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  #1041  
Old 05-24-2021, 06:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
But this is a royal forum.. So his behavior is what is being discussed...yes there may be American and other politicians and so on, who behaved as badly or worse than him.. but they're for another discussion forum.
And a royal has a symbolic function so that without committing actual criminal deeds, they may be criticised and thrown out of public life, "just because they are royal and they acted in an unbecoming way."
Andrew probably didn't realise that the girls were trafficked but he was friends with Ghislaine Maxwell who was the one doing a lot of the nasty stuff. He hung around with Epstein not just to get girls but to make money - just as he has made money on the side by association with dubious oligarchs.. that's another piece of unroyal behavior, that combined with the Epstein friendship and the girls has destroyed his reputation.
And another reason he didn't probably realise the girls were trafficked and were very young was that he is simply blind to people who are of a lower social class than him, and just thinks that they are there to serve him and he does not notice them. That's what's pretty repulsive of him and why no charity will touch him again IMO.

Andrews royal status is unlikely to be taken from him.. because he's the queen's son, he is her favourite and she'll try to make excuses for him.. IMO he is lucky that his status is likely to mean that the only punishment he is suffering is to lose his job and to have to lead a quiet life in premature retirement.
He's definitely blind to those of lower status than him... and it might have been far worse, re consequences. He didn't really lose any money he desperately needed. But he isn't the only royal who is blind this way and it was made clear rather recently. I'll keep watching if the press is going to make the connection, although, in all honesty, even they seem tired of beating the dead horse when it's been almost two years without any new development. Andrew and his horse can fill only so many inches of blank space.



This is a royal forum indeed and I wasn't comparing the treatment royals and non-royals get from the members. I was talking about the press whose relationship with the royals is discussed rather frequently here. Good thing that the royals themselves rarely complain of the press in width, else one forum might be too narrow to contain all the discussions - Prince Andrew said THIS tabloid was mean and THAT tabloid took offense and what do we think about THIS tabloid author with a grudge against this or that royal who now writes for THAT non-tabloid paper and how trustworthy they are...
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  #1042  
Old 05-26-2021, 03:23 AM
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I doubt if Andrew would complain about the press. He is arrogant and stupid, but he by and large hasn't been one for giving interviews or talking to or about the press too much. He was foolish to give that interview 18 months ago.. but since then I think he's accepted that he has completely ruined his life as a working royal and has accepted retirement and seclusion.
And because of that I think the press have given up on him. They can see that he's leading a quiet life.. he only goes out riding as far as I can see, and what is ther to say? He hasn't been charged with anything, he's given up his job, what is there to say about him now? I think the queen made it clear at Bea's wedding that she accepts that her son has to keep out of public life.. and hopefully so does Andrew.
To be honest, I think that Andrew would hardly remember one pressman rather than another... so he's not likely to engage in long winded disputes and complaints about them...
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  #1043  
Old 05-26-2021, 09:22 AM
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Of course we never know what really happens behind the scenes in the family’s private life, but reading about Andrew here makes me think about how the RF needs to figure out how to handle “the spare.” I can’t imagine how hard it would be because they are both a family and a “firm.” But I see these second sons as floundering (both Andrew and now Harry). Perhaps they could develop some sort of “expectations” for the spare? IDK, I thought the Commonwealth “ambassador” so to speak was a good idea for Harry before he made his true feelings clear. Perhaps if this was fleshed out/planned in their teens/twenties but perhaps always discussed that “you have a very important role too” it might mitigate some of what has happened. Maybe they did this and we are unaware.

I can see Charlotte being very much like her great Aunt Anne if what we see and hear of her personality is true. I just would not want to see precious Charlotte and/or Louis ending up as a floundering “spare.”
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  #1044  
Old 05-26-2021, 09:31 AM
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Not all "spares" are difficult and stroppy. I think that Andrew was a bit, and Harry too though he hid it.. but there have been second sons who were very dutiful and made better kings than the heir would have done.
Anyway I think that the second or younger kids in the next generation wont be expected to be full time workers so the issue wont really arise. it was different in the Queen's day...
The problem wiht the Spare I think is now that royals have access to other jobs and roles so perhaps (Unless they are going to be king eventually) they dont like being asked to do a role which has its limitations, and where they will be less noticed as they get older, but which doesn't have the importance of being King or queen. And the "spare" isn't going to be as rich and so on -. but a lot of peopel would of course feel that even if one isn't as rich as the future monarch, its still an important role, which can be interesting and one will still be pretty well to do compared with the rest of the world.....
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  #1045  
Old 05-26-2021, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
Not all "spares" are difficult and stroppy. I think that Andrew was a bit, and Harry too though he hid it.. but there have been second sons who were very dutiful and made better kings than the heir would have done.
I think Margaret was too.

