was scheduled to be with his daughters.

[COUNTESS]

Originally Posted by tausi

I think Andrew, himself, should do the right thing and resign from royal duties. He should NOT wait for her Majesty or Prince of Wales to make him resign.

When in doubt blame someone else. He is a grown man. Even his last visit he spent 4 days with Epstein. If you are breaking up a relationship, with a friend you call. You don't spend 4 days. His actions are his, Sarah is not a puppeteer.

[Westfield Bakery]

Prince Andrew is the black sheep of the family.

I wonder if William, Harry, Zara will speak to their uncle again since he will be shunned from the family.

I wonder how his father, the Duke of Edinburgh feels about this?

Andrew is his father's son, especially with the comments on race that have been revealed.

[ACO]

So some of his patronages are removing him from their websites. They haven't made official statements but I think that action is quite telling.

[Osipi]

Westfield Bakery, I have not seen any credible sources stating that Andrew is "shunned" by his family. Therefore, I do not believe it would behoove us well to speculate on family relationships we have absolutely *no* idea about and that includes Philip's reactions to all of this.

Please.... can we just stick with credible information? Thank you.

Originally Posted by ACO

So some of his patronages are removing him from their websites. They haven't made official statements but I think that action is quite telling.

One of those organizations has come out and stated that their logo was removed from the Pitch@Palace website because it shouldn't have been up there in the first place so that is an anomaly. Its really only been three days since the disastrous interview and perhaps there are many more to drop out of association with Andrew and his incentives. Some decisions just aren't made overnight.

I think website editor of Royal Central, Chris Proctor, was right when he stated "I expected a train wreck. That was a plane crashing into an oil tanker, causing a tsunami, triggering a nuclear explosion level bad."

[rmay286]

Originally Posted by sndral

He claimed in the interview that he doesn’t drink, so, if he’s telling the truth (a big if w/ Andrew these days given his string of denying other’s versions of various events,) he could not have been somewhat intoxicated.
Perhaps he remembers events with his daughters because they are not among the great unwashed unworthy of his notice.

It's been well-documented over the years that Prince Andrew doesn't drink. I've read it many times, from multiple sources.

[sndral]

Originally Posted by rmay286

It's been well-documented over the years that Prince Andrew doesn't drink. I've read it many times, from multiple sources.

Yes, as well as Anne, I believe, I’m not seriously questioning that particular statement. My comment in that regard was a bit flippant given Andrew’s denial of other matters. Although the fact that he doesn’t drink in no way negates the possibility that he would visit a bar, order non alcoholic drinks for himself and order and pay for someone else’s alcohol while there.

[Osipi]

Originally Posted by sndral

Yes, as well as Anne, I believe, I’m not seriously questioning that particular statement. My comment in that regard was a bit flippant given Andrew’s denial of other matters. Although the fact that he doesn’t drink in no way negates the possibility that he would visit a bar, order non alcoholic drinks for himself and order and pay for someone else’s alcohol while there.

The funny thing is the way I read the statement that Andrew made, it was as if he's setting the record straight that he couldn't possibly be a "playboy prince" because he doesn't drink alcohol. There are a lot of morally bankrupt and ethically challenged people out there that never touch alcohol at all so that didn't excuse Andrew in my eyes.

[ACO]

Originally Posted by Osipi

One of those organizations has come out and stated that their logo was removed from the Pitch@Palace website because it shouldn't have been up there in the first place so that is an anomaly. Its really only been three days since the disastrous interview and perhaps there are many more to drop out of association with Andrew and his incentives. Some decisions just aren't made overnight.

I think website editor of Royal Central, Chris Proctor, was right when he stated "I expected a train wreck. That was a plane crashing into an oil tanker, causing a tsunami, triggering a nuclear explosion level bad."

I wasn't referring to Pitch@Palace removing them but the patronages removing Andrew from their official websites. Cambridge Science Center and Teen Tech both had him on their website a few days ago as their "Royal Patron. Today? Removed. It is just telling how people are clearly distancing themselves.

