The Prince Andrew and Jeffrey Epstein Controversy 1: 2010-2022

[Denville]

Well then - I would tell your dog to expect Christmas early and start planing that menu

She will get minimum or probation if anything - she know where the skeletons are hidden. If she is smart she will tell. She wont last long in prison - okay maybe one of those upper crust prisons they have for Trump's friends.

what can she "tell"? She's the one who found girls for Epstein and he then passed the girls she found on to people. Other people who were involved in the pimping are going to be lower in the chain that she is.. sicne she was his girlfriend and the one is chielfly guilty, by the sound of it...

 

[Osipi]

Oh I can see it now. Maxwelll bravely states in open court. "I know "Mr. Big Guy" had sex with (victim's name here) because I set it up in the first place and recorded it."

Who comes out the evil villain in that sentence?

 

[sophie25]

The more we hear about the situation the more I just cannot stop thinking 'why on Earth did Andrew ever get involved in all of this?'

 

[Osipi]

Answer is simple. You can't cure stupid.

 

[Denville]

Oh I can see it now. Maxwelll bravely states in open court. "I know "Mr. Big Guy" had sex with (victim's name here) because I set it up in the first place and recorded it."

Who comes out the evil villain in that sentence?

She does. She's the one who has procured these girls, groomed them and she and Epstein sent them to have sex with men.

 

[Osipi]

She does. She's the one who has procured these girls, groomed them and she and Epstein sent them to have sex with men.

Unless she has lawyers that have the ability to gag her, she may even set herself up for even more charges than she already has. I'd *love* to see that happen actually.

Give her enough rope and she'll hang herself by opening her mouth.


Example: "I *know* too that it was the weekend of (fill in the date) because as it was "Mr. Big Guy", I also was flying in cocaine for him on the helicopter." BAMP. International drug smuggling.

 

[Denville]

Unless she has lawyers that have the ability to gag her, she may even set herself up for even more charges than she already has. I'd *love* to see that happen actually.

Give her enough rope and she'll hang herself by opening her mouth.


Example: "I *know* too that it was the weekend of (fill in the date) because as it was "Mr. Big Guy", I also was flying in cocaine for him on the helicopter." BAMP. International drug smuggling.

I doubt if seh's going to babble all sorts of nonsense. Shes going ot have the most expensive lawyers, guiding her to the best defence possible. Unless she's a very wilful woman who refuses to listen to her legal team

 

[Osipi]

I doubt if seh's going to babble all sorts of nonsense. Shes going ot have the most expensive lawyers, guiding her to the best defence possible. Unless she's a very wilful woman who refuses to listen to her legal team

Who knows? She definitely wasn't overly smart about where to hide out. With all her money and three passports, the last place I expected her to be arrested at was at home in the US.

This is going to a very interesting court case to follow for sure.

 

[Osipi]

And now it starts with the defense team by claiming the charges against Maxwell are "meritless".

"In the Thursday night filing, Menninger also issued broad denials to almost every allegation in Doe's complaint and claimed that whatever physical and psychological damages Doe might have experienced did not come from Maxwell. She went a step further by blaming the alleged victim."

https://www.foxnews.com/us/ghislaine-maxwell-charges-meritless

Anyone want to buy a stale but still tasty box of popcorn?

 

[stunking]

Defense strategy

And now it starts with the defense team by claiming the charges against Maxwell are "meritless".

"In the Thursday night filing, Menninger also issued broad denials to almost every allegation in Doe's complaint and claimed that whatever physical and psychological damages Doe might have experienced did not come from Maxwell. She went a step further by blaming the alleged victim."

https://www.foxnews.com/us/ghislaine-maxwell-charges-meritless

Anyone want to buy a stale but still tasty box of popcorn?

Blame the victim, even in murder trials.

 

[GracieGiraffe]

Ghislaine won’t be speaking up without a sweetheart deal, and such a deal would depend on the fish she brings in. Andy may be one of those fish but he is likely not the biggest and not the one the prosecutors find most interesting. But who knows??

 

[Osipi]

Woah! Good to see you around again, GracieGiraffe!

There really can't be, in my eyes, someone related to the Epstein heinous circus than Maxwell. Sure there could be juicy stuffs coming out about "high profile" people that highlight the circus sideshows with their antics but the reality is that Andrew, in my eyes, is the guy that mans the slop bucket for the elephants. You see him now and then but he's not a huge part of the circus.

 

[MARG]

What a gloriously evocatively picture. Indeed it suits the PTB to have him "named and shamed" as it keeps them occupied and let's face it, there are more photos of President Trump with Epstein and Maxwell than Andrew.

Considering Epstein's sweetheart deal you have to wonder who else was at those "Black Tie" events as well as Trump. Their most been a lot of photos recovered from the original 2011 case . . . or was that evidence lost as part if the deal.

 

[Eskimo]

Andrew is just a distraction in this case. Everyone involved knows that the UK is never going to handover a senior member of the BRF to anyone— its a dead end and everyone knows it.

 

[Osipi]

What a gloriously evocatively picture. Indeed it suits the PTB to have him "named and shamed" as it keeps them occupied and let's face it, there are more photos of President Trump with Epstein and Maxwell than Andrew.

