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  #81  
Old 10-01-2021, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Claire View Post
Oddly enough - my dad is convinced that the Queen now has 2 great grand daughters called Sienna. He has been calling Savanna, Sienna, for years.
Savanna and Sienna are kind of close in spelling & pronunciation, so I can see how your Dad mixed them up. But when I read your post putting those two names together, Sienna Miller and her sister Savannah popped into my head.
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  #82  
Old 10-01-2021, 02:41 PM
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She Probably didnt want to accidently alinate Wolfie by having the sibilings two different last names just a thought for why the couple didnt use Windsor or Mountbatten-Windsor for their child. Maybe she is really proud to have the Mozzi name.
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  #83  
Old 10-01-2021, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by duchesschicana View Post
She Probably didnt want to accidently alinate Wolfie by having the sibilings two different last names just a thought for why the couple didnt use Windsor or Mountbatten-Windsor for their child. Maybe she is really proud to have the Mozzi name.
While it is not uncommon in some other Western countries to use the maternal last name, the last name of an ancestor, or perhaps even a made-up last name for a child, in the UK it would be too far a departure from the rigidly patrilineal naming practices of most Britons for any member of the very traditional British royal family to consider those options, I believe (unless the circumstances are exceptional, such as the case of Queen Elizabeth II's children).

However, that does not necessarily suggest that UK law imposes legal restrictions on the British royal family regarding their children's names. Whether members of the Windsor family have the same legal naming rights as private citizens is a controversial issue, as Mbruno said, owing to the royal proclamations of 1917 and 1960 (which is why I wondered about the wording of the name announcement).

https://www.heraldica.org/topics/bri..._docs.htm#1960

That said, even if the proclamations are legally enforceable, I think they apply only to the names Windsor and Mountbatten-Windsor - so if Princess Beatrice hypothetically wanted to name her daughter Sienna Miller-Mozzi, I suppose it would be legal.
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  #84  
Old 10-01-2021, 04:01 PM
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The vast majority of people in the UK give a child the father's surname, unless the father and mother aren't together. A few people use a double-barrelled name, but most don't. Some use the mother's name alone, but that's very, very rare if the parents are married. I don't think there was ever any question of the baby having any surname other than Mapelli Mozzi, and I don't think they meant anything at all by including it in the announcement - it's just fairly standard wording.
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  #85  
Old 10-01-2021, 05:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Claire View Post
Oddly enough - my dad is convinced that the Queen now has 2 great grand daughters called Sienna. He has been calling Savanna, Sienna, for years.
That's the Miller sisters again! Sienna and Savannah. I think they popularised both names amongst the in crowd.
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  #86  
Old 10-01-2021, 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
The vast majority of people in the UK give a child the father's surname, unless the father and mother aren't together. A few people use a double-barrelled name, but most don't. Some use the mother's name alone, but that's very, very rare if the parents are married. I don't think there was ever any question of the baby having any surname other than Mapelli Mozzi,
Indeed. That is the point I was making.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
and I don't think they meant anything at all by including it in the announcement - it's just fairly standard wording.
So, the "standard" laws apply to the Mapelli Mozzis and the Privy Council declaration of 1960 does not impose any additional restrictions on them?
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  #87  
Old 10-01-2021, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
With exception of the Cambridges whose children are of course closer to the throne, the younger Windsors seem to be moving away from traditional names.
This is my thought too. I love the name Sienna and it flows so nicely with her surname. I have to think they chose the names of their daughter for the sole reason of that they liked it and adding Elizabeth had nothing to do with"royal" or "status" or anything besides being the name of Beatrice's beloved grandmother.

The best part is that Sienna Mapelli-Mozzi will grow up to be her own unique self and actually have the very best of both worlds at her feet. She'll be her own private citizen yet a member of the extended British royal family apart from the monarchy and it's "Firm".

Ahhhhh... babies make me believe there's hope for this planet after all.
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  #88  
Old 10-01-2021, 06:46 PM
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Sienna Elizabeth is a lovely name!
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  #89  
Old 10-01-2021, 07:43 PM
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Sienna has a pretty pronunciation.
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  #90  
Old 10-01-2021, 08:57 PM
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Neither Sienna nor August were on my Bingo card!
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  #91  
Old 10-01-2021, 09:07 PM
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Sienna Mapelli Mozzi is a lovely elegant name.

Will Beatrice and Edo's little daughter have a title from her Dad's lineage? Some kind of honorific?
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  #92  
Old 10-01-2021, 09:29 PM
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I would have preferred a family name, and something more traditional.
But at least Sienna is a pretty name, and Beatrice did use Elizabeth as well.
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  #93  
Old 10-01-2021, 09:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leopoldine View Post
Sienna Mapelli Mozzi is a lovely elegant name.

Will Beatrice and Edo's little daughter have a title from her Dad's lineage? Some kind of honorific?
According to her paternal grandfather Sienna is a "Nobile", and her mother a Countess.

According to the British government and TRF, she is Miss Sienna Mapelli Mozzi.
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  #94  
Old 10-01-2021, 10:35 PM
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So, can she be Dona Sienna Mapelli Mozzi?
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  #95  
Old 10-01-2021, 10:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
According to her paternal grandfather Sienna is a "Nobile", and her mother a Countess.

Has her paternal grandfather said so publicly?

Titles may not have legal recognition, but be still used socially. That is the case for example of noble titles in Italy following the end of the monarchy. Having said that, Sienna is British and will be raised in the UK. I don't see her being ever called "Donna" in England (it wouldn't make much sense).
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  #96  
Old 10-01-2021, 11:30 PM
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Alessandro Mapelli Mozzi made the comment about the titles at the time of the engagement of Beatrice and Edoardo. It was widely published in various media.
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  #97  
Old 10-02-2021, 01:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fijiro View Post
Savanna and Sienna are kind of close in spelling & pronunciation, so I can see how your Dad mixed them up. But when I read your post putting those two names together, Sienna Miller and her sister Savannah popped into my head.
Savannah was also the name that I thought of when Sienna's name was announced, because of the closeness in pronunciation. It wasn't a half day later, I thought about Senna Lewis (born in 22 June 2010), daughter of Lady Davina Windsor and Gary Lewis who has the most similar spelling to Sienna (with a difference of one letter). Coincidentally, both Savannah and Senna were born in 2010.
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  #98  
Old 10-02-2021, 02:42 AM
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I think at times we read too much into things and look for hidden meanings or signals.

The new baby has a lovely name that was her parents
choice.
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  #99  
Old 10-02-2021, 11:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 View Post
According to her paternal grandfather Sienna is a "Nobile", and her mother a Countess.

According to the British government and TRF, she is Miss Sienna Mapelli Mozzi.
Also according to the government of Italy, where the former nobility and titles have no legal recognition according to the Transitory and Final Provisions of the Constitution.

https://www.quirinale.it/allegati_st...ne_inglese.pdf


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Has her paternal grandfather said so publicly?

Titles may not have legal recognition, but be still used socially. That is the case for example of noble titles in Italy following the end of the monarchy. Having said that, Sienna is British and will be raised in the UK. I don't see her being ever called "Donna" in England (it wouldn't make much sense).
See the link for the interview with Alessandro Mapelli Mozzi.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/a...osher-own.html

Notwithstanding his interview, Buckingham Palace named Alessandro as "Mr." in the announcement of Beatrice and Edo's engagement.

https://www.royal.uk/her-royal-highn...ged-be-married
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  #100  
Old 10-03-2021, 05:42 AM
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Serena Armstrong-Jones, Countess of Snowdon; Princess Margaret's daughter-in-law.
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