[Osipi]

I think we all figured that the interview would have some serious repercussions solely by the way Andrew presented himself and seemingly had no regrets, no remorse and some pretty inane excuses that, I think, he actually believed were true of himself and his character. Especially the "honorable" part.

What amazes me is that Andrew had to know what the reasons were for his being "retired" from his role as the UK's trade envoy but obviously he didn't think that anything further would happen to him doing this insane interview.

Its a serious case of giving a man enough rope and he'll eventually hang himself with it. I do expect many, many more repercussions to follow. Will Andrew actually realize the implications of his actions? I have no clue but perhaps he has a magic mirror that shows him what he wants to see.

I do feel bad for the Pitch@Palace incentive as I believe it was a worthwhile endeavor and geared to help so many people and was growing beautifully before all this hit the fan.

[Elenath]

Originally Posted by Muhler

He may actually not recall this particular woman. - Bad memory. He meet so many different people, can't possibly remember them all. He was somewhat intoxicated, so can't remember people he may have met at some party and so on...
He finds it much easier to remember things he did with his daughters. Hardly surprising, eh?
He may actually suffer from a condition where he has problems perspiring. Whether that condition is physical or psychosomatic.

I could fully understand it if he does not remember meeting Virginia Roberts, I'm sure in those days he slept with plenty of women. But remembering a pizza party that happened 23 years ago? Nope… I'm betting the only reason he remember it is because someone on his staff decided to check his old diaries and discovered Andrew was at a pizza party 23 years ago.

Also, whether he remembers it or not is irrelevent. She was 17 at the time. Sleeping with an underaged prostitute is a crime in the UK. Especially is said prostitute is forced and trafficked.

[rob2008]

The Daily Mail is a Conservative paper and yet is hounding Andrew in a relentless way. This is strange.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nt-add-up.html

[Pranter]

Some of that is real nonsense. Andrew has a lot of money...the Queen Mother left her grandchildren money and who knows what the Queen herself may of helped him with/given to him. To suggest or infer he has no income outside a Navy pension is ridiculous.

LaRae

[Denville]

You're surprised that Andrew's acitns are subject to criticism?

Originally Posted by Osipi

The funny thing is the way I read the statement that Andrew made, it was as if he's setting the record straight that he couldn't possibly be a "playboy prince" because he doesn't drink alcohol. There are a lot of morally bankrupt and ethically challenged people out there that never touch alcohol at all so that didn't excuse Andrew in my eyes.

Yes I think that Andrew thinks that his not drinking is a "plus" and that it shows him to be a highly moral person...and that as you say "he cant be a playboy because he doesnt' touch alcohol..."

[wyevale]

She was 17 at the time. Sleeping with an underaged prostitute is a crime in the UK

How many times is it necessary to state the legal position in the UK ?

In Great Britain (England, Wales and Scotland), prostitution itself (the exchange of sexual services for money) is legal, and the age of consent is 16...
but a number of related activities, including soliciting in a public place, kerb crawling, owning or managing a brothel, pimping and pandering, are crimes...none of which [as far as I know] has the Duke been accused of..

Whatever our opinions of this matter maybe, clarity on the Law is important.

^ One 'offence' is alleged to have occurred in London [Age of Consent -16] another in NYC [AoC - 17] and on Epstein's Carribbean island [AoC -16, in most countries there].

I cannot find details of which nations jurisdiction Epsteins private Island was governed by.

[Denville]

Andrew may not have committed a crime but his behaviour in continuing to associate with Epstein, his indifference to what was happening to the girls Epstein had around, his arrogance and greed for money, is bringing the monarchy into disrepute.. as he should know...

[wyevale]

I've already stated [up-thread] my belief that he should retire..

I was merely re-stating the legal position so as to correct an inaccurate assertion...