What you don't hear coming out at all is the fact that not only was Trump pictured with Epstein and Maxwell more than Andrew, Trump also had his name tied to a lawsuit all buddy buddy right next to Epstein in 2016. It mysteriously went away never to be heard about again. (Insert Twilight Zone music here).


But back to Andrew, he really isn't much more than a royal title being used to promote the "upper echelons" of society and status that these two perverted individuals catered to. Even Harvey Weinstein but he's not going to be a focus. He's already incarcerated for his own crimes and won't be let out until he's in his 90s.

Not saying Andrew isn't going to lose even more of his reputation (or what's left of it) but other than being stupid, ignorant, unaware of people around him and having very poor judgement of character, he's not a criminal in this investigation. That we know of anyways.

 

[Winnie]

Ghislaine won’t be speaking up without a sweetheart deal, and such a deal would depend on the fish she brings in. Andy may be one of those fish but he is likely not the biggest and not the one the prosecutors find most interesting. But who knows??

I agree. Andrew small fish and the feds want the huge ones no matter from what family or country. She will get a deal along with plastic surgery and witness protection, which will change every 5 years or so. You really don't think this hasn't happened before for others, do you. Governments and elites knew this garbage has been going on for decades and did nothing....KARMA, and I hope it hurts the big boys [and girls] JMO

 

[Osipi]

I agree. Andrew small fish and the feds want the huge ones no matter from what family or country. She will get a deal along with plastic surgery and witness protection, which will change every 5 years or so. You really don't think this hasn't happened before for others, do you. Governments and elites knew this garbage has been going on for decades and did nothing....KARMA, and I hope it hurts the big boys [and girls] JMO

I respectfully disagree on this. Why would she be put into a witness protection program if she is the one that badly needs witnesses for her defense right now? This case is to wide and blown open on an international scale even for any "under the table" dealings to go by unnoticed. There isn't a bigger fish to be caught in this stinking pond of slime than Maxwell (well.. Epstein but he's dead).

*IF* and its a big if that Maxwell is needed in a future court hearing as a witness, her testimony is easier to get from her in a super duper maximum security prison than anywhere else. It'd cost far more for the US to have her on the outside and have the means to flee the country as Maxwell really doesn't have any good ties to the US at all.

If this was the middle ages, she'd be hung, drawn and quartered for her crimes but in today's world, I think she'll be sentenced to the full extent of the law with no parole hearings at any time. She'll die in prison. Question is how long can she last in prison?

 

[rob2008]

You will find the full creative power of the British state as new and different ways are invented to protect Andrew from facing a legal process. It will be a fascinating sequence of events to keep the Sovereign's second son hidden away from the risk of exposure.

He is after, like Ghislaine, the victim of fashion and change in public opinion. The super rich and upper classes have always behaved and lived according to a code that keeps them separate and concealed from the rest of us in their privileged, entitled cocoon. Recently it has become acceptable to listen to complaints from victims about the appalling disrespectful and unlawful behaviour that goes on in these luxury compounds, villas etc.

Once a teenage girl didnt have the right to be heard in these kind of circumstances. Now the victims have a right to be heard and there is a duty to act. Except, Andrew will always be carefully protected and escape responsibility for his hedonistic, selfish lifestyle.

 

[Osipi]

So far though, Andrew's reputation sure hasn't been protected overly much. He may still remain the second son of the monarch and hold the title of The Prince Andrew, Duke of York but that's as far as it goes for Andy. He's been disgraced, shown himself to be a pompous and arrogant and entitled human being and that has put him out to royal pastures to graze for the rest of his natural life.

Unless he's accused, indicted and prosecuted for an actual crime, not much more damage can be done to his reputation and his "good name" will never be restored again. Sheer stupidity isn't a crime last I looked.

I don't see any criminal charges in relation to Epstein, Maxwell or Andrew being filed in British courts. The US courts will show no mercy (I hope).

 

[Madame Verseau]

Gigi is asking for bail

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...us/ghislaine-maxwell-bail-response/index.html

I don't care what she claims in the filing, the judge would be crazy to grant her bail. She would run.

 

[Excalibur]

Gigi is asking for bail

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...us/ghislaine-maxwell-bail-response/index.html

I don't care what she claims in the filing, the judge would be crazy to grant her bail. She would run.

Say it ain't so!:

In their brief, Maxwell's attorneys also preview legal arguments they plan to make with regard to the indictment, which center on a non-prosecution agreement Epstein signed with federal prosecutors in Miami in 2007 that appeared to immunize "any potential co-conspirators of Epstein."

 

[GracieGiraffe]

Even if Andy were a bigger fish it would cause a real diplomatic mess to charge him and seek his extradition. It will be interesting to see how his brother and nephew treat him when they are on the throne. He might want to start planning what his retirement post Elizabeth will look like.

I agree that Ghislaine’s involvement is so heinous that she’d have to be willing to give up ***many*** big fish, and the right big fish at that, along with some solid evidence to back up her claims. As we’ve seen from the post above, her lawyers are going to fight tooth and nail. I bet the retainer they got made them swoon.