I remember reading that courtiers at the time were saying: It's a good thing that Elizabeth is the elder.
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  #1046  
Old 05-26-2021, 01:34 PM
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Had Margaret been born first she would have been treated differently and flattered as the Heiress. And probably behaved differently. Margaret complained that she did not get as good an education as her elder sister (who was taught more serious subjects.
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  #1047  
Old 05-26-2021, 01:41 PM
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I do find it funny what a little bit of hindsight can do. In 20 years time and Harry is great and wonderful in the public eyes and maybe Andrew has been found complete not guilty. Come back here and have a look.
I cant write off someone's life by one incident or even several of them. Both might still surprise us all.
William and Kate have more then enough time to make mistakes as well.


That been said - you do realize that the DOE had such conversation with Anne and Edward. They are not the heirs they are the what the hells do we do with you children. And Anne's went well - Edward;s not so much. Eventually they will have the discussion with Louis as well. But I am happy that he has more choice now then a generation had ago. Hopefully he will learn and the family will learn from what has happened before
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  #1048  
Old 05-27-2021, 04:23 AM
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Andrew is not going to "redeem himself". Its most unlikely that he will be able to work agian, and in his private life, I doubt if he is going to become a hard working house husband. He isn't going to go around baby sitting and putting up shelves.. why should he?
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  #1049  
Old 05-29-2021, 01:04 AM
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https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbi...ce-Andrew.html


Apparently Ms. Stark has severe financial issues and is going to write a book about Prince Andrew.

She has come up to bat for him at least once during the current spate of unproven accusations against him, but I fear that she will only be richly rewarded if her account is specific, full of new revelations ... basically a juicy read.

Perhaps this salvo is to signal him and/or BP to help her out?
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  #1050  
Old 05-29-2021, 01:29 AM
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Ms. Stark is, by most accounts a gentle and kind woman. She and Andrew preserved their friendship. Just because she will write her memoirs does not mean Andrew will come off badly. In fact, I predict it will be just the opposite.

Andrew is probably not losing sleep.

And no...Buckingham Palace will not be paying her a cent. Why should they? Does anyone care about Andrew's almost 40 year ago relationship with Koo Stark?
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  #1051  
Old 05-29-2021, 04:54 AM
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I doubt if Koo has anything much she can say about Andrew that is to his detriment. She is by all accounts a nice woman and didn't ever speak much about her relationship with him... and when they were together years ago, I think that Andrew hadn't become the louche ultra selfish man that he became in later years. I dont think that he had the friendships with dubious millionaires, or the lifestyle of someone procuring women for him.
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  #1052  
Old 05-29-2021, 04:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
Ms. Stark is, by most accounts a gentle and kind woman. She and Andrew preserved their friendship. Just because she will write her memoirs does not mean Andrew will come off badly. In fact, I predict it will be just the opposite.

Andrew is probably not losing sleep.

And no...Buckingham Palace will not be paying her a cent. Why should they? Does anyone care about Andrew's almost 40 year ago relationship with Koo Stark?
Guess some at BP wished the two had married, maybe less scandal had happened, no divorce, good looking kids, less drama... LOL
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  #1053  
Old 05-29-2021, 05:03 AM
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We dont know what would have happened if htey married. And "good looking kids"?? Really? It seems like you're saying that it woudl be better if Andrew had "good looking kids"?
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  #1054  
Old 05-29-2021, 10:54 AM
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Guess some at BP wished the two had married, maybe less scandal had happened, no divorce, good looking kids, less drama... LOL
Beatrice and Eugenie both bear a strong resemblance to their father as well as their mother. Any children by any mother, for example, might have had Andrew's large teeth.

Beatrice and Eugenie are the only good things to come out of the York marriage imo. They have behaved almost impeccably throughout their public lives and are a credit to their parents and HMQ.

Other Royal parents in that family should be so lucky.
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  #1055  
Old 05-29-2021, 10:57 AM
eya eya is offline
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Duke of York enjoy a horse ride in the grounds of Windsor Castle today

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/a...h-walkers.html

https://www.rexfeatures.com/livefeed...indsor_castle?
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  #1056  
Old 05-29-2021, 11:25 AM
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Andrew did not take up riding until a few years ago compared to his elder siblings Charles and Anne, who started as very young children.

But Andrew seems to have come to enjoy horses too.
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  #1057  
Old 05-29-2021, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
Beatrice and Eugenie both bear a strong resemblance to their father as well as their mother. Any children by any mother, for example, might have had Andrew's large teeth.

Beatrice and Eugenie are the only good things to come out of the York marriage imo. They have behaved almost impeccably throughout their public lives and are a credit to their parents and HMQ.

Other Royal parents in that family should be so lucky.
hope you got the LOL-attention sarcasm! just responding to your post ;-)
Sorry @Denville who missed it.
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  #1058  
Old 05-29-2021, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
Andrew did not take up riding until a few years ago compared to his elder siblings Charles and Anne, who started as very young children.

But Andrew seems to have come to enjoy horses too.
Andrew learnt to ride as a child but he wasn't as keen as his siblings. All of the Queen's children were on horses almost as soon as they could walk, if not sooner. The same with her grandchildren. Some loved it all their lives while others weren't so sold on it.
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  #1059  
Old 06-05-2021, 11:24 AM
eya eya is offline
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Prince Andrew during early morning today horse ride in Windsor

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/a...e-Windsor.html
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