 

[yvr girl]

I just don't see what bigger fish there is than GM. She was Epstein's right hand woman. She groomed the girls.

The more famous fish will be much harder to convict of a crime. They knew these women were young, but did they know they were under age? Did they know that these girls were being coerced? It could be argued that they are only guilty of having sex with women that were on the young side.

 

[sophie25]

What a gloriously evocatively picture. Indeed it suits the PTB to have him "named and shamed" as it keeps them occupied and let's face it, there are more photos of President Trump with Epstein and Maxwell than Andrew.

Considering Epstein's sweetheart deal you have to wonder who else was at those "Black Tie" events as well as Trump. Their most been a lot of photos recovered from the original 2011 case . . . or was that evidence lost as part if the deal.

I disagree about Trump compared to Andrew. Trump was photographed with Epstein at a few social events whereas Andrew's association was a proper close friendship. There were hus visits to the island (no witnesses or victims saw Trump); staying in Epstein's house for days on end; having Epstein to Windsor and Sandringham for private stays; Andrew being photograph lounging on a yacht with Epstein etc, etc. The Clintons were also around Epstein a lot according to flight logs; witness accounts and Ghislaine's appearance at Chelsea Clinton's wedding. Trump's association seems to have been a lot more tenous in comparion to Andrew's, the Clintons and a few other high ranking people.

 

[Nice Nofret]

I just don't see what bigger fish there is than GM. She was Epstein's right hand woman. She groomed the girls.

The more famous fish will be much harder to convict of a crime. They knew these women were young, but did they know they were under age? Did they know that these girls were being coerced? It could be argued that they are only guilty of having sex with women that were on the young side.

The big fish for me are those powerfull men in high positions who took advantage of these young women. Of course Maxwell seems to be quite important in the scheme but has no influence in the world or is rich on her own.


I want to see those people prosecuted who knew what was going on, but didn't do a thing to help those women.

 

[Denville]

The big fish for me are those powerfull men in high positions who took advantage of these young women. Of course Maxwell seems to be quite important in the scheme but has no influence in the world or is rich on her own.


I want to see those people prosecuted who knew what was going on, but didn't do a thing to help those women.

Maxwell is hardly poor.. and she was the one who found these women for her boyfriend who passed them on to his friends and associates. Men who had sex with them.. its going to be very difficult to prove if they knew whether the women were under age, or if they were willing participants or pressured into the set up. Maxwell DID know that she was pressuring these girls, and since she'd need papers for them etc she knew their ages and their back stories. Unless these girls spoke to the men they had sex with and told them that they were being pressured or coerced to live like this, I can't see what anyone coudl do for them..

 

[Osipi]

I disagree about Trump compared to Andrew. Trump was photographed with Epstein at a few social events whereas Andrew's association was a proper close friendship. There were hus visits to the island (no witnesses or victims saw Trump); staying in Epstein's house for days on end; having Epstein to Windsor and Sandringham for private stays; Andrew being photograph lounging on a yacht with Epstein etc, etc. The Clintons were also around Epstein a lot according to flight logs; witness accounts and Ghislaine's appearance at Chelsea Clinton's wedding. Trump's association seems to have been a lot more tenous in comparion to Andrew's, the Clintons and a few other high ranking people.

Do me a favor, Sophie? Type in Jane Doe vs. Donald J. Trump and Jefferey E. Epstein in your search engine and read what pops up. To my knowledge, its clear that Trump is the only "Mr. Big Guy" that has had a lawsuit filed against him *along* with Epstein with several heinous allegations along with child rape. The documents are available and to be honest, made me physically sick. This was in 2016.

Seriously. No joke. Its all there in black and white.

 

[Lilyflo]

Can anyone help me with a timeline?
1 When was Maxwell's naming as someone who was accused of committing crimes become public?
2 When did she last have any contact with Prince Andrew?

 

[tommy100]

I remember that during THAT now infamous Newsnight interview Emily Matlis asked Andrew when he last saw Maxwell and he said "earlier this year" and if I recall said it has been at BP, which caused a visible shocked reaction from Matlis (and many of those watching no doubt)

 

[Osipi]

I remember that during THAT now infamous Newsnight interview Emily Matlis asked Andrew when he last saw Maxwell and he said "earlier this year" and if I recall said it has been at BP, which caused a visible shocked reaction from Matlis (and many of those watching no doubt)

From Andrew's now famous interview with Emily Matlis. Andrew's mind seems to have taken a vacation without leaving a forwarding address.
(transcript in link)

EM: When was your last contact with her?

PA: It was earlier this year funnily enough in the summer, in the spring, summer.

EM: About what?

PA: She was here doing some rally.

EM: So even though he had by then been arrested and was facing charges of sex trafficking?

PA: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, this was… this was early spring I think, it was long… because when was he arrested?

EM: July.

PA: No, it was before July.

EM: And that was the last time?

PA: Yeah, yeah.

EM: Did you discuss Epstein at all?

PA: No, actually funnily enough no not at all, there wasn't anything to discuss about him because he wasn't in the news, you know, it was just… we had moved on.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-50449339